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Author Topic: LOST - 12/8/04  (Read 7615 times)
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BigRedCat
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« Reply #40 on: December 09, 2004, 04:21:38 PM »

I think the island is effecting each survivor in a different way and as the season progresses they will come to realize this. For instance, I don't think anyone besides the kid can have their wishes fufilled. However Jack has become a healer, with the island enhancing his innate skills. Locke is going to be the balance between good and evil, sort of a chaos bringer that will tip the scales either way whenever it is needed. I don't know much about the rest.
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whiteboyskim
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« Reply #41 on: December 09, 2004, 04:23:38 PM »

Maybe they just kept the fight real? Jack is a doctor who obviously doesn't have a lot of experience with hand to hand. If Ethan really has been on the island a while, odds are he knows how to fight to survive. The result of the fight didn't surprise me. Now, if Locke were in it that might be a different story. He also may not have the best fighting skills, but he has likely studied fighting skills and certainly has the desire to win. smile
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Sunderer
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« Reply #42 on: December 09, 2004, 04:41:23 PM »

You all missed the best line:


"Piss poor captain."
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AttAdude
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« Reply #43 on: December 09, 2004, 04:59:37 PM »

Quote from: "whiteboyskim"
Maybe they just kept the fight real? Jack is a doctor who obviously doesn't have a lot of experience with hand to hand. If Ethan really has been on the island a while, odds are he knows how to fight to survive. The result of the fight didn't surprise me. Now, if Locke were in it that might be a different story. He also may not have the best fighting skills, but he has likely studied fighting skills and certainly has the desire to win. smile



I completly agree, jack most definatly should have got his ass kicked.  However dont forget Jack laying out Sawyer those where not beestings he was throwing those where good old fashioned power punches.  Thats not my point however.  it was for me like watching a fight from a movie that had a human hero vs a supernatural villan.  Kinda like watching Lui Kang Vs Shang sung.   It just seemed to me as if Jack was either fighting a supernaturaly enhanced foe, or a foe of his own imagination.  /shrug.  just struck me as real.
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whiteboyskim
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« Reply #44 on: December 09, 2004, 05:23:50 PM »

And that's a possibility, but I don't recall Sawyer fighting back much. I'm not the strongest guy in the world, but even I can land a power punch on someone if they're just standing there. smile Sawyer also was a con man, i.e. someone who talks his way out of things versus punching his way out. At any rate, I'm starting to take what they show us as fact. With a series that has a fantastical slant to it, if we see it then it must be factually true. At least that's how TV did it in the past. smile
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #45 on: December 09, 2004, 05:23:57 PM »

Quote from: "Attatude"
Thats not my point however. it was for me like watching a fight from a movie that had a human hero vs a supernatural villan. Kinda like watching Lui Kang Vs Shang sung. It just seemed to me as if Jack was either fighting a supernaturaly enhanced foe, or a foe of his own imagination. /shrug. just struck me as real.


Yeah that was my point too- its not that Jack got his ass kicked but the way the fight was choreographed and acted- Jack look like he'd been in fights before and knew how to handle himself but Ethan was almost supernatural in knowing exactly what moves Jack would take and how to avoid them.
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AttAdude
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« Reply #46 on: December 09, 2004, 05:50:39 PM »

Quote from: "Kevin Grey"
Quote from: "Attatude"
Thats not my point however. it was for me like watching a fight from a movie that had a human hero vs a supernatural villan. Kinda like watching Lui Kang Vs Shang sung. It just seemed to me as if Jack was either fighting a supernaturaly enhanced foe, or a foe of his own imagination. /shrug. just struck me as real.


Yeah that was my point too- its not that Jack got his ass kicked but the way the fight was choreographed and acted- Jack look like he'd been in fights before and knew how to handle himself but Ethan was almost supernatural in knowing exactly what moves Jack would take and how to avoid them.


Yeah yeah thats what i mean hehe.  this guy just says it better.  


whiteboyskim:  every one could land a punch true, but when jack hit sawyer he literaly picked the guy up and tossed him back a few feet.  most people cant punch like that even if they think they can.  There is a little bit more science to a punch than just swinging your arm.  As a person who knows how to throw a poper punch (with out breaking thier fist) Let me assure that Jack knew what he was doing in that instance.   Even in the fight with ethan had he landed a couple of those blows it would have been lights out.  Well thats assuming that Ethan is not super evil island man and all of that hehe.
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Hamlet3145
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« Reply #47 on: December 09, 2004, 06:09:32 PM »

You know . . . there have been a number of complaints about how the hobbit got brought back to life.  (I.e, the show cheesed out).  BUT . . .  what if he DID die and what we witnessed was Jack WILLING him back to life?  Kinda like how the kid was rolling the numbers, Locke "brought" the rain, etc.
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walTer
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« Reply #48 on: December 09, 2004, 06:30:04 PM »

Agreed "Piss poor Captain" was a fantastic line.

Steel..heh  I really do love the show and this was great for cliffhangers.


I have nothing really to add.... except that if you are a moron like me and missed the Pilot, it is on next Wednesday....yay!!!  I hope they will then start replaying the episodes in order- I missed like the first 3....

but now I have TIVO...woot- never miss one anymore.

Oh and I too thought Charlie was really dead.
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Doomboy
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« Reply #49 on: December 09, 2004, 06:48:32 PM »

I don't think Ethan was really there...  I think Kate would have seen Jack fighting while she was coming down if he had been there.  On the other hand, I don't think it was Jack's imagination either.

I think it was just like what happened to Claire.  Ethan has some ability to get into your head if you are sleeping or unconscious.  When he does that, it is just as if it is real, only he is like superman.

I don't think Jack had blood on his lips when Kate woke him up, like he did when Ethan beat him down.

I do believe that Jack willed Charlie back to life, instead of giving up, he kept trying, and eventually made it happen.
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whiteboyskim
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« Reply #50 on: December 09, 2004, 06:53:52 PM »

AttADude - you're obviously recalling details better than I because I thought Sawyer was just standing there and didn't remember Jack knocking him around like that. Then it may lend credence to this theory....

ETHAN IS THE MONSTER OMGZZ!1!1!!!!11

 :twisted:

Doubtful though that is, I'm starting to think they might be connecting. I'm not going to speculate much more until we see what the steel was, and where it goes if it turns out to be a trapdoor. If the "others" really are running rampant underground like some Morlocks, then that might just make the show even stranger. Love it! biggrin
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AttAdude
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« Reply #51 on: December 09, 2004, 07:01:45 PM »

Quote from: "whiteboyskim"
AttADude - you're obviously recalling details better than I ...


Well there is that, or im having some sort of acid induced flashback.   i suppose thats also possible lol.   biggrin
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Lockdown
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« Reply #52 on: December 09, 2004, 07:11:21 PM »

Regarding the Jack / Ethan fight...

(talk about a bad memory)  Didn't Jack fall a good distance and land with a pretty big "thump"?  I would imagine trying to get up and fight after that, not to mention the fact that he was most likely completely exhausted from the searching, wouldn't put him even close to 100% for a mano-y-mano fight with Ethan the super ninja dreamscaper.

Just a thought.

- - - -

And regarding the death and then willing him back to life thing....

I like that theory.  Even if it's totally wrong, I'm going with that one.  It's pretty good.


- - - -

And lastly - Whoever on this forum came up with the Kate "i need a sandwich" line should be shot!  Everytime I saw her last night, that's all I could think about in my head:

"Look, there's Kate - I need a sandwich."

Curse you!
   

LD
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Rich in KCK
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« Reply #53 on: December 09, 2004, 08:07:20 PM »

Quote from: "Lockdown"
I still believe it is more tied to what they are thinking/feeling.

The young boy is the perfect example.

Thinking about certain dice rolls coming up - Happens

Thinking about finding his dog - Happens

Thinking about the polar bear in the comic book - Happens

LD


I forgot all about the comic until you mentioned it, but the dog is a different story.  The kid never found the dog no matter how much wishing he did.  Jack saw the dog and told Locke it was running around out there somewhere.  Locke made a dog whistle and called the dog to him.  If it were as simple as wishing there would have been no need for anyone but the kid to call (wish) for the dog and no need for an actual whistle.
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Rich in KCK
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« Reply #54 on: December 09, 2004, 08:09:48 PM »

I was just wondering this, where the hell are all of the insects and snakes and rats and stuff like that.  All we have seen is the food that Locke has brought back, the bear, and a few fish.  If we have learned anything from Survivor it is that camping out on beaches and caves gets you eaten alive from insects and everything else.
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« Reply #55 on: December 09, 2004, 08:38:23 PM »

Does anyone have a thorough understanding of Locke's (the philosopher) philosophy?  Just googling it, it appears to center to a certain extent around the idea that the outside world is interacted through by sensation - that you don't have in-born knowledge, just that which you acquire through interaction with the outside world through the senses (both mental and physical).  I just mention it because Locke was so adamant about going on:  "Can't you feel it?"  Also, that he was so shocked that he didn't feel anything around Ethan.

There's also Rousseau - and Delenn makes an interesting noble savage.
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Calvin
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« Reply #56 on: December 09, 2004, 09:03:13 PM »

Quote from: "Sunderer"
You all missed the best line:


"Piss poor captain."


That shit is heresy. Never speak of it again.
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Rich in KCK
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« Reply #57 on: December 09, 2004, 09:04:47 PM »

I'm not a big Sci-Fi fan so maybe that's why I just can't buy into all of the mystical theories surrounding the Island and the survivors.  If Abrahms is adding some island magic to the show I don't think every scene and event has a connection to it.  Some of the things that happen it would seem have to be taken at face value as normal or coincidence.

Here is a wild theory of my own I just came up with.  There is no magic at all.

Jack's vision of his father really was just because of his lack of sleep and need for water and he finally stumbled onto the wreckage and the stream while wandering in the jungle.

Locke's reason for being in a wheel chair wasn't physical at all but in his head.  Remember he wasn't the most rational guy in the real world, he did think a phone sex woman was in love with him and bought her a ticket to go with him to the Outback.  The crash and the fact that he survived broke through his mental barrier and he was able to walk again.

It was Jack's procedure that brought Charlie back from the dead and had nothing to do with the island.

The kid just had a run of good luck playing backgammon.

Sayid was delirious from blood loss and the after affects of the shot the woman gave him and heard what he heard because it was suggested to him in his conscious state of mind.

Locke just happened to see the guitar above his head before asking Charlie to give something to the island to get his guitar back.  I actually think this really did have nothing at all to do with the island and was just a ploy by Locke to get Charlie to give him the drugs.  There have been many other times that people have supposedly received something from the island without giving anything in return.

All of my theories are just as believable as an island magic is but in the end I think it is a combination of the two.  Some things are real and coincidence and something’s are magic.
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« Reply #58 on: December 09, 2004, 10:40:45 PM »

Quote from: "Rich in KCK"
Some things are real and coincidence and something’s are magic.


Id buy that for a buck.  But if all of those things turn out to be the way you state, then this show is about a large number of coinkydinks.
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« Reply #59 on: December 09, 2004, 11:20:16 PM »

Quote from: "Lockdown"

And lastly - Whoever on this forum came up with the Kate "i need a sandwich" line should be shot!  Everytime I saw her last night, that's all I could think about in my head:

"Look, there's Kate - I need a sandwich."

Curse you!

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gameoverman
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« Reply #60 on: December 10, 2004, 12:10:24 AM »

Quote from: "Hamlet3145"
You know . . . there have been a number of complaints about how the hobbit got brought back to life.  (I.e, the show cheesed out).  BUT . . .  what if he DID die and what we witnessed was Jack WILLING him back to life?  Kinda like how the kid was rolling the numbers, Locke "brought" the rain, etc.


This is a good point, and actually for a brief, shining moment when the hobbit came back to life I was hoping he'd be all zombied out and attack and try to bite Jack.

But anyways, this is related to a general problem I have with this show- they don't tell us ANYTHING, so therefore alot of stuff that should be adding much needed drama or suspense is falling flat.

In this case, if I only had one tidbit of info(for example, was Ethan physically 'real' during the fight?), his fight with Jack could have more impact, so to speak.  If I had a hint the island could bring back dead things(like in Pet Semetary), I'd be in suspense wondering what the heck is possessing Charlie. I'm not in suspense now because I don't even know if I'm asking the right questions and worse of all, I know that even if I knew what questions to ask, the show won't answer them anyway.

Two people, at least, have died on the island(pilot and cop) and neither of them came back. The pilot, okay they didn't actually physically verify that he was really dead, but the other guy WAS dead right? Jack tried like hell to save him too, just like with Charlie but he didn't survive. This is why I don't believe the island, though it allowed Locke to walk again, necessarily can raise the dead.
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ChaoZ
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« Reply #61 on: December 10, 2004, 03:07:04 AM »

Maybe Jack didn't want the cop to live badly enough.  Just like they never really yearned for the pilot to live.

All very intriguing theories, fellas!
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Kurth
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« Reply #62 on: December 10, 2004, 03:25:28 AM »

And actually, as I remember, it was strongly suggested that Jack did NOT try to save the cop in the end.  After Sawyer botched the job of trying to put him out of his misery, Jack went in and finished him off by suffocating him.  At least, that's what I remember.
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Rich in KCK
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« Reply #63 on: December 10, 2004, 10:24:29 AM »

Ok I might have imagined this but I'm thinking I read yet another blurb about an upcoming episode where they have to dig up the cop's body and it isn't there or something.  I saw a bunch of stuff last week following links from TV Tome about the show and that might have been one of them.

If that does come to pass than all of my "normal" theories fly right out the window.  I will say I'll be disappointed in the show if it turns into a big Sci-fi fest of a show but right now it is the show I most look forward to each week.
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« Reply #64 on: December 10, 2004, 05:06:09 PM »

Quote from: "Kurth"
And actually, as I remember, it was strongly suggested that Jack did NOT try to save the cop in the end.  After Sawyer botched the job of trying to put him out of his misery, Jack went in and finished him off by suffocating him.  At least, that's what I remember.


Yeah thats the way i remember it as well.  jack was trying to save him, but not after sawyer screwed up.   Also when he WAS trying to save the cop, its was not that emotional i personaly NEED you to be ok type of thing.  it was im a Dr. and this guys sick, i should do my job situation.  not the same thing.
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« Reply #65 on: December 10, 2004, 08:14:08 PM »

Oh and on the Hurley saying he was called a 'warrior' by some; which someone mentioned...

My first thought was that he plays D&D at home.  Exposing my geekiness.
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gameoverman
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« Reply #66 on: December 11, 2004, 12:02:57 AM »

Well, as I remember it, the cop was screaming in pain for quite a long time, and ALL the survivors were wishing he didn't. He neither got better or died at that point, so I don't think the island's power can hold sway directly over life and death.

Unless there is an element of morality in this, maybe the cop was 'bad' and therefore the island does nothing for him, while Charlie was redeemed and therefore the island can help him.

Maybe this was foreshadowed by Locke's behavior. Locke didn't rush to help dig out Jack, and he didn't really want to run right out after Claire & Charlie. Maybe he knows a person's fate on the island is determined by other factors than how hard the other survivors try to help them.  So maybe what is going to happen to Claire and Charlie(in his case, HAS happened) will happen regardless of whether they are tracked down or not.
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