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Question: So when should LE call the chick?  (Voting closed: October 15, 2005, 10:10:27 PM)
Tonite!  Chaaaarrrrrrrrrgggeeee!!! - 6 (18.2%)
Later tomorrow.  Nod to the rules of the game but don't insult her intelligence. - 13 (39.4%)
Monday or Tuesday.  Typical male strategy. - 2 (6.1%)
Later than Tuesday.  Dude, you care too much about this. - 4 (12.1%)
SH!T B0NERZ - 8 (24.2%)
Total Voters: 33

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Author Topic: [Cliché Girl Issues] Act 3/3: Loose Ends  (Read 12400 times)
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« on: October 15, 2005, 10:10:27 PM »

Well, I'm just getting out of an excrutiatingly long, strange relationship (~4 years), and I'm kind of getting into a dating scene which I never really was a part of in the first place.

Last night I had a fun run-in with an attractive, interesting girl named Jessica.  We met at a party; she's a friend of a friend.  She hails from the depths of Chicago, while I'm more on the periphery, in a scandalous little hamlet known as Evanston.  She arrived around the end of the party, my group and I had shown up at 10pm, but it was 1am when she came in, and we were all tired and varying levels of drunk, so we were about to go.

Jessica comes in, we start talking almost immediately (I'd just had a shot of Jagermeister, courage ran thick in my veins).  She had one drink and we talked for about half an hour when everyone else we'd come with decided it was time to go.  They left, and it was just me and her, so we decided to leave too.

So we're walking around, she checks her CTA train card and realizes the trains have stopped running, so it's going to be a 1hr+ bus ride back to her place, or an expensive taxi ride.  I give my condolences, she asks if I knew where an ATM was so she could get some money.  I say, sure, I can show you -- when she asks if it'd just be OK if she could crash at my place (since my room mate was out on a sexual conquest).  I say sure, why not, he won't be using his bed anyway (obviously my thought process wasn't really concerned with sleep at all once that question dropped, but I'm a 20 year old male, can you blame me?)

Anyway.  We go back to my room, sit around and talk and talk and talk.  It's a really intelligent conversation.  She's immensely awesome, and quite pretty, I think I mentioned this before.  It's the typical buildup of flirtation and sexual tension til there we are, cuddling and embracing, talking some more like that, then there's a spurt of kissing which she initiates and I follow up on, then we go back to little flirty cuddling for the rest of the night, til finally around 4:30 we're both so tired that we retreat to our respective beds -- no, we didn't sleep together, I wasn't going to force the issue and quite honestly she didn't seem interested in going to such an extreme, which I respected.  

I did make a point of getting her number, though -- I just point-blank asked for it in a lull in the conversation, and she gladly gave it.

So this morning around 9:30 she's dressed again (she slept in one of my t-shirts) and she wakes me up by kissing me, half on the lips, half on the cheek, and whispers her goodbye.  I wish her farewell and promptly collapse back into sleep.

So here I am, with her number, a good experience from the night before and a desperate little voice screaming "Don't ruin it, moron!!!" in the back of my head.  As forstated, I'm a 20-year-old male, of course I would have liked more to have happened than what actually did, but from a more rational, less chauvenist viewpoint, I'm very satisfied with the night's events.

And thus the crux.  I want it to happen again.  It's why I initiated the ritual of the phone number in the first place.  However, I'm unclear on the rest of the ritual, beyond actually getting the digits.  Apparently, when I decide to call her back is a huge issue -- too soon and I look desperate, too late and I look nonchalant.  Now, I'd definitely rather be seen as nonchalant than desperate, but I'd most like to be seen as normal than either of those two things.

So I come to you, Console Gold readers, for your opinion on this matter.  Obviously I've given the Cliff's Notes version of the events of last night, since the real question for me is when to call her, not whether to call her, but if you detect some egregious error in what happened last night that sets off alarms in your head, please share it with me, since I don't want to waste my time if she's not interested.
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« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2005, 10:20:56 PM »

Bravo on not sleeping with her or trying to get her to sleep with you that night.  I think that shows you really like her and I'd say you've already got +1 rep biggrin

I'm not sure, man, there does seem to be a rule...I think that each case is different, then again, I have had about .04% luck with woman, so I'm the wrong man to get advice from.  Enjoyed the story, though.  I'm sure some knowledgable guys will pop in soon...
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« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2005, 11:15:56 PM »

Interesting story.  I really don't know what to think of it.  Every girl I seem to get to know messes with my head so much (ask Calvin - he knows due to him listening to my rants   biggrin ) that I'm not quite sure what "they" want, what "they" don't want, and so forth.

Consider - it's a Saturday night.  A night meant to go out.  That would make me lean towards give her a call today.

But then again, calling her like, too soon might signal a red flag for her?  See!  It's different with every single girl out there.  And that's what sucks - trying to figure it out (hence your post!).

I would say this - if she seems like more of a "party" girl, likes the whole social scene, and so forth . . . call her tonight and see what she's up to.  If she seems more like, well, not TOO much of a party and social person and such, then maybe give her a call Sunday?

Probably best not to listen to my advice though and let the more experienced CGers respond.  But it's weird how a situation like this - such a great experience and such - comes with so much decision-making and the opportunity to "fail."
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« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2005, 11:19:41 PM »

Dude, the rule is garbage. If you want to call her, then call her. Call her tomorrow (Sunday) in the afternoon when you have a better chance of catching her. Tell her you had a blast, etc. Doesn't sound like she was wigged out by the situation - she wouldn't have woke you up in the morning if she didn't want to see you again. Got a connection? Sparks? Lil' chemistry? Then follow through with it. Good luck to you. Hope it works out.

And props for not sleeping with her. Seriously.
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« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2005, 12:03:17 AM »

If she likes you, she won't give a shit about when you called (that is, unless you waited too long). But if she is turned off that you called her the next day, then she's probably too shallow to bother dating anyway.
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« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2005, 01:11:11 AM »

Wish I'd been home earlier to see this.  I'd have called her this afternoon just to say, "Thanks for a great night.  I hope we can do it again sometime."

Let's her know that you enjoyed yourself/care and puts the ball back in her court to say whether it'll happen again.  It's less about when you call, and more about your attitude when you're on the phone with her.

I'll second the notion that if she's the kind of gal that'll get wigged out by a simple, "Just callin' to say thanks," then she's probably not gonna be worth your time anyway.
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« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2005, 01:15:03 AM »

I never believed in all that crap, just go on feel.
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« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2005, 01:31:28 AM »

Quote from: "depward"
I would say this - if she seems like more of a "party" girl, likes the whole social scene, and so forth . . . call her tonight and see what she's up to.  If she seems more like, well, not TOO much of a party and social person and such, then maybe give her a call Sunday?

No, she's definitely not a party/social person.  It's what drew us to converse in the first place (our lack of belonging).
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« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2005, 03:00:31 AM »

Quote from: "Ralph-Wiggum"
If she likes you, she won't give a shit about when you called (that is, unless you waited too long). But if she is turned off that you called her the next day, then she's probably too shallow to bother dating anyway.

Bingo!! Cool
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« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2005, 04:21:09 AM »

You have 2 choices here.....

-If you're gonna play "The Game" then play it well.
i.e. call her late the next day, and act all non-chalant and shit.
But be prepared for a somewhat long interaction like this....until you both come to a "middle ground"

-Be yourself.
i.e. You feel like calling her and telling her you dig her and want to see her ASAP.

Your choice, man. Both have their positives and negatives.
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« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2005, 04:49:42 AM »

Calling the next day can reek of desperateness, but if you did more than just talk its not out of the question.

Standard timeframe is 2-3 days, any later and you are dropping the ball.

I'd say call her sometime on sunday if you want to seem casual, and the next day if you want to seem like you like her.
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« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2005, 05:08:46 AM »

call her in 3 weeks.  do it at 2 am, make sure you are drunk.  tell her you just realized (use these words specifically) "you cant fuck a phone number" when you found it in your pants pocket.  suggest she rectify that situation - who knows???
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« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2005, 05:56:53 AM »

Quote from: "Semaj"
Standard timeframe is 2-3 days, any later and you are dropping the ball.

I'd say call her sometime on sunday if you want to seem casual, and the next day if you want to seem like you like her.
Why would Monday be interpreted more like I like her than Sunday?

IE, what's the reasoning behind it?

(PS, I didn't call her tonite.  I'm feeling tomorrow might be the best day.)
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« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2005, 06:10:47 AM »

I, too, agree with Wiggum and Cleric.
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« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2005, 01:37:58 PM »

Good Luck LE.  It'll be fine.  By the looks of the story, it sounds like you could call anytime and it would go well.  Just have some fun and don't get too caught up in timeframe and the ritual.  Only thing that can do is lead you to feel uncomfortable and then not really act confident and natural.  Why bother, obviously the natural LE worked already (wait, take another shot of jager before the call!)   biggrin

Let her know you had fun and would like to see her again and take it from there.
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« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2005, 03:20:16 PM »

Take her to a hockey game!


Or if you happen to have a White Sox World Series ticket...
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« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2005, 03:56:18 PM »

Well the key is... you hang out with a girl, calling her within a specific amount of time tends to imply you  have no life/reek of desperation or its just a big sign your phenominally interested.

I never said you shouldnt call, because by the way it went it sounds like your in.  Still call her sometime this afternoon, preferably about an hour before you fav football team plays.  So you get an hour of talk time in before you have stuff to do.  Then have her call ya back when she has the chance now that she has your number and see how long it takes her to call ya back, lol.

Good god, I lived with too many women, I know the games too well.  Meh, call her today.
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« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2005, 06:59:44 PM »

Give her a damned call this afternoon, in between the lull of lunch and evening. Chat it up and take her out sometime this week.

I said the rule is garbage, and it's true - so say my female coworkers. I'm the only guy at work, working amongst six or eight girls. The "calling rule" actually came up a few weeks back, and most of them said the phone game is ridiculous. Without being an asshole and calling her back in like half an hour after meeting her - think Swingers - a next day phone call is fine. I just suggested today because you'll have a better chance of getting her, and you'll have time to talk, yada yada yada.

Seriously, the phone game is a joke - can't make life too much of a Seinfeld episode.
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« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2005, 07:54:53 PM »

Well my 'Ask the Audience' lifeline determined today to be the call day, though I do want to thank the fellow who voted SH!T B0NERZ for keeping the tradition alive.

Anyway, just called her, and... got voicemail!  I left a message saying who I was, that I'd had a great time and wanted to hang out with her again, and that I was just calling to see what she was up to, etc.  I left her my cell number and asked her to give me a call when she got a chance.

Not a sloppy message, but far from perfect.  I'd give it a 7 or 8/10.
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« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2005, 08:01:10 PM »

You know what, that's perfect.  She'll call you if interested, she won't if she isn't - no mixed signals involved biggrin  I hope she calls though, buddy.

and LOL, we all rate our voicemail messages hahahah so funny.
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« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2005, 10:12:06 PM »

That sounds pretty damned good LE!
Nicely done.
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« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2005, 12:54:29 AM »

Don't forget to let us know how it goes.
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« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2005, 01:16:33 AM »

Ask her to a LAN party. Chicks dig that shit.
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« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2005, 03:57:10 AM »

When you talk to her (she's likely to call; I mean, she DID kiss you goodbye)... be into her, but keep the conversation short. Make her want to see you.

Say something like I don't have much time right now Jessica, we'll have to make this quick... that way she feels like she's got to put a bit of herself into the conversation. Don't be afraid to end the call before you get all mushy or get to the "uhm, so howya doiiiin'" lulls. End it on a high note, and be very inviting during the call.

She's going through the EXACT SAME crap, or if she's more practiced she's already figured out what she wants to do.

Good luck LE.. I'd laugh if she turned out to be one of the 12 people responsible for the messages posted under U2K/General. slywink Remember to keep the conversation short, cite busy-ness, and that you'd like to get together. Keep a sense of humour about this, and don't worry if you don't hear from her for a few days. I'd call again 2 days after I left the voicemail... you don't want to be forgotten.
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« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2005, 04:45:27 AM »

Well she called me back around 10:00 CST.  Turns out she was at work from 2:00pm - 10:00pm.

We talked for 30-45 minutes.  It was cool, lots of laughing and plenty of references to having to show eachother stuff in the future.  I didn't bother nailing down a next date or anything, as she said she'd (probably) call me back later, after she was done with her sewing for her project due mid-week (she's a fashion design major).
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« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2005, 05:43:52 AM »

Part 2:

She just called me again, at 12:00am.  This conversation was much shorter, about 10-15 minutes.  In the first lull in the conversation, (it seems we're both nervous and eager to please, so I expected lulls), I told her I'd called in the first place to hopefully set up another time for us to meet up and hang out (I forget my exact wording).  She says she's working a thirty hour week and has several projects all at once, so she doesn't know when would work, but she was going to be working fewer hours in two weeks.  

My stomach sinks at that, it's a cop-out I've heard before.  I say something like "Man, that's rough.  Well, you have my number, so just call me if you've got some time and want to do something."   She goes into the details of her bizarre schedule and I comment on how strange it is... am I being condemned to friendship?!  And then, the saving grace: as if she realized how what she was saying was being interpreted, she said something like "And don't worry, I definitely want to meet up again, I don't want you to think otherwise."  Anyway, there was a little more small talk, then our signal sort of started to die so I decided it was a good point to end the conversation.  We said our goodbyes and it was done.

So, timing is in her hands.  I have a much more open schedule than her, being unemployed and just done with midterms (so very little work is being doled out yet).  I don't know if I like things so nebulous, or the timing of the first date so far out of my power, but I didn't see what else I could do.

It all sounds good, though.  I believed her when she said she wanted to meet up -- I make her laugh, we have good conversations, plus there was the physical chemistry, of course.  I don't know if there are other guys she's dating right now or not, nor do I really care yet, because technically I'm not dating her yet.

Ugh.  Drama.  Logically everything looks fine, but dammit, I'm still nervous.  gg human condition.
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« Reply #26 on: October 17, 2005, 01:27:24 PM »

I would be very encouraged by this LE. Just take everything at face value. She likes you (she phoned you twice AND made sure you knew she really did want to see you again)

Congrats! and try not to overthink/overanalyze things in the days to come...

All the best, man!
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« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2005, 01:38:44 PM »

Quote
My stomach sinks at that, it's a cop-out I've heard before.

Don't read too much into it.  A girl can just be busy. smile
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« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2005, 02:52:54 PM »

Quote from: "Knightshade Dragon"
Quote
My stomach sinks at that, it's a cop-out I've heard before.

Don't read too much into it.  A girl can just be busy. smile


I think you may have forgotten to type the word "gettin'" before the word "busy".  :wink:
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« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2005, 05:19:50 PM »

If there's one thing I could suggest, it's not to leave the "call" in her hands. If she's busy, has a tough schedule, let her know she can call whenever, but ask when you can call back. That's actually the only "phone game" nonsense that has truth to it: don't let the calling be one-sided. You're going to be thinking about her all week, and hopefully she'll be thinking the same, but you can't leave it all in her hands. If you can. Hell, even tell her you'll call at a certain time, and if she's there for it, kind of sets the time aside, it's a good sign, and you get to have a brief "phone date".

Ahh, whatever. Just do what you think's right.
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« Reply #30 on: October 18, 2005, 02:45:25 AM »

If she was interested she would make time.
Saying that stuff about being busy for 2 weeks is just her playing you and seeing how much leash she can keep you on. Wants to see how desperate you are. No matter how you play it off, it is not a good sign.
Working 30 hours a week is nothing. Leaves plenty of time. Those other "projects" are other leashes she has out there.
If she was truly interested she would make time.
Spank it and move on.
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« Reply #31 on: October 18, 2005, 03:15:15 AM »

Quote from: "stimpy"
If she was interested she would make time.
Saying that stuff about being busy for 2 weeks is just her playing you and seeing how much leash she can keep you on. Wants to see how desperate you are. No matter how you play it off, it is not a good sign.
Working 30 hours a week is nothing. Leaves plenty of time. Those other "projects" are other leashes she has out there.
If she was truly interested she would make time.
Spank it and move on.
If she wasn't interested, I don't think she would have bothered to call back.  Twice.  Fuck, I doubt she'd have bothered to do anything in the first place.

I don't understand the ubermachismo bullshit rhetoric of "if she's not your bitch by the end of the night, jerk off and move on."  That smacks of insecure men who were sexually molested as children, not guys in successful relationships.

Also, a newsflash: both men and women are known to date more than one person at a time.  It's standard practice.

I'm welcome to negative opinions, but please, try not to let them be this full of shit.
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« Reply #32 on: October 18, 2005, 03:34:47 AM »

Quote from: "-Lord Ebonstone-"
I don't understand the ubermachismo bullshit rhetoric of "if she's not your bitch by the end of the night"


At what point did I say this or imply it?
What I said was, her saying she was too busy to see you cause she works 30 hours a week is bullshit. Dont kid yourself. Any relationship that is gonna work will include effort, concessions and sacrifices by both parties, if both parties want it. Her reluctance to make time in the near future to spend time with you is either a stall tactic or a game she is playing. You want to wait around and find out which it is, feel free. I think you took my comment about spanking it and moving on too literal.


And I think my wife/girlfriend of 16 years would consider our relationship quite succesful. And the fact that I first fucked her while we were both 17 technically means I was molested as a child. You should be so lucky.
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« Reply #33 on: October 18, 2005, 03:50:47 AM »

Quote from: "stimpy"
What I said was, her saying she was too busy to see you cause she works 30 hours a week is bullshit. Dont kid yourself.

I'd agree if that was the case, but as far as I understand it, it's not.  Read what I wrote again--she didn't say she was too busy to see me, she said her schedule was very hectic this week and she didn't know (on Sunday night at 12:30am) what a good time would be for her.

There's a big difference between "I'm too busy to see you" and "I'm really busy and don't yet know when specifically I can see you, but I do indeed want to."  The cynically minded might say the difference isn't that 'big' at all, but man, at this point, I'm open to taking her word for it.  She's not wronged me yet.  She's not stood me up, or held back, or done anything to make me think she's disinterested.  I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt, for now.  Of course, if a week or so passes and we haven't done anything together, then it's safe to wonder.  But right now?  I don't think there's a basis for it.

Quote
Any relationship that is gonna work will include effort, concessions and sacrifices by both parties, if both parties want it. Her reluctance to make time in the near future to spend time with you is either a stall tactic or a game she is playing. You want to wait around and find out which it is, feel free.

Well, two things with this:

1.)  We're not in a relationship, nor are we even close to one.  We have yet to even begin dating, after all.

2.)  Again, I'd agree with you if that were the case, but I don't think it was 'reluctance.'  I'm worried that it could be, but logically, the facts don't point toward that.  I think she means what she says, which was basically, yeah, I want to do something with you, but let's talk about it later this week.

Quote
I think you took my comment about spanking it and moving on too literal.

I just think it's a piss-poor attitude to have.  If you meant it as a joke, yes, I overreacted and I apologize.

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And I think my wife/girlfriend of 16 years would consider our relationship quite succesful. And the fact that I first fucked her while we were both 17 technically means I was molested as a child. You should be so lucky.
I was exactly that lucky, actually.  That's the girl I just got out of the four-year headtrip with.
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depward
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« Reply #34 on: October 18, 2005, 09:00:46 AM »

No need to argue, women are confusing, you can hardly predict what the heck they ever mean whenever they do/say something, so just go with it and see what happens.
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CrayolaSmoker
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« Reply #35 on: October 18, 2005, 10:59:20 AM »

Quote from: "stimpy"
Working 30 hours a week is nothing. Leaves plenty of time. Those other "projects" are other leashes she has out there.


I'm willing to bet those other "projects" are just that, projects.  For school (she's a fashion design major).  Having been an art major at one point in time, I can attest that the homework and projects will absolutely murderize your shedule.  Add a job for 30 hours a week and your free time is practically nonexistent.

LE, it's possible she's jerking you around.  But right now you have no evidence that it's probable.  Stick to trusting her and seeing where it goes.
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Ralph-Wiggum
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« Reply #36 on: October 18, 2005, 12:27:29 PM »

Quote from: "CrayolaSmoker"


Stick to thrusting her and seeing where it goes.


 :shock:

No, seriously, don't listen to stimpy. If she hasn't made time to go out by two weeks, then you know something's up. But until that time, seems like everything's good.
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Dafones
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« Reply #37 on: October 18, 2005, 02:43:52 PM »

Yeah dude, a 30 hour work week on top of a full school schedule is a pretty busy life. That would make it hard to start up a new relationship. I don't think it's b.s. on her part, especially if she's not a first year student (I remember my "fun time" decreasing drastically each progressing year of Uni.)

Don't get too antsy, or too nervous. I remember a girl that I dated briefly in university that also had a really busy schedule. I thought she was blowing me off, took it personally, and stopped trying. Ran into her later and she asked what the hell happened. I asked the same thing. She really was just busy, and hadn't been dodging me. By then it was too late, and I'd blown it, because I was ... I don't know, insecure? Doubtful? Pissed off even? Whatever. Bottom line is I should have been more patient, and trusted my gut that she was interested, especially considering that I was busy too. Made me feel like an idiot. She was cool too. Damn, now I feel bad.

So just chill, LE. Don't get too worked up about it.
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Ascendent
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« Reply #38 on: October 18, 2005, 03:20:49 PM »

Best thing I can tell you if she likes you she'll make time. I don't know about the rest of the guys here but if I like someone then no matter what I'm doing I'd make time for them maybe a phone call, email, quick lunch and/or dinner. My gf has a super busy schedule but she gets up extra early just to come over and get in bed with me and it's nice. But trust your judgement in this, your the one that has to live with the consequences not us.

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Zekester
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« Reply #39 on: October 18, 2005, 05:32:38 PM »

Where there's a will, there's a way.

And I don't think it's "ubermachismo bullshit rhetoric" at all.......there are many men here that do have experience at this and are trying to keep you out of trouble, LE.
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