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Author Topic: Time Magazine interviews McCain. Hubris ensues  (Read 3364 times)
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Knightshade Dragon
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« on: August 28, 2008, 01:42:45 PM »

http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1836909,00.html

Quote
This is, by far, his worst interview to date.  Why invite a press outlet as big as Time Magazine to your 'Straight Talk Express" airplane and then stiff them on easy questions such as...

There's a theme that recurs in your books and your speeches, both about putting country first but also about honor. I wonder if you could define honor for us?
Read it in my books.

I've read your books.
No, I'm not going to define it.

But honor in politics?
I defined it in five books. Read my books.
  Yeesh.
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« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2008, 01:57:03 PM »

McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.
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« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2008, 02:02:35 PM »

Quote from: Scraper on August 28, 2008, 01:57:03 PM

McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I don't think you are wrong in the slightest.  I think that he's going to make a fool out of himself and come out looking like a bitter old crazy dude.
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« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2008, 02:22:44 PM »

Unfortunately, if the debates meant shit, Gore would have handed Bush his ass.
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« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2008, 02:23:55 PM »

In all the debates against Gore and Kerry, I thought Bush sounded like a bumbling, ignorant idiot, yet the chattering masses went on to declare him the "winner".
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« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2008, 02:25:47 PM »

"You forgot Poland."
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« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2008, 02:33:17 PM »

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on August 28, 2008, 02:02:35 PM

Quote from: Scraper on August 28, 2008, 01:57:03 PM

McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I don't think you are wrong in the slightest.  I think that he's going to make a fool out of himself and come out looking like a bitter old crazy dude.
I think you two apparently haven't been paying close attention to the campaigns.

One: Obama is not a very good debater. Don't believe me? See here, here, here, here, etc (I could list another 20) or just watch his debates where he performed so poorly.

And Two: McCain challenged Obama to *10* town-hall style debates. You really think he's not good speaking on his feet?

No clue what happened in the above interview. McCain certainly can be gruff at times. But don't go overboard in your analysis here slywink.
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« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2008, 02:36:40 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on August 28, 2008, 02:33:17 PM

And Two: McCain challenged Obama to *10* town-hall style debates. You really think he's not good speaking on his feet?

Town halls are very different beasts than professionally moderated debates (unless, of course, Youtube's running the show).  McCain does well with hand-picked friendly crowds who were predisposed to like his rambling answers in the first place.
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« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2008, 02:51:46 PM »

Quote from: Brendan on August 28, 2008, 02:36:40 PM

Quote from: cheeba on August 28, 2008, 02:33:17 PM

And Two: McCain challenged Obama to *10* town-hall style debates. You really think he's not good speaking on his feet?

Town halls are very different beasts than professionally moderated debates (unless, of course, Youtube's running the show).  McCain does well with hand-picked friendly crowds who were predisposed to like his rambling answers in the first place.

Of course, if the last democratic debate is any indication, Obama will get questions like, "Who is more patriotic, you or John McCain?".
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« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2008, 02:56:10 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on August 28, 2008, 02:33:17 PM

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on August 28, 2008, 02:02:35 PM

Quote from: Scraper on August 28, 2008, 01:57:03 PM

McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I don't think you are wrong in the slightest.  I think that he's going to make a fool out of himself and come out looking like a bitter old crazy dude.
I think you two apparently haven't been paying close attention to the campaigns.

One: Obama is not a very good debater. Don't believe me? See here, here, here, here, etc (I could list another 20) or just watch his debates where he performed so poorly.

And Two: McCain challenged Obama to *10* town-hall style debates. You really think he's not good speaking on his feet?

No clue what happened in the above interview. McCain certainly can be gruff at times. But don't go overboard in your analysis here slywink.

1. Obama is one slick dude. Much like Bill Clinton. Much more slick and presentable than McCain.

2. Challenging someone to town hall meetings/debates and actually winning those debates/meetings are two different things.
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« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2008, 03:05:40 PM »

Quote from: Brendan on August 28, 2008, 02:36:40 PM

Quote from: cheeba on August 28, 2008, 02:33:17 PM

And Two: McCain challenged Obama to *10* town-hall style debates. You really think he's not good speaking on his feet?

Town halls are very different beasts than professionally moderated debates (unless, of course, Youtube's running the show).  McCain does well with hand-picked friendly crowds who were predisposed to like his rambling answers in the first place.
At least he answers the questions and doesn't give a "that's not in my pay grade" answer.  Take away the teleprompter and he speaks less eloquently than W.

Besides, I didn't think that Fox News was a valid source of information, and who's not to say that Obama wasn't passing out tickets either?  If it was really so lopsided, the big three would be all over that like white on rice.
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« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2008, 03:08:33 PM »

Quote from: Scraper on August 28, 2008, 02:56:10 PM

1. Obama is one slick dude. Much like Bill Clinton. Much more slick and presentable than McCain.
He's a cool guy, no doubt. Unfortunately his "slickness" didn't help him to win (any?) debates vs. Hill-dog.
Quote
2. Challenging someone to town hall meetings/debates and actually winning those debates/meetings are two different things.
This is a presidential race. Do you really think McCain would challenge Obama to 10 town-hall debates if he didn't think that would give him a huge advantage?
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« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2008, 03:12:53 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on August 28, 2008, 03:08:33 PM

Quote from: Scraper on August 28, 2008, 02:56:10 PM

1. Obama is one slick dude. Much like Bill Clinton. Much more slick and presentable than McCain.
He's a cool guy, no doubt. Unfortunately his "slickness" didn't help him to win (any?) debates vs. Hill-dog.
Quote
2. Challenging someone to town hall meetings/debates and actually winning those debates/meetings are two different things.
This is a presidential race. Do you really think McCain would challenge Obama to 10 town-hall debates if he didn't think that would give him a huge advantage?

Of course McCain thinks he will win, but thinking you will win and actually winning is a different thing. In the end we will know which one of us is right about their debating skills in a couple of months.
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« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2008, 03:27:27 PM »

Quote from: Scraper on August 28, 2008, 03:12:53 PM

Of course McCain thinks he will win, but thinking you will win and actually winning is a different thing. In the end we will know which one of us is right about their debating skills in a couple of months.
You didn't click on a single link I provided did you?
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« Reply #14 on: August 28, 2008, 03:58:50 PM »

Answer the following two questions:

1) Why have no debates, other than that Saddleback forum, occured after Obama has said he'll debate McCain anywhere, anytime?  Citation here.

2) Why has Obama waffled on agreeing to McCain's series of Town Hall style debates?  Citation here.
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« Reply #15 on: August 28, 2008, 04:12:55 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on August 28, 2008, 03:58:50 PM

2) Why has Obama waffled on agreeing to McCain's series of Town Hall style debates?  Citation here.

The McCain camp wanted all-or-nothing:

Quote
On Saturday, in a letter to the Commission on Presidential Debates, Obama campaign manager David Plouffe said the short period between the last political convention and the first proposed debate made it likely that the commission-sponsored debates would be the only ones.

"We've committed to the three debates on the table," campaign spokeswoman Jen Psaki said Saturday in an interview. "It's likely they will be the three appearances by the candidates this fall."

Asked by The Associated Press if that meant Obama would not agree to any other debates, Psaki said, "We're not saying that." She said the McCain campaign had rejected Obama's proposal for two joint town hall meetings.

That Time magazine interview makes McCain look pretty pathetic - I mean, seriously, does he think we can't tell his campaign strategy has changed?
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« Reply #16 on: August 28, 2008, 04:44:34 PM »

Quote from: Scraper
McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I'm not so sure.  Consider the Rick Warren faith discussion, especially the question, "Does Evil exist, and if so, should we embrace It, appease It, negotiate with It, or defeat It?"  Barack Obama offered a considered, nuanced answer about the different types of "evil" that occur in the world, and that while good people should always take a stand against it, the approach needs to suit the circumstances.

John McCain said, "Defeat it."  And the audience *roared* with applause.

One of the things I admire most about Obama is his habit of speaking to the American electorate as though they are all intelligent, thoughtful, educated adults.  Unfortunately for him, there's a sizable portion of the population who view the world beyond their own property line in such incredibly stark and naive terms, they believe the absence of a flag lapel pin to be a sign of deep moral corruption.

McCain isn't going to define an abstract idea like "Honor" because there's no response he can possibly give that would satisfy the reporter without alienating his base.  There's no benefit.  It's too complex.  There are too many potential follow-up questions.  All that matters is that everyone knows John McCain has Honor, and Barack Obama, by dint of his opposition to McCain, does not.  Simple.

Obama might be lured into answering such a question because it appeals to his sense of intellectualism and morality.  Not only does it give him a chance to try to further define his sense of judgment -- something the Republicans have succeeded in slandering these last several weeks -- but it poses an interesting challenge.  How *do* you define such a broad and malleable concept as "Honor?"

Let's all play a game right now: can you imagine any answer Obama could give that wouldn't be *shredded* in the right-wing press?  Anything at all?  Post your answers in this thread, and we can't find a way to Limbaugh-O'Reilly-Hannity-Coulterize it into a revelation of what a horrific, soulless monster Obama secretly is, you get to be a Democratic super delegate.

(On the other hand, refusing to answer would be just as bad.  Imagine the field day they'd have if McCain's response had come out of Obama's mouth....)

That's why I disagree with Scraper that the debates will be a slam dunk for Obama.  When you ask him a complex question, you get a complex answer in response, losing a quarter of the electorate right away and opening the door for a right-wing smear campaign all at once.  Trying to appeal to people's most optimistic, high-minded principles is a lot tougher than just stoking their fears about terrorism, gay marriage, and discount punch cards that earn a free grinder with every thirteenth abortion.

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #17 on: August 28, 2008, 05:20:21 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 04:44:34 PM

Quote from: Scraper
McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I'm not so sure.  Consider the Rick Warren faith discussion, especially the question, "Does Evil exist, and if so, should we embrace It, appease It, negotiate with It, or defeat It?"  Barack Obama offered a considered, nuanced answer about the different types of "evil" that occur in the world, and that while good people should always take a stand against it, the approach needs to suit the circumstances.

John McCain said, "Defeat it."  And the audience *roared* with applause.

One of the things I admire most about Obama is his habit of speaking to the American electorate as though they are all intelligent, thoughtful, educated adults.  Unfortunately for him, there's a sizable portion of the population who view the world beyond their own property line in such incredibly stark and naive terms, they believe the absence of a flag lapel pin to be a sign of deep moral corruption.

McCain isn't going to define an abstract idea like "Honor" because there's no response he can possibly give that would satisfy the reporter without alienating his base.  There's no benefit.  It's too complex.  There are too many potential follow-up questions.  All that matters is that everyone knows John McCain has Honor, and Barack Obama, by dint of his opposition to McCain, does not.  Simple.

Obama might be lured into answering such a question because it appeals to his sense of intellectualism and morality.  Not only does it give him a chance to try to further define his sense of judgment -- something the Republicans have succeeded in slandering these last several weeks -- but it poses an interesting challenge.  How *do* you define such a broad and malleable concept as "Honor?"

Let's all play a game right now: can you imagine any answer Obama could give that wouldn't be *shredded* in the right-wing press?  Anything at all?  Post your answers in this thread, and we can't find a way to Limbaugh-O'Reilly-Hannity-Coulterize it into a revelation of what a horrific, soulless monster Obama secretly is, you get to be a Democratic super delegate.

(On the other hand, refusing to answer would be just as bad.  Imagine the field day they'd have if McCain's response had come out of Obama's mouth....)

That's why I disagree with Scraper that the debates will be a slam dunk for Obama.  When you ask him a complex question, you get a complex answer in response, losing a quarter of the electorate right away and opening the door for a right-wing smear campaign all at once.  Trying to appeal to people's most optimistic, high-minded principles is a lot tougher than just stoking their fears about terrorism, gay marriage, and discount punch cards that earn a free grinder with every thirteenth abortion.

-Autistic Angel

OK I get it, you are basically saying people who dont like Obama and what he says just arent smart enough to understand what he is talking about.    Yes it is unfortunate that you think that about those who oppose him, as there is no way it could be that they just dont agree with what he stands for as an ultra liberal senator and presidential candidate.
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« Reply #18 on: August 28, 2008, 05:22:11 PM »

Great post, AA. And I didn't realize I was due for a free grinder!
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« Reply #19 on: August 28, 2008, 05:38:11 PM »

Quote from: brettmcd on August 28, 2008, 05:20:21 PM

OK I get it, you are basically saying people who dont like Obama and what he says just arent smart enough to understand what he is talking about.    Yes it is unfortunate that you think that about those who oppose him, as there is no way it could be that they just dont agree with what he stands for as an ultra liberal senator and presidential candidate.

I think I see some similarities here...

One of the things I admire most about Autistic Angel is his habit of speaking to the Gaming Trend posters as though they are all intelligent, thoughtful, educated adults.  Unfortunately for him, there's a sizable portion of the posters here who view the world beyond their own property line in such incredibly stark and naive terms, they believe the absence of a flag lapel pin to be a sign of deep moral corruption.

Let's all play a game right now: can you imagine any post Autistic Angel could make that wouldn't be *shredded* by right-wing posters?  Anything at all?

When you ask Autistic Angel a complex question, you get a complex answer in response, losing a quarter of the board right away and opening the door for a right-wing smear campaign all at once.  Trying to appeal to people's most optimistic, high-minded principles is a lot tougher than just stoking their fears about cuh-razy tax hikes, gubmint gun control, AOL, and discount punch cards that earn a free grinder with every thirteenth CeeKay post.
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« Reply #20 on: August 28, 2008, 05:45:54 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 04:44:34 PM

Quote from: Scraper
McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I'm not so sure.  Consider the Rick Warren faith discussion, especially the question, "Does Evil exist, and if so, should we embrace It, appease It, negotiate with It, or defeat It?"  Barack Obama offered a considered, nuanced answer about the different types of "evil" that occur in the world, and that while good people should always take a stand against it, the approach needs to suit the circumstances.

John McCain said, "Defeat it."  And the audience *roared* with applause.


Maybe because John McCain has come face to face with evil and most Americans are blessed enough to not have had the same experience.
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« Reply #21 on: August 28, 2008, 05:50:06 PM »

Quote from: Jag on August 28, 2008, 05:45:54 PM

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 04:44:34 PM

Quote from: Scraper
McCain doesn't seem to be too good talking on his feet. I can't wait to watch the debates for this reason alone. I think Obama is going to smoke him in the debates and from there the polls will shift to Obama. Just my opinion though.

I'm not so sure.  Consider the Rick Warren faith discussion, especially the question, "Does Evil exist, and if so, should we embrace It, appease It, negotiate with It, or defeat It?"  Barack Obama offered a considered, nuanced answer about the different types of "evil" that occur in the world, and that while good people should always take a stand against it, the approach needs to suit the circumstances.

John McCain said, "Defeat it."  And the audience *roared* with applause.


Maybe because John McCain has come face to face with evil and most Americans are blessed enough to not have had the same experience.

Is that a serious answer?  Because it's hardly a policy position.  What does "defeat it" mean in the context of a Russian/Georgian confrontation?  What does "defeat it" mean in the context of North Korea developing nuclear weapons?
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« Reply #22 on: August 28, 2008, 05:57:05 PM »

Alot of people could have looked at the contrast between the Obama and McCain answers as Obama forming a "considered, nuanced, long winded, negotiated response to a world crisis such as an attack on Israel or a major terrorist attack. While McCain gives a direct and firm answer with military force.

There are many people who prefer the McCain approach.  That perception of the differences in the candidates is what alot of people fear about Obama, and find security with in McCain.  Obama is seen as the kid in high school who would try to negotiate his way out of getting his lunch money taken.  While McCain would punch the bully in the face.  Who do you want as President?


I'm not saying I agree with the McCain approach.  But there are many Red State Americans who do.


The vast majority of people found John Carey to be much more "eloquent, nuanced and considered" than George W Bush in 2004.  But we all know how that election turned out.
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« Reply #23 on: August 28, 2008, 06:03:10 PM »

Quote from: Brendan on August 28, 2008, 05:38:11 PM

earn a free grinder with every thirteenth CeeKay post.

That's one way to jump start the economy or at least the grinder industry.
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« Reply #24 on: August 28, 2008, 06:05:38 PM »

UPS is gonna be effen bizzy.
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« Reply #25 on: August 28, 2008, 06:23:03 PM »

Quote from: Moliere on August 28, 2008, 06:03:10 PM

Quote from: Brendan on August 28, 2008, 05:38:11 PM

earn a free grinder with every thirteenth CeeKay post.

That's one way to jump start the economy or at least the grinder industry.

Yeah, but the Democrats will sanction a new tax to pay for all of those grinders.   slywink
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« Reply #26 on: August 28, 2008, 07:07:20 PM »

Quote
While McCain would punch the bully in the face.  Who do you want as President?

Well the current asshole in power has done a bang up job with the 'run around and punch everyone' mentality.  I think I'm gonna have to go with a guy who thinks.
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« Reply #27 on: August 28, 2008, 07:12:49 PM »

Quote from: brettmcd
OK I get it, you are basically saying people who dont like Obama and what he says just arent smart enough to understand what he is talking about.

No, I'm saying that the people I'm describing just aren't engaged enough to consider what he's talking about.

Consider: why was "Defeat Evil!" an applause worthy line?  Is that a courageous stance?  A controversial one?  Is there a segment of American voters he risked offending with his stalwart pro-Good stance?

"Defeat Evil" is a really effective slogan if you're an Autobot or a member of the Rebel Alliance, but in the real world of genocide, meth addiction, rape victim pregnancies, and crushing poverty, it's a pretty lazy answer to a childish question.

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #28 on: August 28, 2008, 07:22:03 PM »

Quote
There are many people who prefer the McCain approach.  That perception of the differences in the candidates is what alot of people fear about Obama, and find security with in McCain.  Obama is seen as the kid in high school who would try to negotiate his way out of getting his lunch money taken.  While McCain would punch the bully in the face.  Who do you want as President?


I'm not saying I agree with the McCain approach.  But there are many Red State Americans who do.

I agree wholeheartedly. Bush "won" debates not through good speaking skills - as far as Presidents go, he's by far the worse public speaking President I've ever seen in my lifetime. He won by connecting at some level with the man on the street. Maybe his bumbling made him more "real" to voters than the wind-up robots of Gore and Kerry.

I think McCain has a similar opportunity to connect with voters during the debate. Perhaps not with Bush's huckleberry charm, but with blunt "Hell yeah, USA! USA! USA!" rhetoric. The danger for McCain is that Obama, unlike Kerry and Gore, does not come off as robotic. He combines the eloquence of previous Democratic candidates with an actual personality.

It's going to be a fascinating thing to watch, and I can't wait for the debates to begin. The contrasts couldn't be more exciting. The visionary n00b versus the grizzled veteran; the eloquent speaker vs. the gruff straight-talk express. I can't wait to see what America is looking for right now. Hope for change, or blunt acceptance of reality.
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« Reply #29 on: August 28, 2008, 07:23:49 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 07:12:49 PM

"Defeat Evil" is a really effective slogan if you're an Autobot or a member of the Rebel Alliance

Awesome  thumbsup
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« Reply #30 on: August 28, 2008, 07:54:08 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 07:12:49 PM

Quote from: brettmcd
OK I get it, you are basically saying people who dont like Obama and what he says just arent smart enough to understand what he is talking about.

No, I'm saying that the people I'm describing just aren't engaged enough to consider what he's talking about.

Consider: why was "Defeat Evil!" an applause worthy line?  Is that a courageous stance?  A controversial one?  Is there a segment of American voters he risked offending with his stalwart pro-Good stance?

"Defeat Evil" is a really effective slogan if you're an Autobot or a member of the Rebel Alliance, but in the real world of genocide, meth addiction, rape victim pregnancies, and crushing poverty, it's a pretty lazy answer to a childish question.

-Autistic Angel

You forgot anal sex. I hear conservatives get all antsy about that too. Tongue

In all seriousness, I think that the person who has less to say has more to hide. When talking, it's easier to keep your lies straight if you say less.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2008, 07:57:32 PM by Purge » Logged

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« Reply #31 on: August 28, 2008, 08:09:28 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 07:12:49 PM

"Defeat Evil" is a really effective slogan if you're an Autobot or a member of the Rebel Alliance, but in the real world of genocide, meth addiction, rape victim pregnancies, and crushing poverty, it's a pretty lazy answer to a childish question.

I figured it was just another dog whistle for the evangelicals who want things to be framed as good (us, the "judeo-christians") vs. evil (Islam) for the purposes of validating their pre-existing world view.  Obama made the mistake of conceding that "a lot of evil's been perpetrated based on the claim that we were trying to confront evil," which isn't an appealing idea for the many Americans for whom self-examination's a difficult task. 
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« Reply #32 on: August 28, 2008, 08:27:41 PM »

Quote from: Brendan on August 28, 2008, 08:09:28 PM

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 07:12:49 PM

"Defeat Evil" is a really effective slogan if you're an Autobot or a member of the Rebel Alliance, but in the real world of genocide, meth addiction, rape victim pregnancies, and crushing poverty, it's a pretty lazy answer to a childish question.

I figured it was just another dog whistle for the evangelicals who want things to be framed as good (us, the "judeo-christians") vs. evil (Islam) for the purposes of validating their pre-existing world view.  Obama made the mistake of conceding that "a lot of evil's been perpetrated based on the claim that we were trying to confront evil," which isn't an appealing idea for the many Americans for whom self-examination's a difficult task. 

Yep keep right on thinking that the people who dont believe as you do are lesser people in some way.   Thats sure going to win an election.
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« Reply #33 on: August 28, 2008, 09:25:28 PM »

Bush didn't win the debates as much as Gore/Kerry lost them. Those guys turned the douchebag up to 11. 

When faced with a choice to vote for an asshole or a douchebag, the asshole will win every time.
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« Reply #34 on: August 28, 2008, 09:39:42 PM »

Quote from: SuperHiro on August 28, 2008, 09:25:28 PM

Bush didn't win the debates as much as Gore/Kerry lost them. Those guys turned the douchebag up to 11. 

When faced with a choice to vote for an asshole or a douchebag, the asshole will win every time.




Sounds like a close race to me... (goddamned Nader! slywink)
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« Reply #35 on: August 28, 2008, 11:10:08 PM »

Quote from: SuperHiro on August 28, 2008, 09:25:28 PM

Bush didn't win the debates as much as Gore/Kerry lost them. Those guys turned the douchebag up to 11. 

When faced with a choice to vote for an asshole or a douchebag, the asshole will win every time.


I would argue that in terms of actual content and delivery Bush did lose the debates. Very badly in fact.  But it didn't make any difference in the actual election. 
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« Reply #36 on: August 29, 2008, 04:05:20 AM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 28, 2008, 07:12:49 PM

"Defeat Evil" is a really effective slogan if you're an Autobot or a member of the Rebel Alliance, but in the real world of genocide, meth addiction, rape victim pregnancies, and crushing poverty, it's a pretty lazy answer to a childish question.

-Autistic Angel

Leave Optimus Prime and Luke Skywalker out of this.
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« Reply #37 on: August 29, 2008, 03:12:19 PM »

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/08/28/mccain-iraq-peaceful/

Well thank God!  Looks like Iraq is a stable and peaceful land full of rainbows and love.  Time to pack and roll people, McSame says so:

Quote
    Q: Some members of the [Iraqi] government have made it clear in the last month or two that they might want to withdraw before complete stability, before totally secure borders, before some of the completeness of victory as you described. Is there any change, do you think there is some wiggle room there because what you described with Petraeus was an end point that was rather complete a peaceful, stable country.

    MCCAIN: Its a peaceful and stable country now.

Here I was thinking there was still people getting killed and injured in Iraq.  Clearly I don't know as mch as my Arizona Senator.  Let me put on these blinders...
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« Reply #38 on: August 30, 2008, 03:03:43 AM »

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on August 29, 2008, 03:12:19 PM

Here I was thinking there was still people getting killed and injured in Iraq.  Clearly I don't know as mch as my Arizona Senator.  Let me put on these blinders...
People get killed and injured in the United States every day. And you've had the blinders on for quite some time now slywink.
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« Reply #39 on: August 30, 2008, 02:06:29 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on August 30, 2008, 03:03:43 AM

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on August 29, 2008, 03:12:19 PM

Here I was thinking there was still people getting killed and injured in Iraq.  Clearly I don't know as mch as my Arizona Senator.  Let me put on these blinders...
People get killed and injured in the United States every day. And you've had the blinders on for quite some time now slywink.

I think we both know that there is a really big difference between "Oh, I feel off this chair and bruised my tailbone" and "Oh, I fell out of the gaping hole made by that RPG that tore through the side of my unarmored Humvee and I have no legs...thank God I'm in this peaceful country!" don't we?  Now who is wearing the blinders?
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