Looking for comparison - EQ2 and WOW

[Fez]

Hi.  Now that they're both out, I'm lhoping someone who's played both games can chime in with a comparison of both.  I've been playing EQ2 since it went live, and I'm wondering if it's worth it to try out WoW, as I've been seeing a lot of buzz about it recently.  Gamespot even gave it a 9.5 and Editor's Pick (not that this means all that much, but it was an impressive score).  So what are the reasons why I should switch over to WoW.  And I'm really just looking for people who have played both to chime in.  Thanks!

[StewMeat]

Warning I'm not going to pull punches on this review, it is based on my personal opinion:
EQ2 is a zone loading pig, unless you have big ram it will load up and choke you to seizures after running the horrible blind missions for 20 minutes.
Wow runs smooth and looks great even on low end machines, it just plain works better.
The missions in WoW are more fun without all the zone loading and are easy to find and understand what the rewards are before hand.
The characters in EQ2 are ridiculous; the elf npc's all speak and act like flaming homosexuals, their comments are absurd and overdone.
The Halflings are also silly and campy, in fact in an apparent effort to make each race unique the developers must have hired a failed comic to do the concepts as they all seem to be stereotypically overblown, lends new meaning to the term role-play.
In WoW the characters have some silly traits and emotes that mirror the Warcraft games but not to the point where you feel odd playing one race or the other like in EQ2.
EQ2 tries to fix flaws in the rpg jondra but misses the mark, in an attempt to remove the landscapes of macroing zombies they moved the crafting into dungeons and selling to brokers or in your room, sort of an out of sight out of mind policy.
WoW hits me as a new fresh approach to mmorpg's and my enduring impression after testing and playing even now is it's fun, the crafting is simple and effective and compliments the game play.
EQ2 uses the crafting to keep solo players occupied until their group mates log on, in WoW you can do almost anything grouped or solo so theirs no waves of fun you need to try and catch.
On the big end you will be an npc commando in EQ2 with no hope of adding good vs. evil raids at higher levels, thus the focus on a complex and tasking crafting based economy to appeal to players that prefer group based npc interaction.
EQ2 has more character customization but you will never notice that unless you are point blank, 3 of my guildies are elf characters and I can't tell them apart if they have helmets on even if I can see their faces unless I get right in front of them.
In closing my impression obviously favors WoW, I am going to play this and have fun.
I think I will wait for Middle Earth online or one of the other elf and ogre games to get my fantasy grove on, EQ2 is built from SWG with a few tweaks and not many improvements.

[Xmann]

This is the bottom line, there are those who like EQ2 and those who like WoW.  It does not mean one product is better than the other simply because you prefer the gameplay of one over the other.  I'm not referring to this post by any means, but all these threads and comments that declare WoW is better than EQ2 or EQ2 rules WoW is ridiculous and i personally would not follow the advice of someone posting such a message.  Having said that...........
I did not play either of the betas for either game to purposely not spoil any parts of the game for me, that's just my feelings.  After all the hype of WoW and so many people declaring it the second coming of gaming, i chose to go with WoW instead of EQ2.  I liked the potential for the casual gamer and ease at leveling rather quickly.  I also liked the idea that our guild at The Wanderers were going to hit it hard at release and i wanted in on it from the start.  However, after playing for just 3 days and up to lvl 11, i was bored out of my mine from constant soloing and quit.  I hated having to solo in a mmorpg and couldn't imagine doing it for the majority of my levels.  Ya i know grouping does get a bit more important at higher levels in order to complete quests, but the little grouping i had done at that moment was lifeless and not as rewarding compared to soloing for most people.  I also did not like the graphics.  The cartoon aproach is just not my style and i just couldn't get into the feel of the world because of it.  I also thought combat was boring for some reason.  You WoW fanbois don't flame me, i just did not personally like it.  For these reasons and a few others, i had to quit because it was boring me to death to solo and chat with my friends instead of grouping.  The fact is most or the majority of people solo and thats not what i was looking for.
Now, i decided to give EQ2 a shot because i heard it was more suited to the grouping player more so than solo'er.  When i immediately entered EQ2, i knew this was the game for me.  I love the graphics, the enormous amounts of character choices, the more mature player, and grouping being encouraged.  I personally think the combat in EQ2 is exciting and more strategic than WoW.  Surprisingly enough i have done more questing solo in EQ2 than i wanted to be, but thus far i haven't been annoyed or bored with it.  I also have been able to find pickup groups each night i've played rather easily.  The leveling is definitely slower than WoW, but until now it's not a burden.  I'm currently level 12 almost 13 and truely addicted to the gameplay, graphics, combat, community, etc.
This DOES not mean EQ2 rules and WoW suxxors.  These are just my personal likes and dislikes about each game and the impressions i had with each on a limited basis.  I have no idea whether EQ2 will hold my attention in the long haul once the grind sets in.  However i do know i traded away my WoW account and will never play it again.  For the many people who say EQ2 is boring and suxxors there are that many people who flame WoW.  I'm not flaming or pumpng either, just giving you my $.02
I  guess the bottom line would be if you have the $$ and extra time, try WoW yourself and make that judgment.  I personally dont think you can decide whats good for you unless you try it first hand.  It surely did not work for me.

Just wanted to edit and add that i can't figure out for the life of me why so many people are having problems with EQ performance.  I have a relatively modest system and at generally high settings i get no lag or stuttering what so ever.  If i hadn't read on different forums all the problems, i wouln't know any existed.

[StewMeat]

Fez you want a comparison on these 2 games and I hope I gave an honest, hard review without getting into personal insults against the players of either game.
I think you will find plenty of questionable behavior however in either game, blame it on the anonimity of the internet and accept it as part of the experience.
Infact even on the roleplay servers in EQ2 you will find an abundance of players with behavior matching their names even though this is supposed to be strictly regulated here, thats why I started characters there, oh well I tried.
I reject the idea that the grown ups play one over the other, the stylized graphics in WoW are meant to mimic the characters in the Warcraft series not attract the infamous and dreaded 13 year old.
If you've played SWG you have all you need to know to make a comparison with WoW, go buy WoW, if you don't like it I will trade you straight up for a copy of EQ2 the dvd edition.

[depward]

Fez, I think a lot has to do with - would you be a casual player or more of a "hardcore" player?  EQII is more of a timesink.  WoW is suited for a more casual player.  I think that in itself might be one of the main reasons as to why people like one or the other.  But I know, it isn't the only one  

I played EQII for a bit, decided to stop.  I thought the voice acting was pretty good.  I like how they included so much in an MMORPG.  I haven't played WoW but I will say EQII is not a bad game at all.  Just wasn't suited to my tastes.

[Fez]

Well, I finally did it.  I broke down and bought WoW as well so that I could try them both.  I spent all of last night playing WoW and I feel at this point I have a pretty good idea of how the two games compare to one another in a general way.  I can't compare higher level adeventures between the two, as my EQ2 character is much higher than my current WoW character.  Anyway, I agree with the above post that both games are good, and it really depends on which feel you like better.  But as for a comparison, here goes:

Graphics:  The first thing I noticed upon logging into WoW was that the graphics really do fall far short of EQ2.  However, that doesn't mean they're bad, just that they will take some getting used to if you've played EQ2.  The good thing is that WoW runs very smoothly in the highest graphic setting on my machine, although even at that setting you're not going to get close to the crisp details in the EQ2 world.  There is a certain crispness missing in the WoW world that makes me feel like I'm playing an older game, notwithstanding the "cartoon-like" feel of the game, which I like overall.  But having played EQ2 first, it really takes some getting used to.  I could certainly see the graphics of one or the other being a drawing point.  However, the nice thing about WoW is that there are no zones, and thus little to no loading unless you are going to an instanced environment.  Nice bonus, although if you are running a top-end machine for EQ2 with a recently defragged hard-drive, the loading times in EQ2 are very acceptable.

World:  Having no zones, WoW feels a lot bigger than EQ2 and less cookie cutter.  However, this also could be negative in that in EQ2 we all know certain zones have certain things for a certain level character.  So, at least initially, WoW feels a bit more daunting, and a bit harder to get around.  I may be slightly biased because I've already had a few weeks with EQ2 and know the ropes over there.  In any case, both worlds are a lot of fun to explore, and I don't see either getting the nod here.

Sound:  I was happy to see that WoW also has a good deal of vocalizations in the game.  Not to the extent that you find in EQ2, where entire quests are given with vocals to accompany the test.  But I found in EQ2 that more than half the time I just clicked ahead after reading the quest rather than wait to hear the entire speech finish.  Also, WoW has some neat vocal commands (initiated with /v ___) which are really fun to use in game.  You can even tell random jokes or be silly with other players and hear your character talk.  As for music and sound effects, I'll give a slight nod to EQ2 here, because I think the quality of the effects and background music are slightly better.  But WoW's are pretty nice too.  I don't think sound would be something to sway you to one or the other.

Lag:  Having started playing WoW last night, a week after launch, I noticed absolutely no lag during the time I played.  This was really impressive following on the heels of my experience in EQ2 where I have to reboot every once in a while because combat starts to lag so much.  WoW definitely wins on this one, but, at the same time, the graphics are not as "realistic", so Id have to say EQ2 will look more current for far longer than WoW, if that's important to you.  But, if you want to run smoothly at all costs pick WoW at this point.

Interface: EQ2 wins on this at least initially, as I especially like the additional hotbars you can open up and the customizability of them and the different chat frames.  Now, I'm basing this only on the iterface that originally shipped with the game as I haven't tried any of the available interface mods available for WoW that are out there.  Im guessing that in the long run, this will probably equal out.  Chatting and other communication tools are fairly similar in both games, although the extra windows in  EQ2 are nice.

Character types/development: It's somewhat nice in WoW to feel like you start out in the class you chose, so you can immediately get a feel for the type of character you've chosen and whether you like it.  It also makes trying out other characters much easier.  In EQ2 you have to level up to 10 before you get to select your first subclass (as a scout you would select rogue, bard, or predator in Qeynos), and then at 20 you select your final class (such as Ranger if your a predator).  With WoW I had the chance to quickly try out a few different characters at the beginning which was nice.  Now, there aren't as many character types to choose from as in EQ2, but that might lead to better balancing overall.  This is still an open question as I haven't played long enough.  It seemed like the characters in EQ2 were a little more set in their roles.

Gameplay:  Ok, I've set this up with a few different subheadings to try and give some opinions on what I experienced.

Grouping/social:  Playing WoW last night, I have to admit that I never ran across anybody looking for groups in chat or elsewhere.  I just was soloing all the time.  This may change later on, but it definitely was a weird experience.  To me, it seems like EQ2 is a bit more of a social game as it essentially wants you to group later on to tackle some of the more difficult obstacles.  In WoW, it seemed like every class could solo, and every class could run around and do their own thing.  So if you like grouping, especially early on in the game, I'll give the nod to EQ2 at this point.  I also give the nod to EQ2 on guilds and such.  It's a lot of fun, for me at least, to see the guild pages and see all the stats for the guild online, as well as accumulating status points for your guild which can be used to purchase items, etc.  WoW does not have this at this time, based on what I'm aware of.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Combat:  At the early levels, I'd have to say combat functions very much the same.  However, WoW does not have the mobs set-up as in EQ2 where certain mobs are "group-specific".  In some ways this is good, and in other ways it's bad.  The group mobs in EQ2 basically force people to socialize to at least get into groups to tackle the mobs.  Therefore, you are forced to interact with other players and "play with them" so to speak.  In WoW, there are no group mobs, but there are times when you may need to group to tackle some mobs that are close enough together such that, if pulled, they will attack together.  I see bonuses to EQ2's system, as I am not against grouping, but if you like soloing more the nod would go to WoW.  If you like grouping and more interaction from the start, go with EQ2.  Again, this is not representative of higher levels where grouping is probably more of a necessityin WoW.

Mechanics:  First, death is handled differently.  In EQ2, you die, or a member of your group dies, and you suffer experience debt.  This means for a certain amount of experience gained, half of your exp will go to debt.  This debt is also wiped out slowly in real time, so if you log out for a day, usually in the next day or two the debt will be gone.  Also, when you die and are not revived by a priest, you will have to return to your body to collect your shard.  This effectively reduces the amount of debt your faced with.  In addition to debt, your items are also slightly damaged.  I don't find it overall to be much of an inconvenience, as if I have a lot of debt, I just logout for the night or switch to a different character.

In WoW, when you die and are not ressed by a healer, you spawn as a ghost in the nearest cemetary.  You then can run back to your body and collect it to minimize item damage or you can choose to be revived right in the graveyard, suffering some nasty damage to your items.  In WoW, unlike EQ2, item durabilitiy always goes down through combat, so you typically have to get things mended anyway.  Item durability also varies, much like in Diablo 2, so you could have a sword with 34/35 durability.  In EQ2 the durability is limited to percentages, and when something drops to 0, it must be repaired before it can be used again.  There is no exp debt in WoW.  I don't find either system to be too annoying.  

The experience debt in EQ2 actually ends up being somewhat similar in practice to the WoW "rest" state.  It's all numbers after all.  In WoW, when you first login for the day, your exp bar will be a light blue color.  This essentially means you are earning 200% experience for a certain number of kills.  Now, if you logged off in an inn the night before, that "rested" state may last significantly longer than if you didn't.  In fact, just visiting an inn while playing may sufficiently rest you so that you're back to earning 200% exp for a few kills.

If you are a casual player, I think this is a benefit.  But I also think WoW gets the nod in general if you are a casual player.  The social interaction does not feel quite as bonding as in EQ2 (the realism of the graphics in EQ2 perhaps enhasnces this feel, as does the guild structure and grouping mechanics) so it does not require as much attention from players.

Quest system:  Both games have lots of quests, but the nod has to go to WoW on this one.  The one really great thing that WoW does, is whenever you complete a part of the task, such as killing a bear, it immediately flashes on the screen "5/8 bears killed" or something like it, so you know how many more you need without having to find the quest in the quest log.  EQ2's quest log is a bit more cluttered, in that you need to have the quest open in the quest helper window to see updates on how you are progressing with a quest.  And, finding the quest in your journal can take a little time sometimes.  Otherwise, I find the quests to be fairly similar overall, although EQ2 seems to have more of the early quests of take x to person y - more of the messenger quest variety.  But, it also seems to me that there are many more quests available in EQ2 at the early levels, for better or worse, so it's easy to get cluttered up with quests.

There are some other odds and ends that I could mention, but my fingers are getting tired.  Tonight will be some more WoW for me, as I try to figure out which game I like better for the long haul.  I don't think you can go wrong with both.  I'll update this a bit more as I explore WoW further.

[Redfive]

Fez, congrats on an outstanding comparison there.  I think you managed to walk the line without falling into either camp and you gave some genuinely helpful information.

The only small point of contention I would have is that you say you don't always get updates in EQ when you gain an item towards a quest.  I've found that even if I don't have it up in the quest helper window I still get an audio cue and text in the very middle of the screen saying what I've gathered.

[-Lord Ebonstone-]

The comparison between EQ2 and WoW is easy!

EQ2 sucks.  WoW doesn't!

 :wink:

[JCC]

Interface: ...  Chatting and other communication tools are fairly similar in both games, although the extra windows in  EQ2 are nice.

Just so you know, you can open and customize multiple chat windows in WoW. I assume that your sentence indicated that you thought you couldn't do this in WoW. Just wanted to let you know you could. If I interpreted your sentence completely wrong, feel free to yell at me and call me an idiot.

[Toe]

Grouping/social: Playing WoW last night, I have to admit that I never ran across anybody looking for groups in chat or elsewhere. I just was soloing all the time. This may change later on, but it definitely was a weird experience. To me, it seems like EQ2 is a bit more of a social game as it essentially wants you to group later on to tackle some of the more difficult obstacles.

Blizzard also wants you to group later on to tackle some of the more difficult obstacles. These are instance dungeons which are filled with mobs that are designated as "elite". Meaning they have a lot more health and hit a lot harder than "standard" mobs.

There is no possible way to solo a instance at the levels it was meant for (although you could possibly zone in and kill some of the creatures depending on your class). You can usually get a taste of the instances around level 15 although you might not be able to make it through all the encounters. Most folks wait till around 20th or so.

It seems the difference is that EQ2 wants you to group early and often whereas blizzard is more lax in "forcing" folks to group, really only forcing it for their instances (and non-instance elite encounters). But smart WoW players know that grouping up and doing quests that are tough for your level benifits you more than waiting until you can solo them yourself.

[Scott]

Just so you know, you can open and customize multiple chat windows in WoW. I assume that your sentence indicated that you thought you couldn't do this in WoW.

WoW's interface ends up being a lot more customizable with all the script UIs you can download or write for yourself.

The first thing I noticed upon logging into WoW was that the graphics really do fall far short of EQ2.

I disagree, by a lot.  I have a pretty good computer, and when I got EQ2's graphics to a level that they ran well, they looked blah.  WoW's art and textures are incredible, and the game runs extremely smoothly on my system.

In two years, when I have a machine capable of running EQ2 smoothly at the higher settings, maybe it'll be different.  I just think EQ2's graphics quality drops faster then any game I've seen as you lower the settings.

As far as gameplay, EQ2 did seem more challening.  Slower too.  I liked having to group at times.  Both games are good.  When I'm sick of WoW, I'll probably play EQ2 again.

[Arkon]

The interfaces in EQ2 can be rewritten just like WoWs.  Personally it is the style of graphics in WoW that annoy me, not the quality.  They are very high quality graphics, they just don't appeal to me.

[Fez]

Thanks for the feedback!  You are correct that I haven't yet found a way to open up multiple chat windows for Warcraft that allow me to designate what is displayed in each multiple window.  In EQ2 I had separate windows for guild chat and tells, regular chat and other stuff, and combat activities.  If anyone has some time, I'd definitely be interested to find out how this can be done in WoW, or if it's possible.

I should have also mentioned that I was comparing the graphics at the highest level in WoW to graphics set at balanced or the next level better graphics in EQ2.  I have a failry beefy machine that I'm running these games on.  EQ2 definitely has more "realistic" graphics.  But, like I said, WoW has a cartoon-nature (almost like being in a Disney film) that may appeal more than EQ2's graphics to some people.

In any case, they are both good games.  I find that there is a lot of running in both games in pre-20 levels at least, and that's still somewhat tedious!  But you have to work to get mounts!  In any case, I'll probably switch back and forth as I get bored with one or the other for a while, unless I find that I can't keep up with them.

[Vesper]

Thanks for the feedback!  You are correct that I haven't yet found a way to open up multiple chat windows for Warcraft that allow me to designate what is displayed in each multiple window.  In EQ2 I had separate windows for guild chat and tells, regular chat and other stuff, and combat activities.  If anyone has some time, I'd definitely be interested to find out how this can be done in WoW, or if it's possible.

Believe it or not, it's possible in the default interface.  I found it by complete accident today.

The secret:  Right cick on the tab names in the chat window (like on the word "General").  You can create new tabs, move it around, separate into separate windows, change colors, assign text to various windows, etc.  There's a TON of options.  I'm really glad I found it because now I have all guild chat in its own tab.

[Warfran]

Thanks for the tip Vesper,that will make chatting a lot more organized for me.

And excellent comparison Fez,I really enjoyed reading it.I hope you will keep updating your take on both these games.