Hello I'm msduncan and I have a Pokemon problem.

[msduncan]

Ok then, back to the drawing board.   Working on unlocking the Nat Dex and then I'll just Ditto until I breed one with good stats.

[Autistic Angel]

Wait a sec....  ok.    I think I see the root of my confusion.  I was under the impression that the NATURE determined the values.     But what I'm hearing from you is that even among two animials of the same Nature, you have varying values.

So there is still a random element to each value you get, thus some Jolly versions might well suck as well?

Yes.  Nature influence specific stats, making certain attitudes ideal for bolstering a pokemon's most valuable qualities at minimal cost, but being Jolly is simply weighting an individual pokemon's baseline stat growth.  Those are random within each species, but can be influenced by selective EV grinding.

In that case I need something that gives me a guide or something on what values are considered good or not.  When I catch a Gible or something else it's daunting trying to figure out what would be considered a good value.

For anything outside the highest tiers of competitive play, it won't matter.  A properly balanced team built around effective EV training will smoke all comers regardless of where your chosen Gible originally fell on its species' bell curve.  

Pokemon eugenics will devour your soul.  Turn away now.  Breed yourself a couple more Jolly Gibles, figure out which one has the best genetic inclination for the one or two stats you value most, and just let nature handle the rest.

-Autistic Angel

[Destructor]

On an entirely random note - it's impressive how such a simple looking game on its surface can be so overwhelmingly complicated when you start digging deep into the rabbit hole.

[Autistic Angel]

Pokemon have a lot in common with Nietzsche's void.  Gaze too long into the IVs of a genetically superior Magmortar, the code starts looking back.

msduncan will either blink, or he'll wind up forfeiting a championship by hurling his own feces at opposing trainers.  Only time will tell.

-Autistic Angel

[msduncan]

I'm loving the subtle complexity in this game.   For the casual observer it looks like a cartoony simple minded game.   The actual truth is deeper than anyone suspects.    Far deeper.

[wonderpug]

What's great about the series, though, is that it's set up to be as complex as you want it to be.  

• Stage 1 - Play with monsters you think are cute.  Totally doable, and while the end of the game will be tough, you can still make it through the whole storyline this way
• Stage 2 - Understand the basic rock/paper/scissors mechanics.  Big leg up, even if you don't have a whole strength/weakness damage table memorized or printed out
• Stage 3 - Understand that there are stronger and weaker pokemon within a single species, but not know exactly how or why.  Another big leg up, even if you just go off of "this one has big potential!" in-game character evaluations.
• Stage 72 - the msduncan min/max rabbit hole.  

I think this post by Gabe of Penny Arcade encapsulates it well.  He had just entered a Gamestop pokemon tournament.

I showed up at the Alderwood mall Gamestop and entered my name. As the little kids poured in I became less and less convinced I should participate. The little boys with their Pokemon backpacks and the girls with tiny Pokeballs in their hair seemed to assume I was just someones Dad rather than their competition.  It was actually really cool to see how much these kids love Pokemon. I’ve been so into it recently that I think I’d forgotten I should be having fun. With my pages of hand written math and charts of carefully plotted out EV training regiments I actually felt sort of dirty. These little kids were showing me teams comprised not of statistically optimal Pokemon but of their favorites. A little girl talked to me for five minutes about why she loved Kyogre so much. When she asked why I used Rotom I couldn’t bring myself to tell her that his ghost/electric type meant he had a lot of immunities while giving him some surprising moves that should allow me to cripple sweepers with status effects but still fight off any Dark types I encounter. "I think he’s cute." I explained. She smiled and nodded as though this was the reason she had expected to hear.

More to read, if you're curious:

[msduncan]

Another question:

Is there a consolidated list somewhere that shows which Pokemon are available in which Pokemon game?

What I'm looking for is a way to see which Pokemon in Diamond aren't available in Heartgold/Silver and Black/White.    You know...see which I need to transfer forward into my Pokemon White.

[Isgrimnur]

You might start here.

[msduncan]

You might start here.

Actually that's not what I'm looking for.   For instance that Seal type Pokemon in the top left is available both in HeartGold and also in Black/White. 

I'm looking for something that shows me what Pokemon from previous games aren't available in future games.

[Isgrimnur]

Seems like there's a database list waiting to be created, then. 

[Isgrimnur]

Try here.  Seel is listed Diamond/Platinum, but not the others.  Bear in mind, I have little idea as to what's going on. 

[wonderpug]

Another question:

Is there a consolidated list somewhere that shows which Pokemon are available in which Pokemon game?

What I'm looking for is a way to see which Pokemon in Diamond aren't available in Heartgold/Silver and Black/White.    You know...see which I need to transfer forward into my Pokemon White.

Again, serebii.net is the place to go for all things pokemon.  It's a little hard to navigate, but it's got a lot more information than bulbapedia does.  Look up a pokemon in there serebii pokedex and look in the "Location" listing.  For each title, it will say the area it's located, if the pokemon is present, or if it must be traded from another title.

[msduncan]

Another question:

Is there a consolidated list somewhere that shows which Pokemon are available in which Pokemon game?

What I'm looking for is a way to see which Pokemon in Diamond aren't available in Heartgold/Silver and Black/White.    You know...see which I need to transfer forward into my Pokemon White.

Again, serebii.net is the place to go for all things pokemon.  It's a little hard to navigate, but it's got a lot more information than bulbapedia does.  Look up a pokemon in there serebii pokedex and look in the "Location" listing.  For each title, it will say the area it's located, if the pokemon is present, or if it must be traded from another title.

I'm surprised someone hasn't put together a chart where you can look down the list and easily see games where each pokemon is available.   It's very cumbersome having to drill down into each one to get that info.

And you are right -- Serebii is just as complex to navigate as Pokemon is complicated.  lol

[wonderpug]

Ah, I get what you're saying now.  Hmm..  Well, there's a chance of something like that being on GameFAQs maybe, but yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a simple consolidated capture list.

[msduncan]

Ah, I get what you're saying now.  Hmm..  Well, there's a chance of something like that being on GameFAQs maybe, but yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a simple consolidated capture list.

Yeah.   In a nutshell I'm trying to figure out which pokemon I need to catch in Diamond and pass forward because they don't randomly occur in Black or White.

[msduncan]

JUST GOT MY FIRST SHINY!!!!!!!!

I chained 40 Geodudes and then started using the radar over and over and about 20 recharges past my 40 chain I got a Shiny Geodude!

WOOT!

[wonderpug]

lol!  Congrats, you poor, poor, addicted man. 

[msduncan]

lol!  Congrats, you poor, poor, addicted man. 

Bought Soulsilver too.   

Also looking to get an original DS and Emerald so I can get the 3 legendary Golems to then unlock the other one in Diamond.

 

[Autistic Angel]

Don't forget to start using your Pokewalker.  You'll want to start banking watts early to unlock new trails and get access to the rarer Pokemon.

lol!  Congrats, you poor, poor, addicted man. 

Oh weird: this was wonderpug's 9000^th post.

-Autistic Angel

[wonderpug]

Can I go back and delete some so I can try again and make #9000 more epic?

[msduncan]

Can I go back and delete some so I can try again and make #9000 more epic?

Based on what I've heard, a Pokemon related topic is probably appropriate for post #9000.

[msduncan]

I need a system for chaining.   This morning I made it to 34 chained Budews.   I then lost concentration for 1 INSTANT and broke the chain.   I'd say 80% of my broken chains happen when my repel wears off and I keep moving instead of taking another Repel.    I don't know what compels me to hit the move button again after it alerts me that my Repel has worn off, but I do if I'm half paying attention.

So I'm going to try a method by which I chain 5 mobs, then I play a PC game for a few minutes, then I go back to chaining 5 more mobs.    Hopefully this will refocus me on chaining each time I go back to it.

Cover me!  I'm going in.   

[msduncan]

And so my system worked.   I would chain about 5 to 10 and then take a Legend of Grimrock break for a few minutes.   Then I'd go back and repeat.  I was able to get to 40 this way and after that it was easy pickins.

Three shiny Shinx is what I have to show for it.    Wewt!

[Teggy]

I guess that youtube video was actually posted by duncan...

[msduncan]

I guess that youtube video was actually posted by duncan...

Somehow I missed that and just went back to view it.   Uh.  WOW.   That kid was excited!

[msduncan]

Ok so Wonderpug, I couldn't get an answer on Seribii for some reason.    I need guidance on which of the 3 Shiny Shinx that I caught I should keep.     I will post their nature and stats on here after I get home from work.   Then I have to work on which EV's to train and how.

[Harpua3]

I think I would understand Chinese more than this conversation... Have no fucking clue what is being talked about;).

[MonkeyFinger]

I think I would understand Chinese more than this conversation... Have no fucking clue what is being talked about;).

 

I am so in the same boat. No clue why I pop in on occassion to check up on the current state of the pokemon problem...

[wonderpug]

What's scariest to me is that he's now ventured into some deeper levels of Pokemon mechanics that I never dared learn.  The thing about chaining to get better odds of shinies?  Greek to even me. 

[msduncan]

Let me attempt to pull you back into the pit Wonderpug!



In tha games that feature the Pokeradar, you are able to do something called chaining.   Here's how it works:

1.  Set the radar to Y button
2.  Set the Pokeapp on your DS to show you what number you are on the chain.   Can't remember the name of the app but you get it after you unlock the National Dex
3.  Select a patch of grass big enough to allow you to operate from, which also has a Pokemon you are interested in catching that is Shiny.
4.  You then get into the middle of the patch and hit your radar.   4 patches of grass with shake in one of three ways:   normal shaking.    shaking with a flash of light, and then shaking with a SLOW double flash that looks like diamonds.     The slow diamond flash is the Shiny pokemon and you should always go straight to those patches because it will be a Shiny pokemon.  Normally you have to chain for a while to get a shiny patch
5.  So when you begin chaining you select a normal shaking or flash shaking patch of grass and enter it.   Faint the pokemon.    As soon as it exits the battle 4 more patches will shake.   Select the SAME kind of shaking patch about 4 or 6 spaces away from you and enter it and repeat over and over.   The pokemon you start chaining will be the SAME pokemon for the entire chain and also will be the shiny pokemon you get.   In other words if you start chaining a Pikachu it will be a shiny Pikachu you are going for
6.  Once you hit 40 in a chain you can STOP walking into any patches unless they are the Shiny patch. 

I've managed to get to 40 three times over the past week and after that the Shiny pokemon start popping.   So far I've captured 1 Shiny Geodude, 3 Shiny Shinx's, and 3 Shiny Ponytas.

[msduncan]

 My journey to Pokemon Emerald to retrieve the legendary Golems continues.  I have reached the elite 4.   Next step after beating the league is to track these guys down and take them with me to Pokemon Diamond in order to unlock another legendary.

[Scraper]

I started to read this thread. Then I realized that I wanted to keep my man card and decided to read CeeKay's "Secret Circle" thread instead. 

[wonderpug]

The thing is, Scraper, some of us want to be the very best.  Like no one ever was. To catch them is our real test, and to train them is our cause.

[Purge]

Go TEAM ROCKET!