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Author Topic: Star Wars: The Old Republic announced  (Read 126968 times)
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StewMeat
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« Reply #2040 on: November 29, 2011, 06:34:29 AM »

More insite from a long time tester, this weekend a friend of mine was in, we fired up Vent and played a Sage and a Guardian through lvl 18-19.
I have played both classes solo and with my fellow testers before, but with our group dynamic, coordination, my knowledge of the game and my friends fresh enthusiasm, it was like a new experience.
We were able to run some 4 man Heroics with very coordinated companion tactics with great success, follow each others storyline and class quests as though we were going through it in a real situation, definately the way to go.
I saw plenty of weekend testers claim jumping, filling the chat with ignorant, baseless opinions, obvious hate and bias and in general the sort of stuff you would expect from people who have no intention of buying or playing this title.
I also noticed alot of people wrapped up in their characters, asking legitimet questions and all in all having a blast, so I think many role players will agree that your personal story sells this game.
I paid zero attention to my level while playing except for the purpose of training, gear adjustment, companions and introducing my friend to his Deffender class star ship. At no point did I or my buddy feel compeled to rush trough, skip quests or power level, I never heard a word about it.
Plenty of conversation on the "next move", tactics and lightside, darkside chatter, but no spacebar skipping, and that tells me I wont be alone at release. I firmly believe those actions are symptoms of a broken format that sadly are addressed by other developers slathering on sillyness to mask it, SWTOR will be a huge success, wow killer? dont know dont care, but it will have a substantial following of real rpg fans and those are the folks I wana adventure with.
I'll take the role players, haters can have the pandas.
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« Reply #2041 on: November 29, 2011, 12:33:15 PM »

I ultimately got my Jedi Knight up to class 11, and then fired up a bounty hunter and got her up to level 6 before I had to leave the game off. Normally in games like these I stick to good characters. Playing evil has never felt right. I think part of the issue is that I refuse some quests because there is no reason a bad guy would do it. "You want me to save your village, what's it worth to you? You don't have anything to give as a reward? Piss off." Then I start thinking of the lost experience, and I go back and accept the quest anyway. I don't have this issue too often as a good guy. It's rare to get a mission where you are asked to straight up murder someone for no good reason. Usually there is some lame excuse that at least gets you to go talk to the target. Oddly enough, the only games I ever finished as an evil character were KOTOR 1 and 2. So maybe I'll be able to work my way through some of the evil storylines.

Grouping was easy to do, even for someone like me who is hesitant to even bother people on his friends list with a game invite. I grouped up in the Heroic Area's, and they were a lot of fun. The only downside was I couldn't get into a group conversation. I think my random partner started the conversation solo rather than waiting for me to join. I would have liked to experience that aspect of the game, so that was annoying. There was also a Flashpoint that I passed on with my Jedi Knight character because I didn't feel like going through the trouble of getting into a group, and I'm kind of kicking myself for not getting to see that aspect of the game.

I even tried PVP for a match. I saw the comments here that said it made it almost unplayable on their systems, so I assumed I was in for a bad experience, but I didn't notice any slowdown in performance. Maybe it was just a non-issue for me, but I'm assuming that my normal system performance is borderline unplayable for everyone else.  icon_lol

The only thing keeping me from pre-ordering this game is money. I spent a lot of money in October/November, and now work is slow and I'm staying home because there is nothing to do. Between two holiday days last week, and being told to stay home yesterday and today, I'm out 4 days of pay.  crybaby
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Blackjack
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« Reply #2042 on: November 29, 2011, 01:58:49 PM »

Re: Stewmeat's observations, I am hopeful the early access/launch audience will have more chat about the game itself and less about WoW or well, chat about everything but this game. I saw signs of that last night just before beta was ending. People were truly, albeit mostly good naturedly, upset about stress test ending. They talked about how much fun they were having, how mid December couldn't come fast enough. Someone even joked, "There's too much optimism here!"  icon_smile

The sad thing is -- if chat has to be about comparisons about other games -- is no other mmorpgs are ever mentioned. The Advanced Classes and the format of the Flashpoints remind me quite a bit of things I liked in Tabula Rasa. The class quests remind me a bit of the class-oriented quests and storytelling (albeit not voiced) in LOTRO. STO's upcoming Duty Officer system has a few things in common with the companions in terms of sending them off on their own little missions although duty officers is a "higher volume" type thing. I played WoW maybe 3 weeks around the time it launched, so when I have to resort to comparisons, I at least reference something else and my comparisons are more just interesting observations. icon_smile

You can create custom chat channels (a la Cryptic's MMOs), but these don't show up on any sort of "master list" afik, so nobody even knows it's there unless you tell someone. I hope they consider adding some sort of "custom chat channel" list. I've suggested an LFG chat channel. They have a separate Trading channel so I figure that's not a big stretch.

One of the feedback forms inline asks you "how you got your group together," so I like to think they'll consider some sort of more specific LFG function. I realize you can turn on a "LFG tag" in the list but how many people ever bother to look at that at all? My groups mainly came from hollering in general chat or pestering people near the entrance to a Heroic instance. In a really busy zone, your LFG messages in General Chat scroll out of view in 2 seconds, so that's why I'd still favor a channel specific to it. Though if they don't, I'll live.  icon_smile
« Last Edit: November 29, 2011, 02:06:58 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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« Reply #2043 on: November 29, 2011, 02:30:09 PM »

I noticed something funny at the end of the first flashpoint. Actually my entire group did, and our chats poked fun at it. Many a laugh was had. So I wonder if anyone else saw:

Spoiler for Hiden:
The cruiser went into hyperspace and the crew cheered Hoorray! We got away! Only to find the Empire ship still there in the viewscreen and still firing on us. We could even hear the ships blaster bolts in the background. So our chats went something like:

"Turn around, you foolish fool! They are still in front of us!
"Credits, shmedits. How can I spend this reward when the Empire ship is still attacking?"
"Um, does anyone else see the big bad ship on the viewscreen?"

 icon_lol
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« Reply #2044 on: November 29, 2011, 02:32:08 PM »

Quote from: Blackjack on November 29, 2011, 01:58:49 PM

I played WoW maybe 3 weeks around the time it launched, so when I have to resort to comparisons, I at least reference something else and my comparisons are more just interesting observations. icon_smile

How about asking them if they've played anything else besides WoW? I bet you dollars to donuts they haven't. Heck, in that list you mentioned I only played STO and haven't followed it since I dropped six months after launch. So I have no comparison other than WOW.
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« Reply #2045 on: November 29, 2011, 03:47:25 PM »

Quote from: raydude on November 29, 2011, 02:32:08 PM

Quote from: Blackjack on November 29, 2011, 01:58:49 PM

I played WoW maybe 3 weeks around the time it launched, so when I have to resort to comparisons, I at least reference something else and my comparisons are more just interesting observations. icon_smile

How about asking them if they've played anything else besides WoW? I bet you dollars to donuts they haven't. Heck, in that list you mentioned I only played STO and haven't followed it since I dropped six months after launch. So I have no comparison other than WOW.
That's my point.  icon_smile I just wish people would at least try other mmorpgs when they get the chance -- many of course are now F2P (including LOTRO, AoC and soon STO), and others offer free trials on occasion. Though certainly if people have no other frame of reference, I don't blame them for constantly bringing that up. icon_smile For a few years I thought City of Heroes was my WoW (i.e., the only mmorpg I would ever play), but LOTRO won me over and I tried many things the last few years.

Many other mmorpgs, even the failed ones, have done very interesting, innovative or refreshing things, and I think discussions would get more interesting and diverse instead of beginning and ending with "This is just like WoW," "This kicks WoW's ass!" and "WoW does all these things better." I'd tab away from the SWTOR general chat when it turned into that.

Although I find that unappealing, I enjoy chatting about "hey this reminds me of X feature from that game, remember it?", and I quite like that SWTOR has a few features I liked from other games in one package.  icon_smile Or even, "This feature in SWTOR is OK, but maybe if they handled it like in X game it would even be cooler." That's even something one could submit as beta feedback.
===========
I know from the fact they've improved the game's chat system so much since my previous weekend chat, including clickable items in chat (I believe it's SHIFT/Click on an item to do that), that Bioware does listen. Gives me much hope for the future, even if every little feature I want probably won't be there at launch.
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« Reply #2046 on: November 29, 2011, 05:22:48 PM »

Seriously good breaking news -- if you participated in this past weekend's stress test, you won't have to re-download the client for Early Game Access/Launch (they'll just patch that up):
http://www.darthhater.com/articles/swtor-news/19730-thanksgiving-beta-game-client-will-patch-to
Quote
Stephen Reid confirmed via Twitter that the Star Wars: The Old Republic testers from the Thanksgiving Beta Weekend will be able to be patch their game client for Early Game Access and Release. As such, players should keep their game installation in tact on their computers.

For players who tested the game prior to November 25th, however, Mr. Reid recommends a clean installation of the game client.

Read on for the direct quotes from Stephen Reid.
Twitter Update

   Stephen Reid
    FAQ: if you played this weekend you do NOT need to uninstall the #SWTOR client. We are planning to patch it to Early Game Access / Live.

    Stephen Reid
    If you played before this weekend we will recommend a reinstall just to clean up, but otherwise no.
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« Reply #2047 on: November 29, 2011, 05:38:00 PM »

I guess that would have been a reason to at least download this weekend. Oh well.
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« Reply #2048 on: November 29, 2011, 08:29:15 PM »

I had participated in one weekend before this last weekend.  I launched that client and it downloaded what seemed like the whole thing again.  It didn't seem like it installed in a whole other directory, but in the exact same one, which I would assume means it overwrote the files.  I played just fine this weekend.  Makes me wonder if I should uninstall just in case.
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Blackjack
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« Reply #2049 on: November 29, 2011, 08:30:43 PM »

Quote from: Teggy on November 29, 2011, 05:38:00 PM

I guess that would have been a reason to at least download this weekend. Oh well.
If you got into the stress test but didn't bother to play, I'd definitely check if the client downloader/installer link is still working.
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« Reply #2050 on: November 29, 2011, 08:41:56 PM »

there's a folder called retail your star wars directory, totally knew this was coming.

So I'm quite shocked the bioware seems to be ignoring the UI complaints. I honestly expected there to be something different given the few months apart from the last weekend i tested.

It is near impossible to heal in pvp. They still put the frames way off the left, this draws your focus out of the action and to the side of your monitor. Healing frames should always, ALWAYS be in the middle, or at least have the fucking option to move things around. Which is another point. let me move my ui. The healing frames are also delayed. They do not update in real time. There's no indication where people are relative to you. You just get a message, that you'll miss because you aren't looking there, that says not in line of sight. Or maybe there's arrows, but again, you'll looking to the far left. This means you miss the hoard of people running to you. By the time you see them, it's too late. There's also no indication you're low on mana/energy until you try to heal and you're wondering why you aren't casting. Could also be solved by MOVING THE DAMN BARS TO THE CENTER.

I honestly feel this UI is going to turn off so many healers. It's not even close to be functional. The fixes are simple enough they could be in before retail.

Since I leveled one char this time I got to just shy of 18. I stopped sorta late sunday because I played what I wanted to do and skyrim was calling again. I played a smuggler this time around and it was fairly fun. The gun play was so-so. It didn't feel as exciting as a force wielder, almost like a turn base game where we trade shots. I obviously went with the healing AC, scoundrel I think. My only healing experience was PvP. I didn't do any flashpoints because I want my ship. Because of the energy method of healing I think they may struggle in flashpoints if there's a crap ton of AE damage. So hopefully they stay from the blizzard method of thinking healers love this and it adds difficulty(hint: we don't and it doesn't). They should be boss healers in raids and pvp keeping 1 or 2 tanks alive. Then again, I could be wrong because hey, no one is at level cap and have done the raids.

What does this game do right? quite a few things. The addition of fleshed out stories for one. Some of these, given bioware's recent writing, are quite good. Others hit or miss. The dark/light side choices are fairly good as well. I'm sure we've all experienced at least one so no need to dig deep. I messed around with crafting and actually quite like it. You just send your companion off to get mats and make the item. Once you get two, you can send one off and fight with the other. The pvp games were pretty fun.

This game though, it has issues. First a few graphic gripes. The textures are ugly. I understand they want a wide range of setups, but could ya least include a scale? It's like i get to choose between crap, or slightly less blurry crap. Not a big deal, but I like armor that does look semi good. Also, things are very blocky.
Judging from being a much higher level than previously, this game is very theme parkish. Things have their set themes and color pallets and that's what you get for the next 5 levels. Doing a quick glance at the later planets pretty much confirms you're on an on rails leveling experience, which means leveling an alt will seem booooring. The quests are also kill/collect. Though no one seems to have solved this. Oh but I have! Just do away with leveling already. It's dated, it's boring. Alas, I'll never have my true skill based game though.
The world is static and doesn't feel alive. NPCs just stand around. Hardly any move. There's a very surprising lack of ships flying overhead in coruscant. The world isn't populated much when you're out questing. In fact, I think it's a little too sparse in the open world
Space combat is on rails and very, very easy frown I hope we get an expansion with full blown space battles for pvp. If done right that would guarantee by 15 bucks for a long time.
Only 2 bars at the bottom for quick slots is not enough. Hotkeying your bars is cumbersome. here you go bioware, click a bind hotkey button, hover mouse over a button, click a key. Done. I have to navigate way too much to hotkey stuff

I'll still be picking this up. If anything a months time would be worth it. Though I hope there's some staying power. there's a very big been there, done that vibe, which is a by product of copying WoW too much.
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« Reply #2051 on: November 29, 2011, 08:53:40 PM »

Quote from: jersoc on November 29, 2011, 08:41:56 PM


It is near impossible to heal in pvp. They still put the frames way off the left, this draws your focus out of the action and to the side of your monitor. Healing frames should always, ALWAYS be in the middle, or at least have the fucking option to move things around. Which is another point. let me move my ui. The healing frames are also delayed. They do not update in real time. There's no indication where people are relative to you. You just get a message, that you'll miss because you aren't looking there, that says not in line of sight. Or maybe there's arrows, but again, you'll looking to the far left. This means you miss the hoard of people running to you. By the time you see them, it's too late. There's also no indication you're low on mana/energy until you try to heal and you're wondering why you aren't casting. Could also be solved by MOVING THE DAMN BARS TO THE CENTER.


Set your preferences to show operation frames as party frames, adjust size of health bars to your liking, unlock the panel and move where desired.

Couple vids with more details on party frames and target focusing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BujnSlyXhGs&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ip4hv8ca-aM&feature=related

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« Reply #2052 on: November 29, 2011, 09:27:37 PM »

Having never spent a lot of time in any previous mmos, I think it says a lot about this game that all I wanted to do today was jump back in and keep playing. Hopefully work picks up so I can afford to get this at launch.
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« Reply #2053 on: November 29, 2011, 10:15:45 PM »

I'm glad I had the opportunity to play from Sat-Mon, which I milked for as long as I could right up to the stress test server shutdown.  I'm really looking forward to the live game.  I was able to sample all of the classes I wanted, and experienced enough of the game to know I'll enjoy it. 

A lot of what has already been said about areas for improvement I agree with.  There's also a lot of good things too.  I felt like I was playing mmo Kotor, but with the option to play 4 different base classes per faction (8 advanced classes), each with their own voice over and story support.  All of the classes I played were fun.  I took Imperial Agent, Bounty Hunter and Sith Inquisitor to their advanced classes (Sniper, Mercenary and Assassin respectively).  I also sampled Sith Warrior, and a few levels of Trooper and Smuggler to hear the voice acting.  All were good. 

While I may not play one at release, Bioware hit a homerun with the Imperial Agent.  Everything is cool about that class.  They even seem a bit more powerful than the other classes I tried too.  Sniper is awesome.  I'm assuming the excellent gameplay is the same with the Smuggler?

Sith Inquisitor was cool.  I love the british accents for some of the Imperials.  I think if I go Inquisitor I will try Sorc instead of Assassin so I have the option to heal.

Sith Warrior was a 1 dimensional experience early on, but it was fun.  Warriors kick ass.  I'm assuming Jedi Knights do too.

I really liked the Bounty Hunter, and was impressed to see that it wasn't just mashing buttons.  Even by the low teens you have a lot of tools.  Plus...Death from Above every 90 seconds?  They did a nice job on the BH. 


 
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« Reply #2054 on: November 29, 2011, 11:08:20 PM »

Quote from: Roguetad on November 29, 2011, 10:15:45 PM

I'm assuming the excellent gameplay is the same with the Smuggler?
While I won't say the male smuggler is quite the young Harrison Ford, it's fun. A lot of the dialogue choices are funny, sarcastic or flirting, yet there's plenty of room to be a "nice guy" or to make pretty dark decisions if you want to.

Sometimes the brief choice "dialogue lines" are more entertaining than the "full dialogue" your character says.  icon_smile

Lots of tools in the weapons/gizmos department including some ability put a droid out of action for a while (Slicer), or knockback targets away from you. The Gunslinger tree also has a skill or two to add knockback to attacks that don't regularly have them (I would give that some thought if you play in groups a lot cause not every tank is crazy about knockback).

I wanted to try other classes but I really wanted to work up the class quests on the smuggler and get a ship and all that. I don't think I really spoiled things because I'd like to see how things shape up if I go Dark Side on everything next time.  icon_twisted

Speaking of which, on the Essen Flashpoint I...
Spoiler for Hiden:
finally won that conversation roll to send the ship's crew flying out the airlock! Bahahaha.
  icon_twisted
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« Reply #2055 on: November 29, 2011, 11:17:45 PM »

One thing I was pleased to see that I haven't seen mentioned is that once I hit level 10 I received a reward that allowed me to choose from several different companion "appearance" packs that completely changed the way my companion looked -- ethnicity, hairstyle, etc. -- so I saw less clone companions running around.  I was curious as to how they were going to do that.

So, I know that the Wanderers is starting a guild, but is GT also?  We should try to combine them.
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« Reply #2056 on: November 29, 2011, 11:54:20 PM »

Unfortunately, if you download the installer now, it requires an activated account to log in.
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« Reply #2057 on: November 30, 2011, 01:16:57 AM »

Quote from: Fez on November 29, 2011, 11:17:45 PM

So, I know that the Wanderers is starting a guild, but is GT also?  We should try to combine them.

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« Reply #2058 on: November 30, 2011, 01:33:14 AM »

Quote from: Fez on November 29, 2011, 11:17:45 PM

So, I know that the Wanderers is starting a guild, but is GT also?  We should try to combine them.

At least for Rift, Wanderers was on a PvP server, GT SWTOR guilds are on a PvE server.
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« Reply #2059 on: November 30, 2011, 02:47:28 AM »

you know, the banner add for this was reminding me of something, and I just figured out what it is:

the banner ad:



what it reminds me of:



now it can stop driving me crazy  icon_lol
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« Reply #2060 on: November 30, 2011, 03:40:31 AM »

Quote from: ydejin on November 30, 2011, 01:33:14 AM

Quote from: Fez on November 29, 2011, 11:17:45 PM

So, I know that the Wanderers is starting a guild, but is GT also?  We should try to combine them.

At least for Rift, Wanderers was on a PvP server, GT SWTOR guilds are on a PvE server.

From what I read over on the Wanderers boards, it seemed like people preferred PvE this time.  I'm kind of curious about what a PvP server would be like, as I didn't level a character high enough to get to a point where I was questing in an area with the opposite faction.  Anyone try it out in beta?
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« Reply #2061 on: November 30, 2011, 04:07:26 AM »

I mentioned finally winning that decision in Esseles Flashpoint. What's cool is seeing your character then do something -- in this case it's just a gesture, and a flip of a switch. I think I can share that much vaguely without spoiling anything. icon_smile It's kinda neat you can see (as in lower left corner here) how rest of the group voted:


Since we had one of each Republic class (jedi knight, jedi consular, smuggler, trooper), it was kind of a given the Jedis would go light side on everything. I don't remember how the trooper went. I'm usually a light side guy but really did want to try a couple dark side responses simply to see some different outcomes on my second go round. Folks still get whatever side points they chose.
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« Reply #2062 on: November 30, 2011, 04:32:47 AM »

Quote from: Blackjack on November 30, 2011, 04:07:26 AM

I mentioned finally winning that decision in Esseles Flashpoint. What's cool is seeing your character then do something -- in this case it's just a gesture, and a flip of a switch. I think I can share that much vaguely without spoiling anything. icon_smile It's kinda neat you can see (as in lower left corner here) how rest of the group voted:

About that:

Spoiler for Hiden:
As I recall, the other choice was to shut down the blahblahs yourself. Which was harder in that they were guarded by Imps, but then again, you'd get experience points and possible loot for killing them. Does the venting out the airlock give XP as well? Cause I'd hate to think a chance at getting XP could be spoiled by someone's lucky roll in group chat
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« Reply #2063 on: November 30, 2011, 05:31:55 AM »

Quote from: Fez on November 30, 2011, 03:40:31 AM

From what I read over on the Wanderers boards, it seemed like people preferred PvE this time.  I'm kind of curious about what a PvP server would be like, as I didn't level a character high enough to get to a point where I was questing in an area with the opposite faction.  Anyone try it out in beta?

I've leveled a 50 assassin (wiped) then a 43 sorc (wiped) and now a 50 sorc (not yet wiped, yay) all on the main general testing PvP server. There is no world PvP in SWTOR. There is almost no difference between a PvP server and a PvE server because they've designed the game specifically to discourage world PvP. You will not see anyone of the opposing faction that you can kill in a non-warzone setting until around level 25. Even then you'd probably have to go out of your way to find them, as the quest areas don't criss-cross very much. On my 43 sorc I did not cross paths with a republic player until level 41. On the 50 sorc I actually saw a couple on Tatooine in my late 20's, and then went actively looking for fights in my 30's on Alderaan.

There is a possibility for what one might call "griefing" in this game, but it is slim. When you die you can choose to rez at the cloner which takes you far away from the battle and to an area that is protected by guards that a 50 wouldn't bother with.
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« Reply #2064 on: November 30, 2011, 07:17:57 AM »

Dear Lord Cheeba - you have already levelled that many toons to near max?? Whats left for you to do in this game? And how quick did you do that?

I'm kinda curious - are you a hardcore player? I.e. do you go for max level as fast as possible and min-max gear and the like in order to get that many to that high a level?

I'm a bit concerned about staying power of the game as well. I can see it being fun for a month or two, but thats probably it.
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« Reply #2065 on: November 30, 2011, 07:53:49 AM »

World pvp is alive and well on pvp servers like Darth Malak, bearing in mind that until the last weekend surge there are simply not alot of folks to fight.
Out of the regular testers that are on the pvp servers, a large portion are heavily engaged in the venues that truely test and ballance the characters pvp abilities.
Coupled with the fact that folks are really exploring the games bounties and you dont see alot of "griefing" right now, that certainly doesn't warrant an absolutely false statement like "there is no world pvp in swtor".
I think the pvp will be very rich and is already quite good, it wont be an fps, and if folks are looking for a hop and pop shooter with t-bags and so on, this aint it, but all the ellements are absolutely 100% there for world pvp on the pvp servers.
Getting to level 50 is only endgame for your class story, and that's only until they release additional content. I would certainly hope people are smart enough to take the initiative and persue an area of the game they enjoy once they do hit 50, by then you should be fairly passionate about something you've experienced along the way.
I've said it before, anyone who tries to "powerlevel" through this game is missing the point and has likely made or is going to make a poorly informed purchase, it takes me many hours of playtime to bring one of my characters through the adventure Bioware has laid out and that's if I dont deviate by crafting, going pvp, doing the heroics or chassing down holocrons or just flying some missions.
I played Age of Conan for a time a desperately wanted to like that game, the content however was so thin that you ended up running out of ways to even progress, it just was not fun to play.
I played Shadowbane and was hooked on the character creation, the idea of truely building your own fighting machine of a character with runes and stats and crazy abilities, sadly the banes were not enough to keep a real fanbase and it went the way of the Dodo.
Galaxies was still born, a craftcentric mess with a leathal memory leak that left you in a slide show upon entering Corellia to get your doctor buffs so you could solo Krayt dragons. A shame because I liked ellements of it aswell, sadly every fix only made it more unpaletable and off the sony pass line up it went.
The list goes on, so there is the foundation for my excitement invested in this title, it's fun, it changes the old leveling diagram and rekindles the importance of the individual playing the game, without trying to smother you with cheesy, theme park, smoke and mirrors.
Compare or dont compare it to anything, I only use other games as a familiar refference and I dont regret my time playing Warcraft, it was fun, not perfect, not eternal, but fun. I like how SWTOR does things better and so Chuck Norris or not, I'm hanging up my leveling hat for awhile and playing my character.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 08:31:39 AM by StewMeat » Logged
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« Reply #2066 on: November 30, 2011, 08:01:55 AM »

Quote from: Razgon on November 30, 2011, 07:17:57 AM

Dear Lord Cheeba - you have already levelled that many toons to near max?? Whats left for you to do in this game? And how quick did you do that?

Been beta testing for a good few months now. I still have pretty much all the end game left to do as well as several flashpoints I haven't done. When I got my assassin to 50, there was nothing done for the end game. No operations, no Ilum (it existed but nothing really to do), nothing. So I got him to 50 and didn't really play after that until the wipe when I started my first Sorc.

I level quickly because I spacebar through nearly all conversations. That way I can keep the content relatively fresh for when the game goes live. This last 50 Sorc has been easy because for a good few days there they experimented with raising the xp for warzones. I would get literally 30k-40k xp in a warzone. Also, I stopped playing for several days for Skyrim and had rested double-xp for like the last 12 levels.
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« Reply #2067 on: November 30, 2011, 08:07:39 AM »

Quote from: StewMeat on November 30, 2011, 07:53:49 AM

World pvp is alive and well on pvp servers like Darth Malak, bearing in mind that until the last weekend surge there are simply not alot of folks to fight.

Wha? I'm on Darth Malak and have hardly seen any world PvP. Even on Ilum, since it's broken, there's not much PvP.
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« Reply #2068 on: November 30, 2011, 08:41:27 AM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 30, 2011, 08:07:39 AM

Quote from: StewMeat on November 30, 2011, 07:53:49 AM

World pvp is alive and well on pvp servers like Darth Malak, bearing in mind that until the last weekend surge there are simply not alot of folks to fight.

Wha? I'm on Darth Malak and have hardly seen any world PvP. Even on Ilum, since it's broken, there's not much PvP.

"bearing in mind that until the last weekend surge there are simply not alot of folks to fight" you missed that part I guess.  Wait are you saying you are the only person on the pvp server who pvp's?
All the options are there, so I gota know, why aren't you joining in? You get where I am going with that?
The beta itself is smothering the blood bath, not intentionally but as a side effect of everyone working on ellements of the game, it's all there and at release I'm sure you will be able to take full advantage of it with like minded players.
Hell I don't run into many people anywhere durring our regular test time, everyone is just busy, but I know for a fact if I see an enemy on an open planet I can attack them and they me.
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« Reply #2069 on: November 30, 2011, 02:06:01 PM »

Quote from: raydude on November 30, 2011, 04:32:47 AM

Quote from: Blackjack on November 30, 2011, 04:07:26 AM

I mentioned finally winning that decision in Esseles Flashpoint. What's cool is seeing your character then do something -- in this case it's just a gesture, and a flip of a switch. I think I can share that much vaguely without spoiling anything. icon_smile It's kinda neat you can see (as in lower left corner here) how rest of the group voted:

About that:

Spoiler for Hiden:
As I recall, the other choice was to shut down the blahblahs yourself. Which was harder in that they were guarded by Imps, but then again, you'd get experience points and possible loot for killing them. Does the venting out the airlock give XP as well? Cause I'd hate to think a chance at getting XP could be spoiled by someone's lucky roll in group chat
Interesting question, though I honestly don't remember. If it is, and it bends you out of shape, I'd recommend not doing Flashpoints with pickup groups -- stick with guild folks or pals you know, and agree in advance what kinds of answers you want to choose so you don't get any surprises. I like the suspense of not knowing what kind of answers will "win," and I'm not too worried about missing out on what I recall as a few "trash mobs" (as opposed to a boss that would give some special loot).

I'll pay more attention to that next time I get to play it in early access and I'll try to note what's different afterwards when I make that choice.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 02:08:58 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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« Reply #2070 on: November 30, 2011, 02:16:14 PM »

Darth Hater noted some "Patch Changes" to the ongoing test build ("full" patch notes expected later):
http://www.darthhater.com/articles/swtor-news/19732-patch-changes-11-29-11
*It apparently includes many new schematics, and more than 1,700 new mods for items
Quote
Flashpoint: The Colicoid War Game (changes to the Flashpoint) [this was one of the Flashpoints just "opened" with about the Nov. 17 build, according to that date's build notes-bj]

Sub-zones:
Hive Battleground(Weapons Testing Range)
Hive Battleground(Arena Registration)
Hive Battleground(Combat Simulation Room)
Hive Battleground(Hazard Course)
Hive Battleground(Contestant Processing)
Hive Battleground(Arena)

Abilities:
Shield Boost
Increases ranged and melee defenses for 50% for 1 seconds. Shares a cooldown with Officer's Insight.

Combat Acumen
Increases the critical hit chance by 25% for 1 seconds. Shares a cooldown with Survival Instinct.

Item Qualities: Moddable and Currency

Items: 1877 new items, all but 129 are mods

Schematics: 600 new schematics
I noticed belatedly from the Nov. 17 build notes that the initial Flashpoints (Esseles for Republic, and Black Talon) were "balanced for two players." So I guess that means you can, in theory, tackle them with two players plus companions. Though I'd think the couple nasty bosses on that one would make it a challenge.
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« Reply #2071 on: November 30, 2011, 03:31:03 PM »

Quote from: StewMeat on November 30, 2011, 08:41:27 AM

"bearing in mind that until the last weekend surge there are simply not alot of folks to fight" you missed that part I guess.

No, I got that part, but you have a huge problem with your logic.

I say there's pretty much no world PvP. This is PvP out in the world, not in the warzones.
You say PvP is "alive and well," but there's not a lot of folks to fight except for the weekend surge.
The problem with your logic is the weekend surge people are almost 100% under level 25, and probably 98% under level 22. These people are not engaged in world PvP in any way.

Quote
Hell I don't run into many people anywhere durring our regular test time, everyone is just busy, but I know for a fact if I see an enemy on an open planet I can attack them and they me.

Uh, yeah, that was never in question. The problem is it is not often that we see an enemy on an open planet.
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« Reply #2072 on: November 30, 2011, 03:37:41 PM »

I tried to test that Colicoid War Game flashpoint but when we entered the instance we were transported to the twilight zone - a huge flat checkered area with no walls or landmarks, its edges dropping off into space. We couldn't get out of it with the /stuck command. So we tried entering warzones and coming out. That worked for my group mates but not me. So I ran and jumped off into space. That worked smile. I believe they've fixed it late last week but not sure.

And I would disagree with your statement of not running the first flashpoint with a PUG. You still get your dark or lightside points no matter what your team picks and it's great, easy xp. I think you do get a title for your light/dark choice, so if you want to choose something different, just run it again. It's quick and easy enough.
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« Reply #2073 on: November 30, 2011, 04:04:29 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 30, 2011, 03:37:41 PM

And I would disagree with your statement of not running the first flashpoint with a PUG. You still get your dark or lightside points no matter what your team picks and it's great, easy xp. I think you do get a title for your light/dark choice, so if you want to choose something different, just run it again. It's quick and easy enough.
That was directed to raydude's concern that if someone makes a certain dialogue choice, your group may end up "bypassing" certain mobs and missing out on certain loot and xp you would have gotten with raydude's "preferred" choice. I'm being purposefully vague here.  icon_smile

So my advice is if the thought of missing something on a Flashpoint because a teammate's choice isn't in line with yours bothers raydude (and maybe he doesn't want to replay a Flashpoint over and over to run through all the Possibilities), then save himself the heartburn and don't do it as a pick up group.  icon_smile I'm not talking about light side/dark side as much as possibly "missing out on some content" because someone's dialogue choice amounts to a "shortcut" with fewer mobs encountered.

I actually think that particular situation is cool because it seems like one of the few times dialogue choices have major consequences. Something more interesting than telling some NPC her brat son is "dead" or "he went off to join the circus."  icon_razz The Flashpoints have some real possibilities for "branching" storytelling where your dialogue choices could change the experience substantially and make repeat playthroughs more rewarding. I'll be curious to see if Bioware explores that or frets that will "ruin it" and ultimately has your Flashpoint dialogue choices not affect much.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 04:14:50 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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« Reply #2074 on: November 30, 2011, 04:18:11 PM »

Well, I was just in the weekend betas, and I played a limited amount of time because I didn't want to spoil it later.  That being said, I leveled my Bounty Hunter up to level 10.  Question -- what exactly is a Flashpoint?  Are there any before level 10?  I remember one quest on Hutta that was given out by a Twilek who asked me to venture into a non-instanced heroic factory and destroy some things.  I recall we also picked up some other item (can't remember the name of the item off the top of my head, but you assemble them into something?).  Was that a Flashpoint, or is it something different altogether?
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« Reply #2075 on: November 30, 2011, 04:23:21 PM »

Quote from: Blackjack on November 30, 2011, 02:06:01 PM

Quote from: raydude on November 30, 2011, 04:32:47 AM

Quote from: Blackjack on November 30, 2011, 04:07:26 AM

I mentioned finally winning that decision in Esseles Flashpoint. What's cool is seeing your character then do something -- in this case it's just a gesture, and a flip of a switch. I think I can share that much vaguely without spoiling anything. icon_smile It's kinda neat you can see (as in lower left corner here) how rest of the group voted:

About that:

Spoiler for Hiden:
As I recall, the other choice was to shut down the blahblahs yourself. Which was harder in that they were guarded by Imps, but then again, you'd get experience points and possible loot for killing them. Does the venting out the airlock give XP as well? Cause I'd hate to think a chance at getting XP could be spoiled by someone's lucky roll in group chat
Interesting question, though I honestly don't remember. If it is, and it bends you out of shape, I'd recommend not doing Flashpoints with pickup groups -- stick with guild folks or pals you know, and agree in advance what kinds of answers you want to choose so you don't get any surprises. I like the suspense of not knowing what kind of answers will "win," and I'm not too worried about missing out on what I recall as a few "trash mobs" (as opposed to a boss that would give some special loot).

I'll pay more attention to that next time I get to play it in early access and I'll try to note what's different afterwards when I make that choice.

This is a very interesting discussion.  I think it really shows the different types of players.  Also read somewhere a comment by someone where they said this line and i quote i think "This game makes me just want to roleplay all the decisions instead of powergame them".

Some gamers just die if they don't eek out the maximum points of everything in everything they do every time.

On the other hand, some gamers are going to get the most fun out of enjoying playthroughs of things not knowing how they're going to end up because in a real temporary alliance of 4 "heroes" working together to accomplish a goal those 4 heroes have different personalities and will make different choices and who knows which one may be the one in a position to make the choice for the group at any given time...the rest of the group has to live with that choice since they've made the decision to work together to accomplish the overall objective.  In game terms, this brings suspense, replayability, unpredictability, and real roleplay to the table.

I'm with blackjack on this one, i think, i like the unpredictability, even if it means missing killing a pull or 2 for a tiny bit of exp and loot possibility sometimes....roleplay it...you can do the flashpionts multiple times i understand, and it's the roleplay and replay value you're getting here.

You just enjoy a game more i believe when you go with it rather than fight it or "read ahead".  

My personal example is when i played Dragon Age the first time through.  Every encounter i made was completely fresh and i roleplayed the whole game and stuck with the consequences, whatever they were, of everything i did and said.  I didn't read ahead and go, well i want Y, not X, so i need to say this and take this member with me when this comes up and take this action here so i get Z.  So by the time i found out who Wynn was, i'd already killed her, the only dedicated healer in the game...i thought it was awesome the way it had worked out just roleplaying things most players never had things happen the way i did cause everyone gamed the system to make sure they had that character.  The game still worked fine for me...and my enjoyment of it was even greater because it all felt so much more real not gaming it.

If you're a die hard powergamer though that can't stand the idea of not killing every last pull, then you should probably only run groups with other dedicated die hard powergamers so that you don't end up spitting mad and screaming at folks who enjoy the roleplay aspects more:)  Not saying that's you (any of you)...just saying...   I can't help what my character is going to choose...there's me...then there's my character....when i'm playing my character my character is making the choice, not me.

If they were stronger they could have found a way to survive and been a more worthy opponent, they were weak, so they died.  They weren't worthy.
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« Reply #2076 on: November 30, 2011, 04:23:55 PM »

Quote from: Asharak on November 30, 2011, 01:16:57 AM

Quote from: Fez on November 29, 2011, 11:17:45 PM

So, I know that the Wanderers is starting a guild, but is GT also?  We should try to combine them.

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You can only set 2 allies and adversaries it seems.  Wanderers Republic guild already has 2 allies (QT3) but I think we can still set the GT imperial guild as adversaries.  That might put us all on the same server.
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« Reply #2077 on: November 30, 2011, 04:30:29 PM »

Quote from: Fez on November 30, 2011, 04:18:11 PM

Well, I was just in the weekend betas, and I played a limited amount of time because I didn't want to spoil it later.  That being said, I leveled my Bounty Hunter up to level 10.  Question -- what exactly is a Flashpoint?  Are there any before level 10?  I remember one quest on Hutta that was given out by a Twilek who asked me to venture into a non-instanced heroic factory and destroy some things.  I recall we also picked up some other item (can't remember the name of the item off the top of my head, but you assemble them into something?).  Was that a Flashpoint, or is it something different altogether?

Flashpoints are the SWTOR equivalent of dungeons - instanced adventures for groups of people with an on-going story, where you get to make decisions with your teammates as well through the story telling.
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« Reply #2078 on: November 30, 2011, 04:32:52 PM »

Quote from: Fez on November 30, 2011, 04:18:11 PM

Well, I was just in the weekend betas, and I played a limited amount of time because I didn't want to spoil it later.  That being said, I leveled my Bounty Hunter up to level 10.  Question -- what exactly is a Flashpoint?  Are there any before level 10?  I remember one quest on Hutta that was given out by a Twilek who asked me to venture into a non-instanced heroic factory and destroy some things.  I recall we also picked up some other item (can't remember the name of the item off the top of my head, but you assemble them into something?).  Was that a Flashpoint, or is it something different altogether?

A flashpoint is a themed group instance.

There are heroics, which are typically also group instances, but flashpoints are not associated with a planet. They're found off the faction hub in the space station. The first flashpoint is around level 10. You can do it before 10, but it really helps to be level 10 with an advanced class first.
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« Reply #2079 on: November 30, 2011, 04:40:35 PM »

Quote from: Fuzzballx on November 30, 2011, 04:23:21 PM


On the other hand, some gamers are going to get the most fun out of enjoying playthroughs of things not knowing how they're going to end up because in a real temporary alliance of 4 "heroes" working together to accomplish a goal those 4 heroes have different personalities and will make different choices and who knows which one may be the one in a position to make the choice for the group at any given time...the rest of the group has to live with that choice since they've made the decision to work together to accomplish the overall objective.  In game terms, this brings suspense, replayability, unpredictability, and real roleplay to the table.

I'm with blackjack on this one, i think, i like the unpredictability, even if it means missing killing a pull or 2 for a tiny bit of exp and loot possibility sometimes....roleplay it...you can do the flashpionts multiple times i understand, and it's the roleplay and replay value you're getting here.


I agree with all points, and I was actually just curious because at the time I thought if I was one of the four people in that situation I would have felt slightly upset because not only did it mar my enjoyment of the storyline (thinking we were part of a band of heroes just like Han, Luke, Leia and Chewie and they would never have blasted folks out of the airlock) but that I may have also been out some XP to boot.

As a point of fact, I do enjoy roleplaying and have roleplayed in groups before. However, in my experience, when roleplaying with friends, I have a general idea of what said friends will do with their character and in what circumstances their choices would run from very "good" to somewhat "bad". But in no cases would I have expected a party I'm playing in to summarily execute NPCs for no good reason - unless we were all roleplaying evil characters. Certainly not "just for the hell of it" which sounds like what Blackjack was doing.

In any case, its no big deal. Like cheeba said, if someone does something that I didn't like in the storyline then I'll probably just re-run it again. No skin off my back. I'll just put the person who marred my experience on my ignore list.  icon_twisted
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