[movie] Star Trek 2, AKA Star Trek Into Darkness

[Suitably Ironic Moniker]

I need to slingshot around the sun so it can be May 17th already.

[WarPig]

All right, if I heard that correctly, Kirk asked the villain who he was. If it was Gary, wouldn't Kirk already know who he was? I'm back in the Khan theory.

[Fireball1244]

WarPig, I'm feeling the same drift.

[metallicorphan]

All right, if I heard that correctly, Kirk asked the villain who he was. If it was Gary, wouldn't Kirk already know who he was? I'm back in the Khan theory.

Like Gary,wouldn't he of known Khan as well?

EDIT:
Article here about Benedict Cumberbatch,about not being a typical English bad guy in Star Trek and other projects he is involved in this year
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/film/4777389/Benedict-Cumberbatch-Star-Trek-baddie.html

[Covenant]

Like Gary,wouldn't he of known Khan as well?

Why would he? Think move TV episode Khan than movie Khan. I've thought it was Khan since the beginning and J.J. was just pulling every one's chain; last night basically sealed the deal for me.

[Rumpy]

A purpose and intention? Sure hope that's in the movie! 

[hepcat]

I'm still convinced he's playing a Horta...

[Isgrimnur]

I'm still convinced he's playing a Horta...

 

[CeeKay]

I'm still convinced he's playing a Horta...

 

I bet it'll be a holodeck episode.

[rshetts2]

All right, if I heard that correctly, Kirk asked the villain who he was. If it was Gary, wouldn't Kirk already know who he was? I'm back in the Khan theory.

This could also be a classic JJ dodge.  without context, the question could be totally different than you think.  For example, lets say he is Mitchell and Kirk had seen him do some pretty impossible things ( as we know Mitchell becomes capable of )  the question, in that context works. 

[hepcat]

Just out of curiosity, but has it ever actually been established that Cumberbatch is playing someone with a history in the star trek universe and NOT an entirely new character?

[CeeKay]

plus Star Trek history has changed as of the first movie (a whole planet full of people closely tied with the Federation blowing up would have quite a ripple effect), so it's possible it is Gary Mitchell but Kirk never met him.

[Isgrimnur]

That would imply that not only is the future of the timeline re-written, but also what we know about the past.  If that's the case, why bother with the Nimoy/Spock tie-in?

[CeeKay]

That would imply that not only is the future of the timeline re-written, but also what we know about the past.

it looks like other things in the timeline were changed too for this version before Vulcan.  the original Kirk started Starfleet in 2250, while the new Kirk starts in 2255.  plus the Enterprise is only just being launched at the time of Nero's attack on Vulcan, so it never had Pike as captain for 11 years nor did Robert April act as the ships first captain.

looking at the history from Memory Alpha about Gary Mitchell:

Mitchell was an Academy friend of James T. Kirk, stemming back to the time then-lieutenant Kirk was serving as an instructor and Mitchell was a first-year cadet. That year, Mitchell aimed a "little blonde lab technician" towards Kirk – as a means to distract his rigid instructor – and, in turn, Kirk almost married her.

in the new Star Trek I don't believe Kirk ever reached LT before the Vulcan incident as they keep calling him a cadet instead of a LT while Spock is referred to as Commander.

tl:dr - it's a whole new world so don't rely on what happened before as a guideline.

***********

If that's the case, why bother with the Nimoy/Spock tie-in?

to bring in the old geeks

[Isgrimnur]

Fair enough.

[WarPig]

I have no good response to that. Good point?

[sgoldj]

That would imply that not only is the future of the timeline re-written, but also what we know about the past.

it looks like other things in the timeline were changed too for this version before Vulcan.  the original Kirk started Starfleet in 2250, while the new Kirk starts in 2255.  plus the Enterprise is only just being launched at the time of Nero's attack on Vulcan, so it never had Pike as captain for 11 years nor did Robert April act as the ships first captain.

looking at the history from Memory Alpha about Gary Mitchell:

Mitchell was an Academy friend of James T. Kirk, stemming back to the time then-lieutenant Kirk was serving as an instructor and Mitchell was a first-year cadet. That year, Mitchell aimed a "little blonde lab technician" towards Kirk – as a means to distract his rigid instructor – and, in turn, Kirk almost married her.

in the new Star Trek I don't believe Kirk ever reached LT before the Vulcan incident as they keep calling him a cadet instead of a LT while Spock is referred to as Commander.

tl:dr - it's a whole new world so don't rely on what happened before as a guideline.

***********

If that's the case, why bother with the Nimoy/Spock tie-in?

to bring in the old geeks

Things had to start changing before Vulcan was destroyed. From the time Nero first appears during Kirk's birth. No Sam, no father, no progression up the ranks like a normal person   Kirk, Sulu, McCoy, Uhura, Checkov all in school at the same time.....  It goes on and on.

[CeeKay]

Things had to start changing before Vulcan was destroyed. From the time Nero first appears during Kirk's birth. No Sam, no father, no progression up the ranks like a normal person   Kirk, Sulu, McCoy, Uhura, Checkov all in school at the same time.....  It goes on and on.

yeah, Vulcan was a bad choice for the ripple effect, I should have used the Kelvin's destruction.  sure, minor ripples compared to Vulcan, but enough to change stuff.  IIRC, in the Prime universe George Kirk is still alive when James joins Starfleet.

[Bullwinkle]

Did EW just spill the beans?

Spoiler for Hiden:

[sgoldj]

I've been (stupidly) thinking about this. My operating assumption is that Nero and Crew, then (older) Spock id a time jump that splintered into a parallel uniververse. My problem is that I can't seem to make this fit with Starfleet before Kirk was born, things like the first war with the Romulans. And why would Vulcan culture allow (young) Spock to exhibit the emotions he does as a Starfleet instructor.

So my mind wonders: what if Nero/(older) Spock never traveled in linear time. They, instead, traveled into a closely parallel universe. One which had several differences before the major shift of Nero's arrival? Much like the Mirror Universe, that would allow for the same people, but different characters. (old) Spock couldn't know the future events with real certainty, and characters like Khan could be different enough to allow a new story, but still be recognizable. (old)Spock and (young) Spock could have a mentor relationship that would be based on (old) Spock's experience, not knowledge of the future.

Anyway, I think that explanation would free the writers up more. Anything that didn't fit is easily explained.

Aside: I'd love to see a movie/short based on the old short story of Shatner, Nimoy, and (I think) Kelly, being beamed up to the real Enterprise in an accident that had Kirk, Spock, and McCoy beamed to the set at Desilu productions. It's an old story, written before NextGen even was announced, probably before anyone thought of Phase II. I'd have to check on it.  I think the name was Strange Planet Revisited in the first Short Story collection. New Voyages,maybe?

[Bullwinkle]

I've been (stupidly) thinking about this. My operating assumption is that Nero and Crew, then (older) Spock id a time jump that splintered into a parallel uniververse. My problem is that I can't seem to make this fit with Starfleet before Kirk was born, things like the first war with the Romulans. And why would Vulcan culture allow (young) Spock to exhibit the emotions he does as a Starfleet instructor.

So my mind wonders: what if Nero/(older) Spock never traveled in linear time. They, instead, traveled into a closely parallel universe. One which had several differences before the major shift of Nero's arrival? Much like the Mirror Universe, that would allow for the same people, but different characters. (old) Spock couldn't know the future events with real certainty, and characters like Khan could be different enough to allow a new story, but still be recognizable. (old)Spock and (young) Spock could have a mentor relationship that would be based on (old) Spock's experience, not knowledge of the future.

Anyway, I think that explanation would free the writers up more. Anything that didn't fit is easily explained.

Aside: I'd love to see a movie/short based on the old short story of Shatner, Nimoy, and (I think) Kelly, being beamed up to the real Enterprise in an accident that had Kirk, Spock, and McCoy beamed to the set at Desilu productions. It's an old story, written before NextGen even was announced, probably before anyone thought of Phase II. I'd have to check on it.  I think the name was Strange Planet Revisited in the first Short Story collection. New Voyages,maybe?

They did a similar thing in the Red Dwarf: Back to Earth series (which I really loved, but it turned a lot of people off).

[farley2k]

Anyway, I think that explanation would free the writers up more. Anything that didn't fit is easily explained.

Or from that Simpson's episode with Lucy Lawless  - "a wizard did it."

[hepcat]

They did a similar thing in the Red Dwarf: Back to Earth series (which I really loved, but it turned a lot of people off).

I'm honestly surprised at this as I've never heard of a single fan of Red Dwarf saying anything about that mini series that even remotely sounded positive.    (Season 10 however...much, much better)

Sorry to derail...   

[Bullwinkle]

They did a similar thing in the Red Dwarf: Back to Earth series (which I really loved, but it turned a lot of people off).

I'm honestly surprised at this as I've never heard of a single fan of Red Dwarf saying anything about that mini series that even remotely sounded positive.    (Season 10 however...much, much better)

Sorry to derail...   

Part of it was that I had been cranking through everything all at once when I got to BTE, so it's not like I'd been waiting a decade to see it.  I didn't put extra weight or anticipation on it. 

Most of it was that I really enjoyed the meta aspect of it.  I thought it was some cool story telling.

But I get why fans hated it.  The lack of a laughtrack alone made it seem jarringly serious.  Bad jokes that would just slip through with a fake laugh stand out as not funny without it.  These moments were especially noticeable in the first episode, but once they got off ship, they were less frequent. 

It's also not traditional Red Dwarf.  And while I appreciated that as a refreshing change of pace, I can totally understand how that might feel like a slap in the face if you'd been waiting a long time.

[metallicorphan]

yeah i love Red Dwarf,and wasn't too keen on BTE....too many Blade Runner references(I know it was a homage to it,but still),first episode was okay,but by the third and last it was limping along.....but yeah as Hepcat says last November's New Series was great and back to basics

back to Star Trek,Simon Pegg was asked on the Red Carpet of the BAFTAs if J.J Abrams would be back for Star Trek 3 with him doing Star Wars 7,and he said yes he'll be back,however on his twitter account later he said that he did not know if he would be back for the third one

video

Simon Pegg ‏@simonpegg
Just to be clear, contrary to reports in the press, I have no idea whether or not JJ will helm Star Trek 3.

Just to be clear,peggster!!...the reports in the press are videos of you SAYING that he would helm Star Trek 3

[Bullwinkle]

yeah i love Red Dwarf,and wasn't too keen on BTE....too many Blade Runner references(I know it was a homage to it,but still),first episode was okay,but by the third and last it was limping along.....but yeah as Hepcat says last November's New Series was great and back to basics

back to Star Trek,Simon Pegg was asked on the Red Carpet of the BAFTAs if J.J Abrams would be back for Star Trek 3 with him doing Star Wars 7,and he said yes he'll be back,however on his twitter account later he said that he did not know if he would be back for the third one

video

Simon Pegg ‏@simonpegg
Just to be clear, contrary to reports in the press, I have no idea whether or not JJ will helm Star Trek 3.

Just to be clear,peggster!!...the reports in the press are videos of you SAYING that he would helm Star Trek 3

I think he was saying that JJ would do the next ST as a kind of false bravado/bully tactic.  You know, the more you say it, the more likely it'll come true, kind-of-thing.

Right after college, half of the people I lived with senior year moved to Boston, myself included.  We started telling everyone that a fourth guy was moving to Boston.  We told so many people who then said to that guy, "I hear you're moving to Boston" that soon enough, it was easier for him to say yes than explain, and he wound up moving to Boston.

[rshetts2]

yeah i love Red Dwarf,and wasn't too keen on BTE....too many Blade Runner references(I know it was a homage to it,but still),first episode was okay,but by the third and last it was limping along.....but yeah as Hepcat says last November's New Series was great and back to basics

back to Star Trek,Simon Pegg was asked on the Red Carpet of the BAFTAs if J.J Abrams would be back for Star Trek 3 with him doing Star Wars 7,and he said yes he'll be back,however on his twitter account later he said that he did not know if he would be back for the third one

video

Simon Pegg ‏@simonpegg
Just to be clear, contrary to reports in the press, I have no idea whether or not JJ will helm Star Trek 3.

Just to be clear,peggster!!...the reports in the press are videos of you SAYING that he would helm Star Trek 3

Whats the big deal? Pegg stated an opinion that he felt JJ would do ST3, He can have an opinion and still not be absolutely sure.  Even if JJ were under contract to do ST3, theres no guarantee that he would follow through.   After the press started to blow this up he clarified.  Hell, even if JJ himself stated that he WAS 100% positive he was doing ST3, its still no guarantee that he would, hollywood changes directions ( and directors ) constantly. 

[metallicorphan]

opinion,yeah sure

it's not a big deal as your post seems to making out and maybe you think i am getting at Simon Pegg for saying J.J Abrams was doing it and then going back on it,I am NOT

what i am getting at is when he says "He WILL do Star Trek 3" then why is his tweet directing blame at the press when those were his exact words?...the press just said what he said,and he is saying "contrary to the press"..no,not contrary at all,you said it,those were your words,its up to you to explain that it was just your opinion,not blame the press for reporting the exact words you said

that's all i am getting at Star Trek 3 hasn't even been announced yet,so i know nothing is set in stone yet

[CeeKay]

I hear Bret Ratner is feeling left out on big franchises lately, so maybe he'll do ST3

[metallicorphan]

Simon Pegg ‏@simonpegg
Looks like Star Trek Into Darkness will land in the UK first. Release date May 9th. That's about 8 weeks away. Not long considering.

8 weeks,it's gone fast,it's going to be a great (spring/)summer for movies(as long as the films are actually good that is )

[metallicorphan]

new teaser trailer

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/61376

[CeeKay]

new teaser trailer

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/61376

Spoiler for Hiden:

[metallicorphan]

That's quite disturbing,CK ...it's the stare!!

Simon Pegg ‏@simonpegg
Hey, did I tweet this picture already? http://twitpic.com/cakz30

Maybe this will be how JJ will do both....a crossover movie!!

[CeeKay]

new international trailer.

[PeteRock]

new international trailer.

I haven't done a midnight show since Half Blood Prince.  This may change that.

[Covenant]

There's a URL secreted away in the trailer as well that leads to a new poster.  Info here... (pic of girl in underwear on page so maybe NSFW??)

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/03/21/new-star-trek-poster-is-your-reward-for-not-ogling-alice-eve-in-her-underwear/

[leo8877]

new international trailer.

Wow that was REALLY good

[Blackjack]

RE: the international trailer...

The Red Shirt at the 1:25 min. mark is SO doomed, along with the Red Shirt Brigade at 1:43...  

I hear Bret Ratner is feeling left out on big franchises lately, so maybe he'll do ST3

AAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaiiiieeeeee!  

Thing is, I find all this hyperventilation about JJ's successor misguided. I didn't think Sam Mendes would do one of the best James Bond films, or that Irvin Kershner would do a great job with The Empire Strikes Back (nothing before or after TESB suggests he was a perfect fit for a big sci-fi/fantasy film). For that matter, nothing in Peter Jackson's filmography before LOTR trilogy (or after, based on the King Kong remake and the disastrous The Lovely Bones adaptation) suggests he was great for that.

imho, stay away from thinking X or Y is a good choice because he's directed comic book movies, sci-fi or action films. Maybe what we need as JJ's successor is way out in left field doing Miramax art house movies, focused on characters and storytelling rather than FX, that very few people see. Then again, is Paramount brave enough to "think outside the box" for the new-ST franchise? Who knows...

[Turtle]

So much cyan!

[metallicorphan]

AICN have a good article about the above poster(which is the same one Covenant linked to above) and about the new Star Trek overall
Where's All The Trekking Gone In STAR TREK?