Lost: The Final Season (spoilers not tagged)

[JayDee]

That was....harsh.

[Barrakketh]

That was....harsh.

Indeed. I honestly wasn't expecting a bloodbath like that until the final episode.

[Ironrod]

Gotta narrow the focus to a few candidates. The real question is, Why is Kate still alive?

We learned (if Jack is right) that Smokeylocke doesn't need all the candidates to leave alive...he needs them all dead. But he has to trick them into killing themselves/each other. So we have Hurley, Jack, and Sawyer left as candidates, right? Maybe Kate will narrow them down further.

I think Hurley's going to be the last man standing, btw.

[CeeKay]

wow, didn't expect something like that.

[edit]it was even worse when Hurley started blubbering, and I have a feeling Darth Claire isn't going to be Locke's friend at the very last minute 

[EddieA]

"I won't leave you.  I'll never leave you again." 

[rittchard]

Gotta narrow the focus to a few candidates. The real question is, Why is Kate still alive?

We learned (if Jack is right) that Smokeylocke doesn't need all the candidates to leave alive...he needs them all dead. But he has to trick them into killing themselves/each other. So we have Hurley, Jack, and Sawyer left as candidates, right? Maybe Kate will narrow them down further.

I think Hurley's going to be the last man standing, btw.

I've actually been betting on Kate being the final island savior.  Just a wild hunch based on a few hints here and there.  Jack is being set up too obviously as the main guy so i kind of ruled him out.  I can definitely see cases for Sawyer or Hurley, but i like the misdirection of Kate.  One thing i saw when rewatching lighthouse was "Austen" listed on the compass - of course they are saying she was eliminated or crossed out but no one's really said why.  The more they play her as being lame and inconsequential the more i think they are trying to mislead us for a twist.  Last hunch was based on reading the original pilot had Jack dying and Kate was supposed to lead the survivors, so this might be consistent with the original vision.  Or i could just be blinded by my Kate fandom

[Kyosho]

There's people that like Kate?   

Man, this episode was like a kick in the nuts. It would've been even more sad if not for the alternate timeline. That kind of "ruins" some of the sadness, knowing that they're okay elsewhere.

[CeeKay]

30 minutes added to the finale, but this does not make me warm and fuzzy:

Lindelof recently told The Hollywood Reporter that the crew built all-new sets for the finale, and he promised that the ending would prompt more questions.

on a side note I remember just reading an article where they were asking the guy who played Jin if Jin and Sun would have a happy ending.  IIRC he said 'kinda'.

[Qantaga]

I've actually been betting on Kate being the final island savior.  Just a wild hunch based on a few hints here and there.

   
Interesting. I had been buying into the "Kate is no longer a candidate" Kool-Aid, but you're right that they seem to be pushing that a little hard.
   
As for me, my money is on Desmond saving the island. It would be cool if it were Hurley, though.

[Eel Snave]

My guess is that Jack gets everyone off the island.  Smokey tries killing Jack, but he can't.  That leaves only Jack and Locke alone on the island, with Jack taking over Jacob's role and Locke taking over Smokey's role.  The last scene will be the cave with Jack writing new names on the walls.

[CeeKay]

The last scene will be the cave with Jack writing new names on the walls.

or maybe them sitting on the beach, with Locke telling Jack he's going to have him killed.

[TiLT]

Appealing as that sounds, I don't think it's going to happen that way, mostly because the show's creators have said recently that the ending will resolve the alternate reality thing, and I don't see how your idea for the ending would do that.

We'll just have to wait and see. Not long now.

[Ironrod]

There's people that like Kate?   

  I am not one of those people. I've never liked Jin & Sun, either. Their death scene didn't move me, although I did appreciate the final Michelangelo-like image of their hands parting.

I'm sticking with Hurley becoming the Big Kahuna because he has always seemed the least likely for the role -- the eternal sidekick, never the star. Although now that it's been pointed out, it does look like they're trying to downplay Kate (while keeping her alive for mysterious reasons).

[tgb]

I liked Jin & Sun and was sorry to see them go.

So NotLocke's master plan was to get them to kill themselves by attempting to diffuse the bomb?  What if Kate hadn't been shot?  What if Jack had no reason to look inside his pack until after they were all off the sub and separated?

And why is NotLocke shooting at people on the dock instead of smoking them (pun intended)?

[Kyosho]

And why is NotLocke shooting at people on the dock instead of smoking them (pun intended)?

Convenience/speed of killing. Might have taken him a moment to change form, and then to float over to them and kill them. Shooting with perfect accuracy was just easier, I'd guess.

[CeeKay]

And why is NotLocke shooting at people on the dock instead of smoking them (pun intended)?

Convenience/speed of killing. Might have taken him a moment to change form, and then to float over to them and kill them. Shooting with perfect accuracy was just easier, I'd guess.

I don't think he's ever changed forms in front of anyone, he always goes off somewhere to take off the Locke tights.

[tgb]

And why is NotLocke shooting at people on the dock instead of smoking them (pun intended)?

Convenience/speed of killing. Might have taken him a moment to change form, and then to float over to them and kill them. Shooting with perfect accuracy was just easier, I'd guess.

I don't think he's ever changed forms in front of anyone, he always goes off somewhere to take off the Locke tights.

You mean like this?

[denoginizer]

I may be missing something. But why didn't nonLocke just let them get on the plane with the bomb on it?  The plane would have blown up and they would have all been dead. 

[tgb]

I may be missing something. But why didn't nonLocke just let them get on the plane with the bomb on it?  The plane would have blown up and they would have all been dead. 

Or once NotLocke had removed the bomb and showed it to them, didn't it make it ok to, you know, take the plane?  Or do the Widmorons have SAMs?

[TiLT]

I thought the episode made these things obvious. When Locke started shooting, he did so in order to merely waste time and keep him clearly visible and close to the Losties so they'd panic and flee as soon as he came running back.

He couldn't just let them get on a rigged plane because the bomb would have failed to explode. Jack has clearly shown us that he can't be killed, just like Richard, and this probably also goes for the other Candidates. The only person who got hit by gunfire in the firefight (except for Locke) was Kate, and she's not a Candidate any more. For them to die they have to be killed by another Candidate. Suicide may be an option, but if their situation is the same as Richard's, then I don't think so.

Locke had built up a certain amount of trust to get to the point he was at this episode, so when he told the Losties that the plane was unsafe, they trusted him immediately, particularly when he presented them with the bomb he found inside. What's to stop Widmore from placing more bombs there, after all?

[Barrakketh]

Gotta narrow the focus to a few candidates. The real question is, Why is Kate still alive?

We learned (if Jack is right) that Smokeylocke doesn't need all the candidates to leave alive...he needs them all dead. But he has to trick them into killing themselves/each other. So we have Hurley, Jack, and Sawyer left as candidates, right? Maybe Kate will narrow them down further.

I think Hurley's going to be the last man standing, btw.

I've actually been betting on Kate being the final island savior.  Just a wild hunch based on a few hints here and there.  Jack is being set up too obviously as the main guy so i kind of ruled him out.  I can definitely see cases for Sawyer or Hurley, but i like the misdirection of Kate.  One thing i saw when rewatching lighthouse was "Austen" listed on the compass - of course they are saying she was eliminated or crossed out but no one's really said why.  The more they play her as being lame and inconsequential the more i think they are trying to mislead us for a twist.  Last hunch was based on reading the original pilot had Jack dying and Kate was supposed to lead the survivors, so this might be consistent with the original vision.  Or i could just be blinded by my Kate fandom

I think Kate still has a part to play - she already seems to have begun to turn Claire away from unLocke. I imagine there will be another showdown between Kate and Claire. Claire needs to be reunited with Aaron somehow, but not in her current "tainted" by unLocke condition. The only people I see having any influence with her now are Kate and possibly Jack. How it plays out, I have no idea, but they could have easily killed Kate off last night if the writers had been so inclined.

[tgb]

I thought the episode made these things obvious. When Locke started shooting, he did so in order to merely waste time and keep him clearly visible and close to the Losties so they'd panic and flee as soon as he came running back.

He couldn't just let them get on a rigged plane because the bomb would have failed to explode. Jack has clearly shown us that he can't be killed, just like Richard, and this probably also goes for the other Candidates. The only person who got hit by gunfire in the firefight (except for Locke) was Kate, and she's not a Candidate any more. For them to die they have to be killed by another Candidate. Suicide may be an option, but if their situation is the same as Richard's, then I don't think so.

Locke had built up a certain amount of trust to get to the point he was at this episode, so when he told the Losties that the plane was unsafe, they trusted him immediately, particularly when he presented them with the bomb he found inside. What's to stop Widmore from placing more bombs there, after all?

Which still doesn't answer the question of how NotLocke knew for sure Jack would find the bomb while still aboard the sub.

[CeeKay]

since there was a two week hiatus I can't remember where Ben is.  Miles too.

[Kyosho]

After Hurley blew up the Black Rock, Ben and Miles went with Richard to the Dharma barracks to get more explosives.

Hey, wait a minute. They were going to blow up the plane, right? So SmokeyLocke couldn't leave? Was that their explosives, rather than Widmore's? If so, WTF was going on with Widmore? And why didn't Jack et al figure out whose explosives those were?

Or was there not enough time for Richard's group to get there, sneak in to place the explosives, and get out again?

[Barrakketh]

After Hurley blew up the Black Rock, Ben and Miles went with Richard to the Dharma barracks to get more explosives.

Hey, wait a minute. They were going to blow up the plane, right? So SmokeyLocke couldn't leave? Was that their explosives, rather than Widmore's? If so, WTF was going on with Widmore? And why didn't Jack et al figure out whose explosives those were?

Or was there not enough time for Richard's group to get there, sneak in to place the explosives, and get out again?

Would the Dharma cache have had that much C4? Also, how would they sneak past Widmore's guards to plant the explosives? I'm going with Widmore booby-trapping the plane and leaving a couple guards. Sucks to be those guards.

[Kyosho]

Would the Dharma cache have had that much C4? Also, how would they sneak past Widmore's guards to plant the explosives? I'm going with Widmore booby-trapping the plane and leaving a couple guards. Sucks to be those guards.

I wouldn't have put it past Ben to keep a lot of explosives on-hand when things were still going good in Otherton. Also, as for how they snuck past? Well.... how did Sayid?

[rittchard]

I may be missing something. But why didn't nonLocke just let them get on the plane with the bomb on it?  The plane would have blown up and they would have all been dead. 

Or once NotLocke had removed the bomb and showed it to them, didn't it make it ok to, you know, take the plane?  Or do the Widmorons have SAMs?

If they got on the plane, he'd have to get on with them so that made sense to me; otherwise they'd know something was wrong if he didn't get on.  As for after he removed the bomb, he explicitly says there might be other traps so it's not safe.  At that point in time everyone (including lame me) believed him.

So I'm guessing he still needs the plane to exit the island completely?  Actually this is rather unclear at this point, since he was lying about needing everyone to go with him.  You'd think once they were all dead he could just turn into smoke and fly across the ocean.  Maybe his smoke transformation range needs to be levelled up lol.

[Qantaga]

Maybe his smoke transformation range needs to be levelled up lol.

   
I hear the best way to do that is to grind mobs on Hydra Island or run instances in the Pearl Station.

[CeeKay]

Maybe his smoke transformation range needs to be levelled up lol.

   
I hear the best way to do that is to grind mobs on Hydra Island or run instances in the Pearl Station.

you used to be able to get awesome weapons at the Black Rock but the devs nerfed it big time 

[rshetts2]

Locke did all this misdirection because he still needs the plane to leave.  If he got them all to blow themselves up on the sub, then he would be free to take the plane and leave, but as long as a candidate is living he can not leave the island.  BTW my vote for the one who stays when this is all said and done is Sawyer.  He will make the big sacrifice , after all if he had trusted Jack, perhaps the others would have survived, so in part he is responsible for the recent culling.  Just my 2 cents worth.

[Roguetad]

I think it's kind of funny that they keep contributing to Claire's craziness by repeatedly leaving her behind or trying to ditch her.  Do we have everyone!?  [Quickly scans and sees Claire pinned down by gunfire]  Yep, we're good, let's rock and roll!    

It is hard for me to feel too sad about Jin and Sun knowing that they are still alive in the other timeline.  I don't think the Island timeline will end up being the base timeline, or real timeline.  

I'm not sure what role Kate is going to play.  I've always thought of her in a key supporting role, but not as a lead on the same level as Jack, Locke, Sawyer or Desmond.  I also think of Hurley as a key supporting character, who may emerge into a lead by the end.  

My frontrunners for last candidate standing are Jack, Desmond, and possibly Sawyer...if there is still a Jacob role by the end.  We've kind of assumed that there will still be a need to balance the black and the white on the island.  What if they are able to do something that would destroy lockmonster, eliminating the need for the cork?                  

[CeeKay]

I think it's kind of funny that they keep contributing to Claire's craziness by repeatedly leaving her behind or trying to ditch her.  Do we have everyone!?  [Quickly scans and sees Claire pinned down by gunfire]  Yep, we're good, let's rock and roll!    

Sawyer did try and get her on board, but when he saw I Can't Believe It's Not Locke heading his way it looked like he decided he didn't have time to get her on board.

[rittchard]

It is hard for me to feel too sad about Jin and Sun knowing that they are still alive in the other timeline.  I don't think the Island timeline will end up being the base timeline, or real timeline.  

Next week's episode is titled "Across the Sea" but the one following is, more ominously, "What They Died For" - which does seem to give the implication the alternate timeline will be "saved" or preserved or folded/merged into.

[CeeKay]

It is hard for me to feel too sad about Jin and Sun knowing that they are still alive in the other timeline.  I don't think the Island timeline will end up being the base timeline, or real timeline.  

Next week's episode is titled "Across the Sea" but the one following is, more ominously, "What They Died For" - which does seem to give the implication the alternate timeline will be "saved" or preserved or folded/merged into.

is the finale going to be called '..and Found'?

[Roguetad]

Another reason why I think what we are calling the alt timeline is actually the real timeline is because the flow of memory recall is going from the island to LA, and not the other way around.  In Juliet's dying words she told Sawyer that it worked, and something about a coffee shop.  So maybe when they die they merge back into the main timeline?  Which got me thinking that Sawyer probably won't play a permanent role on the Island, since I'm guessing he runs into Juliet at a coffee shop and they cosmically reconnect, or whatever happens when they remember.     

[TiLT]

It is hard for me to feel too sad about Jin and Sun knowing that they are still alive in the other timeline.  I don't think the Island timeline will end up being the base timeline, or real timeline.  

Next week's episode is titled "Across the Sea" but the one following is, more ominously, "What They Died For" - which does seem to give the implication the alternate timeline will be "saved" or preserved or folded/merged into.

You should be careful with mentioning the names of upcoming episodes. You'd get banned from Lostpedia for this post, because it's considered a spoiler.

[TiLT]

It is hard for me to feel too sad about Jin and Sun knowing that they are still alive in the other timeline.  I don't think the Island timeline will end up being the base timeline, or real timeline.  

Next week's episode is titled "Across the Sea" but the one following is, more ominously, "What They Died For" - which does seem to give the implication the alternate timeline will be "saved" or preserved or folded/merged into.

is the finale going to be called '..and Found'?

Hah, there's already an episode with that name.

[LoneStarSpur]

"There is no Sayid!"
"I wish you wouldn't have believed me." (ncl-Locke to ncl-Jack)
I'm pretty sure the "dentist" that Jack went to see knows what's up with NCL (no crash land).
Even as stupid as ncl-Jack is I think he's finally getting a clue that something's not quite right in NCL.
Poor Jin and Sun. That wasn't very nice of the writers.

The whole plane/attack the sub stuff didn't feel right. Uber-paranoid Widmore had only two guards at the plane? The sub was unguarded? Didn't make any sense to me. Maybe smokey did more damage than was shown when he freed the prisoners? Piss poor writing? 

I'm still holding out hope that smokey is not the bad guy simply because the idea of Widmore being the good guy is repugnant. 

[Malificent]

"There is no Sayid!"
"I wish you wouldn't have believed me." (ncl-Locke to ncl-Jack)
I'm pretty sure the "dentist" that Jack went to see knows what's up with NCL (no crash land).
Even as stupid as ncl-Jack is I think he's finally getting a clue that something's not quite right in NCL.
Poor Jin and Sun. That wasn't very nice of the writers.

The whole plane/attack the sub stuff didn't feel right. Uber-paranoid Widmore had only two guards at the plane? The sub was unguarded? Didn't make any sense to me. Maybe smokey did more damage than was shown when he freed the prisoners? Piss poor writing? 

I'm still holding out hope that smokey is not the bad guy simply because the idea of Widmore being the good guy is repugnant. 

There are no good guys.

[CeeKay]

I'm pretty sure the "dentist" that Jack went to see knows what's up with NCL (no crash land).

it was cool seeing Bernard again.