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Zekester
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« on: January 12, 2011, 01:49:46 PM »

Can I ask something without it seeming that i'm trying to be inflammatory? Because i'm really not, I just want to understand a little more about how liberals think sometimes.

Will liberals be ok with it if Loughner gets off on insanity defense?

The sheriff has used it as a tool against conservatives and conservative talk radio, and, in my opinion and others, increases the likelihood that he could use the insanity defense and actually get off lighter than I feel he should.

Now, some of you liberals KNOW that you liked that the sheriff tied it in against conservatives. But will you be ok with it if he ends up getting off on an insanity defense?
« Last Edit: January 12, 2011, 02:14:42 PM by Zekester » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2011, 02:33:28 PM »

What reason is there to think that he will "get off on an insanity defense"? It's clear that this was an attack that was planned over a long time horizon. I'll lay down money right here and now that he is found guilty and executed.

I'm also getting tired of this criticism of the Sheriff, whose comments were accurate. The most intense rhetoric from the Far Right *is* violent, damaging to our public discourse, and sounds as though it intends to incite violence. Yes, both sides use intemperate language more often than they should, but the most violent imagery, the toting of guns to public forums, the use of elimination rhetoric, is far more prevalent on the right than it is on the left. I'm getting sick of having to pretend that this is somehow a level playing field. There are no mainstream voices on the left that as consistently use this kind of rhetoric the way that Glen Beck, Mark Levine or Sarah Palin do.
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« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2011, 02:43:24 PM »

Fireball, I disagree.

First, the wheels are already in motion that increase the chance that he will get off of on the insanity defense. Do I want him to? Hell no.

Second, I think the negative, potentially=violent rhetoric IS even from both sides. One look back during the Bush Administration easily equals what is going on today.
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« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2011, 03:05:48 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 02:43:24 PM

Second, I think the negative, potentially=violent rhetoric IS even from both sides. One look back during the Bush Administration easily equals what is going on today.

Your turn.
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Zekester
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« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2011, 03:10:31 PM »

Quote from: Captain Caveman on January 12, 2011, 03:05:48 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 02:43:24 PM

Second, I think the negative, potentially=violent rhetoric IS even from both sides. One look back during the Bush Administration easily equals what is going on today.

Your turn.

Oh come on.....there is no possible way to count up every single instance, but all intellegent people on both sides know damn well it works out about even. We're not comparing earthlings to martians here.
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« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2011, 03:22:14 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 02:43:24 PM

First, the wheels are already in motion that increase the chance that he will get off of on the insanity defense. Do I want him to? Hell no.

It won't happen, and only an imbecile would think that an insanity defense will somehow result in this guy going free.

Quote
Second, I think the negative, potentially=violent rhetoric IS even from both sides. One look back during the Bush Administration easily equals what is going on today.

Yes, there was intemperate rhetoric, but please point me to major candidates of the Democratic Party during Bush's presidency saying things like major Republican candidates have about "second amendment solutions". Show me major liberal media figures using eliminationist rhetoric the way Glen Beck *routinely* does. Glen Beck once spent several minutes waxing on about how he'd really like to kill Michael Moore, but was thinking that it might be better to hire someone else to do it instead -- find me *ANYTHING* from a major liberal media figure like that. And then there's Sarah Palin, who has done more to debase political dialogue in this country than anyone since Father Coughlin -- from lies in the 2008 campaign (Obama "isn't one of us," he "pals around with terrorists") to her constant use of gun-violence metaphors (gun sights on Congressmembers she didn't like, "Don't retreat, RELOAD!").

You can claim that there is comparative rhetoric form the left, but that's just smoke and mirrors until you can show liberal figures as powerful as Levine, Beck or Palin using violent, eliminationist and gun related imagery as much as Beck, Levine or Palin. It's a challenge on you to show that this comparative rhetoric exists. So far you've done no such thing.
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Zekester
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« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2011, 03:33:24 PM »

Fine, just for arguments sake let's fantasize that the right is worse.

Answer my original question. Crazier things keep happening more and more in this country, so why would it be hard to imagine that this result is possible?

And will any liberals here condemn what the sheriff has done? Injected politics into this situation by using it to take a stab at conservatives. I mean, seriously....liberals would go flaming nuts if it was the other way around. Not to mention, should we have law officials that immediately jump to such conclusions without getting the facts yet? Would you want that done to you or your family by a lawman?

If there's so much intellegence on this board, let's see some of it.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2011, 03:34:57 PM by Zekester » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2011, 03:41:08 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:10:31 PM

Quote from: Captain Caveman on January 12, 2011, 03:05:48 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 02:43:24 PM

Second, I think the negative, potentially=violent rhetoric IS even from both sides. One look back during the Bush Administration easily equals what is going on today.

Your turn.

Oh come on.....there is no possible way to count up every single instance, but all intellegent people on both sides know damn well it works out about even. We're not comparing earthlings to martians here.

Quote from: Fireball1244 on January 12, 2011, 03:22:14 PM

You can claim that there is comparative rhetoric form the left, but that's just smoke and mirrors until you can show liberal figures as powerful as Levine, Beck or Palin using violent, eliminationist and gun related imagery as much as Beck, Levine or Palin. It's a challenge on you to show that this comparative rhetoric exists. So far you've done no such thing.

Like Fireball says - we're not asking for all of them.  We're asking you to find us one.

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« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2011, 03:48:24 PM »

DCCC map of "targeted Republicans" (which of course can't be found on the DCCC site anymore):

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Zekester
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« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2011, 03:50:12 PM »

Ok, well so much for an intellegent discussion on here about this.

All you guys are interested in is a pissing contest. Just answer my questions if you have the intellegence and balls to do so. Because by just trying to prove the sheriff right, then you must also agree with what he has done....use that tragedy for political gain.

Guess I got my answer.
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« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2011, 03:55:36 PM »

All we're interested in is reasonable debate.  You aren't at all interested in that.  You want to post random bullshit and run like a bitch when you get called on it.

That is your rhetoric.  The board has spoken.  Deal with it.
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« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM »

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

If it turns out that this goofball killer was indeed a conservative fueled by the rhetoric, i'll condemn him. Hell, I condemn him now regardless.
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« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2011, 03:57:03 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 03:48:24 PM

DCCC map of "targeted Republicans" (which of course can't be found on the DCCC site anymore):



Stretching it a bar far, don't you think?  I mean given the current climate I understand that it's marginal, but in a rational context it's dots on a map.  If you didn't have Palin's map in mind, this wouldn't really strike me as odd.  Maybe that's just me though.
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« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2011, 03:58:18 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:55:36 PM

All we're interested in is reasonable debate.  You aren't at all interested in that.  You want to post random bullshit and run like a bitch when you get called on it.

That is your rhetoric.  The board has spoken.  Deal with it.

I wasnt asking for a pissing contest debate, fool.

Go back and read my original post AND ANSWER THEM WITH YOUR OPINION.

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« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2011, 03:58:26 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

It's a political move done by an elected official in office.  None of that bothers or shocks me anymore.

Are you condemning any of the politicians who used 9/11 to further their political careers?  Or Palin's rhetoric?  You can't have one without the other - or are you condemning THIS guy because he's a democrat?
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« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2011, 03:58:31 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:33:24 PM

Fine, just for arguments sake let's fantasize that the right is worse.

Answer my original question. Crazier things keep happening more and more in this country, so why would it be hard to imagine that this result is possible?

He shot a Federal Judge and a 9 year old girl, amongst others, in broad daylight in front of hundreds of witnesses. It doesn't matter what sort of defense he puts up. He will be convicted, and executed. I don't generally support the death penalty, and even I would vote to execute him.
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« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2011, 04:00:53 PM »

Quote from: Fireball1244 on January 12, 2011, 03:58:31 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:33:24 PM

Fine, just for arguments sake let's fantasize that the right is worse.

Answer my original question. Crazier things keep happening more and more in this country, so why would it be hard to imagine that this result is possible?

He shot a Federal Judge and a 9 year old girl, amongst others, in broad daylight in front of hundreds of witnesses. It doesn't matter what sort of defense he puts up. He will be convicted, and executed. I don't generally support the death penalty, and even I would vote to execute him.

Now this is an answer. Thank you.
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« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2011, 04:01:58 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:58:26 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

It's a political move done by an elected official in office.  None of that bothers or shocks me anymore.

Are you condemning any of the politicians who used 9/11 to further their political careers?  Or Palin's rhetoric?  You can't have one without the other - or are you condemning THIS guy because he's a democrat?

Bush or Guiliani blamed liberals and/or Democrats a day after 9/11? Really?

Proof, please
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« Reply #18 on: January 12, 2011, 04:02:47 PM »

Quote from: Fireball1244 on January 12, 2011, 03:58:31 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:33:24 PM

Fine, just for arguments sake let's fantasize that the right is worse.

Answer my original question. Crazier things keep happening more and more in this country, so why would it be hard to imagine that this result is possible?

He shot a Federal Judge and a 9 year old girl, amongst others, in broad daylight in front of hundreds of witnesses. It doesn't matter what sort of defense he puts up. He will be convicted, and executed. I don't generally support the death penalty, and even I would vote to execute him.

The insanity defense has an extremely low success rate and in those successes, the patient was previously diagnosed with a mental illness 90% of the time.  This guy is not getting off on this.  The sheriff's actions will have zero effect on the court case.

He may not go to death, but he's certainly going to spend a long, long time incarcerated.  
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« Reply #19 on: January 12, 2011, 04:03:37 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 04:01:58 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:58:26 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

It's a political move done by an elected official in office.  None of that bothers or shocks me anymore.

Are you condemning any of the politicians who used 9/11 to further their political careers?  Or Palin's rhetoric?  You can't have one without the other - or are you condemning THIS guy because he's a democrat?

Bush or Guiliani blamed liberals and/or Democrats a day after 9/11? Really?

Proof, please

Oh so it's OK to use tragedy to further your political career so long as you aren't blaming the other side?  Or it's OK if you wait one week (or month, or year)?  Is that the argument?
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« Reply #20 on: January 12, 2011, 04:12:25 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:57:03 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 03:48:24 PM

DCCC map of "targeted Republicans" (which of course can't be found on the DCCC site anymore):



Stretching it a bar far, don't you think?  I mean given the current climate I understand that it's marginal, but in a rational context it's dots on a map.  If you didn't have Palin's map in mind, this wouldn't really strike me as odd.  Maybe that's just me though.

Bullseyes over targeted Republicans in the 2010 election is not too big a stretch.

Besides, if it's so harmless, why can't you find this map on the DCCC's still active 2010 races page?
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Zekester
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« Reply #21 on: January 12, 2011, 04:12:48 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 04:03:37 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 04:01:58 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:58:26 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

It's a political move done by an elected official in office.  None of that bothers or shocks me anymore.

Are you condemning any of the politicians who used 9/11 to further their political careers?  Or Palin's rhetoric?  You can't have one without the other - or are you condemning THIS guy because he's a democrat?

Bush or Guiliani blamed liberals and/or Democrats a day after 9/11? Really?

Proof, please

Oh so it's OK to use tragedy to further your political career so long as you aren't blaming the other side?  Or it's OK if you wait one week (or month, or year)?  Is that the argument?

This sheriff has no good argument for doing what he has done.

Of all people, a lawman is not supposed to shoot first and prove guilt later. Are you seriously defending this??

And just reverse this situation. Would you not be on here infuriated by what has he done? Should I spell it out so it has the desired effect?

Headline: nutjob makes assasination attempt on Obama, kills others. Conservative sheriff immediately uses it to point fingers at Democrats/liberals, saying they contributed to it.
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« Reply #22 on: January 12, 2011, 04:13:46 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:12:25 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:57:03 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 03:48:24 PM

DCCC map of "targeted Republicans" (which of course can't be found on the DCCC site anymore):



Stretching it a bar far, don't you think?  I mean given the current climate I understand that it's marginal, but in a rational context it's dots on a map.  If you didn't have Palin's map in mind, this wouldn't really strike me as odd.  Maybe that's just me though.

Bullseyes over targeted Republicans in the 2010 election is not too big a stretch.

Besides, if it's so harmless, why can't you find this map on the DCCC's still active 2010 races page?

Weak.
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« Reply #23 on: January 12, 2011, 04:20:37 PM »

I'm pretty sure he's never going to be deemed competent to stand trial.  But that being said, he's not ever goig to be deemed sane enough to gain his release, either.  There's a history of episodes.  The college kicked him out and told his parents that he's need a psych review before they'd let him back. 

If the shrinks can medicate him and run him enough therapy to get him to function on his own, more power to them, but I don't see it happening.
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« Reply #24 on: January 12, 2011, 04:21:02 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 04:12:48 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 04:03:37 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 04:01:58 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:58:26 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

It's a political move done by an elected official in office.  None of that bothers or shocks me anymore.

Are you condemning any of the politicians who used 9/11 to further their political careers?  Or Palin's rhetoric?  You can't have one without the other - or are you condemning THIS guy because he's a democrat?

Bush or Guiliani blamed liberals and/or Democrats a day after 9/11? Really?

Proof, please

Oh so it's OK to use tragedy to further your political career so long as you aren't blaming the other side?  Or it's OK if you wait one week (or month, or year)?  Is that the argument?

This sheriff has no good argument for doing what he has done.

Of all people, a lawman is not supposed to shoot first and prove guilt later. Are you seriously defending this??

And just reverse this situation. Would you not be on here infuriated by what has he done? Should I spell it out so it has the desired effect?

Headline: nutjob makes assasination attempt on Obama, kills others. Conservative sheriff immediately uses it to point fingers at Democrats/liberals, saying they contributed to it.

In the grand scheme of my give-a-fuck-o-meter, political activities do not register.  The system is so fucked and broken that I couldn't care less what either side does.

Should he have done it?  No.
Am I surprised he did it?  Not at all.
Would a Republican have done the same thing?  Almost certainly.
Would I give a shit in either scenario?  Not at all.
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« Reply #25 on: January 12, 2011, 04:22:10 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 04:21:02 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 04:12:48 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 04:03:37 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 04:01:58 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:58:26 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 03:56:47 PM

You guys are showing your true selves by not condemning what this sheriff has done. It was wrong on a couple levels.

It's a political move done by an elected official in office.  None of that bothers or shocks me anymore.

Are you condemning any of the politicians who used 9/11 to further their political careers?  Or Palin's rhetoric?  You can't have one without the other - or are you condemning THIS guy because he's a democrat?

Bush or Guiliani blamed liberals and/or Democrats a day after 9/11? Really?

Proof, please

Oh so it's OK to use tragedy to further your political career so long as you aren't blaming the other side?  Or it's OK if you wait one week (or month, or year)?  Is that the argument?

This sheriff has no good argument for doing what he has done.

Of all people, a lawman is not supposed to shoot first and prove guilt later. Are you seriously defending this??

And just reverse this situation. Would you not be on here infuriated by what has he done? Should I spell it out so it has the desired effect?

Headline: nutjob makes assasination attempt on Obama, kills others. Conservative sheriff immediately uses it to point fingers at Democrats/liberals, saying they contributed to it.

In the grand scheme of my give-a-fuck-o-meter, political activities do not register.  The system is so fucked and broken that I couldn't care less what either side does.

Should he have done it?  No.
Am I surprised he did it?  Not at all.
Would a Republican have done the same thing?  Almost certainly.
Would I give a shit in either scenario?  Not at all.

Ok
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« Reply #26 on: January 12, 2011, 04:22:55 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:12:25 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 03:57:03 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 03:48:24 PM

DCCC map of "targeted Republicans" (which of course can't be found on the DCCC site anymore):



Stretching it a bar far, don't you think?  I mean given the current climate I understand that it's marginal, but in a rational context it's dots on a map.  If you didn't have Palin's map in mind, this wouldn't really strike me as odd.  Maybe that's just me though.

Bullseyes over targeted Republicans in the 2010 election is not too big a stretch.

Besides, if it's so harmless, why can't you find this map on the DCCC's still active 2010 races page?

On your first, we'll agree to disagree.

On your second, I answered that in the post above.  Given the *current* climate, the graphic can be taken in bad taste and of course they took it down.  It would be horrific form to leave it up.
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« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM »

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.
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« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2011, 05:13:10 PM »

Another Arizona Sheriff speaks

http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Giffords-Dupnik-Arpaio-Arizona/2011/01/11/id/382540

Quote
Referring to assertions by some that Sarah Palin and others on the right are somehow to blame for Loughner’s actions, Arpaio tells Newsmax: “I don’t think it’s fair.

“I have to say that I have been threatened constantly, threatened by elected officials, calling me Nazi, Hitler, every name in the book. Yet I haven’t heard anybody speak out in the Democrat administration saying that’s not right.

“Why are they blaming her? They put me in [cross hairs]. They put me in KKK uniforms. They call me Hitler and everything else. They say I should be dead. They’ve got rewards out for me. So why isn’t anybody talking about this sheriff? I’m talking about the Democrats. They’re investigating me, the Justice Department, but why aren’t they concerned about this sheriff?”
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« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?
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« Reply #30 on: January 12, 2011, 08:31:01 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?

You open with that line, and then expect me to "prove you wrong"?

No.  Not just no, but hell no.

Besides, you're not interested in my opinion, anyway.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2011, 08:33:09 PM by pr0ner » Logged

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gellar
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« Reply #31 on: January 12, 2011, 08:33:31 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?

I'm not exactly a liberal, but I did say what he did shouldn't have been done.  I just also said I don't give a fuck.
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« Reply #32 on: January 12, 2011, 08:34:03 PM »

No what, pr0ner?
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Zekester
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« Reply #33 on: January 12, 2011, 08:35:12 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 08:33:31 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?

I'm not exactly a liberal, but I did say what he did shouldn't have been done.  I just also said I don't give a fuck.

Me thinks you would give a shit more had I done something similar here
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« Reply #34 on: January 12, 2011, 08:36:28 PM »

A little more information on the Insanity Defense:

Quote
Most insanity defenses do not succeed.  One study found that less than 1% of criminal trials involve an insanity defense, and of those only about 25% succeeded.  An insanity defense requires much more than a simple diagnosis of a mental disorder.  The “Unambomber” was diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic, yet still declared competent to stand trial and convicted on 10 counts.  An example of a successful insanity defense comes from the attempted Reagan assassination.  John W. Hinkley’s lawyers argued that he was a schizophrenic, and that he had not acted on his own volition when he fired at Reagan.  Hinkley was found not guilty by reason of insanity and subsequently confined to St. Elizabeth’s hospital in Washington D.C.  If someone “wins” an insanity defense, he or she is rarely let free.  Instead the defendant “wins” is the right to be confined in a mental institution or hospital instead of a prison.

The bad news for Loughner is that federal law has been changed since the Hinkley trial in order to make the insanity more difficult.

FWIW, Hinkley is still in the Mental Institution almost 30 years later, probably less time than he would have spent in jail for his attempted assassination.
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Pardon me, but that is a .... damn fine cup of coffee.
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« Reply #35 on: January 12, 2011, 08:39:02 PM »

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:35:12 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 08:33:31 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?

I'm not exactly a liberal, but I did say what he did shouldn't have been done.  I just also said I don't give a fuck.

Me thinks you would give a shit more had I done something similar here

Well if the sheriff posted here and I could ridicule him in a manner that made him look like an idiot, I probably would.  That doesn't mean I give a shit.  That just means it was an opportunity to be a dick to someone who deserves it that I took advantage of.  It's fun!
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« Reply #36 on: January 12, 2011, 08:40:34 PM »

Holy crap, Zekester was right. Breaking news: the shooter walks.
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Zekester
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« Reply #37 on: January 12, 2011, 08:42:35 PM »

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 08:39:02 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:35:12 PM

Quote from: gellar on January 12, 2011, 08:33:31 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?

I'm not exactly a liberal, but I did say what he did shouldn't have been done.  I just also said I don't give a fuck.

Me thinks you would give a shit more had I done something similar here

Well if the sheriff posted here and I could ridicule him in a manner that made him look like an idiot, I probably would.  That doesn't mean I give a shit.  That just means it was an opportunity to be a dick to someone who deserves it that I took advantage of.  It's fun!

Ahhh....so the likely consensus of many a behavior on this board is finally revealed.
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« Reply #38 on: January 12, 2011, 08:43:49 PM »

Revealed?  Everyone knows that my MO is to ridicule the dumb.  It's my role around here.
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Zekester
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« Reply #39 on: January 12, 2011, 08:43:59 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 08:31:01 PM

Quote from: Zekester on January 12, 2011, 08:16:55 PM

Quote from: pr0ner on January 12, 2011, 04:58:38 PM

Fair enough.  I just wanted to provide some sort of concrete counter argument.

pr0ner, your correspondence with me on these boards has been, well, for the most part juvinile

Prove me wrong by showing me you have some substance, and give me your opinion on what this sheriff did. Was he right, and why? wrong? why?

Still no liberal here can say that they think what this sheriff did was wrong. Had I posted something like the opposite less than 24hrs after it happened like the sheriff did, most of you would be slamming the shit out of me for being stupid, insensible, inflammatory, etc. But you guys won't do it here, will you? That's fine...all you do is prove people like Rush Limbaugh right.

And where's Mr Fed? Surely he can't think it was right. Right?

You open with that line, and then expect me to "prove you wrong"?

No.  Not just no, but hell no.

Besides, you're not interested in my opinion, anyway.

So you're refusing to answer? LOL You're either running for some public office in the future, or, as I always suspected, are just a paper tiger.
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