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Author Topic: Fostering a pup.  (Read 3083 times)
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Booner
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« on: August 26, 2008, 06:27:14 PM »

What an odd ordeal.

My girlfriend is a Vet Tech at an emergency clinic, and every once and a while people have to surrender their animals if they cannot afford the treatments. About 2 months ago this lil 6-week old fella came in with seizures due to brain swelling and some other minor medical issues, but the owners couldn't afford the bill...so he was surrendered. They were going to put the guy down, but my lady has a soft spot for seizure-prone animals...she is epileptic too, so she helped him through a slow work-night and he was in good shape after a couple days of TLC. She believes that he may have been dropped or stepped on, but anyways...she took him in.

Well she had never raised a pup before, so she was at a complete loss at what to do and completely frustrated at his behavior...so she asked if I'd try to train him/keep him for a bit after about 3 days. My girls got a big heart, but little patience. smile

I'm the opposite, big bastard with lots of patience...so I took him off her hands and began puppy boot camp. Two months later and he's trained/trainable, housebroken, healthy, and full of love. This afternoon he'll be getting the last of his shots and be ready for a new home, he'll still need the big snip in a couple months, but that's it.

So I've printed up fliers, spoken with a few adoption centers, and plan on taking out a few adds in craigslist, the local traders, etc.

He's still in the nibbling, chewing, hyperactive stage of puppydom...but overall he's a good pup. He's smart and a fast learner...took about 5 minutes to teach him to sit, maybe 20 mins to laydown...stay and come have been tough, but he's slowly getting it. Not bad for a 3 month old.

There's only one rub though...I've kinda grown fond of the lil' guy. He loves me to pieces...follows me everywhere, sits in my lap, sleeps curled up near me. I'm just not sure I have the room for another permanent animal...especially something as fair sized as a Dutch Shepherd.

He's a bit bigger and his ears are fully standing , plus alot bigger than this 3 week old pic...but this is Grunts.


I guess I'm going to be extra picky on who gets him.

« Last Edit: August 26, 2008, 06:29:24 PM by Booner » Logged
The Grue
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« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2008, 06:41:16 PM »

He is so flippin' cute.
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kratz
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« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2008, 07:04:40 PM »

Cute as hell.

Somehow I've never heard of the Dutch Shepherd before... looks like my kind of dog.

Where do you live?

And were the seizures just symptomatic of an injury and now the dog no longer has seizures and is not epileptic?  My in-laws have an epileptic dog... she's a real sweetheart, but I know it is a challenge.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2008, 07:14:24 PM by kratz » Logged
Booner
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« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2008, 07:31:25 PM »

I live in SC...across the country from ya. :|

Don't worry, I had no clue about Dutch Shepherds until recently either. When I first brought him over I figured he was a shepherd+pit/boxer/terrier mix due to his brindle coat...but my girl said the reason the lady couldn't afford his medical bills is because she had just spent a bit of cash on buying him. Who would spend more than a basic fee on a mix-breed, and the more he grew the less terrier he looked. So I knew he was 'something'..so I started searching for short haired German Shepherds, and ended up with Belgian Malinois, then searched for brindle Malinois, found this pic of a Dutch and knew right off that was him.



His ears and snout have grown like this ones...I have to get a newer pic for the flier.

Once I read up on the breed, it explained why he would have what I term his occasional "Crack-Attack". If it's raining or I don't get a chance to take him for some outside time...he'll crouch down, pop his ass in the air, bark at me once, and then start tearing through my house at full speed, ass near the floor like it's on fire, while leaping over me...the Mastiff...the cats...the chairs. 5 minutes of pure high-octane insanity...then he'll hop into my lap and take a nap.

He really needs more to do than I have time/room for.

Edit: Nope...no further medical issues for him. He had a bit of flea anemia and possible head trauma from a kids foot or a drop, either could have caused the brain swelling and seizures. The only odd thing now is the vicious case of hiccups every once and a while. smile





« Last Edit: August 26, 2008, 07:36:55 PM by Booner » Logged
joeyjazz
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« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2008, 08:16:33 PM »

Beautiful puppy, I hope you're able to find him a great home.
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Daehawk
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« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2008, 08:33:18 PM »

Its awesome you two saved him and loved him. I just could'nt give him up after that much time with a little guy. Hell 1 day and nobody is prying a dog from me. smile
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« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2008, 08:35:46 PM »

Quote from: Booner on August 26, 2008, 06:27:14 PM

There's only one rub though...I've kinda grown fond of the lil' guy. He loves me to pieces...follows me everywhere, sits in my lap, sleeps curled up near me. I'm just not sure I have the room for another permanent animal...especially something as fair sized as a Dutch Shepherd.

Ah yes, the "temporary" fostering trap. I volunteered to foster a Boston Terrier until they could find him a permanent home and 4 years later he's still here:



I told them to take me off their list. Two dogs in the house is enough.
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kratz
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« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2008, 08:49:50 PM »

Wish we could come and meet him. frown

The wife and I had said we'd wait a while before we got another dog, but already we're both combing the shelters online.  Our house just feels empty with McHann gone.
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« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2008, 08:53:37 PM »

My daughter gave my ex-wife a silky terrrier for her birthday about 3 years ago.
Shit happened and my ex-wife had to move and couldnt take the dog with her.
She called me looking for $50 to take the dog to the local ACS.
The dog was basically untrained and uncared for.

Never went out of the basement. Not housebroken. Dirty, matted hair.
It would chew and claw the doors and furniture.
Had terrible separation anxiety.

I thought the thing wouldnt stand a chance of getting adopted anytime soon, so I took her.

Within 2 weeks she was almost totally housebroke and doing tricks.
4 months later shes doing great and is able to be home by herself, with our 2 cats, all day with no accidents.
She got all of her shots and was groomed. Hasnt been spayed yet. Not sure I'm going to do that, though it may help to settle her down some, which she could use. Besides the obvious health benefits.

I, like so many others, swore I was done after my last dog died.

Princess (not my choice of names) makes me glad I changed my mind.
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« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2008, 09:49:42 PM »

That's funny, my SIL went through a very similar situation (although with a different ending). She is the administrator of an animal specialty hospital (although was a vet tech when she was younger) and one day a guy came in with a Vizsla that he had literally just bought and then had been hit by a car. He couldn't afford the surgery because he had blown all of his money buying the dog. As it happened, my SIL and BIL were considering getting a Vizsla to add to their 2 Whippets, so she offered to take the dog off his hands. Unfortunately, the dog was a little hard to train and didn't get along with the female Whippet. After doggie therapy and everything else they could try, they finally gave up. They found a home for the Vizsla on a big farm where he apparently is having the time of his life, but they felt frustrated that they couldn't get it to work out.
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JCAnejo
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« Reply #10 on: August 27, 2008, 02:25:39 AM »

Dutch Shepherds have become the favorite dog of the sheriff's department here  for their police dogs. They are a little more stable then the malinois so they have imported a whole breeding line. Whoever gets him should realize they have an extreme working breed and better be smart cause he is and be ready to do plenty of training to keep his brain busy or there will most likely be trouble. It is a really impressive breed to see working, fast and powerful.
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« Reply #11 on: August 27, 2008, 04:47:05 AM »

Quote from: JCAnejo on August 27, 2008, 02:25:39 AM

Whoever gets him should realize they have an extreme working breed and better be smart cause he is and be ready to do plenty of training to keep his brain busy or there will most likely be trouble. It is a really impressive breed to see working, fast and powerful.

Yeah, he's plenty smart...and with it comes clever. Just under four months old and he'll come marching into the living room and drop his food dish at my feet. He's also figured out that standing on the pedal opens the top of the trashcan.  If I catch him doing something he's been told more than once not to...he'll see me and run right under my coffee table before I even have to scold him.

I could tell he'll be strong. He may look a bit lanky, but he is pretty athletic and can pull like hell even at a young age.

Once I read about the breed, I had a better understanding on what was causing him to do some of the things he does and have been able to adjust our daily routine.

The only thing I'm having difficulty with is the constant mouthing...his bite inhibition is good (no pressure), yet he'll get into a mode where he just doesn't stop. I know it's typical of pups his age due to teething, I just want him to stop with the fingers, hands, and toes. I've tried scruffing, quick hand 'bites' to his neck, gentle pops to the lower jaw, yelping and walking away....but he doesn't seem to get it.

Any suggestions?



   
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kratz
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« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2008, 06:00:54 AM »

Wait for him to get a bit older?  Figure a dog's mouth is its hands, and a puppy... they are just going to try everything out.

Our shepherd just grew out of it.
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« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2008, 07:01:47 AM »

We gave our Weimer lots and lots of toys...she finally grew out of it (I think).  She still likes to gnaw on her bed - so we replace that every so often.
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« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2008, 04:17:21 PM »

Quote from: Booner on August 27, 2008, 04:47:05 AM

The only thing I'm having difficulty with is the constant mouthing...his bite inhibition is good (no pressure), yet he'll get into a mode where he just doesn't stop. I know it's typical of pups his age due to teething, I just want him to stop with the fingers, hands, and toes. I've tried scruffing, quick hand 'bites' to his neck, gentle pops to the lower jaw, yelping and walking away....but he doesn't seem to get it.

Any suggestions?

When we had this problem our trainer had us use Grannick's Bitter Apple Spray.  It is an all-natural citrus-based product that won't harm your dog and is safe for any surface, fabrics, electronics, and skin.  The key is first acclimating your dog to the spray's flavor and scent.  Otherwise some develop an affinity for the spray and that pretty much ruins its effectiveness.

To properly acclimate your dog to the spray, choose a starting day and both in the morning and that night spray a full blast of the spray into the back of your dog's throat.  You will feel horrible when he starts coughing, making that "I just ate something awful face", and maybe foaming a little around the mouth.  But trust me, it is worth the initial heartache.  Make sure not to do this anywhere near when your dog just recently ate.  Otherwise he could throw up, making you feel even worse, and then providing another mess to clean up. 

For argument's sake, let's say that you started on a Monday.  Go through the same process on Wednesday, and then again on Friday (more or less going through the acclimation process for three days, every other day).  Following this week of acclimation your dog should absolutely loathe the spray.  If he even sees the bottle he'll probably do his best to get away.  Now that he is familiar with the spray's scent and flavor, if there is anything in your house you don't want him to chew on, give it a light spray of Bitter Apple.  Your dog may show some curiosity, and he might even take a tentative lick, but the moment he tastes Bitter Apple he'll never go near that item again.

My point is that once your dog is acclimated to Bitter Apple, you can also use it to discourage him from being "mouthy."  In order to do this, make sure not to get any of the spray on your dog's toys, otherwise he'll not want anything to do with them anymore.  First, spray one arm and hand with Bitter Apple, making sure not to get any on your other arm or hand.  Then, play with your dog with the "clean" hand, holding your Bitter Apple hand behind your back.  Anytime your dog gets mouthy and starts nipping at your hand, quickly switch hands and place the Bitter Apple hand/arm/wrist in his mouth.  Force him to get a good portion of your arm/hand/wrist into his mouth so he gets that Bitter Apple flavor.  Then pet him, say "it's okay", and go back to playing with the "clean" hand.  If he gets mouthy again, quickly switch and put the Bitter Apple hand into his mouth again.  You don't have to do it all the time, but if you take the time to do this for 15 minutes each evening for a few days, before the end of the week if he accidentally gets your hand in his mouth he'll let go as quickly as possible and you won't have a mouthing problem ever again.

We learned this process from our professional obedience trainer and it works like a charm.  It isn't cruel, it doesn't require any physical discipline or yelling, and the spray merely causes the dog to salivate more than usual, which to them is an unpleasant sensation.  Soon he won't ever get mouthy again, and if he accidentally gets your hand in his mouth, even without any Bitter Apple spray, he'll let go immediately.  And it is a rather easy and effective method. 
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« Reply #15 on: August 27, 2008, 04:29:37 PM »

Quote from: PeteRock on August 27, 2008, 04:17:21 PM



When we had this problem our trainer had us use Grannick's Bitter Apple Spray.  It is an all-natural citrus-based product that won't harm your dog and is safe for any surface, fabrics, electronics, and skin.  The key is first acclimating your dog to the spray's flavor and scent.  Otherwise some develop an affinity for the spray and that pretty much ruins its effectiveness.

Plus, it doubles as a cologne...how do you think Pete keeps smelling so fabulous?  Fabulous
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Booner
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« Reply #16 on: August 27, 2008, 05:46:05 PM »

Thanks Pete...I'll give this a shot. I have a PetCo on my way home.

As far as the heartache thing...the initial unpleasantries are always hard, but I know these disciplinary things always make for a healthier, happier dog. I ended up having to get him a barking collar a while back as he would just have a complete fit when getting caged...I felt bad for him when it would hit him and he'd yelp, but after a few days he was over it and has learned to relax in the cage and not freak out. Now when I come to uncage him, he just sits at the door and waits for me to open it up.

I did have to test the thing on myself before I put it on him though. I pressed the prongs against my arms and barked at it until it went off a few times at increasing levels.  icon_lol

Uncomfortable...but not really painful. Similar to licking a pair of 9volt batteries. biggrin
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PeteRock
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« Reply #17 on: August 27, 2008, 05:51:38 PM »

Quote from: Booner on August 27, 2008, 05:46:05 PM

Thanks Pete...I'll give this a shot. I have a PetCo on my way home.

Just be sure to follow my trainer's directions.  You have to go through that week of acclimation before using the spray on items around the house or else your dog may not develop quite the level of aversion he needs to have in order for the spray to work.

Also, do not try the spray on yourself.  Seriously.  We had a guy in class once decide that he was going to try the spray out on himself before using it on his dog and he needed a roll of paper towels to catch all of the saliva.  His salivary glands went into overdrive and he looked like a rabid loonatic as foam and saliva came running uncontrollably out of his mouth.  But if you do decide to go against my warning, I'd be curious to read about your experience.   icon_wink
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« Reply #18 on: August 27, 2008, 05:56:25 PM »

Don't tempt me.  ninja
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« Reply #19 on: August 27, 2008, 08:00:01 PM »

You might have luck with Bitter Apple or Orange but just realize that some dogs like the taste. Sounds like you are doing the right things with your bite training. The biggest one is always letting the puppy realize that you will not interact with it when it mis behaves. Certainly is one of the mouthier breeds to begin with but if you and everyone that interacts with himn is consistant then he should get it.

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« Reply #20 on: August 27, 2008, 08:03:15 PM »

Quote from: Booner on August 27, 2008, 05:46:05 PM

Thanks Pete...I'll give this a shot. I have a PetCo on my way home.

If someone finds a PeteCo, please let me know.  I could use a little fabulousness in my life.
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rickfc
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« Reply #21 on: August 27, 2008, 08:06:09 PM »

Quote from: Isgrimnur on August 27, 2008, 08:03:15 PM

Quote from: Booner on August 27, 2008, 05:46:05 PM

Thanks Pete...I'll give this a shot. I have a PetCo on my way home.

If someone finds a PeteCo, please let me know.  I could use a little fabulousness in my life.

I LOL'd...

And seriously, you should open PeteCo, Pete.  You'd not only be fabulous, but rich too.
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« Reply #22 on: August 27, 2008, 08:35:36 PM »

Quote from: JCAnejo on August 27, 2008, 08:00:01 PM

You might have luck with Bitter Apple or Orange but just realize that some dogs like the taste.

Hey, yeah mine did.  She would sit there licking whatever you sprayed clean.  Loved it.
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rickfc
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« Reply #23 on: August 27, 2008, 08:39:37 PM »

Quote from: kratz on August 27, 2008, 08:35:36 PM

Quote from: JCAnejo on August 27, 2008, 08:00:01 PM

You might have luck with Bitter Apple or Orange but just realize that some dogs like the taste.

Hey, yeah mine did.  She would sit there licking whatever you sprayed clean.  Loved it.

Yeah, we had a Norwegian Elkhound that loved fucking hot sauce.  They told us to put that on anything we didn't want him to bite, and it did the exact opposite.  biggrin
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« Reply #24 on: August 27, 2008, 08:45:48 PM »

Quote from: rickfc on August 27, 2008, 08:39:37 PM

Yeah, we had a Norwegian Elkhound that loved fucking hot sauce.  They told us to put that on anything we didn't want him to bite, and it did the exact opposite.  biggrin

Uhm ... ew?  Must have made cleanup a little messy.
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« Reply #25 on: August 27, 2008, 08:49:49 PM »

Quote from: Isgrimnur on August 27, 2008, 08:45:48 PM

Quote from: rickfc on August 27, 2008, 08:39:37 PM

Yeah, we had a Norwegian Elkhound that loved fucking hot sauce.  They told us to put that on anything we didn't want him to bite, and it did the exact opposite.  biggrin

Uhm ... ew?  Must have made cleanup a little messy.

Well, he used to love chewing through the AC wires on the outside unit, so first, we covered them in foam and then wrapped that in the hard aluminum.  He chewed through that.  So we did it again and then put a hot sauce-soaked rag on there.  He fucking ate the rag and then chewed through the wires again.  We ended up fencing the fucking unit up so he couldn't get to it.   icon_lol
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« Reply #26 on: August 27, 2008, 08:58:51 PM »

Actually my comment was more about your choice of word order rather than the facts of the situation. 
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« Reply #27 on: August 27, 2008, 09:23:21 PM »

Well...curiosity got the best of me and had had a wee taste of that Bitter Spray.

Bleck. retard

No foaming of the mouth, but I'd only imagine that the pups super-sensitive taste and nose will not be too thrilled once I start the 'treatment'.
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« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2008, 09:25:15 PM »

Quote from: Isgrimnur on August 27, 2008, 08:58:51 PM

Actually my comment was more about your choice of word order rather than the facts of the situation. 

oh, I just caught that.  Tongue
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« Reply #29 on: August 27, 2008, 09:29:29 PM »

Quote from: Booner on August 27, 2008, 09:23:21 PM

Well...curiosity got the best of me and had had a wee taste of that Bitter Spray.

Pussy.  If you wanted the full effect you should have applied a full spray.  For some reason I just knew you wouldn't be able to resist.   icon_wink  

As a kid curiosity once got the better of me while I waited in my mom's car as she ran into Wendy's.  I had pressed in the cigarette lighter and when it popped out I was curious as to just how hot "red-hot" really was.  I pressed the lighter firmly to my thumb and the inside of the car immediately smelled like seared PeteRock.  Apparently "red-hot" is pretty damn hot.  For quite some time my thumbprint resembled a perfect spiral.   retard  

Quote
No foaming of the mouth, but I'd only imagine that the pups super-sensitive taste and nose will not be too thrilled once I start the 'treatment'.

As JC has said, some dogs seem to like the taste.  Hopefully yours does not.  But it can't hurt to at least try.  If it works your biting issues will be solved pretty quickly.  If not then we'll have to come up with something else.
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« Reply #30 on: August 28, 2008, 05:58:48 PM »

Nope, he does not like the taste. Well, at least not yet.

He was extremely dejected after getting a blast of it this morning...crawled under my coffe table and licked his chops for 5 minutes looking at me with his "What did I do?" look.

One another note, I found this clip this morning...oh boy, my hands are full with a Dutch and a Mastiff.   retard

Edit: This is what he looks like now...lots of ear.

« Last Edit: August 28, 2008, 06:03:47 PM by Booner » Logged
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« Reply #31 on: August 28, 2008, 06:09:26 PM »

I keep reading this thread title as "Frosting a pup." Then I come in here, and there's no cake.  retard
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« Reply #32 on: August 28, 2008, 08:36:55 PM »

Wish we could meet him.
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« Reply #33 on: August 29, 2008, 07:32:56 PM »

We just had our application with the Front Range German Shepherd Rescue in Colorado accepted.  Without even a phone call.

Guess they liked my application. smile

Now we just need to keep an eye out for a dog.
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« Reply #34 on: August 29, 2008, 08:07:31 PM »

I was trying to let you know what these guys could do. As a Police dog demonstration I have never seen anything like them agile, powerful and fierce it was very impressive. Wish I could find the old story of the first one on the Cape's first meeting with a suspect. Let's just say that after deciding to ignore the calls to stop and lay down they let the dog go. The suspect thought better of it after the dog was lose but as he turned around to change his mind the dog hit him and the next thing he knew he was in an ambulance on the way to the hospital knocked him right out and busted some ribs. Always remember when a policeman says hit the ground or we will let the dog go...... hit the f'n ground people
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« Reply #35 on: August 29, 2008, 08:22:59 PM »

Quote from: JCAnejo on August 29, 2008, 08:07:31 PM

Always remember when a policeman says hit the ground or we will let the dog go...... hit the f'n ground people

Hopefully most around here aren't very likely to find themselves in this type of situation.   ninja
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« Reply #36 on: August 29, 2008, 08:46:07 PM »

Found another awesome looking program in Colorado that actually has a large number of Dutch Shepherds (and some absolutely beautiful Belgian Malinois).  It's the Dept. of Corrections K-9 Companion program, where dogs are trained by inmates.  Pretty cool.

Here's a link.

http://www.coloradoci.com/?puppy

Kiya and Baby are some good looking dogs...

It's about a 4 hour trip from here to there... might have to schedule a time to go and look.
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« Reply #37 on: August 29, 2008, 10:12:12 PM »

Quote from: PeteRock on August 29, 2008, 08:22:59 PM

Quote from: JCAnejo on August 29, 2008, 08:07:31 PM

Always remember when a policeman says hit the ground or we will let the dog go...... hit the f'n ground people

Hopefully most around here aren't very likely to find themselves in this type of situation.   ninja

Just Ron.
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Booner
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« Reply #38 on: September 03, 2008, 08:07:25 PM »

Well...I've mulled it over for the past few days and I'm pretty sure I'm gonna have the little guy stay. I didn't really need another pet, but I've spent so much time getting him trained in preparation for a new home that he's turning out to be a cool pup.

Granted at four months old this week, he's still full of puppy...he's easily distracted from the commands he already knows and goes into hyper mode when new people are around...but in time I think he'll end up being well behaved and obedient. He's already loving as anything, so I hope that once he grows a bit mellower he'll be a fantastic dog to have around.

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PeteRock
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« Reply #39 on: September 03, 2008, 08:27:57 PM »

Quote from: Booner on September 03, 2008, 08:07:25 PM

Well...I've mulled it over for the past few days and I'm pretty sure I'm gonna have the little guy stay. I didn't really need another pet, but I've spent so much time getting him trained in preparation for a new home that he's turning out to be a cool pup.

Granted at four months old this week, he's still full of puppy...he's easily distracted from the commands he already knows and goes into hyper mode when new people are around...but in time I think he'll end up being well behaved and obedient. He's already loving as anything, so I hope that once he grows a bit mellower he'll be a fantastic dog to have around.



Out of curiosity, how has the Bitter Apple worked with discouraging mouthy play? 
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Beauty is only skin deep.  Which is why I take very good care of my skin.
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