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Author Topic: Think you can balance the federal budget?  (Read 1384 times)
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Kobra
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« on: December 21, 2006, 01:34:28 PM »

Why not find out?

http://www.budgetsim.org/nbs/shortbudget06.html

I was able to induce a large surplus by simply reducing military spending, unfunding the war in Iraq, rolling back the Bush tax cuts for the super-rich, and reducing corporate tax incentives a bit.   While INCREASING funding for alternative energies, science/tech, conservation, and educational programs.

Budget Totals
Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

New budget is $3229.7 billion
($2409.15 billion in spending, $820.55 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
You have cut the deficit by $517.66 billion.
Your new deficit is $-116.65 billion.
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whiteboyskim
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« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2006, 03:57:42 PM »

Unfortuately there's nothing that can be done about social security. I selected "eliminate" and when I ran the numbers there was no change to it at all. Since nothing can be done about that one, I'm bothered by it. Oh, and by scaling back certain tax breaks (40% on corporate, 10% on everything else, 30% on 2001-2003 tax breaks) then cutting General Government Administration by 30%, and scaling back the military engagements by 40% then increasing funds towards Natural Resources and such by 20% I had a surplus of 28 billion. Then I "held even" on the Natural Resources and my surplus went down, which struck me as funny considering it should have gone up since I would technically be spending less money.

Net result? Utter bullshit. But fun to play with. icon_wink
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Knightshade Dragon
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« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2006, 04:50:07 PM »

In the real world, sure. Complete spending revamp.  Cut programs that have no point. (Nobody gives a rats ass what the mating habits of the common gerbil is on the moon)  Properly fund things that have a point. (body armor for soldiers)  Exit strategy for current war.  (Requirement to HAVE an exit strategy before getting any more money) And my biggest one...

Make businesses pay their own taxes instead of passing it to the consumer.  No more passing the bill.  Also, no more government help for some businesses (I'm looking at you Airlines.  Improve or die).
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Ron Burke
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Exodor
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« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2006, 07:09:09 PM »

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on December 21, 2006, 04:50:07 PM

Make businesses pay their own taxes instead of passing it to the consumer.  No more passing the bill. 

How do you prevent business from passing increased costs on to the consumer?
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Knightshade Dragon
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« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2006, 07:59:46 PM »

Quote from: Exodor on December 21, 2006, 07:09:09 PM

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on December 21, 2006, 04:50:07 PM

Make businesses pay their own taxes instead of passing it to the consumer.  No more passing the bill. 

How do you prevent business from passing increased costs on to the consumer?

That is the tough part.  When you think about it, you pay the taxes at the register, and the company has also padded their taxes into the product price.  Then they get a tax break from the governement to skip out on those same taxes that they've already padded in.  Extra profit and double taxes.
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Kobra
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« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2006, 08:07:44 PM »

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on December 21, 2006, 07:59:46 PM

Quote from: Exodor on December 21, 2006, 07:09:09 PM

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on December 21, 2006, 04:50:07 PM

Make businesses pay their own taxes instead of passing it to the consumer.  No more passing the bill. 

How do you prevent business from passing increased costs on to the consumer?

That is the tough part.  When you think about it, you pay the taxes at the register, and the company has also padded their taxes into the product price.  Then they get a tax break from the governement to skip out on those same taxes that they've already padded in.  Extra profit and double taxes.

Exactly..  We're double, even triple dip taxed in this country, and it is fucking criminal.
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Knightshade Dragon
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« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2006, 08:26:57 PM »

Quote from: Kobra on December 21, 2006, 08:07:44 PM

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on December 21, 2006, 07:59:46 PM

Quote from: Exodor on December 21, 2006, 07:09:09 PM

Quote from: Knightshade Dragon on December 21, 2006, 04:50:07 PM

Make businesses pay their own taxes instead of passing it to the consumer.  No more passing the bill. 

How do you prevent business from passing increased costs on to the consumer?

That is the tough part.  When you think about it, you pay the taxes at the register, and the company has also padded their taxes into the product price.  Then they get a tax break from the governement to skip out on those same taxes that they've already padded in.  Extra profit and double taxes.

Exactly..  We're double, even triple dip taxed in this country, and it is fucking criminal.
Problem is...who can change it? 
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Kobra
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« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2006, 08:43:30 PM »

Nothing.  Short of a revolution, it is shocking to read the declaration of independance today, and how much merit it has in our CURRENT situtations.  Sad really.
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brettmcd
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« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2006, 09:36:47 PM »

Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
New budget is $2657.68 billion
($2274.7 billion in spending, $382.98 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

You have cut the deficit by $1089.68 billion.
Your new deficit is $-688.67 billion.


Increases tax cuts, and military spending, gave all social spending a 30% cut (wanted to elminate, but that would be done over a few years).
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Knightshade Dragon
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« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2006, 09:49:35 PM »

Quote from: brettmcd on December 21, 2006, 09:36:47 PM

Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
New budget is $2657.68 billion
($2274.7 billion in spending, $382.98 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

You have cut the deficit by $1089.68 billion.
Your new deficit is $-688.67 billion.


Increases tax cuts, and military spending, gave all social spending a 30% cut (wanted to elminate, but that would be done over a few years).

Nicely done!  (and welcome to the site btw)
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gameoverman
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« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2006, 12:14:08 AM »

Your New Budget

Budget Totals
Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

New budget is $3421.85 billion
($2701.98 billion in spending, $719.87 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
You have cut the deficit by $325.51 billion.
Your new deficit is $75.49 billion.

I eliminated Iraq/Afghanistan(although I would have preferred to only eliminate Iraq), I eliminated 2k1 and 3 and Corp tax cuts.  Then I raised most spending ~10-20%(Health, Education, Veterans, stuff like that).  The rest stayed even.
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Fireball
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« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2006, 08:27:56 AM »

My budget was built by:

Decreasing overall military spending by 10%
Decreasing Iraq/Afghanistan by 50% (to simulate ending the Iraq quagmire)
Increasing Education by 10% (more student loans is my intention)

Eliminating the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts
Cutting Corporate Tax Breaks by 30%

Budget Totals

Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
New budget is $3340.53 billion
($2578.41 billion in spending, $762.12 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

You have cut the deficit by $406.83 billion.

Your new deficit is $-5.82 billion.


So, in effect, I cut spending by $94 billion and repealed $313 billion in tax cuts, and in the process restored a roughly $6 billion surplus that should be used to begin paying down the debt (which eventually will cut down the interest payments we owe every year, allowing us to cut taxes).
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dbt1949
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« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2006, 12:07:53 PM »

That was fun. I need something like that for my own budget. icon_wink
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« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2006, 02:21:21 PM »

Budget Totals
Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

New budget is $3625.62 billion
($2666.62 billion in spending, $959 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
You have cut the deficit by $121.74 billion.
Your new deficit is $279.26 billion.


I kept spending almost even, by cutting Military costs down to next to nothing, and eliminating Iraq/Afghanistan. I raised spending by a minimum of 20% in almost every category. Some like Social Security are pointless and require a major overhaul to fix. I eliminated corporate tax breaks, reduced 01 and 03 cuts by 10%. Shoot, if you eliminate those tax cuts you can not change spending and pretty much eliminate the deficit.
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CeeKay
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« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2006, 03:42:23 PM »

Quote
Budget Totals
Old budget was $3747.36 billion
($2672.527 billion in spending, $1074.833 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).
New budget is $3280.57 billion
($2560.7 billion in spending, $719.87 billion in tax expenditures and cuts).

You have cut the deficit by $466.79 billion.
Your new deficit is $-65.78 billion.

I killed Corporate Tax Breaks, Afghanistan and Iraq and the 2001/2003 tax cuts and left everything else the same.
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« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2006, 08:50:53 PM »

my high school government mid term was to come up with a 4 year plan to balance the budget from the numbers given to us in the book.  our only requirement was that we were NOT allowed to cut from the veterans Fund, as our teacher had been a door gunner in a huey in Vietnam.  He warned us ahead of time that we would be given a F for our papers grade if we did so.  Some people apparently thought to test him.  they failed.  I on the other hand left the small amount going to the Veterans alone, and took small bits from a large slection of groups, and I was able to come up with a pretty good balance over 4 years.

its not that hard on paper.
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GGMark
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« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2006, 08:54:01 PM »

I just gave that little thing a try.  WOW, is military spending outrageous.  I mean I understand that it has to be, but WOW, thats a lot of money.
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mori
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« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2006, 10:47:44 PM »

Does it calculate how deep of a recession your budget balancing will cause if not done with a little thought to the outcome.
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brettmcd
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« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2006, 11:12:56 PM »

Quote from: GGMark on December 28, 2006, 08:54:01 PM

I just gave that little thing a try.  WOW, is military spending outrageous.  I mean I understand that it has to be, but WOW, thats a lot of money.

Well its one of the few legitimate things for the federal government to spend money on, and national defense isnt cheap.
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jpinard
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« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2006, 01:32:54 AM »

Quote from: brettmcd on December 28, 2006, 11:12:56 PM

Quote from: GGMark on December 28, 2006, 08:54:01 PM

I just gave that little thing a try.  WOW, is military spending outrageous.  I mean I understand that it has to be, but WOW, thats a lot of money.

Well its one of the few legitimate things for the federal government to spend money on, and national defense isnt cheap.

It's amazing how we're in a military tech race with... umm... err...who???  France?  If you want to see how out of wack military spending is look at who profits the most.  The subcontactor defense agencies have made an insane killing under Bush Jr.  Meanwhile we respond to our own natural disasters like a third world country... and when we finally do respond ther'es enourmous waste and once again... the defense subcontractors make a killing. 
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« Reply #20 on: December 29, 2006, 04:38:57 PM »

Yeah, we are ramping up military spending by billions to compete with... guys making bombs in their bathtubs.

Sounds like a losing proposition to me.  We are going to run out of money before they run out of bathtubs.
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« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2006, 06:38:57 PM »

Quote from: unbreakable on December 29, 2006, 04:38:57 PM

Yeah, we are ramping up military spending by billions to compete with... guys making bombs in their bathtubs.

Sounds like a losing proposition to me.  We are going to run out of money before they run out of bathtubs.

Not if we bomb all the bathtub factories.
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