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Author Topic: So... other candidates besides McCain and Obama?  (Read 1426 times)
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Turtle
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« on: October 27, 2008, 01:50:04 AM »

So, the two party system... not all it's cracked up to be.

Alas, even though I can't vote for them since we need to keep republicans out of office, I am interested in other candidates and parties to see what they have to offer.

What candidates or parties outside the two party system are interesting enough for you to take a look despite the focus on the big two?
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Eduardo X
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« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2008, 02:35:38 AM »

I know two this year! Not counting one of the running mates.

One is a refugee from Nicaragua. Apparently he didn't read the rules. He's a really nice guy, but that doesn't mean I totally agree with his politics. I know his running mate from Colorado, where she organized at a coal mine.

Here is the list of... SOME of the alternatives.
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2008, 07:35:10 AM »

Well, Ralph Nader is running again as an indepdent. (www.votenader.org)

Bob Barr caught my attention, running as a libertarian. (www.bobbarr2008.com)

I've always voted republican in the past but Bush completely destroyed the party, IMO. I can't believe I voted for him in 2000. (Voted Nader in 2004)

If it were any other democrat running against McCain, I'd vote Nader again. But because how close this election is going to be, I'm going to have to vote for Obama because we can't have another 4 years of this BS Bush got us into. And despite what the mainstream media wants to lead you to believe about Obama being in the lead, I can almost guarentee you McCain is going to take the election.
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Canuck
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« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2008, 11:17:09 AM »

Well he's definitely not out of it, but things are looking pretty good for Obama.  Of course I lost all faith in America when they voted Bush in for a second term so you never know.
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Eduardo X
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« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2008, 12:17:52 PM »

Quote from: corruptrelic on October 27, 2008, 07:35:10 AM

Well, Ralph Nader is running again as an indepdent. (www.votenader.org)

Bob Barr caught my attention, running as a libertarian. (www.bobbarr2008.com)

I've always voted republican in the past but Bush completely destroyed the party, IMO. I can't believe I voted for him in 2000. (Voted Nader in 2004)

If it were any other democrat running against McCain, I'd vote Nader again. But because how close this election is going to be, I'm going to have to vote for Obama because we can't have another 4 years of this BS Bush got us into. And despite what the mainstream media wants to lead you to believe about Obama being in the lead, I can almost guarentee you McCain is going to take the election.
I'd only vote for Obama if you live in a swing state or red state. Otherwise, you may as well vote for a third party so somebody can get some public funding next election.
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Ironrod
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« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2008, 02:22:33 PM »

Quote from: Eduardo X on October 27, 2008, 12:17:52 PM

Quote from: corruptrelic on October 27, 2008, 07:35:10 AM

Well, Ralph Nader is running again as an indepdent. (www.votenader.org)

Bob Barr caught my attention, running as a libertarian. (www.bobbarr2008.com)

I've always voted republican in the past but Bush completely destroyed the party, IMO. I can't believe I voted for him in 2000. (Voted Nader in 2004)

If it were any other democrat running against McCain, I'd vote Nader again. But because how close this election is going to be, I'm going to have to vote for Obama because we can't have another 4 years of this BS Bush got us into. And despite what the mainstream media wants to lead you to believe about Obama being in the lead, I can almost guarentee you McCain is going to take the election.
I'd only vote for Obama if you live in a swing state or red state. Otherwise, you may as well vote for a third party so somebody can get some public funding next election.

I've voted for third parties and independents in every election since 1976. I generally default to the Libertarians, but Barr's anti-choice position closed that option off for me this time. After watching An Unreasonable Man recently, I toyed with casting my vote to Nader. (I recommend this movie, btw, as being both informative and entertaining). But Nader's time has passed, his politics don't really match mine, and he's not building a party. After rejecting these alternatives, I'll be joining in my state's Obama landslide. I've convinced myself that he is a transformative figure who's worthy of my symbolic vote.
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Blackadar
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« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2008, 02:31:56 PM »

Quote from: corruptrelic on October 27, 2008, 07:35:10 AM

And despite what the mainstream media wants to lead you to believe about Obama being in the lead, I can almost guarentee you McCain is going to take the election.

Curious...any particular reason you feel this way?  Certainly every poll disagrees with that statement and the degree of voter fraud it would take to get McCain elected would mean that this country isn't a Democracy or even a Republic any more.  And if that's the case, we need to be having an entirely different level of discourse.
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brettmcd
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« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2008, 02:45:53 PM »

Quote from: Blackadar on October 27, 2008, 02:31:56 PM

Quote from: corruptrelic on October 27, 2008, 07:35:10 AM

And despite what the mainstream media wants to lead you to believe about Obama being in the lead, I can almost guarentee you McCain is going to take the election.

Curious...any particular reason you feel this way?  Certainly every poll disagrees with that statement and the degree of voter fraud it would take to get McCain elected would mean that this country isn't a Democracy or even a Republic any more.  And if that's the case, we need to be having an entirely different level of discourse.


Nice to see you think the only way Obama can lose is if the other side cheats, it couldnt possibly have anything to do with the numerous stupid and ridiculous things your candidate stands for.   I seem to remember a candidate named Kerry leading in all the polls also, but somehow I dont remember him being president.   I am not a McCain supporter, but the attitudes of some of the Obama supports here almost makes me hope McCain does win.
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Blackadar
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« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2008, 03:02:10 PM »

Quote from: brettmcd on October 27, 2008, 02:45:53 PM

Quote from: Blackadar on October 27, 2008, 02:31:56 PM

Quote from: corruptrelic on October 27, 2008, 07:35:10 AM

And despite what the mainstream media wants to lead you to believe about Obama being in the lead, I can almost guarentee you McCain is going to take the election.

Curious...any particular reason you feel this way?  Certainly every poll disagrees with that statement and the degree of voter fraud it would take to get McCain elected would mean that this country isn't a Democracy or even a Republic any more.  And if that's the case, we need to be having an entirely different level of discourse.


Nice to see you think the only way Obama can lose is if the other side cheats, it couldnt possibly have anything to do with the numerous stupid and ridiculous things your candidate stands for.   I seem to remember a candidate named Kerry leading in all the polls also, but somehow I dont remember him being president.   I am not a McCain supporter, but the attitudes of some of the Obama supports here almost makes me hope McCain does win.

This one deserves the big  Roll Eyes

John Kerry didn't have a 5-10 point lead going into the final week of the election in any poll.  So much for that example...

What we're talking about here is mathematical probabilities and they're not in McCain's favor right now.  If the polls stay as they are and McCain somehow gets elected, we'd be talking about a larger upset than Truman/Dewey - with far better polling and statistical analysis now.  Even the trend is against him - polling trends are in Obama's favor over the last few weeks, new registrations are overwhelmingly Democratic, turnout is already very heavy in advance voting and high turnout historically favors Dems.  Even money is in Obama's favor and he'll likely outspend McCain 4-to-1 in the final week of this election season.  So, yes, unless something changes dramatically in these final days before the election, a McCain win would be an unprecedented upset - and so statistically improbable that voter fraud would be one of the likely factors and not some far-fetched tinfoil hat theory.

Could that change over the next week?  Possibly, but that's doubtful since there is nothing scheduled that would change the race in a dramatic fashion.  It would have to be something from far left field...and what are the chances of that?  Usually, you don't save "October surprises" for November.  biggrin
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« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2008, 10:36:03 PM »

or the Bradley effect is bigger than most people suspect/realize/like to admit...
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heloder
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« Reply #10 on: October 28, 2008, 11:25:19 AM »

Quote from: brettmcd on October 27, 2008, 02:45:53 PM

I am not a McCain supporter, but the attitudes of some of the Obama supports here almost makes me hope McCain does win.

Of course. If Obama/Biden wins, that's cool because it's the better ticket. If they lose, you get to listen to the howling from the leftist forums. It's win-win.
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YellowKing
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« Reply #11 on: October 28, 2008, 02:04:54 PM »

Quote
or the Bradley effect is bigger than most people suspect/realize/like to admit...

While it's true that since we've never had a black Presidential nominee we can't say for 100% certainty what the racial effect is on a Presidential election, there have been numerous studies that have found little to no Bradley effect since the phrase was coined, and there are other studies that dispute that it exists at all.

Even if there is a Bradley effect, I find it difficult to believe that it would be big enough to erase McCain's deficit in the polls. These aren't margin of error-type differences here.

If McCain wins (leaving aside voter fraud for a moment), it will be because Democratic turnout/new voter turnout was far lower than expected (unlikely, since early surveys show the exact opposite), and because undecideds ended up breaking in large numbers for McCain at the last minute, and he got a significant boost from independents (again, contrary to polls), and he squeaked by with some strange electoral combination that barely gave him the number of votes necessary (once again, contrary to polls). It's going to be the equivalent of walking into a casino and hitting 3 or 4 jackpots on the slots in a row. Sure it's possible, but right now it seems exceedingly unlikely.

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