[Private citizens generate income through productively providing a product or service that people want and can afford.]

So you would never consider increasing your income as part of your plan? That's pretty silly.

The government doesn't have income. Taxes are removing money from one part of the economy, taking some out to cover bureaucracy and then moving it to another part of the economy.

Isn't that what we all do? In your scenario, they don't have any expenses either. I can't believe you'd argue taxes aren't government income.

No, that's not what we all do. Private citizens generate income through productively providing a product or service that people want and can afford. We don't forcibly take money from the system and put it somewhere else. And yes, the government has expenses known as bureaucracy.

I'm not an Anarchist. I think there is a proper and moral role for government to take. Unfortunately 99% of all politicians rate their success by how much they grow the size and power of government.

So taking it from another area of the economy in other words. Governments provide services we need and want. Governments have budgets. Hopefully the amount they have to spend (i.e fire dept. salary) is less than the amount they take in (i.e. property taxes). Why are you so reluctant to call what they take in income?

Ale

So you would never consider increasing your income as part of your plan? That's pretty silly.

The government doesn't have income. Taxes are removing money from one part of the economy, taking some out to cover bureaucracy and then moving it to another part of the economy.

Isn't that what we all do? In your scenario, they don't have any expenses either. I can't believe you'd argue taxes aren't government income.

Ale

I know, that total is insane, and not one cent of it should be spent in those ways.

Yeah, maybe not all of it was needed, but I think its pretty clear the way things were heading that a very large stimulus package was needed. I know you'll disagree with me, and thats fine, but you're wrong. All these billions to my knowledge have kept the credit market from collapsing and getting us into a worse mess than the Great Depression.

We should be pillorying Bush and Clinton advisors over this. Hopefull Obama can dig us out of the hole, though it will probably take two terms to do. At least I live in the industrial country least affected by this crisis.

The only thing I'm worried about is the fact that Obama will need to probably do some general tax increases and they'll be needed, but Americans don't seem to realize yet that having the lowest tax levels in the post-industrial world has got to end if the government is going to remain able to pay bills in the long term. Again, you can disagree with me on this as cutting some of the social programs would largely solve these issues (and we could have a discussion about that), but that doesn't seem realistic or even feasible.

Yes yes tax increases when in an economic downturn, thats a recipe for recovery   

Cutting programs is the only way to make up any of this money, unless you just want to increase the length of the recession or even turn it into a depression with idiotic tax increases.

I agree.  Increasing taxes as a way to boost the economy-the concept is so flawed it's laughable.  It is the SIZE and WASTE of government spending that has got us here.  The ONLY way to fix it is to do what you, me, and ANYONE else with even the teeniest sense on how to stay within a budget would do,  stop spending money on things you don't absolutely need and pay off your debt. 

Let me tell you why raising taxes won't lower our national debt.  Because, get ready for it, the government won't spend a fucking dime on paying off the debt.  They will just continue to spend money on bad, wasteful programs, and even start a few more.  They are like a person whose credit card is completely charged up to the max and then someone is stupid enough to give them money so they can go buy a new stereo.  How fucking dumb is that??!!!


Mark my words, giving them another red cent more than they are getting will       not      fix      anything!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So you would never consider increasing your income as part of your plan? That's pretty silly.

Ale

[full extent]

I have to say Cheeba you are the one that brought it up as an example and now you are saying no one can know what happened.

That would not be a correct interpretation. Words mean things. Quoth me:

None of these articles we cited even know the full extent of what happened.

We know stuff happened. W's removed from keyboards, lewd photos left in copiers, phone lines cut - at least some of that stuff happened.

If you have been around the government and worked inside the Capitol beltway you would know that GSA, especially with a brand new incoming administration would never just flat out say the White House staff made it up.

Weird sentence. You think "being around government" or proximity to Washington DC gives one special insight into the White House General Services Administration?

And the oddly described lettuce is right. This is a stupid argument. Can we end this, or are you guys really so desperate to say, "omgz we won!"?

Why have none of you commented on these booing democrats? You really think democrats don't boo? Or show lack of class?

The thread is called McCain's Concession Speech. Why would we talk about booing Democrats?

This thread is a great example of why politics doesn't work. You guys are arguing about nonsense just like the Repubs and the Dems do.  If you'd quit trying to figure out whose d*** is bigger and try to find a common ground, maybe this country would get somewhere and you and your annointed ones woundn't be Party first, country a DISTANT 2nd.

It's not about whose deck is bigger, it's about someone making accusations based on facts they admit we know nothing about, all the while claiming to be non-partisan.

Ale

Obviously people care or we won't have this thread or other sites where people accused Bethesda for lying.

As for not expecting Bethesda to know the rumor that was spread by fans? Just try this, google "Fallout 3 DRM" today. Check the result on the first several pages, more than one hit is from article that claim that Fallout 3 has no DRM. Or go to amazon site and read about what people post about Fallout 3 before release.

It has a CD Check.  Whether you consider that DRM or not, I don't know but Bethesda was up front about it. 

Should that CD check check whether I have emulation software? Is that part of checking for the disk?

Ale

AFAIK, CD Checks that detect Alcohol and Daemon Tools have been pretty standard for many years now so I would assume the answer is yes. 

Lesse... if I were going to hire a security guard service for a wedding, am I going to hire:

A) A nazi SS guard so anal he does full body cavity checks on every guest and all the members of the party
B) Barney Fife
C) John McClane (Die Hard) who knows who the bad guys are and acts when he needs to but not before.

Yeah. People are upset that it's not Don Knots asleep in the corner; apparently Bethsoft is interested in letting people enjoy their product whilst deterring casual piracy.

If you hire a guard at a wedding to make sure no one crashes it, and he ends up doing cavity searches, you definitely hired the wrong guard and the guests sure aren't going to dig it.

Ale

Obviously people care or we won't have this thread or other sites where people accused Bethesda for lying.

As for not expecting Bethesda to know the rumor that was spread by fans? Just try this, google "Fallout 3 DRM" today. Check the result on the first several pages, more than one hit is from article that claim that Fallout 3 has no DRM. Or go to amazon site and read about what people post about Fallout 3 before release.

It has a CD Check.  Whether you consider that DRM or not, I don't know but Bethesda was up front about it. 

Should that CD check check whether I have emulation software? Is that part of checking for the disk?

Ale

AFAIK, CD Checks that detect Alcohol and Daemon Tools have been pretty standard for many years now so I would assume the answer is yes. 

Well, then that ceases to be just a disk check, doesn't it? And I have neither of those. And it has only happened once out of about 8 starts.

Obviously people care or we won't have this thread or other sites where people accused Bethesda for lying.

As for not expecting Bethesda to know the rumor that was spread by fans? Just try this, google "Fallout 3 DRM" today. Check the result on the first several pages, more than one hit is from article that claim that Fallout 3 has no DRM. Or go to amazon site and read about what people post about Fallout 3 before release.

It has a CD Check.  Whether you consider that DRM or not, I don't know but Bethesda was up front about it. 

Should that CD check check whether I have emulation software? Is that part of checking for the disk?

Ale

I prefer eating beaver without mustard. 

Perhaps you prefer a little mayo?

Ale

After starting the game 3 times, the second time gave me a Windows error, I got an error message the fourth time saying something about incompatibility with emulation software, and had a Securom link for more info. I just cancelled and restarted and it worked that time. Is this just part of the cd check?

Ale

^Guess who's been called a kool-aid drinker before  .

That's awesome! 

Ale

Well to be totally honest the judge didnt rule on the merits of the case one way or the other, just to say that Berg doesnt have the standing to bring the case forward.

What do you think of the merits of the case?

Ale

Yeah, good responses. I kept thinking it was WTFTV, not WFTV.

Ale

At least it wasn't lupus.

Ale

Haven't we been redistributing wealth to the super-rich for a while now?

Ale

Notice gas prices aren't dropping as quickly as they go up.  And no one elected office is doing anything about it...

Maybe because a gas station owner wants/needs to sell his older gas he bought at a higher price somewhere near that price so he doesn't take a total bath on it?  So he, you know, can attempt to make a profit and keep his station open?

And your defense for why he raised the price so eagerly on gas he'd already bought for less?

Ale

Any word on the cost of haircuts?

edit:

She did an interview with People magazine that's out on newstands today that reveals the next baby name she'd use:

Palin said if she and husband Todd had had a sixth child, they had already picked a name for a boy joining siblings Track, Bristol, Willow, Piper and Trig.

"I always wanted a son named Zamboni," she said.

I have to admire her creativity.

Seeing as that's the machine that grooms hockey rinks, I'm hoping that's humor, not creativity.

Ale

Unfair poll. We all know the liberal elite sip a ton of over-priced coffee while reading their Nietzsche!

Apparently so does Joe the Plumber, considering the poll involves 7-11 coffee.

Ale

[I never have advocated or subscribed to the idea that Obama was anti-American, muslim, or any of the blogger smears. Liberal bloggers, on the other hand, are just as out of control as some on the right.]

Same ol' Democrat character assassination on Palin.      I'm not suprised.

Same ol' Duncan hypocrisy.

Ale

Your side paints Palin as either stupid, or insane (relative to her religious beliefs).

My side paints Obama as a socialist.   And he is.    Redistribution of wealth is socalist.    This tax plan of Obama's is redistribution of wealth.   38% of those he would give a tax cut to already get full refunds.

I never have advocated or subscribed to the idea that Obama was anti-American, muslim, or any of the blogger smears.   Liberal bloggers, on the other hand, are just as out of control as some on the right.

You're kidding, wright?

Ale

John McCain's spiritual guide.  Scary as fuck...

And Jeremiah Wright isn't scary?

Edit - See, this is why y'all think I'm pro-McCain and/or anti-Obama. The minister linked in the video is scary as hell. But so is Jeremiah Wright. Some of the hypocritical points in that video about McCain are bad. But Obama has changed his views as well, and has been hypocritical as well. For example, first he was against drilling, now he seems to be for it. He promised to take public funding, but realized how dumb that was and went back on it. Politicians are hypocrites by their very nature.

No, the reason we think you're right-wing is because whenever someone posts anything critical of a conservative, you always say, "But the democrats are just as bad". I've never seen you do anything similar when a liberal is criticized. It's ok to have a critical discussion of someone. We don't constantly need to be reminded that someone else is guilty also.

Ale

Same ol' Democrat character assassination on Palin.      I'm not suprised.

Same ol' Duncan hypocrisy.

Ale

McKinney 93
Nader 85
Obama 68
McCain 48

I guess the most liberal senator evar! is not liberal enough for me.

Ale

[No doubt there's still a lot of progress to be made]

The hits just keep on coming.  We, as a country, have not progressed as far as we might like to think.

I love quotes like this.

We, as a country, for the first time in our history have a black man running as one of the major candidates for President.
We, as a country, for the first time in our history are very likely to elect that black man into the highest office one can attain in our country.

But you don't hear that much do you? Instead, you hear junk like, "we are not as progressed as we might like to think" because some idiot county chairman is being an idiot.

No doubt there's still a lot of progress to be made, but this should be a time of celebration. Look at the 50 some million or whatever people who are going to vote for the first time for a black candidate, rather than the 1 idiot county chairman who thought he was being clever with stupid slogans.

"We, as a country, have not progressed as far as we might like to think."

How are these two statements different?

Ale

What's next? you're voting for Obama?! 

Actually I am voting for Obama. This would not surprise you if little things like facts mattered in your reasoning.

Little tip for ya: arguing against the far-left insanity often displayed on this forum does not make me far right.

Maybe people wouldn't think you so conservative if you spent any time arguing against the far-right insanity.

Ale

Holy christ. These people make Cheeba seem like a flaming liberal in comparison.

You talk as if I'm ultra-conservative, when I'm closer to the middle than you are .

How do you know that? Do you know where he stands on nearly every issue?

Ale

I'm so shocked the Alaska legislature came to a different conclusion than the McCain campaign.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7662820.stm

4 more years, baby!

Ale

[No one cares what some idiot county chairman says]

Yes.  In that thread, an outspoken Republican started a thread because he took personal umbrage at the suggestion that any other Republican, anywhere, would ever mount a race-based attack.  You didn't have a problem with that.

In this thread, an outspoken Democrat has started a thread about a particularly explicit race-based attack made by a Republican working on McCain's campaign and, after dismissing it as a "joke" by a "county scrub," you've started objecting to the very existence of the topic.

Context matters. It matters who says what. Everyone cares what Barack Obama says. No one cares what some idiot county chairman says.

what *exactly* was your point?  Does overt, vitriolic racism not count so long as the campaign official spewing it eventually remembers to say, "Kidding!"

You don't get to make that call, and, you've been proven wrong.

Ale

So if two people serve on a board, of a charitable group, it means they have some sort of relationship that a voter needs to be concerned about?

Don't forget that Obama went to Ayers' home to kick off his senate run.

I am certainly not friends with everyone I work closely with on a daily basis.

Have you gone to the home of anyone you worked with who was not your friend?

Why should it reflect badly on Obama that someone who supports him has a bad history but is now a community leader?

That "bad history" is more like "radical, terrorist history." Personally, I can't blame people for asking the questions about his ties to this guy. Whether or not those questions are satisfactorily answered is up to each person to decide for himself. For me, someone who is very likely to vote for Obama, this doesn't change that. It does add a pause in there, though, and it is worth criticism.

What exactly is the pause? Do you think maybe under Obama's leadership, the Weather Underground will be resurgent? Again, what gives you pause?

Ale

most recently by slandering Obama as one who hangs out with terrorists.

You're saying it's untrue he hung around with Ayers? Or that Ayers is not a terrorist?

Ummm.... both. If he's a terrorist, why is he still on the loose? He's got to be easier to find than bin Laden , don't you think?

Ale

OJ knew exactly what the hell he was doing, however setup it might seem or been.   he's a lowlife scum who got away with murder and thought he was above the law.  he could have simply went to the proper authorities and went through the proper channels to get his property.   but instead he chose to go along with this plan, which included guns btw.

hell ya he deserves to go down.   karma is a bitch....won't find one drop of sympathy or second guessing with this for me.   i personally don't care how he went down....just that he did.

Except where you second guess the jury that acquitted him.

Ale

For me personally, I don't give a rat's ass what they think on how old the earth is.  Their opinion on that matter has no affect on me.  What does is their opinion on these terrorist motherfuckers and our economy.  I want every last one of them, and their supporters, dead dead dead.  That and someone in office who doesn't think stealing more of my hard-earned money to make gov't bigger is the answer to America's problems.  Those are the ONLY two things I care about.  On every other subject I will take care of myself.   

So who do you think best addresses your two criteria?

Ale

LOL,yeah he's famous isnt he,so i reckon a fine and some community service

Correction. He was famous. He's now infamous. I'm hoping the sentencing judge was really pissed at the outcome of the "trial of the century", and doesn't mind setting things right.

It would be sad if that happened. Judges aren't supposed to have vendettas.

Ale

Another reason rice is popular in American lagers is that it is cheaper than barley malt.

Do all the big guys use it? I always thought it was a Bud thing.

Speaking of AB, how is ShockTop? I have never tried it.

I think some of them do, and some also use corn in the form of starch or syrup (especially malt liquors).

I didn't know Shock Top was AB. That's the orangey wheat or belgian-style one, isn't it? I smelled one someone was drinking out of a bottle and it didn't smell very good.

Ale

Rice adds no flavor to the beer. It is used to lighten the body and dryness to the beer. It gives the so-called "crispness" that Bud has marketed to us for generations.

While technically rice may contribute no flavor of it's own, you can't say brewing with it doesn't influence the flavor of the beer. You could use plain white sugar as an adjunct, and while you wouldn't be able to taste the sugar, the flavor would be noticeably different.

Another reason rice is popular in American lagers is that it is cheaper than barley malt.

Ale

I strongly disagree. While it is drinkable compared to the rest of the stuff they call beer, it is still quite weak flavored and has this Budweiser like after taste that I didn't like it all (maybe from the rice?). It tastes like a water downed amber to me. I would buy it only if my choices were it or Bud. For that price ($7 here) I expect a lot more from a beer.

I'd be surprised if it contained rice or corn. Have you seen an ingredient list?



Ale

No, but Budweiser uses rice in their other beers, why would this be different? It has a similar taste to Bud I think.

Because this is a different kind of beer? The whole point is to mimic a craft brew, isn't it?

I wonder if they are 'aging' it on beechwood, and if that might give it a distinctive Bud taste.

Ale

I strongly disagree. While it is drinkable compared to the rest of the stuff they call beer, it is still quite weak flavored and has this Budweiser like after taste that I didn't like it all (maybe from the rice?). It tastes like a water downed amber to me. I would buy it only if my choices were it or Bud. For that price ($7 here) I expect a lot more from a beer.

I'd be surprised if it contained rice or corn. Have you seen an ingredient list?

Ale

Damn. Are you sure it's the stones again? Have you ever had appendicitis?

Ale

It's not just that he posted a new thread, it's that he loves to see something fail that he either didn't like, or couldn't play, and doesn't miss a chance to bring it up. He's been doing it for years.

And this is different from the rest of the internet, how? 

What's your point? Do you really think that's all the Internet is?

Ale

The bickering in here is ridiculous and needs to stop.  While we all might prefer tidier threads, GT doesn't have a policy about "Official" threads or anything of the sort so it's generally up to the posters' discretion if they start a new thread or put it in an existing thread.  People who are intent on criticizing the quality of others posts probably wouldn't want that same microscope applied to every one of their own posts. 

FWIW, I agree with morlac and DragonFyre- I would never have looked into AoC impressions thread but I do find news of the server merge interesting in an industry news sense and would not have known about it if it weren't for this thread. 

It's not just that he posted a new thread, it's that he loves to see something fail that he either didn't like, or couldn't play, and doesn't miss a chance to bring it up. He's been doing it for years.

Ale