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Author Topic: Dark Knight Spoilers Discussion Thread!  (Read 9224 times)
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LordMortis
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« Reply #80 on: July 24, 2008, 03:19:25 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on July 22, 2008, 12:42:20 AM

oh, and whenever I hear Johnny Depp as the Riddler I get goosebumps.....

I don't think it'll ever happen.  Depp is Burton's play thing and and I raterher doubt he'd dare play with Burton's vision.


And I didn't see the Joker as all that methodical.  I just saw him as fucking with opposition.  Showing his crazy.  Rolling with the punches, as it were.  But then I may be wrong because his capture and escape was methodical as evidenced by the cell phone surgery.
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« Reply #81 on: July 24, 2008, 03:33:13 PM »

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 03:19:25 PM

And I didn't see the Joker as all that methodical.  I just saw him as fucking with opposition.  Showing his crazy.  Rolling with the punches, as it were.  But then I may be wrong because his capture and escape was methodical as evidenced by the cell phone surgery.

You didn't see the bank robbery as methodical and calculated?  Each piece of the puzzle being eliminated when they had completed their task?  Or the corruption of Harvey Dent?  Or taking the lead of the criminal underworld?  His criminal achievements weren't at all coincidental.  Yes, he was a scary character, but what made him really scary was that he was not only crazy, but crazy smart.
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« Reply #82 on: July 24, 2008, 03:35:27 PM »

Quote from: kadnod on July 23, 2008, 05:27:09 PM

Quote from: Blackjack on July 23, 2008, 05:21:24 PM

Or did the Joker trick them by lying about which person (Dent or Rachel) was at each location?  icon_confused

This one.

I didn't catch this one either.
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« Reply #83 on: July 24, 2008, 03:43:03 PM »

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 03:35:27 PM

Quote from: kadnod on July 23, 2008, 05:27:09 PM

Quote from: Blackjack on July 23, 2008, 05:21:24 PM

Or did the Joker trick them by lying about which person (Dent or Rachel) was at each location?  icon_confused

This one.

I didn't catch this one either.

Rachel had to die in order for the corruption of Harvey Dent to be complete.  The Joker indicated that Batman would be able to save one of the two, knowing that whoever Batman went after would survive.  He also knew that Batman, while recognizing that Gotham needed Dent, would still go after his childhood love, Rachel.  Knowing that Batman would go after Rachel and most likely succeed in saving her, The Joker sent Batman to the location with Dent.  All parties involved were under the impression that Batman was on his way to save Rachel and the police were off to save Dent.  Hence the shocking surprise when Batman stormed in to find Dent and not Rachel.  The last step in Dent's fall from grace was to take away the person he loved most and to have to listen to her die.   
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« Reply #84 on: July 24, 2008, 03:44:41 PM »

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 03:33:13 PM

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 03:19:25 PM

And I didn't see the Joker as all that methodical.  I just saw him as fucking with opposition.  Showing his crazy.  Rolling with the punches, as it were.  But then I may be wrong because his capture and escape was methodical as evidenced by the cell phone surgery.

You didn't see the bank robbery as methodical and calculated?  Each piece of the puzzle being eliminated when they had completed their task?  Or the corruption of Harvey Dent?  Or taking the lead of the criminal underworld?  His criminal achievements weren't at all coincidental.  Yes, he was a scary character, but what made him really scary was that he was not only crazy, but crazy smart.

'so, I guess the boss told you to shoot me.'
'no, he told me to shoot the bus driver.'
'what bus driver?'


man, I need to see this movie again.
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« Reply #85 on: July 24, 2008, 03:49:22 PM »

I just watched it on IMAX last night.  It was fucking INCREDIBLE.  Better the second time!   thumbsup thumbsup
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« Reply #86 on: July 24, 2008, 04:00:06 PM »

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 03:33:13 PM

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 03:19:25 PM

And I didn't see the Joker as all that methodical.  I just saw him as fucking with opposition.  Showing his crazy.  Rolling with the punches, as it were.  But then I may be wrong because his capture and escape was methodical as evidenced by the cell phone surgery.

You didn't see the bank robbery as methodical and calculated?  Each piece of the puzzle being eliminated when they had completed their task?  Or the corruption of Harvey Dent?  Or taking the lead of the criminal underworld?  His criminal achievements weren't at all coincidental.  Yes, he was a scary character, but what made him really scary was that he was not only crazy, but crazy smart.

I didn't see them as necessarily methodical and calculated.  Everything is planned.  But I didn't see those plans at methodical.  I saw his planning as generalized to roll with the punches.  In a "There are no rules, look at what I can do with gasoline" changing sort of way.  Crazy smart was there, but it was make a joke and adapt it sort of crazy smart, or at least I like that view better.  He didn't plan for Dent to get hospitalized, he saw a changing opportunity and he played with it. This crazy smart ability to adapt can fit everything but the capture and prison break.
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« Reply #87 on: July 24, 2008, 04:05:04 PM »

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 04:00:06 PM

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 03:33:13 PM

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 03:19:25 PM

And I didn't see the Joker as all that methodical.  I just saw him as fucking with opposition.  Showing his crazy.  Rolling with the punches, as it were.  But then I may be wrong because his capture and escape was methodical as evidenced by the cell phone surgery.

You didn't see the bank robbery as methodical and calculated?  Each piece of the puzzle being eliminated when they had completed their task?  Or the corruption of Harvey Dent?  Or taking the lead of the criminal underworld?  His criminal achievements weren't at all coincidental.  Yes, he was a scary character, but what made him really scary was that he was not only crazy, but crazy smart.


I didn't see them as necessarily methodical and calculated.  Everything is planned.  But I didn't see those plans at methodical.  I saw his planning as generalized to roll with the punches.  In a "There are no rules, look at what I can do with gasoline" changing sort of way.  Crazy smart was there, but it was make a joke and adapt it sort of crazy smart, or at least I like that view better.  He didn't plan for Dent to get hospitalized, he saw a changing opportunity and he played with it. This crazy smart ability to adapt can fit everything but the capture and prison break.


Do I really look like a man with a plan, Harvey? I don't have a plan. The mob has plans, the cops have plans. You know what I am, Harvey? I'm a dog chasing cars. I wouldn't know what to do if I caught one. I just *do* things. I'm a wrench in the gears. I *hate* plans. Yours, theirs, everyone's. Maroni has plans. Gordon has plans. Schemers trying to control their worlds. I am not a schemer. I show schemers how pathetic their attempts to control things really are. So when I say that what happened to you and your girlfriend wasn't personal, you know I'M telling the truth. It's a schemer who put you where you are. You were a schemer. You had plans. Look where it got you. I just did what I do best-I took your plan and turned it on itself. Look what I have done to this city with a few drums of gas and a couple bullets. Nobody panics when the expected people get killed. Nobody panics when things go according to plan, even if the plans are horrifying. If I tell the press that tomorrow a gangbanger will get shot, or a truckload of soldiers will get blown up, nobody panics. But when I say one little old mayor will die, everyone loses their minds! Introduce a little anarchy, you upset the established order, and everything becomes chaos. I am an agent of chaos. And you know the thing about chaos, Harvey? It's fair.
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« Reply #88 on: July 24, 2008, 04:19:38 PM »

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 04:00:06 PM

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 03:33:13 PM

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 03:19:25 PM

And I didn't see the Joker as all that methodical.  I just saw him as fucking with opposition.  Showing his crazy.  Rolling with the punches, as it were.  But then I may be wrong because his capture and escape was methodical as evidenced by the cell phone surgery.

You didn't see the bank robbery as methodical and calculated?  Each piece of the puzzle being eliminated when they had completed their task?  Or the corruption of Harvey Dent?  Or taking the lead of the criminal underworld?  His criminal achievements weren't at all coincidental.  Yes, he was a scary character, but what made him really scary was that he was not only crazy, but crazy smart.

I didn't see them as necessarily methodical and calculated.  Everything is planned.  But I didn't see those plans at methodical.  I saw his planning as generalized to roll with the punches.  In a "There are no rules, look at what I can do with gasoline" changing sort of way.  Crazy smart was there, but it was make a joke and adapt it sort of crazy smart, or at least I like that view better.  He didn't plan for Dent to get hospitalized, he saw a changing opportunity and he played with it. This crazy smart ability to adapt can fit everything but the capture and prison break.

Then we'll have to disagree.  Yes, he was an advocate of chaos.  However, I believe that the path he followed in order to create chaos was very systematic and methodical.  A crazy person adapting to unknown variables would burst into a bank with heavy firepower and leave a trail of dead bodies in his wake.  The Joker, on the other hand, long before the robbery ever took place, ensured that his own "partners" would eliminate each other, one by one, at the right time (following completion of each of their specific tasks), in time for him to drive away with all of the money himself.  Perhaps The Joker didn't intend or plan for Dent to be hospitalized, but Dent's disfigurement wasn't a key element of the big picture.  Joker's intent was to corrupt one of Gotham's incorruptable figures.  In order to do that he had to take from Dent what he valued most.  Love.  Dent wasn't a vain or self-centered character.  And Dent wasn't angry or out for revenge  because of his disfigurement.  He wanted revenge for the death of his one true love.  That was part of The Joker's plan.  You're focusing on the minor details.  But when looking at the overall big picture, while The Joker was a merchant of chaos, his approach to creating chaos was far from being haphazard or chaotic.  The results were always planned and intended.  The Joker was certainly able to adapt to unforeseen variables, but that doesn't suggest an overall haphazard approach. 
« Last Edit: July 24, 2008, 04:26:03 PM by PeteRock » Logged

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« Reply #89 on: July 24, 2008, 04:22:33 PM »

Quote from: LordMortis on July 24, 2008, 04:00:06 PM

I didn't see them as necessarily methodical and calculated.  Everything is planned.  But I didn't see those plans at methodical.  I saw his planning as generalized to roll with the punches.  In a "There are no rules, look at what I can do with gasoline" changing sort of way.  Crazy smart was there, but it was make a joke and adapt it sort of crazy smart, or at least I like that view better.  He didn't plan for Dent to get hospitalized, he saw a changing opportunity and he played with it. This crazy smart ability to adapt can fit everything but the capture and prison break.

Dude, the bank was totally methodical.  Every single step was orchestrated to perfection, outside of the bank manager trying to blow them all to hell.  The Harvey Dent stuff was still planned out from point A to C, and he took minor deviations to get from one to another.
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« Reply #90 on: July 24, 2008, 04:26:31 PM »

The thing about being an agent of chaos, you see, is that you can TELL someone you hate plans and that you don't scheme, but you COULD be lying.   icon_wink
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« Reply #91 on: July 24, 2008, 04:31:12 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 24, 2008, 04:26:31 PM

The thing about being an agent of chaos, you see, is that you can TELL someone you hate plans and that you don't scheme, but you COULD be lying.   icon_wink

Exactly.  If he came out and told Harvey that all he wanted to do was corrupt him and cause him to create chaos himself, I doubt that he would have been so willing to do so.  By the Joker telling him that he was just doing, he gave Harvey no choice on who to place the blame upon.
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« Reply #92 on: July 24, 2008, 04:36:15 PM »

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 04:19:38 PM

Then we'll have to disagree.

We don't so much disagree.  I know my thoughts are wrong exactly because of the prison break.  However, if I saw the entire movie that way at the time, I would have been let down and bored by the plot and wouldn't have thought so much of the Joker at the time.

Fiction of the perfect plan, as a rule of thumb, does nothing for me.  I'll be fine if I never read another Stainless Steel Rat sort of book ever again.  If Nolan and company do a third movie, and it has the Riddler, I might be more inclined to accept methodical planning from him, as it would be in the nature of the character.  We'll see.
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« Reply #93 on: July 24, 2008, 05:04:44 PM »

"sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another, if I have to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice".

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« Reply #94 on: July 24, 2008, 05:15:25 PM »

Probably only the Nolan brothers (Chris and writer Jonathan) and David Goyer *really* know what the various motivations are. Then again, probably the best kind of movie or storyline is the kind that builds up so much of its own momentum and reasons that it takes on its own life, and we (the audience) forget someone was banging away at a keyboard to think it all up. I've seen lots of forgettable comic book character-based movies that don't get that kind of discussion going. So it's nice TDK does.  icon_cool

I would love to see this on IMAX at some point. In my region though it's only playing on IMAX screens in museums where I'd have to pay obscene fees for parking. There's one new IMAX screen at a regular theater in my area but inexplicably they are playing Kung Fun Panda  saywhat on it instead of TDK (which they are showing on several regular screens). Argh.

While I'd love to see them all do another go-round with Bats, I also hope C. Nolan gets to do at least one other film (as he did with The Prestige) before returning to the character. I think that's healthy for him as a director, and the cast would have time to tackle other roles (or just take a break) before returning to it too. Working on TDK, grieving over two deaths (Ledger, and stunt technician Conway Wickliffe), and doing all the massive publicity for it has to have been exhausting for Nolan and Bale in particular.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2008, 05:23:07 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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« Reply #95 on: July 24, 2008, 05:37:56 PM »

Quote
all the massive publicity for it has to have been exhausting for Nolan and Bale in particular.

Probably enough to make you want to smack your mama.
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« Reply #96 on: July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM »

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

Side note:  It was interesting to see Zeus back in action slywink
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« Reply #97 on: July 24, 2008, 06:25:09 PM »

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

Side note:  It was interesting to see Zeus back in action slywink

okay, my dumb question of the day:  what/who was zeus?
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« Reply #98 on: July 24, 2008, 06:34:06 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 24, 2008, 06:25:09 PM

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

Side note:  It was interesting to see Zeus back in action slywink

okay, my dumb question of the day:  what/who was zeus?

'Tiny' Zeus. The tall, scary-looking black actor who played the inmate in the ferry that talks the detonator out of the cops hand. He was in the first 'Friday' film. That was a very nice cameo role he got in TDK; well-done.
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« Reply #99 on: July 24, 2008, 06:34:37 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on July 24, 2008, 06:25:09 PM


okay, my dumb question of the day:  what/who was zeus?

The prisoner that threw the detonator out the window.
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« Reply #100 on: July 24, 2008, 07:57:37 PM »

Quote from: PR_GMR on July 24, 2008, 06:34:06 PM

Quote from: hepcat on July 24, 2008, 06:25:09 PM

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

Side note:  It was interesting to see Zeus back in action slywink

okay, my dumb question of the day:  what/who was zeus?

'Tiny' Zeus. The tall, scary-looking black actor who played the inmate in the ferry that talks the detonator out of the cops hand. He was in the first 'Friday' film. That was a very nice cameo role he got in TDK; well-done.

You disappoint me.  He has a far more important role in his film career that far outshines his acting in Friday.  How can anyone forget his role as "Zeus" in Hulk Hogan's film masterpiece "No Holds Barred"?  While everyone around me yelled, "Hey, that's Deebo," I was the one true fan yelling, "OMG that's Zeus!":





 icon_cool

When met with confused looks I added that he was also the actor who defined the role of President for films to come in his groundbreaking performance in "The Fifth Element":

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« Reply #101 on: July 24, 2008, 08:17:07 PM »

Thank you Pete, I thought no one would remember frown

Question:  Lucius knows Wayne is Batman right?  When he asked him about pulling R&D I wondered why he was doing it, I figured he must know about Batman.
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« Reply #102 on: July 24, 2008, 08:24:07 PM »

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 08:17:07 PM

Thank you Pete, I thought no one would remember frown

Question:  Lucius knows Wayne is Batman right?  When he asked him about pulling R&D I wondered why he was doing it, I figured he must know about Batman.

He does know about Batman.  The thing is that Bruce Wayne pulled R&D without telling Lucius even though Lucius runs the company in his stead.
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« Reply #103 on: July 24, 2008, 08:25:27 PM »

Touche, Pete... touche. You bested me with your film knowledge.... this time.  Cool
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« Reply #104 on: July 25, 2008, 12:42:52 AM »

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 07:57:37 PM



Tell me about the rabbits again George.
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« Reply #105 on: July 25, 2008, 01:18:15 AM »

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

No, that doesn't work. The Joker spends most of the movie trying to get people to willfully commit evil deeds. The (relatively) evil thing to do is to blow up the other boat.  If you want to encourage chaos and selfishness, you have to reward it; not punish it. 
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« Reply #106 on: July 25, 2008, 01:30:12 AM »

Quote from: yossar on July 25, 2008, 01:18:15 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

No, that doesn't work. The Joker spends most of the movie trying to get people to willfully commit evil deeds. The (relatively) evil thing to do is to blow up the other boat.  If you want to encourage chaos and selfishness, you have to reward it; not punish it. 

Agreed, but when I was watching the film I did indeed have the same guess that leo did.
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« Reply #107 on: July 25, 2008, 02:23:23 AM »

Quote from: PeteRock on July 24, 2008, 07:57:37 PM

Quote from: PR_GMR on July 24, 2008, 06:34:06 PM

Quote from: hepcat on July 24, 2008, 06:25:09 PM

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

Side note:  It was interesting to see Zeus back in action slywink

okay, my dumb question of the day:  what/who was zeus?

'Tiny' Zeus. The tall, scary-looking black actor who played the inmate in the ferry that talks the detonator out of the cops hand. He was in the first 'Friday' film. That was a very nice cameo role he got in TDK; well-done.

You disappoint me.  He has a far more important role in his film career that far outshines his acting in Friday.  How can anyone forget his role as "Zeus" in Hulk Hogan's film masterpiece "No Holds Barred"?  While everyone around me yelled, "Hey, that's Deebo," I was the one true fan yelling, "OMG that's Zeus!":



Yeah, every time I see that guy I immediately think of No Holds Barred even though it's been like 20 years since that came out.
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« Reply #108 on: July 25, 2008, 02:26:44 AM »

No love for Klaang?
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« Reply #109 on: July 25, 2008, 03:42:46 AM »

Quote from: wonderpug on July 25, 2008, 01:30:12 AM

Quote from: yossar on July 25, 2008, 01:18:15 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

No, that doesn't work. The Joker spends most of the movie trying to get people to willfully commit evil deeds. The (relatively) evil thing to do is to blow up the other boat.  If you want to encourage chaos and selfishness, you have to reward it; not punish it. 

Agreed, but when I was watching the film I did indeed have the same guess that leo did.

same here.  I was hoping that idiot guy on the non-prison ship would grab the remote and hit it only to blow himself up after the prisoner threw out their remote.  It still would have been an evil deed because whoever triggered the remote would be killing others while trying to save their own ass.
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« Reply #110 on: July 25, 2008, 07:16:01 AM »

So I finally got a chance to see it last night. It didn't quite strike me as well as the first one did. Heath's performance was of course nothing short of amazing. Bale's pursed-lip growling got kind of grating after a while and for all of Nolan's other superb filmmaking skills, he still can't shoot a fight scene worth a lick. All of the fight scenes pretty much comprised of quick half-second close-in upper-torso-framed cut shots of Batman punching someone. Yawn. The movie felt really long to me too, in which I now agree about cramming the Dent/Two-Face story arc into the last section of the film. I can appreciate the storyline of Joker's corruption of Dent, but it all just felt forced.

Was pretty cool to see so much of Chicago shot as well. I was watching from across the street when they were shooting the street scenes with Bruce's grey Lambo.

All in all, I would probably watch it again, if nothing else for Heath's final and enthralling depiction of Gotham's most cunning and diabolical super-villian.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2008, 01:29:52 PM by spigot » Logged

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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #111 on: July 25, 2008, 01:13:05 PM »

I actually thought the fight scenes were significantly improved this time out. 

To me, Harvey Dent is the very core of the entire film so the Two Face stuff seemed rather the point of the whole thing rather than something just shoved into the final act.  For all of the chaos and destruction that the Joker wrought, his impact on Harvey is really our window into that destruction. 
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« Reply #112 on: July 25, 2008, 01:45:54 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on July 25, 2008, 03:42:46 AM

Quote from: wonderpug on July 25, 2008, 01:30:12 AM

Quote from: yossar on July 25, 2008, 01:18:15 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on July 24, 2008, 06:06:14 PM

Regarding the ferry scene; did you guys think that even though he said the other ferry would explode when the switch was pulled, it would actually blow up their own ship?  That's what I figured was going to happen.  The ol' Joker switch-a-roo.

No, that doesn't work. The Joker spends most of the movie trying to get people to willfully commit evil deeds. The (relatively) evil thing to do is to blow up the other boat.  If you want to encourage chaos and selfishness, you have to reward it; not punish it. 

Agreed, but when I was watching the film I did indeed have the same guess that leo did.

same here.  I was hoping that idiot guy on the non-prison ship would grab the remote and hit it only to blow himself up after the prisoner threw out their remote.  It still would have been an evil deed because whoever triggered the remote would be killing others while trying to save their own ass.

I was kinda hoping that the detonator itself was the only thing rigged to blow and it would kill whoever pushed the button smile
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« Reply #113 on: July 25, 2008, 01:55:51 PM »

On the subject of Zeus, all I can say is "D'OH".  I know the name "Tiny" Lister, but wasn't aware of the Zeus pseudonym.  I stand humbled and beaten, a hollow shell of a man. 
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« Reply #114 on: July 26, 2008, 04:49:07 AM »

I was sifting through search engines for some more interviews, and found a pretty neat site called "Slashfilm." I would though suggest their news posters learn the values of Returns between paragraphs and stop writing their interviews likeStreamOfConsciousnessTranscriptsThatBecomeSomewhatHardtoReadKnowWhatIMean?  icon_lol

Dark Knight Cast and Crew Tease Third Batman Film
http://www.slashfilm.com/2008/07/09/dark-knight-cast-and-crew-tease-third-batman-film/
Quote from: David Goyer
“We’re not gonna tell you… other than to say that Batman has been published for 70 years. In the first movie we use Ra’s Al Ghul and The Scarecrow, who had not been in the movies before, and had not been in the sixties TV show before. And there are dozens if not hundreds of other characters that fit that bill. Everyone says its gotta be The Penguin or Catwoman [the latter is a hope of the Batman on Film webmeister - bj] … well I completely disagree.”

“I think Warner Bros would like to do another one,” Goyer admitted. “But it wasn’t until three or four months after Batman Begins had opened that Chris and I sat down and talked about another one. It was a scary proposition trying to do Dark Knight, and it’s sort of a geometrically scary proposition to try to do another one.”
I had forgotten, but back in summer/fall 2006, the scuttlebutt was that C. Nolan was supposedly going through final negotiations to direct a movie version of The Prisoner:

U reloads 'Prisoner'; Nolan to helm Peoples script
http://www.variety.com/index.asp?layout=story&articleID=VR1117948317&cs=1
He has sounded noncommittal about it in more recent interviews, so I don't know if that deal actually went through. The guy's gotta be exhausted from TDK and all these interviews of late. I hope he and his producer wife Emma can get a nice long vacation before they tackle something else.  icon_smile
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« Reply #115 on: July 26, 2008, 02:15:54 PM »

The thing about The Prisoner is that AMC just announced they were doing a new mini-series of The Prisoner with Ian McKellan.  So that might put a damper on any plans for Nolan to do a big screen version. 
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« Reply #116 on: July 30, 2008, 10:40:13 AM »

eh, Batman did say he'd save "Rachell", but how the hell did the Joker know who Batman was, to orchestra something like the reversal of the adresses???
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« Reply #117 on: July 30, 2008, 11:43:21 AM »

My take on it is that the Joker tells Batman where each of them is, and let's Batman decide who to save.

Therefore, it's irrelevant who Batman is, he will go to his first choice- and either way it will be wrong since the Joker has pulled a fast one on him and given him the opposite location.

If Batman really wanted to save Rachel, he will save Dent instead.  If he really wanted to save Dent, he will wind up saving Rachel instead.   It's a twisted thing the Joker does, but the really cool thing is that it's so tempting because the Joker has been doing this the whole movie(making people decide between tough choices).  I don't blame Batman for believing the Joker would really give him the right addresses, why not since it would force Batman to let one of them die?  Haha, but how much more evil is it to force Batman to make the choice and then taking it away from him at the last second? 

About the ferry, having the detonators blow their own ships up doesn't work.   The idea is that the people making the choices have to live with the knowledge of what they did, as well as knowing other people know what they did.   For instance assuming self detonation, if it goes the Joker's way and the prison boat people push the button, the prison boat blows up.    And the 'good' people shrug, right?  If the good people push the button and they blow up, the prison boat people shrug right?

But if the good people push the button and kill the others, it's not quite a shrug.   That's because there were law enforcement(ie good) people on that boat too.   If the prison boat people push the button and kill the good boat people, it's not a shrug because law enforcement people have massacred(or allowed to be massacred) innocent people.
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« Reply #118 on: July 30, 2008, 01:05:37 PM »

Quote from: Razgon on July 30, 2008, 10:40:13 AM

eh, Batman did say he'd save "Rachell", but how the hell did the Joker know who Batman was, to orchestra something like the reversal of the adresses???

Joker comments that he initially did believe that Batman was Dent because of the way Batman saved Rachel at the party.  So even once he found out that Dent wasn't Batman, he still knew that Rachel was someone very important to him.  This was further confirmed when Batman flies off the handle at Joker in the interrogation room once Joker brings Rachel up. 
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« Reply #119 on: July 30, 2008, 02:16:08 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Grey on July 30, 2008, 01:05:37 PM

Quote from: Razgon on July 30, 2008, 10:40:13 AM

eh, Batman did say he'd save "Rachell", but how the hell did the Joker know who Batman was, to orchestra something like the reversal of the adresses???

Joker comments that he initially did believe that Batman was Dent because of the way Batman saved Rachel at the party.  So even once he found out that Dent wasn't Batman, he still knew that Rachel was someone very important to him.  This was further confirmed when Batman flies off the handle at Joker in the interrogation room once Joker brings Rachel up. 


plus you have to figure which would damage someone more?  a mostly innocent woman (granted she was a lawyer) or the guy who took on the mob and knew the risks?  I doubt even without the confirmation that she was important to Batman the Joker would have given him the right address.
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