Star Wars: The Old Republic announced

[Blackjack]

Brief F2P Q&A
http://www.swtor.com/blog/community-qa-free-play-edition

[Greggy_D]

I'm glad it's going ftp.  I'll go back and finish up some storylines.  I just had a really hard time justifying paying $15 a month for it.

I'm with ya.  I could see paying $5-$7 a month, but sure as hell not $15.

Which makes you wonder....why not offer a $5 a month price point before going F2P?

[Blackjack]

I'm glad it's going ftp.  I'll go back and finish up some storylines.  I just had a really hard time justifying paying $15 a month for it.

I'm with ya.  I could see paying $5-$7 a month, but sure as hell not $15.

Which makes you wonder....why not offer a $5 a month price point before going F2P?

Thing is, that's been the norm ($14.99/mo.), I believe going back to Everquest in 1999, perhaps Ultima Online in 1997. You can look at as nearly $180 a year and be outraged although most people I know burn that much in cellphone bills in maybe two months. Or look at it as 50 cents a day to play something you're addicted to and find it a bargain.

With me I either love the game and the fees don't bother me (as they didn't with SWTOR and Rift for a few months each), or I hit a wall, burnout, fall out of love with the game and even if goes F2P, I just don't care anymore. Many games I had the hots for when they were subscription games (AoC, Champions, STO, LOTRO, CoX until its upcoming demise, and now SWTOR) switched to F2P but by that point no longer interested me. I think a lot of folks are like that now with the genre.

There were certainly F2P's (mostly in Asia) before Turbine/Warner Bros. took Dungeons and Dragons, and then LOTRO into F2), but imho, that's what really got the ball rolling. I just don't see F2P as a license to print money. It's working enough for a few companies to survive, basically, but many of those doing it are probably surviving more because of a deep pockets partner (Warner Bros. for Turbine; Asia-based Perfect World Entertainment for Cryptic Studios; and now EA for Bioware [yeah I know they're joined at the hip]).

=========
Back to SWTOR-specific news -- lead designer Daniel Erickson goes "bye bye" via his Twitter account (and it's clear from the message he's probably not leaving because he has some hot job lined up)

https://twitter.com/DanielAErickson/status/253549613351567360

As part of leaving BioWare I'm officially starting a twitter account for job hunt and design thoughts.

[rshetts2]

I think "burnout" is pretty endemic to the MMO genre as a whole now.  WoW hit the perfect window and basically milked it for as long as it could.  Theres really no chance for any MMO to repeat that without something truly innovative and different brought to the table.  GW2 has done well but it too is the same old thing.  Sure it has some slight differences in questing mechanics but they still boil down to kill that, get this etc.  I dont know if it will take a change in tech on the level of virtual reality or what but it looks like, at this point, MMO's have peaked and are in a rut.  Until then it looks like they are going to dangle FTP to hook subscribers and then try to micro-transaction the hell out of their wallets.  Of course, after seeing how quickly Diablo 3 fell off peoples gaming priorities, perhaps the issue isnt just MMOs but PC/Console gaming in general.  It seems that the entire gaming industry is going through a remarkable lack of innovation.

[Razgon]

I'm glad it's going ftp.  I'll go back and finish up some storylines.  I just had a really hard time justifying paying $15 a month for it.

I'm with ya.  I could see paying $5-$7 a month, but sure as hell not $15.

Which makes you wonder....why not offer a $5 a month price point before going F2P?

Thing is, that's been the norm ($14.99/mo.), I believe going back to Everquest in 1999, perhaps Ultima Online in 1997. You can look at as nearly $180 a year and be outraged although most people I know burn that much in cellphone bills in maybe two months. Or look at it as 50 cents a day to play something you're addicted to and find it a bargain.

With me I either love the game and the fees don't bother me (as they didn't with SWTOR and Rift for a few months each), or I hit a wall, burnout, fall out of love with the game and even if goes F2P, I just don't care anymore. Many games I had the hots for when they were subscription games (AoC, Champions, STO, LOTRO, CoX until its upcoming demise, and now SWTOR) switched to F2P but by that point no longer interested me. I think a lot of folks are like that now with the genre.

There were certainly F2P's (mostly in Asia) before Turbine/Warner Bros. took Dungeons and Dragons, and then LOTRO into F2), but imho, that's what really got the ball rolling. I just don't see F2P as a license to print money. It's working enough for a few companies to survive, basically, but many of those doing it are probably surviving more because of a deep pockets partner (Warner Bros. for Turbine; Asia-based Perfect World Entertainment for Cryptic Studios; and now EA for Bioware [yeah I know they're joined at the hip]).

=========
Back to SWTOR-specific news -- lead designer Daniel Erickson goes "bye bye" via his Twitter account (and it's clear from the message he's probably not leaving because he has some hot job lined up)

https://twitter.com/DanielAErickson/status/253549613351567360

As part of leaving BioWare I'm officially starting a twitter account for job hunt and design thoughts.

Turbine aren't surviving due to deep pockets of Warner - They are surviving because both DDO and LOTRO actually makes a decent profit. Warner is not in the habit of having companies that arent making money survive.

[metallicorphan]

F2P Restrictions

New features and restrictions are as follows:

-Three Flashpoints per week
-Three Warzones per week
-Three Space Missions per week
-The option to buy a weekly premium pass
-Inventory expansion and cargo hold restrictions
-Field revivals upon death are restricted
-Character creation restrictions
-Limited quick travel
-Restrictions on login wait time

Video in the link

[Blackjack]

F2P launches next Thursday (Nov. 15). I wish I cared enough to want to re-activate or even re-subscribe but... I don't.  

I find it sad to remember how unbelievably excited most of us here were about the game exactly one year ago, and how for a couple months it got me in trouble at work cause I'd play it all night and then all morning. 

[Arclight]

Yeah, amazing how it goes with some games. It starts out like a wonderful glass of high quality bubbly, only to become a mug of sour vinegar in record time.

Like the old punch drunk boxer once said: "I coulda been a contender".............To bad SWToR didn't make it through the first round. 

[Roguetad]

If the Preferred Status FTP experience isn't too obnoxious, I'd like to finish up a couple of my storylines.  From what I've read, I have to choose 2 of my characters, and the rest will be locked in their FTP model.  It sounds like they will let players keep and use all of the upgrades and items they purchased as a subscriber.  If that's the case, it might be ok for just experiencing the class stories.

[rshetts2]

I believe that MMO's are in trouble these days FTP or not.  Theyve milked the basic concept and even games that try to be a bit different like GW2 turn out to be the same old thing with a new coat of paint.   I enjoyed SWTOR and finished the class quest for the infiltrator but I have no real urge to return to the game.  GW2 is suffering the same fate.  Its already starting to get barren in the world.  One of the nice innovations, the open world events are not doable in a lot of cases because theres just no one around to join in. I really think they need to find something new to draw people to MMOs or they will start to fade away.  I dont know if its an advancement in tech that they need for more immersion into the game world or that they just need to find a whole new formula for MMOs but its clear that something needs to change.

[Roguetad]

I tried out the FTP model last night.  All of my characters had been moved onto 1 server.  I was told I needed to rename those with red warning signs next to their names...which was pretty much all of them.  After spending about 15 minutes trying to find names that hadn't already been chosen, I logged in with my highest level character (lvl 40 bounty hunter).  A pop up screen letting me know that I am a preferred status player welcomed me, but also pointed out what I was missing compared to subscribers.  The option to subscribe was flashing.  I closed that message and finally saw my bounty hunter, just where I left him months ago. 

He was waiting for me with 1 action bar, the other 3 bars were gone.  Preferred players get 2 bars, which I was able to load back up because my UI preferences were saved.  If you don't have saved preferences you can select the one named "Extended Actionbars" or something like that.  There's now a big Cartel Coin store icon front and top center, just in case I forgot this was FTP. 

I was happy to see that he still had access to his speeders, so no issues there.  The game let me know that only subscribers get rest XP from cantinas, so when I logoff I should just go outside in the snow.  The single player content seemed just like it was before.  But it was hard to go back to after playing GW2.  I prefer the much faster pace and movement of GW2's combat system. 

The perferred status faqs say I'm limited to just 2 characters, but I was able to login with all of my characters last night.  It must be a grace period thing. 

The biggest thumbs down from me is the XP gain penalty that FTP/Preferred players have of -25%.  Give subscribers a boost to XP gain, but don't penalize the FTP crowd.  Another thumbs down  is the performance of the SWTOR engine.  GW2 looks much better and plays smoother.

[Gratch]

Tried to login into Origin to give the F2P model a shot last night.  It's tells me my password is incorrect.  I click on the "forgot password" link, enter my email, and it says a password reset e-mail has been sent. Don't receive an e-mail, try it a couple more times, wait an hour, still nothing. Go to their support website to find out why I'm not getting the e-mail and find out what I can do to get it reset.

In order to submit a support ticket or ask any sort of question, I have to be logged in to my account which requires...the password. That I don't have.

:sigh:

[Gratch]

Got my log-in issues straightened out and fired up SW: TOR this afternoon.  After a couple hours, I came to conclusion that going back to other MMO's is going to be awfully difficult after spending so much time with GW2.  Just the idea of non-shared kills is a really tough adjustment to make.

[Covenant]

Got my log-in issues straightened out and fired up SW: TOR this afternoon.  After a couple hours, I came to conclusion that going back to other MMO's is going to be awfully difficult after spending so much time with GW2.  Just the idea of non-shared kills is a really tough adjustment to make.

I believe LOTRO has already adapted by adding this feature to the game.

[metallicorphan]

Eurogamer have re-reviewed this game

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-26-star-wars-the-old-republic-re-review

Spoiler for Hiden:

4/10

[Teggy]

They give scores other than 7?

[Gratch]

Eurogamer have re-reviewed this game

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-26-star-wars-the-old-republic-re-review

Spoiler for Hiden:

4/10

Pretty accurate assessment, I'd say.  I leveled a Sith character to 11 over the weekend, and was amazed at how boring it all felt.  Maybe it's just that my paradigm has shifted after exposure to better MMO's, but it all felt incredibly dull.  I do still like the more significant focus on storytelling, but everything outside of that was very 'meh'.

[PR_GMR]

Eurogamer have re-reviewed this game

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-26-star-wars-the-old-republic-re-review

Spoiler for Hiden:

4/10

Pretty accurate assessment, I'd say.  I leveled a Sith character to 11 over the weekend, and was amazed at how boring it all felt.  Maybe it's just that my paradigm has shifted after exposure to better MMO's, but it all felt incredibly dull.  I do still like the more significant focus on storytelling, but everything outside of that was very 'meh'.

A shame, but true. Bioware just copied Wow so much. The 'theme park' paradigm they followed for the game was very boring. When I played, I literally could see the rails I was following. I barely put in 6 hours before I unsubscribed. I don't think I would play for free either.

[Covenant]

They give scores other than 7?

Only when the review is meaningless; if you look back at their original review, it was a solid 8.  Hell, according to metacritic it didn't receive less than a 7 anywhere.

[Roguetad]

I agree with the "re-reviewer's" thoughts on the FTP model.  It's like they implemented an anti free player FTP model. 

[Gratch]

I agree with the "re-reviewer's" thoughts on the FTP model.  It's like they implemented an anti free player FTP model. 

There's a huge message that pops up once you've hit level 10 that basically says "You're completely gimped in this game unless you pay us a monthly fee.  Good luck!"  It's actually quite funny how blatant they are about it.

[Soulchilde]

I logged in over the weekend...  ran around the station and logged off.  Deleted the game from my hard drive


Sad I was excited for this game...   I'll stick with Guild Wars 2 for my MMO at the present

[Arclight]

If you didn't like the game enough to keep a subscription, you certainly aren't going to like the free to play model.
Although I played the game a ton at first, yes I can proudly display "founder" above my nogging, I quit when GW2 came out.

But guys come on, you get to play the game through all the class story lines. And the vo's and story lines were always the main strength of the game.
It might not be as good as GW2 and its FTP model, but it is most certainly worth the price of the game for first time players. In my opinion you get tons more content than a single player game for the same price.

Free is free. You can't compare it to the subscription model. Apples and pears.

[ericb]

Not all that recent but it's not posted here so more info:

Hi everyone!

As you know, we take player feedback very seriously and we wanted to take this opportunity to thank you all for being a part of our Free-to-Play transition.

When Game Update 1.5 was on PTS, we heard your feedback and increased Quickbars for Free-to-Play Players, increased Warzones from three to five per week, and reduced the Cartel Coin temporary bind.

We want to let you know that we are constantly listening to you folks, and we’ve heard your feedback regarding limited Quickbars for Preferred Status Players.

This is why, after an upcoming patch that is scheduled for next week, Preferred Status Players will be given two additional Quickbars (for a total of four) that will immediately improve their gameplay experience.

We’ll have more details for you – including information for Preferred Status Players that have already purchased extra Quickbars - once the change goes live.

Thanks again for your feedback and please continue to provide it for us!

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=5477407#edit5477407

[Blackjack]

I logged in over the weekend...  ran around the station and logged off.  Deleted the game from my hard drive

Sad I was excited for this game...   I'll stick with Guild Wars 2 for my MMO at the present

C'mon bud. I mean, you wouldn't cancel various MMOs because the first half hour was banging on rats and mice, right? 

My memory is foggy but for me the sweet spot in SWTOR was probably somewheres around L10 to L35 or so. Once you get your class tree delineated into specialties, get a speeder, have enough places to go, there's some more variety in mission lines to follow etc.

What lost me later on is many of the later zones just didn't seem as interesting to me as Tatooine, Hoth and some earlier areas. I don't think it was an accident that the areas I remembered from various SW movies were the most fun, and later ones I never heard of just felt drab.

I loved playing as smuggler. Ultimately I just didn't really get into any of the other classes that much, and being a jedi just wasn't quite as much fun as I hoped. I still think a more interesting light saber "fighting mechanic," maybe akin to AoC's key combos, might've made using light sabers more fun.

And I think ultimately the whole ridiculous mmorpg gameplay mechanics that a server based game require -- i.e., a so-called AI that "responds" to you on proximity, chases you X distance, then goes back to its starting point  -- over the years just grated on me.

I mean, it's 13 years past Everquest, most players have broadband now, yet the mmorpg gameplay mechanics are largely still "plop groups of 3 enemies here and there, and maybe an occasional group to 'patrol.'" And players either engage groups one by one, or try to sneak past them. That's about it.

Is it just not possible to change that up? That's why I'm out of mmorpgs.

[Blackjack]

Digital expansion announced! ($19.99, or $9.99 for current subscribers):

Rise of the Hutt Cartel
http://www.swtor.com/rothc?intcmp=sor_bwa-mkt-t-us-rhp-004

The first Digital Expansion for The Old Republic™ introduces an aggressive new enemy threatening the future of the galaxy: the Hutt Cartel

    Experience 5 new levels, including story-driven missions, as the level cap increases to 55!
    Face-off against a frightening new enemy when you battle the nefarious Hutt Cartel.
    The fate of the new planet Makeb is at stake... and in your hands.
    Stay tuned for more information coming soon - Over the next few months we will reveal more exciting new features!

Who's excited! Does anyone care? ... Me neither...

[Crawley]

Well they priced it right for what it seems to include - which isn't much. But I don't think this is going to rejuvenate the game.

[Knightshade Dragon]

Oddly enough, I'm playing again.   I never finished the storylines, and that's what I'm there for.  I've revived the guild (character name "Wrathfulness" on Ebon Hawk) and I'm slowly cranking through the Sith Sorc line.   Going F2P has put enough bodies in play to get through some of the latter planets (when I got to Alderan the first time I was LITERALLY the only person on the rock!) and the Flashpoints are usually busy enough.   It may not set the world on fire, but I think there is still some meat on the bones.

[Teggy]

I have an unused 60 day card that I never used that sits on my shelf and laughs at me. Maybe I should buy the expansion and use the card for whatever perks it gives (which would include the option of lady Jedi love on Makeb I guess)

[Knightshade Dragon]

I have an unused 60 day card that I never used that sits on my shelf and laughs at me. Maybe I should buy the expansion and use the card for whatever perks it gives.

Being a subscriber is kinda cool.  You move faster, level faster, and get a ton of perks.  They clearly stacked the deck towards subs, which makes sense when you think about it. 

[USMC Kato]

I have an unused 60 day card that I never used that sits on my shelf and laughs at me. Maybe I should buy the expansion and use the card for whatever perks it gives (which would include the option of lady Jedi love on Makeb I guess)

Yeah I still have an unused 60 day card,  might hop in at some point

[CeeKay]

I'm probably going to start playing again in May once spring semester is over.