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Author Topic: WAZ 7/3/14  (Read 1194 times)
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hepcat
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« Reply #40 on: July 07, 2014, 05:21:31 PM »

So you'd rather have them get early onset diabetes than go hungry for one meal?  It's more harmful for them to eat that shit than it is to miss one damn meal.

Parents have been sending their kids to bed without supper for friggin' ever.  I don't see them dropping like flies over missing one meal, for christ's sake.

This wussy attitude of "waaahhh....my kid can't eat twizzlers for lunch instead of a healthy meal so we shouldn't rock the boat" is such a nanny state example of lax parenting that I'm surprised you endorse it.  Kids often need to be told what's good for them.  Period.

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« Reply #41 on: July 07, 2014, 05:40:25 PM »

That article does not explain how the standards have resulted in the lunches tasting badly or did i just miss it?

is that kids don't like whole grain bread instead of white or is the new bread somehow inedible? 

if it's the former, well, eating healthy takes some getting used to and the kids and parents just need to suck it up. If it's the latter it's a problem.

Article also doesn't tie the 'bad taste' to the drop in participation.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 05:43:56 PM by ATB » Logged
hepcat
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« Reply #42 on: July 07, 2014, 05:45:26 PM »

News flash:  If I offer a kid a Snicker's bar instead of a salad, 9 out of 10 times they're going to lunge for the chocolate. That's why parents don't normally have a snicker's bar on their kid's plates at supper time.

ATB, CBS put up an example of common change to the menus.

Quote
Monday:

Before:michelle obama, school lunch, usda, guidelines

    Bean and cheese burrito (5.3 oz) with mozzarella cheese (1 oz)
    Applesauce (1/4 cup)
    Orange juice (4 oz)
    2 percent milk (8 oz)


After:

    Turkey (1 oz) and low-fat cheese (0.5 oz) sandwich on whole wheat bread
    Refried beans (1/2 cup)
    Jicama (1/4 cup)
    Green pepper strips (1/4 cup)
    Cantaloupe wedges (1/2 cup)
    Skim milk (8 oz)
    Mustard (9 grams)
    Reduced fat mayonnaise (1 oz)
    Low-fat ranch drip (1 oz)

Michelle Obama is a monster!!   Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 05:47:32 PM by hepcat » Logged

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« Reply #43 on: July 07, 2014, 06:57:00 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 07, 2014, 05:21:31 PM

So you'd rather have them get early onset diabetes than go hungry for one meal?  It's more harmful for them to eat that shit than it is to miss one damn meal.

Parents have been sending their kids to bed without supper for friggin' ever.  I don't see them dropping like flies over missing one meal, for christ's sake.

This wussy attitude of "waaahhh....my kid can't eat twizzlers for lunch instead of a healthy meal so we shouldn't rock the boat" is such a nanny state example of lax parenting that I'm surprised you endorse it.  Kids often need to be told what's good for them.  Period.



So you are all for ending free lunch?

I don't think anyone has been serving candy for lunch. The school lunches they have had are much more healthy than what most of them eat for the other meals.

I am all for making school lunches more healthy but you have to do it with a focus on meals that taste good so they will embrace it. When a vast majority say they are horrible to the point they would embrace what they used to get it isn't going to work. Especially when you consider most of them weren't fond of the old food. Quite an accomplishment to take something that was bad and make it horrible.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 07:01:11 PM by Rip » Logged
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« Reply #44 on: July 07, 2014, 06:57:57 PM »

The "after" lunch looks a lot like what we packed my daughter for lunch at summer camp today. With the exception of the refried beans, she doesn't like that - and she doesn't like the mayo and mustard. And I have no idea what jicama is, so that's not in there.

Then again, she wouldn't have touched the burrito in the "before" lunch either.
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« Reply #45 on: July 07, 2014, 06:59:09 PM »

Quote from: Rip on July 07, 2014, 06:57:00 PM

Quote from: hepcat on July 07, 2014, 05:21:31 PM

Stuff totally unrelated to Rip's reply, but let's see where he tries to go!

So you are all for ending free lunch?

No, why?
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« Reply #46 on: July 07, 2014, 06:59:30 PM »

Quote
And I have no idea what jicama is, so that's not in there.

Mexican yam.  
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« Reply #47 on: July 07, 2014, 07:04:07 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 07, 2014, 06:59:09 PM

Quote from: Rip on July 07, 2014, 06:57:00 PM

Quote from: hepcat on July 07, 2014, 05:21:31 PM

Stuff totally unrelated to Rip's reply, but let's see where he tries to go!

So you are all for ending free lunch?

No, why?

Because,

Quote
Parents have been sending their kids to bed without supper for friggin' ever.  I don't see them dropping like flies over missing one meal, for christ's sake.

Sounds to me like there is no need for the rest of us to buy someone a meal. Not like they would be "dropping like flies".
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hepcat
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« Reply #48 on: July 07, 2014, 07:07:41 PM »

Sooooo, in your world, punishing your kid by sending them to bed without supper if they don't eat their vegetables automatically equates to "we should totally abolish lunch and save money!"  

Come on, you can do better than that.   icon_lol

Rip logic:

Rip:  Kids will die if they miss a meal!
Hepcat:  Missing one meal won't kill a kid.
Rip:  Then why feed them lunch to begin with!

Anyway...

I found this slideshow of school lunches from around the world kind of neat (scroll down the page to see the presentation).
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 07:20:01 PM by hepcat » Logged

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« Reply #49 on: July 07, 2014, 07:23:22 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 07, 2014, 07:07:41 PM

Sooooo, in your world, punishing your kid by sending them to bed without supper if they don't eat their vegetables automatically equates to "we should totally abolish lunch and save money!"  

Come on, you can do better than that.   icon_lol

Rip logic:

Rip:  Kids will die if they miss a meal!
Hepcat:  Missing one meal won't kill a kid.
Rip:  Then why feed them lunch to begin with!

Anyway...

I found this slideshow of school lunches from around the world kind of neat (scroll down the page to see the presentation).


No, what I say is why make the rest of us pay for lunches for them to just get thrown away.

Quote
SNA officials rightly point out that many students are throwing away the additional fruits and vegetables included in their lunches, amounting to $684 million in food waste every year – or roughly “enough to serve complete reimbursable school lunches to more than 228 million students,” according to the Times.

Quote
SNA critics contend the group sold out to big food companies that don’t like the “healthy” lunch overhaul, but what they don’t discuss is the overwhelming evidence that many parents and school nutrition experts also dislike the new rules.

Aside from the significant school lunch revenue declines and massive food waste tied to the changes, hungry students across the country have protested against the strict nutrition guidelines.

Many student athletes, for example, have argued their limited-calorie lunches leave them famished. Parents have reported their children are now going without school lunch, then binge eating when they get home. Parents have also complained about ridiculously strict interpretations of the federal lunch rules, which have resulted in a ban on birthday cupcakes in classrooms, among other things.

http://eagnews.org/school-nutrition-group-turns-on-michelle-o-now-fighting-federal-lunch-regulations/
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« Reply #50 on: July 07, 2014, 07:31:18 PM »

Rip, you've admitted in the past that you don't even freakin' pay taxes.  So it's not coming out of YOUR pocket anyway.  icon_lol

But on a more serious note, if you think kids weren't wasting food BEFORE the lunch changes than I have to wonder where the hell you've been your entire life.  

Also, if it's so horrible, why are parent associations  (who aren't politically motivated to fight against it because...OBAMA!) supporting it?

Quote
Last week, the president of the National PTA, Otha Thornton, wrote a letter to members of Congress urging them to reject Mr. Aderholt’s effort to scale back the standards. “At a time when families are working hard to live healthy lives, school meals should be supporting families’ efforts, not working against them,” he wrote.

Edit:  this article pretty much debunks anecdotal claims about waste after the lunch program changes.

Quote
Study details

For the study, the researchers tracked the food that students at four low-income elementary and middle schools in Boston selected — and threw away — during lunch. The researchers visited the schools twice before the new USDA standards were implemented (fall 2011) and twice afterward (fall 2012).

They found that the new standards did not cause an increase in food waste. About 60 percent to 75 percent of the vegetables and about 40 percent of the fruits ended up in lunchroom trash bins in 2012 — roughly the same amount as in 2011.

Still, that high level of waste is a problem and warrants serious attention, say the study’s authors.

Other key findings of the study include the following:

    After the new standards went into effect, the percentage of children selecting fruit rose significantly, from 53 percent to 76 percent. The percentage of the fruit eaten by these students dipped from 58 percent in 2011 to 55 percent in 2012, but that dip was not statistically significant, say the study’s authors.
    The number of children choosing a vegetable remained the same. But the amount of vegetables those students ate increased from 25 percent in 2011 to 41 percent 2012, as did the cups consumed (from 0.13 cups to 0.31 cups).
    Students also consumed more of their entrée after the standards were implemented — up from 72 percent in 2011 to 88 percent in 2012).

Admittedly, this was a small study, involving only 1,030 students. But it is the only study that has actually tracked how much food is being thrown away under the new USDA standards.

The study was run by the Harvard School of Public Health by the way.

Quote
Some 32 million students eat school meals every day; for many low-income students, up to half their daily energy intake is from school meals. Under the previous dietary guidelines, school breakfasts and lunches were high in sodium and saturated fats and were low in whole grains and fiber. The new standards from the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) aimed to improve the nutritional quality of school meals by making whole grains, fruits, and vegetables more available, requiring the selection of a fruit or vegetable, increasing the portion sizes of fruits and vegetables, removing trans fats, and placing limits on total calories and sodium levels.

The researchers collected plate waste data among 1,030 students in four schools in an urban, low-income school district both before (fall 2011) and after (fall 2012) the new standards went into effect. Following the implementation of the new standards, fruit selection increased by 23.0%; average per person fruit consumption was unchanged, but because more students selected fruit, overall, more fruit was consumed post-implementation. In addition, consumption of vegetables per student increased by 16.2%. Entrée selection per student remained unchanged.  (Note: “Selection” means if a student took a food item, such as a fruit. “Consumption” refers to once a student selected the food, how much did they eat. The percentages refer to the average percent of the food that was consumed per person.)*

The new standards did not result in increased average food waste per person, contradicting anecdotal reports from food service directors, teachers, parents, and students that the regulations were causing an increase in waste due to both larger portion sizes and the requirement that students select a fruit or vegetable. In fact, there was a decrease in vegetable waste. However, the overall high levels of fruit and vegetable waste continued to be a problem—students discarded roughly 75% of vegetables before the USDA school meal standards went into effect and 60% of vegetables after the standards went into effect, and they threw out roughly 40% of fruits on their trays both before and after the implementation of the new standards. The authors say that schools must focus on improving food quality and palatability to reduce waste.*
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 08:29:13 PM by hepcat » Logged

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« Reply #51 on: July 07, 2014, 09:47:52 PM »

Quote
About 60 percent to 75 percent of the vegetables and about 40 percent of the fruits ended up in lunchroom trash bins in 2012 — roughly the same amount as in 2011.

Ahh, but that ignores that the percentage of the lunch that was fruit and veggies went from a third to two thirds. So yeah there was more thrown away. Unless like a fool you look at the percentages of one category that gets thrown away while ignoring what percentage of the meal is comprised of that category.

BTW, I do pay taxes. I just failed to file a few years and filed late. I am filed up to date now, although I still owe money. I am pretty sure they will get their money out of me sooner or later.

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« Reply #52 on: July 07, 2014, 09:54:23 PM »

I guess because making it bold wasn't enough I'll just have to quote it again:

Quote
The new standards did not result in increased average food waste per person, contradicting anecdotal reports from food service directors, teachers, parents, and students that the regulations were causing an increase in waste due to both larger portion sizes and the requirement that students select a fruit or vegetable

Also

Quote
In fact, there was a decrease in vegetable waste.

So no, nothing is being ignored.  Unless like a fool you just ignore words and stuff.   slywink
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 09:58:46 PM by hepcat » Logged

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« Reply #53 on: July 07, 2014, 11:21:04 PM »

Quote from: Fireball on July 07, 2014, 02:31:39 PM

Quote from: Scraper on July 03, 2014, 03:53:47 PM

I predict this thread goes from amusing to awesome once Fireball jumps in.

Meh. Low-class, gay-hating troll posts a low-class trolling tirade that includes anti-gay nonsense. Boring.

LOL

and you took the high road with this post?

Fucking hypocrite  icon_lol
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« Reply #54 on: July 07, 2014, 11:28:26 PM »

Years ago some braniac thought it was a good idea to stop serving whole milk in school lunches, or in vending machines.

Turns out it was completely wrong
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/whole-milk-may-be-better-for-kids-than-skim-milk/
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« Reply #55 on: July 07, 2014, 11:44:18 PM »

Completely wrong, eh?  Let's see what they have to say:

Quote
In a viewpoint published on July 1 in JAMA Pediatrics, Dr. David S. Ludwig, an endocrinologist at Boston Children's Hospital, and Dr. Walter C. Willet, Fredrick John Stare professor of epidemiology and nutrition chair at the Harvard School of Public Health in Cambridge, Mass., questioned why low-fat milk was given the OK over the whole milk option.

"There's never been such a strong evidence base for these recommendations," Ludwig told the Boston Globe. "We're not arguing that milk should be eliminated from the diet, but that a broader range of recommendations might be more appropriate."
...
The authors point out that there are only a few clinical trials that have looked at the benefits of reduced-fat milk compared to whole milk. Most people just assume the lower-fat milk has fewer calories, which theoretically decreases total caloric intake and lessens weight gain.

However, the researchers said that just because someone lowers fat intake doesn't necessarily mean that it will help with losing the pounds.

So you're stating that two doctors publishing a viewpoint, in other words, an opinion, mean that the people on the other side of the discussion are completely wrong?  When not even the authors state definitively that it's wrong and there are no studies to back up their assertion?

Go buy a dictionary and learn some critical thinking skills.
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« Reply #56 on: July 07, 2014, 11:44:35 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on July 07, 2014, 11:28:26 PM

Years ago some braniac thought it was a good idea to stop serving whole milk in school lunches, or in vending machines.

Turns out it was completely wrong
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/whole-milk-may-be-better-for-kids-than-skim-milk/

Completely wrong?  Um, no.  Key word in that headline is "may".   "May", as in, "based on huge number of additional dietary variables".

EDIT:  Isgrimmnur beat me to it. 
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« Reply #57 on: July 07, 2014, 11:45:53 PM »

I think zeke truly believes there's a study being held back by this administration that proves fruits and vegetables are bad for you while pizza sticks are healthy.

Edit:  on second thought I'm hoping that's true.
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« Reply #58 on: July 08, 2014, 12:00:41 AM »

this thread frigging sucks now.
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« Reply #59 on: July 08, 2014, 01:12:44 AM »

Now?
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« Reply #60 on: July 08, 2014, 02:23:17 AM »

Fine. LOL

I'll stay out of R&P for good from now on. It's just the same like-minded people getting eachother off mentally anyway.

Have fun  icon_biggrin
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« Reply #61 on: July 08, 2014, 02:31:55 AM »

 crybaby

No Zeke means fewer laughs.  This thread became tragic.
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« Reply #62 on: July 08, 2014, 03:01:57 AM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 08, 2014, 02:31:55 AM

crybaby

No Zeke means fewer laughs.  This thread became tragic.

He doesn't mean it, he needs the attention. He'll be back.
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« Reply #63 on: July 08, 2014, 03:10:57 AM »

The last word on skim milk.
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« Reply #64 on: July 08, 2014, 10:39:28 AM »

Quote from: Zekester on July 08, 2014, 02:23:17 AM

Fine. LOL

I'll stay out of R&P for good from now on. It's just the same like-minded people getting eachother off mentally anyway.


Oh, okay.  Goodbye forever, again.

Quote from: Autistic Angel on June 19, 2014, 05:02:48 PM

I don't think anyone here expects to change Zekester's mind.  We've all seen him circle this drain before.  He'll continue making LULZsome zingers until it finally dawns on him that everyone is laughing AT him, at which point he'll melt down, claim he's leaving forever, and then pop back up in a day or two like nothing ever happened.


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« Reply #65 on: July 08, 2014, 12:07:27 PM »

Quote from: Lee on July 08, 2014, 03:01:57 AM

Quote from: hepcat on July 08, 2014, 02:31:55 AM

crybaby

No Zeke means fewer laughs.  This thread became tragic.

He doesn't mean it, he needs the attention. He'll be back.

who has a higher post count again? Idiot. I rarely ever came in to the R&P forum here, so remind me again where I crave attention  retard

and actually searching out another poster's past threads is pathetic, AA. You didn't have anything better to do in the time it took to do that?  retard retard

Because apparently some of you can't read, I said I was staying out of the R&P forum. Not the whole forum. You guys just want to caress yourself here anyway, so have at it.

I care not  icon_biggrin

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« Reply #66 on: July 08, 2014, 12:08:34 PM »

Quote from: Ironrod on July 08, 2014, 03:10:57 AM


 thumbsup
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« Reply #67 on: July 08, 2014, 12:46:21 PM »

For the record I love Zeke posts and hope he's just bluffing. Everyone agreeing with AA all the time gets old. Plus he gives Hep a good outlet for his insanity.
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« Reply #68 on: July 08, 2014, 12:53:17 PM »

I have gotten a couple messages about this thread so I am going to close it. 

If there is something important or useful you all still want to talk about start a new thread and maybe it will be more productive.
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