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Author Topic: LOST Season 1 Finale - Nice  (Read 4888 times)
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whiteboyskim
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« on: May 25, 2005, 02:19:25 PM »

So what are the predictions for tonight's season 1 finale? Thoughts? Hopes? Opinions? I never got around to cerating a thread for last week's because I missed it due to Star Wars and my wife generously taped the re-airing of it last night. As such, I just saw it last night and that was a doozy of a lead-in to the last two hours. Everyone finds out from The French Woman that a group of really unpleasant people want to kill everyone, so they need to launch the raft and hide. Flashbacks were of Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Boone&Shannon (and to a degree Sayid), and I loved that. The little hints of how everyone crossed paths is starting to really prove more than simple happenstance, and I love it. Also, Michelle Rodriguez supposedly joins the cast which should be REALLY interesting considering where her seat on the plane was. smile Personal highlight of the evening?

"And THAT'S why I need five guns." biggrin

Can't wait until tonight. We hopefully will see what's in the hatch, which Hurley is going to be adament about not opening once he sees the numbers on the side of it. At which point of course, the hatch will spring open and unleash hell. At which point of course, the show ends and we have to wait until next season. slywink
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« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2005, 03:13:49 PM »

I also can't wait for tonight.

No predictions though, I'm in Wilmington DE on business, leeching someone's wireless connection while I work... slywink
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« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2005, 04:24:25 PM »

Michelle Rodriguez joins the cast... for how long?

I like her lots and lots.


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« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2005, 05:43:13 PM »

It's going to be bitter-sweet. Can't wait to see it, but then it will be over for 4 or 5 months and there'll be nothing on the old boob tube worth watching.

Sad thing it that nothing will probably be resolved and there will be multiple cliff-hangers.

And only one episode of Firefly left to watch, too.  frown

-Randy
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« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2005, 05:46:48 PM »

Some guesses:

That skeleton in chains is down in the hatch.  The 'others' are, in fact, people.  There's lots of goodies in the Black Rock, but it will be hard/dangerous to get them out.  The Frenchwoman dies.  The raft comes back for some reason, which allows Shannon to talk about anal with Walt again.  The dog saves Shannon from something. It ends with Jack having a stunned look on his face.  Kate redeems herself in the eyes of her fellow passengers by doing something heroic, which will kill her off.  Locke takes some people down into the hatch and they barricade themselves down there.  Sayid says a variation of "I told you so" at some point.

Last but not least, we still won't know what the deal with the island is, or what the giant creature is.

I'm looking forward to this.  Either it will be great and redeem the whole season, or it'll leave people saying "Awww, I watched all year for THAT?".  There's no middle ground for this finale.

I'll miss you Kate!
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« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2005, 06:05:14 PM »

Do you guys want some small hints about what will happen tonight (not total spoilers): right here

Here are the short versions...to look at longer ones, read the story.  These are straight from the writers/producers...

SPOILER SPACE















Spoiler No. 1: Look for the castaways to venture inside the Black Rock

Spoiler No. 2: We'll finally get a look, albeit a partial one, at the monster.  

Spoiler No. 3: Hurley's seemingly jinxed lottery numbers, which appear on the hatch, will come back into play.

Spoiler No. 4: The raft riders — Michael, Walt, Jin and Sawyer (or should we call him James?) — encounter something shocking in the water.

Spoiler No. 5: You will be talking about the cliff-hanger all summer.



















SPOILER SPACE

Since it has been out there before, the executives have been on record as saying you would see a piece of the monster tonight and Spoiler #2 pretty much confirms that.
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« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2005, 06:14:06 PM »

Hey gurus...  I have a quick question, as I may have missed it...

Remember the black woman who told Jack she knew her husband wasn't dead?  

Did something happen to her?  I can't remember seeing her in, I don't know, forever.

Thanks.

LD
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gameoverman
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« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2005, 06:20:30 PM »

Nothing happened to her, they just haven't devoted any time to her character.  Maybe tonight we will see her and her husband's story will get resolved.
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whiteboyskim
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« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2005, 06:34:47 PM »

Quote from: "Lockdown"
Hey gurus...  I have a quick question, as I may have missed it...

Remember the black woman who told Jack she knew her husband wasn't dead?  

Did something happen to her?  I can't remember seeing her in, I don't know, forever.

Thanks.

LD


That actress is a fairly in-demand theater actor and since next year is really when they will devote time to extras like her, she's off acting on stage. She'll return and presumably so will her husband. He, like Michelle Rodriguez, was in the tail section of the plane. slywink
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« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2005, 02:09:46 AM »

That was fun.  My favorite part, during the boat shenanigans near the end:

"They can't leave it like this all summer.  FUCK THEM!  Assholes!  FUCK!"

Said by my normally demure wife.  biggrin
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« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2005, 02:16:11 AM »

I enjoyed that quite a bit.  So I guess the next season is devoted to the Morlocks.
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« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2005, 02:23:34 AM »

WOW!...I was expecting the hatch to hide a nuclear weapon that somehow gets activated by the opening....but that?? hmmmm. And those others..I say kill them but Im wonderwhere they are from and what purpose they serve.

spoilers
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
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I think the part of the 'monster' I saw was mechanical in nature. I wonder if that whole island is a giant spaceship. Or perhaps Atlantis. Damn that was a deep shaft. Sucks that the ladder is busted..but who the hell would climb that long a ladder anyways.
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« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2005, 02:24:38 AM »

HEAVY SPOILERS FORTHWITH. SHOO IF YOU HAVE NOT SEEN IT YET.



Overall, I liked it. The closure at the end for this season's main characters was great with the montage of them getting on the plane. The most heartbreaking was Locke's though Hurley's odessey was hilarious. In fact, I daresay Hugo the Large stole the show out from everyone else. Sayid, Locke, Jack, Hurley, Michael, Jin, and Sawyer all shared center stage and each did a great job.

So who pegged Arzt as a red shirt? Show of hands?

"Dude." About summed it up for me. biggrin

If they bring in "red shirts" for a couple episodes each then kill them off, it makes for a much more entertaining show. you then never know when someone, no matter how tangential, is going to die. Personally, I love that. It keeps the stakes high, gives the folks at home a drinking game (take a shot whenever they kill someone who's been in three episodes or less), and keeps the viewers on their toes. Wheee!!!

I kept waiting and waiting for Hurley to see the numbers on the hatch, and as I figured it was at the last second. Can't wait to see where that tunnel leads.

I guess "the others" really were after Walt then. I'm now really anxious to see how they get Jin, Michael, and the wounded Sawyer out of the middle of the ocean. Oh, and Charlie picking up the statue was a great touch. Much better than him just grabbing bags. Good for him to have the temptation, though I'm thinking if he goes back on the heroin train the island may decide to take him out. But if was fun that he's still calling the baby "Turnip Head." biggrin

Highlights:

- Everyone on the raft making peace with each other
- The French Woman being stranger than usual while not evoking Delenn as much
- Arzt's lecture on how tempermental nitro is
- "Dude."
- Hurley in general, but how he got to and onto the flight was the stand-out
- the many flashbacks and how all the characters were in and out of each other's lives so quickly
- the blink and you miss it character who passed by Michael while he was on the phone
- Jack and Locke finally trading their beliefs with each other
- the reveal of The Monster, which was tons cooler than what I thought they would do. We now have absolutely no idea where it can and will pop-up and that makes it even scarier, which simply rules
- "Well what did you do in the army?!?"
- Sayid's answer
- The beautiful scenery
- The French Woman's hints of who The Others were really after
- The impossibly "we are so screwed" manner in which we leave the raft
- The final montage on the plane
- The return of the comic, which I'm honestly stunned I never put 2 & 2 together on
- The last shot

It's going to be a long summer. biggrin

Grade: A-
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« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2005, 05:05:03 AM »

Didn't like it.  No payoff whatsoever.

Definitely not worth two hours.

gellar
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« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2005, 05:13:06 AM »

Quote from: "gellar"
Didn't like it.  No payoff whatsoever.

Definitely not worth two hours.

gellar


I agree.  I understand they have to keep the suspense up, but this show is all tease at this point.  After the entire first season all we really know is some of the backstory for about 7 or 8 characters and very little else.  Some of the creator's comments back when about never knowing when a major character might die (only one so far) and the suggestion that major answers were coming at mid-season and then in this season finale all seems to have been a lot of hot air.  I feel deceived.

What do we really know right now?  They're on an island.  There's a weird creature.  Walt may have special abilities.  There are other people with their own agenda.  Great.  :x
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« Reply #15 on: May 26, 2005, 05:24:54 AM »

I can finally leave this show  behind for good.  All the people who said 'give it time, they can't answer everything right away'...well, they answered nothing and took a whole season to do it.  In effect, at this point in time we know as much about everything now as we did in the beginning:

Why are they on the island?
How did they get on the island(what kind of crash allows that kind of survival)?
What's in the hatch(so we know a ladder and passageway, big deal, I'm talking about what the hell that hatch is for)?
What is the creature?(smoke and 'security device' answers nothing)?
How did Locke reach his understanding with the island?(why did he get his legs back)
Jack's dad, what was that all about?
Rose and her husband, what was that all about?
The polar bears, what was that all about?

But we do know that Charlie would leave Claire all by herself(not counting the insane Frenchwoman WHO HAD HER BABY STOLEN!), when they are running from people who are coming to STEAL HER BABY!  The same girl who WAS KIDNAPPED once already.  

OMFG!11!   as they say on teh internets.

Kate is standing right there as they pack the explosives yet Jack somehow sneaks them into his pack without her noticing, the same Kate who knows every sneaky trick in the book.

Hurley, the guy who knows everything turns to crap around him,  walking right up to the pack of explosives AFTER IT'S SET and practically dropping his crap RIGHT ON TOP OF IT!!!...just so that we can see that yes, he has noticed the numbers.

 :roll: This entire show is one big  :roll:
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« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2005, 05:30:32 AM »

Brinstil in #gg irc

 [22:00] Brinstil|Lost: Lost is like the biggest cocktease ever
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« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2005, 06:56:17 AM »

I liked it...I think a big part of the whole anger issue is that Lost is an amalgamation of 3 shows: X-Files, Buffy and Angel...needless to say there are people on the crew that have had their hand in one, two or all of those (David Fury being the most obvious having been on all 3...he is going to 24 next year though).  For those that never watched any of those series, Lost seems like a new concept when in reality it very much mimics X-Files in what it gives you as answers and leaves as questions.  If you think Lost is a cocktease, just think that X-Files went 9 seasons (and a movie) without really answering much and leaving a lot up to interpretation.

The Lost season ender reminded me a lot of Buffy's 2nd season ender (where she stabs Angel and leaves town) and the 5th season ender (where she dies and Buffy transfers to UPN where only a handful of episodes were good).

Anyway, I liked it even though it didn't answer any questions at all and created more of them.  I could expand on my thoughts of what the hatch is, but everything is conjecture in this series.
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« Reply #18 on: May 26, 2005, 07:19:01 AM »

Hmm, I don't see it quite that way.  In the early, good, years of Xfiles, we knew what we needed to know.  Mulder and Scully- those are the ones who couldn't quite get the info(or proof) they needed.   The point was seeing if Mulder and Scully would ever find the 'truth'.

We, the audience, knew what was up more or less.  Mulder and Scully were the 'good' guys, Lone gunmen were allies, Skinner rode the fence, Cig man and others worked against them.  The rest was gravy.

In Lost, is Locke good or bad? Sawyer? Kate? Hurley? The island itself? The 'creature?  What side are they all on, or is there even sides?  In Lost, what's the point of all this? Surviving the island experience or getting off the island?

That's what has me so aggravated.
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« Reply #19 on: May 26, 2005, 08:20:26 AM »

I loved every second of it.  I was in suspense the entire two hours.  I honestly could care less about answers as long as I'm entertained.  

The boat scenes at night, in particular, were very creepy.  

Quote from: "AgtFox"
(David Fury being the most obvious having been on all 3...he is going to 24 next year though).


When did David Fury work on X-Files?  Was it late in the series.? I was an X-Files fanboy until I said goodbye in Season Eight and followed most of the creative team pretty closely but I don't remember Fury's name.
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« Reply #20 on: May 26, 2005, 11:32:38 AM »

Quote from: "Kevin Grey"
I loved every second of it.  I was in suspense the entire two hours.  I honestly could care less about answers as long as I'm entertained.

I'm with Señor Grey on this.  Part of me would like answers but I enjoy the ride.  That's what the show is about for me.  You guys need a healthy dose of Taoism.
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« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2005, 11:42:17 AM »

I liked the episode from the standpoint that it was a very good episode.

That being said, as a season finale - it left me wanting a HELL of alot more.

Them coming for Walt and not Claire's baby was something I knew (predicted) long ago.  So no surprise there whatsoever.

The incredibly anticipated hatch seen: Disappointing doesn't begin to describe it.  A ladder going deep into the ground!!!!  Stop the presses!!!!  Holy Shit!!!!   - You have got to be kidding me.

Grade as a show:  A -
Grade as a season finale: C


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« Reply #22 on: May 26, 2005, 11:56:13 AM »

I'm still not sure if I liked it or not.  I liked most of it, but I am getting tired of this show.  Like others said, at 10:00 I thought, they still didn't answer any questions, only raised more.

Random thoughts, no particular order:

1.  I think when Danielle said she heard whispers saying they wanted the boy, it was Walt, not the baby.
2.  I think Hurley's luck is that everyone around him has bad luck, while he has good luck.  His good luck/fate was trying to keep him OFF the plane.
3.  How did Locke know Hurley's real name?
4.  I was afraid that Danielle was going to turn out to be evil.  I'm glad she's not, just a little crazy.
5.  Charlie calling Danielle pathetic, after he smuggled drugs in his sack, is ironic.  This leads me to my biggest complaint about the show:

Biggest complaint:

The strength of this show is its characters.  But, at least in my eyes, many of the characters are taking great strides in becoming unlikable.  Here's the list (I used to like these characters, but now I don't or am on the fence):

1.  Charlie - His first reaction to a kidnapped baby?  Why, I'll take a swing at Sayid.  This irritated me.  Every character in this show just seems to have knee-jerk reactions to everything.  The island setting can only go so far.  When your first reaction to everything is to lash out at somebody else, it gets old quick.
2.  Kate - Actually, I never liker her.
3.  Jack - Used to, but now he seems to have some kind of God/hero complex or something.  I'm hoping he stole the dynamite from Kate because he either cares about her, or doesn't trust her.  But I think he might have done it cause he always wants to be hero.  This bothers me.
4.  Locke - Walt/Sayid/Hurley all said, "Don't open the hatch".  Were they in some kind of time crunch that Locke couldn't even stand up and ask Hurley "Why not?"  Instead, he did it anyway.  This sent a message from him to the others that, "Your opinions do not matter."  Basically it just made Locke more unlikable to me.
5.  Claire - Her "do not touch my baby" complex is also getting old.  Eh, I just basically don't like her anymore.

Ironically the characters that I originally thought were there just to hate (Jin, Sawyer, Shannon), are the ones I like.  

The above hate list is bad for me, because they are central to the show.  

I don't know, I'll watch a bit next year, but if they really don't start explaining SOMETHING, I might be gone too.  I wonder what the general census will be of this episode in a few days.


Edited to Add:

Also, what was up with Danielle attacking Claire in the flashback?  When did that happen?  Was SHE the one who kidnapped her for several weeks?  If not, then what was that scene all about?  Again, more stupid questions.
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« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2005, 11:57:44 AM »

What's the phrase? Meh?

Some good, some absolute crap.

Arzt was there for 3 reasons: get the boat launched by the end of the season, be the voice of the rest of the people not in the show and to get blowed up real good. Bleh. Hated his ass. Hated that they even created his ass.

I can easily see this going the way of Alias...probably just a stupid rouge government agency involved. Likely evil neocons bent on taking over the world with psychic childen or some such nonsense. Or evil necons keeping all the good psychics who just want to help the world captive. One of 'em might have healed Locke who will try to save them all.

And Alias now has zombies. How ridiculous has that show become?

There were some good things. The monsters' apperance, everything about Locke (he's gonna be making one long assed rope next season), Walt being the "boy", Artz getting his worthless ass blown to bits.

I'm sure I'll hang with it next year at least for a while, but I don't think I'm going to really like the answers to all these riddles.

-Randy
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« Reply #24 on: May 26, 2005, 12:37:40 PM »

Quote from: "LoneStarSpur"
And Alias now has zombies. How ridiculous has that show become?


I thought the same thing.  Not to mention that NOBODY dies on that show.  Dixon gets shot?  Next scene he'll be in the hospital.  Nadiya turns into a zombie AND gets shot?  Next scene, she's in the hospital, too.  Where's the freakin' danger?

And Vaughn has a reveal that'll change the tone of the first and second season?  Good to know that the powers that be aren't asleep at the wheel, as I'd feared.  Instead, they want to retroactively shit on the show's entire run.  AWESOME!

Alias, I'm done with you.  Good riddance.
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« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2005, 02:36:09 PM »

HEY

Though Ive never seen either Alias or Lost, and have no bussiness in this thread whatsoever, I will not tolerate zombie bashing on my forum.
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« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2005, 03:39:35 PM »

The fact that they didn't show ANYTHING about the contents of the hatch means, to me, that they don't really know what's down there (the writers, I mean!). For goodnes' sake, Locke SAW SOMETHING down there when it lit up (well, that's one freakin long shaft, so maybe he did or maybe he didn't).

I felt there wasn't enough payoff for people who watched all season. We can't continue to have question after question piled on us, we need so resolve SOME issues now and then. Otherwise the weight of mysteries gets so heavy that there's no way to write your way out of it.

Three things:

1. Hurley's hotel room (in the flashback): room 2346 (of course you know the numbers are 4 8 15 16 23 46 right? So there's 2 of the numbers right there).

2. Was Danielle's warning about "the Others" completely false? Yeah, she heard voices.. but aren't we led to believe SHE started the black smoke fire in an effort to get Turnip Head?

3. We were supposed to see part of the "creature" according to a post above. We did? You mean that freaky black smoke we saw two times? I wouldn't say that's "seeing" the creature. frown

All in all, a good cliffhanger episode but to me, ultimately unsatisfying in that it resolved nothing but just piled more on top.
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« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2005, 05:08:59 PM »

As a Season Finale, it was horrible.  

Baby gets kidnapped!  Who woulda thunk it?
Hatch gets blowed up!  Know what's inside? Nope.   No change there since the episode where Locke found it in the first place back in 2002...

As a standard episode it was just fine, and if there was a new episode next week, I wouldn't grumble all that much, but jesus!  Everytime one of the characters makes a comment about how long it's been since the plane crash, I can only laugh knowing that we've been watching this damn show for more than 6 months with very little to show for it.  Think the characters are frustrated?   The viewers are too.

Evangeline Lilly is almost cute enough to make up for all the show's defficiencies however.

Edit: I'd have to go back and watch the episode (which I don't want to do), but Hurley's  evil numbers also showed up in the concourse gate numbers in the airport as he was running to catch his plane.  I think it showed "4-23".
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« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2005, 05:40:25 PM »

Quote from: "Charlatan"


2. Was Danielle's warning about "the Others" completely false? Yeah, she heard voices.. but aren't we led to believe SHE started the black smoke fire in an effort to get Turnip Head?

3. We were supposed to see part of the "creature" according to a post above. We did? You mean that freaky black smoke we saw two times? I wouldn't say that's "seeing" the creature. frown


I think the "Others" did light the fire. There were no footprints in the sand because they lit it from the boat. Danielle thought that by bringing the child to them, she could get her own child back.

There was a brief glimpse of the "creature" when it was pulling Locke. It looked like a long, retractable arm of a machine (with a clamp on the end).
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« Reply #29 on: May 26, 2005, 06:34:20 PM »

Quote from: "Ralph-Wiggum"
I think the "Others" did light the fire. There were no footprints in the sand because they lit it from the boat. Danielle thought that by bringing the child to them, she could get her own child back.


With a really fucking long match, or with a flare gun?

Either way, that's a pretty damn inefficient way to light a fire.

gellar
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« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2005, 06:53:40 PM »

"Dude"... Hurley is definitely my favorite character.

As for resolution, you have to remember that the show might be on the air for 5 years- if they tell us everything now, well what is left?

There was really a lot of plot points made-- the black smoke wasn't made by the others.. probably smile

Walt kidnapped by ... uh who?? but geeze that whole raft part was pretty massive as far as plot happenings.

The hatch is finally open... now we wait.

Arzt....DUDE, you have a piece of Arzt on you.... laughed out loud-and I agree the fact that they can introduce a character for an episode or 2 then whack them like that-- ballsy but good.

I think we will see some new charaters-- that we do not know are on the island yet, be introduced next year.

but in the end, i liked it- it was more a season cliff hanger than a finale...
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« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2005, 07:59:00 PM »

For those claiming there was no closure, allow me to defer to AgtFox's earlier post regarding The X-Files. The way that first season ended Scully snatched a flask with alien baby stuff in it, then Deep Throat was 86'd in front of her, and the X-Files were shut down with both agents reassigned. How's that for an uplifting cliff-hanger? No different here, although the difference between the two shows (and why I have more faith in LOST than X-Files) is that the creators of LOST already have the first three seasons mapped out whereas Chris Carter in the X-Files just made shit up as he went along.

I won't argue that there were not a lot of answers given. Probably the most concrete answer we saw was "the monster" and that essentially was smoke-and-mirrors, pun intended. I trust that this show won't jump the shark like Alias and The X-Files did, but I will remain wary like everyone else. While I'll cop to being a huge fan, that fandom is laced with a strong amount of concern for the future.

And wouldn't it be cool if the island was really Atlantis? biggrin
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« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2005, 08:22:09 PM »

Quote from: "whiteboyskim"
For those claiming there was no closure, allow me to defer to AgtFox's earlier post regarding The X-Files. The way that first season ended Scully snatched a flask with alien baby stuff in it, then Deep Throat was 86'd in front of her, and the X-Files were shut down with both agents reassigned. How's that for an uplifting cliff-hanger? No different here, although the difference between the two shows (and why I have more faith in LOST than X-Files) is that the creators of LOST already have the first three seasons mapped out whereas Chris Carter in the X-Files just made shit up as he went along.


It certainly did end that way, the Xfiles I mean.  

But like I said in my earlier post, with Xfiles we DID know alot.  We knew what Mulder and Scully's motives were, we knew what they were up against, more or less.  We knew what Mulder was ultimately trying to do, what the point of everything was.  The fun was in seeing them try to get there.

Now, with Lost, we know nothing like this.  We don't know what this show is about really.  What's the point?  Beyond the meaningless "it's about the characters".  Yeah, I know that, ANY story with characters in it is about the characters, but what's it about?  

In other words, I know I'm supposed to enjoy the ride.  With Xfiles, I knew where we were going, I didn't know how or if we were gonna get there.  With Lost, I have no idea where we are going, in fact we haven't even started moving as far as I can tell.  And if we have started moving, or if we will, I have no idea where we are going or if there is even a destination.  Who enjoys a trip like that?
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« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2005, 08:44:59 PM »

I don't see how you can say we haven't started moving yet. We know a great deal more about the characters, and the island, than we did at the start of the season. We know Locke's motivations, Jack's motivation, Kate's motivation. In just this past episode, we learned tidbits about the Others, the Tree Crushing Monster and the hatch. Did we learn a lot? No. Did everything we learn lead to more questions? Yes. I'm still not sure that's a bad thing.

And I, for one, learned a great deal about dynamite from Arzt.

I don't know if anyone's seen it, but given the smokey glimpse of the monster we saw last night, it seems interesting:

http://www.livejournal.com/community/lost_tv/533584.html?view=7176528

I need to Tivo and rewatch the first episode, see if that's real or just some nonsense someone made up.
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« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2005, 09:18:36 PM »

Do re-watch and report back post-haste because if that was really there originally... then holy crap! biggrin
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« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2005, 09:41:34 PM »

Oh man, that livejournal thing can't be true.   Because if it is, that would be cool and that would have been the perfect cliffhanger ending- one of the characters flashing back and remembering seeing that!

" We know Locke's motivations, Jack's motivation, Kate's motivation."

We know why Locke likes it on the island, yes.  But do we know anything about Locke's actual motivations? I think not.  For instance, did he do that to Boone knowingly or did he just lead Boone there not knowing exactly what the island had in store for him?   Or was it just a case of Boone being stupid enough to go to the front of the airplane, a plane balanced precariously on the edge of a cliff?  See what I mean, we really don't know, do we?

What was Kate's problem?  We don't know, we know what she did AFTER she was already on the outs with her mom and the law, but why was she on the outs?  We don't know. So how can we really say we know her motivations?

Jack? Well, for one thing, did he see his dad or not?  Did his dad lead him to the water or was that some kind of coincidence?  What about the coffin?  We don't know.

To be fair, I'd say Jack is the closest we have to a complete character.  Whatever else he says or does, I do believe he has everyone's best interest at heart.
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« Reply #36 on: May 27, 2005, 01:52:17 AM »

Quote from: "whiteboyskim"
No different here, although the difference between the two shows (and why I have more faith in LOST than X-Files) is that the creators of LOST already have the first three seasons mapped out whereas Chris Carter in the X-Files just made shit up as he went along.


First, I think Carter DID have a clue the first few seasons.  It wasn't 'till the show took off and he had to come up with more that he began to wing it - and the show suffered accordingly.

Second, if they've ACTUALLY got the first three seasons planned out, I feel somewhat better.  However, the original plan also called for red-shirts as decoys for killing of primary cast members and we've yet to see that.

I think the primary difference between X-Files and LOST is that we don't know ANYTHING in LOST.  With X-Files I felt like I had enough information to reasonably speculate as to where the show was going.  I could start to speculate with LOST, but I won't be making educated guesses, I'll be taking shots in the dark.

Also, the first few seasons of X-Files, and the first couple seasons of ALIAS for that matter, were exceptional at answering major questions in ways that fostered several more.  I've yet to really see that from LOST.  All we get are vague hints at answers while more questions pile up. *shrug*
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« Reply #37 on: May 27, 2005, 02:13:25 AM »

Quote from: "gameoverman"
I'll miss you Kate!


GOM - that might have been one of the funniest posts I have read in a good while.  Well done.  And I am sure you loved when Artz asked for Kate's T-shirt... I know I did.

Quote from: "kevin grey"
I loved every second of it. I was in suspense the entire two hours. I honestly could care less about answers as long as I'm entertained.


KG - I agree 99%.

The first hour was not much to go crazy about except for Hurley clearly being THE most refreshing character on the show.  But the second half moved quite well.  With the stolen baby Erin being returned, the hatch being blown open, glimpses of the "security system" not to mention that crazy black smoke "wisp" that occurred post-dynamite, and last but not least -- possibly the greatest scene in the first season -- when Walt was taken from the boat.  I didn't see that coming and would challenge most to admit they saw that twist ahead of time.  Awesome.

Overall, questions aren't answered.  That is unfortunately not LOSTs point.  They are not about wrapping things in nice little packages from week 2-7 and then it going away.  They keep it open and flowing.  LOST actually seems more like a low-budget HBO series than anything else.  Imagine stripping the commercials and giving them some HBO quality resources and I think the show would be hands down awesome.  But as it is on network, it is great and appealing.  It is unique for a TV series with similarities to X-files though completely in its own mind as far as keeping you wanting more.

Finale: A-
Series: B+

In comparison, a nice refresher from the usual TV guidelines for a series.
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« Reply #38 on: May 27, 2005, 04:38:14 AM »

Quote from: "CrayolaSmoker"
Second, if they've ACTUALLY got the first three seasons planned out, I feel somewhat better. However, the original plan also called for red-shirts as decoys for killing of primary cast members and we've yet to see that.


I think the lack of killing of primary characters can be very much linked to network concerns.  If this show was getting decent but not blockbuster ratings, ranked somewhere around 20-30, then I think the creators could get away with a lot more.  However since the show is a top ten hit I think ABC is *very* wary of messing with success when it comes to the main cast.  I think creators were on record as saying it was very difficult to get the network to buy into killing Boone off.  

I do think they have an overarching plan for one very simple reason:  I don't think ABC would have ever greenlighted this show without knowing how that it could 1) be sustained long term and 2) some idea of what the ultimate resolution is.  There were concerns among viewers immediately about long term viability and I think it would be silly to think that the network didn't think the same thing when Abrams came to them with the relatively expensive show.

Also, so far I haven't really seen any contradictions.  While they might be slow in giving out information it does all seem to fit so far.  And there have arguably already been far more "mytharc" episodes of Lost in the first season compared with, say, X-Files.
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« Reply #39 on: May 27, 2005, 12:56:04 PM »

Quote from: "Kevin Grey"
I think the lack of killing of primary characters can be very much linked to network concerns.  If this show was getting decent but not blockbuster ratings, ranked somewhere around 20-30, then I think the creators could get away with a lot more.  However since the show is a top ten hit I think ABC is *very* wary of messing with success when it comes to the main cast.  I think creators were on record as saying it was very difficult to get the network to buy into killing Boone off.


Then my concern becomes network meddling.  Rimbaldi was dropped from Alias season 3 and most of season 4 due to network concerns.  Likewise the season-long A and B plots and weekly cliff-hangers.  They thought it was "too difficult to attract new viewers."  While the network may have had a point, the willingness of Abrahms to screw with his formula and/or plans for the show at network whim is a distinct concern.  Particularly if the network decided they want more seasons and Abrahms has to scramble to either a) come up with more mystery, or b) stretch the mystery out even longer.  If they don't make him change the mystery altogether.

Quote
Also, so far I haven't really seen any contradictions.  While they might be slow in giving out information it does all seem to fit so far.  And there have arguably already been far more "mytharc" episodes of Lost in the first season compared with, say, X-Files.


The difference being, I always knew the final goal of X-Files.  To find out what happened to Mulder's sister and discover whether aliens truly exist.  With LOST, I'm not even sure what the goal is.  Is it to have the characters face their demons and redeem themselves?  Is it to solve the mystery of the island?  Is it a revelation about some grand cosmic or government conspiracy having to do with their pasts?  Is it to fuck with our heads long enough to milk advertising dollars for all they're worth?

I have no clue.

I guess it's the difference between being on a rollercoaster, or being in a remote controlled boat on the ocean.  When I get on a rollercoaster, I know that I will end up at a specific destination.  Sometimes I'll be able to see enough of the track to anticipate the next turn, sometimes I won't.  But the entire time, I know I'll end up where the designer put the ending of that rollercoaster.

In the boat, I'm at the whim of the person holding the remote control.  He's in full control and can either take me to a predetermined destination outright, with a few detours here-and-there, or he can jerk me around indefinitely until he decides he's had his fun and deposits me at the place most convenient.  If he doesn't just turn the boat off in the middle of nowhere and let me rot.

Despite hearing that the creators have a three year plan, I still feel that, given the data we have from the show itself, I'm on the remote control boat.  *shrug*  Your mileage may vary.
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