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Author Topic: Bob Barr steps into the presidential race!  (Read 1514 times)
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corruptrelic
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« on: May 14, 2008, 03:31:12 AM »

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Former Republican Rep. Bob Barr launched a Libertarian Party presidential bid Monday, saying voters are hungry for an alternative to the status quo who would dramatically cut the federal government.

His candidacy throws a wild card into the White House race that many believe could peel away votes from Republican Sen. John McCain given the candidates' similar positions on fiscal policy.

Barr, who has hired Ross Perot's former campaign manager, acknowledged that some Republicans have tried to discourage him from running. But he said he's getting in the race to win, not to play spoiler or to make a point.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5jGwp22QlX2kmePoy02e4pTBLwWwAD90KEJ980

I can't vote for any of the current 3 in good faith, so it looks like Barr will be getting my vote.

There's also a Q&A with him here:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/136847 
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Ironrod
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« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2008, 04:39:59 AM »

I read elsewhere that he is anti-abortion. I would like to know how he reconciles that with libertarianism.
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Moliere
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« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2008, 04:59:39 AM »

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 04:39:59 AM

I read elsewhere that he is anti-abortion. I would like to know how he reconciles that with libertarianism.


Some Libertarians feel that the "baby's" life/rights trumps the mother's.
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2008, 05:17:50 AM »

If you're looking for the "perfect" candidate on every single issue, good luck finding one. Ron Paul, even though he's a republican congressman, is still very much libertarian and had taken a pro-life stance during his campaign.

If anything I really hope more votes for Barr mean less votes for McCain. We don't need 4 more years of Bush.
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Ironrod
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« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2008, 03:25:12 PM »

Quote from: Moliere on May 14, 2008, 04:59:39 AM

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 04:39:59 AM

I read elsewhere that he is anti-abortion. I would like to know how he reconciles that with libertarianism.


Some Libertarians feel that the "baby's" life/rights trumps the mother's.

Thanks for the link. I don't agree with their premise, but at least now I can understand how big-L Libertarians can take a position so directly contradictory to small-l libertarianism.

Quote
Our reasoning is expressly scientific and philosophical rather than either pragmatic or religious, or merely political or emotional. 

Then they lay out a six-point argument that is entirely religious and emotional, with no scientific grounding whatsoever. I will probably not be voting Libertarian unless Bob Barr explicitly supports abortion rights. Too bad; the Libs have been my go-to alternative for the past five or six elections.
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brettmcd
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« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2008, 05:26:40 PM »

I honestly think the consistent libertarian position should be pro life, as they want the government to stay out of peoples lives except if that person is taking away someone elses rights.   
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brettmcd
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« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2008, 05:28:19 PM »

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 03:25:12 PM

Quote from: Moliere on May 14, 2008, 04:59:39 AM

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 04:39:59 AM

I read elsewhere that he is anti-abortion. I would like to know how he reconciles that with libertarianism.


Some Libertarians feel that the "baby's" life/rights trumps the mother's.

Thanks for the link. I don't agree with their premise, but at least now I can understand how big-L Libertarians can take a position so directly contradictory to small-l libertarianism.

Quote
Our reasoning is expressly scientific and philosophical rather than either pragmatic or religious, or merely political or emotional. 

Then they lay out a six-point argument that is entirely religious and emotional, with no scientific grounding whatsoever. I will probably not be voting Libertarian unless Bob Barr explicitly supports abortion rights. Too bad; the Libs have been my go-to alternative for the past five or six elections.

Id have to disagree with you on at least their first point, its a biological fact that human life begins at conception.   That can be shown scientifically or in any other way you choose.
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Ironrod
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« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2008, 06:00:57 PM »

Quote from: brettmcd on May 14, 2008, 05:28:19 PM

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 03:25:12 PM

Quote from: Moliere on May 14, 2008, 04:59:39 AM

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 04:39:59 AM

I read elsewhere that he is anti-abortion. I would like to know how he reconciles that with libertarianism.


Some Libertarians feel that the "baby's" life/rights trumps the mother's.

Thanks for the link. I don't agree with their premise, but at least now I can understand how big-L Libertarians can take a position so directly contradictory to small-l libertarianism.

Quote
Our reasoning is expressly scientific and philosophical rather than either pragmatic or religious, or merely political or emotional. 

Then they lay out a six-point argument that is entirely religious and emotional, with no scientific grounding whatsoever. I will probably not be voting Libertarian unless Bob Barr explicitly supports abortion rights. Too bad; the Libs have been my go-to alternative for the past five or six elections.

Id have to disagree with you on at least their first point, its a biological fact that human life begins at conception.   That can be shown scientifically or in any other way you choose.

Their policy statement ascribes personhood to a fertilized egg cell. That is entirely an article of faith, outside the scope of science. I'm not going to step through the entire abortion debate here, as that can only go round in circles. But when Point 1 of a six-point policy statement is fallacious, the ensuing points are moot.
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Geezer
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« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2008, 05:27:18 AM »

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 06:00:57 PM

Quote from: brettmcd on May 14, 2008, 05:28:19 PM

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 03:25:12 PM

Quote from: Moliere on May 14, 2008, 04:59:39 AM

Quote from: Ironrod on May 14, 2008, 04:39:59 AM

I read elsewhere that he is anti-abortion. I would like to know how he reconciles that with libertarianism.


Some Libertarians feel that the "baby's" life/rights trumps the mother's.

Thanks for the link. I don't agree with their premise, but at least now I can understand how big-L Libertarians can take a position so directly contradictory to small-l libertarianism.

Quote
Our reasoning is expressly scientific and philosophical rather than either pragmatic or religious, or merely political or emotional. 

Then they lay out a six-point argument that is entirely religious and emotional, with no scientific grounding whatsoever. I will probably not be voting Libertarian unless Bob Barr explicitly supports abortion rights. Too bad; the Libs have been my go-to alternative for the past five or six elections.

Id have to disagree with you on at least their first point, its a biological fact that human life begins at conception.   That can be shown scientifically or in any other way you choose.

Their policy statement ascribes personhood to a fertilized egg cell. That is entirely an article of faith, outside the scope of science. I'm not going to step through the entire abortion debate here, as that can only go round in circles. But when Point 1 of a six-point policy statement is fallacious, the ensuing points are moot.

To be fair, I don't think science has yet been able to come up with an incontrovertible definition of "personhood."  And even though it doesn't mirror my personal feelings on the subject, "At conception" IS one of the easier bright lines to draw philosophically.
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Trappin
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« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2008, 09:41:17 PM »

Bob Barr was the lead law counsel for the House impeachment of Clinton correct? He then retired from the House and took a cush job at the ACLU? - weird. And now... after serving many many many years in the Republican party he has what can only be described as an idealogical epiphany and declares to the world to be Libertarian?

Dunno what this guys game is but its more akin to Three Card Molly than Yahtzee.

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