http://gamingtrend.com
August 01, 2014, 11:58:11 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News:
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Happy Patch Day! [WoW]  (Read 13424 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
The Rocketman
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 433



View Profile
« Reply #80 on: March 30, 2005, 06:02:30 AM »

I play on Earthen Ring, a european RP server. It's low population, and it has NEVER been down. Actually, I haven't heard of a single european server to be down, but then, I could be mistaken.

Can't you create characters on different servers if it bugs you so much?
Logged
Ibby
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 154


View Profile
« Reply #81 on: March 30, 2005, 07:06:19 AM »

Whatever you do, stay away from the official WoW forums.  There is much frothing and gnashing of teeth out there in teh intarweb tonight.
Logged
dangerballs
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 532


View Profile
« Reply #82 on: March 30, 2005, 07:09:15 AM »

Quote from: "The Rocketman"
I play on Earthen Ring, a european RP server. It's low population, and it has NEVER been down. Actually, I haven't heard of a single european server to be down, but then, I could be mistaken.

Can't you create characters on different servers if it bugs you so much?


The problem for me half the time isn't the realm server.    It's the login server.  It seems that it is down constantly, probably because they also host the web server on it  :shock: Everyone logs in through the same login server.  When that one is down, you can't even connect to the game period.
Logged

What's Cooking at Hacienda de Bolas del Peligro?

PC: Tomb Raider | Xbox360: GTA V | PS3: Infamous 2, Ni No Kuni
Ibby
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 154


View Profile
« Reply #83 on: March 30, 2005, 07:12:20 AM »

Quote from: "The Rocketman"


Can't you create characters on different servers if it bugs you so much?


Sure. In fact, I've made characters scattered across five different servers.  Of those five, only 2 are up at the moment.

Perhaps I'll just make characters on every server and level them all to 60.  Shouldn't be hard.  :shock:
Logged
The Rocketman
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 433



View Profile
« Reply #84 on: March 30, 2005, 08:04:10 AM »

Yes, I realise making several characters is not an optimal solution, but it beats not playing the game, no?

Oh, and I may have been wrong about the european severs not being down, apparantly we get 2 days free now, because of some issues when the patch arrived. (Kinda ironic, no?)

Anyway, I wish you all the luck in the world, but I do agree that there's a lot of moaning here. Yes, you pay for it, yes, you want to play the game... But now can I moan because I had to wait about 3 months before the game got available in Belgium? Didn't hear anyone then...

But to be fair, that's a different story. I really hope they'll solve the -apparently - large problems the us servers have!
Logged
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #85 on: March 30, 2005, 12:36:07 PM »

Quote from: "unbreakable"
I dont find my logic flawed in the least.  Blizzard is providing a service.  If said service displeases you, take your money and go elsewhere.  The logical flaw is to continue paying for it, and continue bitching about it.

Im of the opinion that you either enjoy your time on the game, or you find something else to do.  Complaining seems utterly pointless, and extremely... Im fishing for a word, I guess distasteful, or classless.  Anyway, I pay for the game too, in case that fact escaped you.  I really enjoy playing, and probably play far more than I should.  But if I cant play for some reason, I just find something else to do.

All this complaining and swearing at Blizzard accomplishes nothing, and just ends up making you look foolish.  "Incompetant"?  Oh yeah, they just created by far the best MMOG of all time, it is a success not only as a game, as a form of entertainment, but also as a work of art, and it is definitely a success financially.  However, I guess we should just take the word of some guy on an internet forum that Blizzard, the creators of one record breaking and critically acclaimed game after another, are a bunch of incompetant boobs who dont know what the hell they are doing.  Um, okay  :roll:


Your logic isn't flawed?  Ok, the next time you order a pizza, I'll make sure it gets delivered with a big pile of shit on top.  After you pay for it, feel free to order another pizza elsewhere.  And complaining would be...classless/foolish.  After all, you can just order another pizza elsewhere.

Next time you purchase a PC game, I'll code it so that it crashes every 10 minutes on your desktop.  No use complaining about it.  Just go buy another PC game.

See how stupid that sounds?  

Yes, it's no use complaining about a game that I shelled out $50 for, paid a non-refundable subscription fee and is down almost as much as it's been up for the last month.  No justification there.  I should just walk away quietly and forgo my initial investement because it's "only" $100 or it's "only" entertainment.

Uh, no.  Screw that.  

As for incompetence, Blizzard has shown that they are incompetent in terms of running the servers or programming stable server code.  Which is much different than art direction or content creation.  Duh.
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
The Rocketman
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 433



View Profile
« Reply #86 on: March 30, 2005, 01:07:52 PM »

Easy milord, he ain't Baldrick far as I can tell... :p
Logged
Gedd
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 340


View Profile
« Reply #87 on: March 30, 2005, 01:14:05 PM »

Quote
Oh yeah, they just created by far the best MMOG of all time


From a design standpoint, you may be correct.  From a technical standpoint you're way off.  The infrastructure supporting the game and the processes involved in maintaining it are downright awful.

Heavy load times routinely mean that authenticating requires multiple attempts and usually ends up meaning the login server is brought down for emergency maintenance.

The Tuesday maintenance process *never* is completed on time. Here's an idea...update your ETAs and continue to work on getting the maintenance period down.  The Scotty priniciple says folks like it when you estimate high and end up early, not the other way around.

The stability of the servers after the Tuesday maintenance process, a process designed to make things run better, is typically worse than on Monday.

Loot lag on some servers still abounds.  On other servers you get mail lag, AH crashes, and disapperaing NPCs.

You can have the best game in world ever, but if you can't keep it up and running smoothly, the end product is far less than "the best".
Logged
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #88 on: March 30, 2005, 01:14:28 PM »

<We are aware of the issues affecting several realms, and are working diligently to correct them. Thank you for your patience.>
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
Gedd
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 340


View Profile
« Reply #89 on: March 30, 2005, 01:19:00 PM »

Oh, and one more for my list...Bliz can't even keep their web server up and running.  With all the high traffic web sites out there that don't lock up and bomb when the hits start coming, you'd think they'd at least be able to keep their front page running smoothly.
Logged
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #90 on: March 30, 2005, 02:38:19 PM »

<Working as intended>
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
morlac
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 2778



View Profile
« Reply #91 on: March 30, 2005, 03:11:25 PM »

I have got to get some of this blizzard coolaide...it must be fantastic!  Unbreakable, which flavor do you like best?
Logged

morlac00 on PSN
SuperHiro
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 1199

Pants on Fire


View Profile
« Reply #92 on: March 30, 2005, 04:32:23 PM »

My two usual servers went up without a hitch, though one of them was just getting mashed with refugees.  I made the unfortunate decision of logging out in ogrimmar, which drove my comp to its knees when logging in.  

I got in playing normally around 9 pm PST.  Pretty ridiculous.  They updated the messages at 10:45pst, so it was basically an update every 3-4 hours.  

Still, that's unacceptable (the problems), esspecially when it's been consistently like this for so long and after so many "fixes".  Blizzard likes to blame it on the unexpected high number of players.  Great you're successful, get over it.  Since it seems the nasty problems exist only on the high pop servers, is it so hard to just add a bunch of new servers and allow transfers there?  Say two high pop servers to one new server.
Logged

Just Hiro will do.
dangerballs
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 532


View Profile
« Reply #93 on: March 30, 2005, 06:23:05 PM »

Quote from: "Gedd"
Oh, and one more for my list...Bliz can't even keep their web server up and running.  With all the high traffic web sites out there that don't lock up and bomb when the hits start coming, you'd think they'd at least be able to keep their front page running smoothly.


That's because the web server is running on the same server as the login server  :o which means when the login server is having problems the webpage will as well.
Logged

What's Cooking at Hacienda de Bolas del Peligro?

PC: Tomb Raider | Xbox360: GTA V | PS3: Infamous 2, Ni No Kuni
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #94 on: March 30, 2005, 06:39:04 PM »

I don't think they run on the same server.

The login you use for the forums and the one you use in-game are on the same server.  But the forums - the web server itself - is on a different server.  Otherwise, how could you review (but not login to post on) the forums when the login server isn't working?  (which you can and I have, many times)
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
Gedd
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 340


View Profile
« Reply #95 on: March 30, 2005, 06:52:50 PM »

Yep, I agree with Blackadar. The two servers wouldn't be the same, or else when they brought down the login server you wouldn't be able to reach it at all.  During these times, I can sometimes reach the site, but it's really, really slow.

Now, the login server and the forum server are talking to each other, which is why you can't log in to the forums during maintenance usually, but they're not running on the same server.

The problem is that someone didn't determine what the peak traffic would be on the server during game outages, and the web server is getting hopelessly overwhelmed by folks looking for information.
Logged
olaf
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 582


View Profile
« Reply #96 on: March 30, 2005, 08:41:53 PM »

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=2277601&p=1&tmp=1#post2277601

lol unbelievable.  Who thought it was a good idea to compensate downtime with a reward that requires more of it?

olaf
Logged
zinckiwi
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 310


View Profile
« Reply #97 on: March 30, 2005, 08:51:43 PM »

That is very, very funny. I'm not 60 so will appreciate the rest bonus, but I'd still perfer to be able to, you know... *play the game* tonight.
Logged
hepcat
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 9147


I'M the one that knocks! Now...burp me!


View Profile
« Reply #98 on: March 30, 2005, 08:52:41 PM »

Quote from: "olaf"
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=2277601&p=1&tmp=1#post2277601

lol unbelievable.  Who thought it was a good idea to compensate downtime with a reward that requires more of it?

olaf


I think we're all aware what this REALLY means.  They've found another problem but don't want to admit it.  They therefore are covering up tonight's fix that requires server downtime by telling us that it's for a nice little treat for the users.  That's really clever...


...if your intended victims are 7 years old.
Logged

Warning:  You will see my penis. -Brian

Just remember: once a user figures out gluten noting them they're allowed to make fun of you. - Ceekay speaking in tongues.
olaf
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 582


View Profile
« Reply #99 on: March 30, 2005, 08:58:08 PM »

I am hoping it is some kind of fucked up April Fool's joke.

olaf
Logged
zinckiwi
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 310


View Profile
« Reply #100 on: March 30, 2005, 09:01:08 PM »

Gave that a little thought, but with the announcement on the 30th and the intended downtime on the 31st, their aim is off. I don't think they'd mis-time it like that on the heels of a serious downtime issue. For the players to get the joke and not hold a grudge, it would need to be far more obvious.
Logged
Gedd
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 340


View Profile
« Reply #101 on: March 30, 2005, 09:04:47 PM »

Quote from: "hepcat"
I think we're all aware what this REALLY means.  They've found another problem but don't want to admit it.  They therefore are covering up tonight's fix that requires server downtime by telling us that it's for a nice little treat for the users.  That's really clever...


...if your intended victims are 7 years old.


Paranoid much? smile

Seriously, if Bliz needed to bring the servers down to fix something that couldn't wait until Tuesday, they would've gone ahead and brought them down already.

Their actions in the past would also indicate that they would either tell us or not tell us, not make stuff up to cover for it.

Or *do* they...
Logged
olaf
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 582


View Profile
« Reply #102 on: March 30, 2005, 09:41:20 PM »

It seems unlike they would need to pull the servers down for three hours to give everyone full rested XP...

olaf
Logged
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #103 on: March 30, 2005, 09:44:04 PM »

I also think it's total horseshit.  They're trying to fix something else.
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
-Lord Ebonstone-
BANNED
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3428

get naked


View Profile WWW
« Reply #104 on: March 30, 2005, 10:08:34 PM »

Quote from: "Blackadar"
I also think it's total horseshit.  They're trying to fix something else.
Duh.  Something else is wrong.
Logged

xbl tag = cthonic horror

NNNOOOOOO!!
SuperHiro
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 1199

Pants on Fire


View Profile
« Reply #105 on: March 30, 2005, 10:24:32 PM »

Yeah I would say they're going to do something for April Fool's (Like they do all the time), and are covering it up.

Personally, I don't think that's a good idea.
Logged

Just Hiro will do.
unbreakable
Guest
« Reply #106 on: March 31, 2005, 09:08:00 AM »

Quote from: "Blackadar"
Your logic isn't flawed?  Ok, the next time you order a pizza, I'll make sure it gets delivered with a big pile of shit on top.

1. A pizza isnt a service, it is a good.  
2. The delivery is a service.
Quote
After you pay for it, feel free to order another pizza elsewhere.

You dont have to pay for it.  Cancel your account and dispute the charge.
Quote
And complaining would be...classless/foolish.  After all, you can just order another pizza elsewhere.

Warning other people away is one thing.  Eating a pizza with shit on top, and bitching while your mouth is full, and then reaching for yet another slice, is quite another.
Quote
Next time you purchase a PC game, I'll code it so that it crashes every 10 minutes on your desktop.  No use complaining about it.  Just go buy another PC game.

See how stupid that sounds?  

Yeah, it does sound stupid.  You just return the game and move on with your life.  Repeat after me- "You are not a victim.  You are not a victim.  You are not a victim."

Quote
Yes, it's no use complaining about a game that I shelled out $50 for, paid a non-refundable subscription fee and is down almost as much as it's been up for the last month.  No justification there.  I should just walk away quietly and forgo my initial investement because it's "only" $100 or it's "only" entertainment.

Uh, no.  Screw that.  

Maybe you should stop ordering pizza from that place then.  Oh wait, if your first free month was over, and you still kept playing (and paying), what could that possibly mean?
Quote
As for incompetence, Blizzard has shown that they are incompetent in terms of running the servers or programming stable server code.  Which is much different than art direction or content creation.  Duh.

Feel free to stop playing at any time.  You are also perfectly free to create a competing product, since you can obviously do so much better.

In closing, you guys need your diapers changed.
Logged
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #107 on: March 31, 2005, 12:23:13 PM »

Quote from: "unbreakable"
Quote from: "Blackadar"
Your logic isn't flawed?  Ok, the next time you order a pizza, I'll make sure it gets delivered with a big pile of shit on top.

1. A pizza isnt a service, it is a good.  
2. The delivery is a service.
Quote
After you pay for it, feel free to order another pizza elsewhere.

You dont have to pay for it.  Cancel your account and dispute the charge.
Quote
And complaining would be...classless/foolish.  After all, you can just order another pizza elsewhere.

Warning other people away is one thing.  Eating a pizza with shit on top, and bitching while your mouth is full, and then reaching for yet another slice, is quite another.
Quote
Next time you purchase a PC game, I'll code it so that it crashes every 10 minutes on your desktop.  No use complaining about it.  Just go buy another PC game.

See how stupid that sounds?  

Yeah, it does sound stupid.  You just return the game and move on with your life.  Repeat after me- "You are not a victim.  You are not a victim.  You are not a victim."

Quote
Yes, it's no use complaining about a game that I shelled out $50 for, paid a non-refundable subscription fee and is down almost as much as it's been up for the last month.  No justification there.  I should just walk away quietly and forgo my initial investement because it's "only" $100 or it's "only" entertainment.

Uh, no.  Screw that.  

Maybe you should stop ordering pizza from that place then.  Oh wait, if your first free month was over, and you still kept playing (and paying), what could that possibly mean?
Quote
As for incompetence, Blizzard has shown that they are incompetent in terms of running the servers or programming stable server code.  Which is much different than art direction or content creation.  Duh.

Feel free to stop playing at any time.  You are also perfectly free to create a competing product, since you can obviously do so much better.

In closing, you guys need your diapers changed.


1.  WoW is a product as well.  I have a box, disks, etc.  But if you want a different analogy, the pizza shows up 3 hours late and only 2/3rds of it is there.  Either way.

2.  I've already paid for it.  A fact you keep missing.

3.  Can you find anyplace that will take a return of a game?  I can't return WoW.

4.  In closing, the whole crux of your points seems that it's pointless to complain about anything, so we should just take it in the ass and quietly go away.  That's about the stupiest friggin' thing I've heard.  

I won't even address the whole "make your own game" comment - it just shows how absurd your logic is.
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
ericb
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 1650



View Profile
« Reply #108 on: March 31, 2005, 04:11:10 PM »

Well it's beginning to look like they did try something else with the rested bonus downtime.  From the official boards:

1. At least one entire server (Icecrown?) missed the bonus completely

2. At least two servers are completely missing with the characters shown as being on a totally different server prompting rumors of an unannounced server merge.  Of course no one can log in to their servers (old or the new one that is showing the characters) to check

3. Numerous people are logging in as ghosts even though they were alive and in an inn when they logged out last night.  This includes the 10% equipment durability loss.

4. Not a word in general or the realm status threads about any problems
Logged
-Lord Ebonstone-
BANNED
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3428

get naked


View Profile WWW
« Reply #109 on: March 31, 2005, 06:28:07 PM »

Quote from: "unbreakable"
foolishness


Thank you, unbreakable, for bringing CG on step closer to the official WoW forums.  Your argumentative technique, best and completely summarized in the line, "stfu or quit," is just a sterling example of objective wisdom and rational thought.
Logged

xbl tag = cthonic horror

NNNOOOOOO!!
The Rocketman
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 433



View Profile
« Reply #110 on: April 01, 2005, 06:27:54 AM »

In my opinion, comparing WoW to a pizza with shit on, brings these forums closer to the official WoW-forums. Arguing intelligently about each point mentioned and, most importantly, staying polite (even when shown little respect) does not.

I respect Unbreakable for it, and not you or Blackader. I may not have many posts behind my name, but I've been here since the beginning, and I spent more than a year on the GoneGold-forums. Stop your whining and grow up. You've made your point, albeit you've not made a very good case for it, in my opinion.
Logged
Blackadar
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 3458



View Profile
« Reply #111 on: April 01, 2005, 01:14:04 PM »

Quote from: "The Rocketman"
In my opinion, comparing WoW to a pizza with shit on, brings these forums closer to the official WoW-forums. Arguing intelligently about each point mentioned and, most importantly, staying polite (even when shown little respect) does not.

I respect Unbreakable for it, and not you or Blackader. I may not have many posts behind my name, but I've been here since the beginning, and I spent more than a year on the GoneGold-forums. Stop your whining and grow up. You've made your point, albeit you've not made a very good case for it, in my opinion.


That's fine.  Perhaps I should use Unbreakable's logic.

stfu noob

Better?
Logged

Raise the bridge! I have an erection!
Knightshade Dragon
Administrator
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 21051



View Profile WWW
« Reply #112 on: April 01, 2005, 11:40:06 PM »

Cut it out.  Get civil or the thread gets locked.
Logged

Ron Burke
EiC, Director of Gaming Trend
Gamertag:
Gaming Trend
PS3 Tag: GamingTrend
unbreakable
Guest
« Reply #113 on: April 02, 2005, 06:15:21 AM »

Quote from: "Blackadar"


That's fine.  Perhaps I should use Unbreakable's logic.

stfu noob

Better?

I dont recall saying anything so infantile.  Having said that, it isnt bad advice  Tongue

As long as we are talking about the infantile WoW forums, perhaps you could confine your bitching to over there?  I know Ive been playing the game quite a bit the last few days, so if anybody tries saying they 'arent able to play' or some such nonsense is insane.

Likewise, claiming that you are 'paying for it' seems to ignore the fact that you are being reimbursed for downtime.  Hmmm.... did we forget about that?

I think Blizzard used 'riposte' and disarmed that arguement, myself.


[edit] I just realized of this- LE, didnt you quit WoW a while ago?
Logged
drifter
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 1246


View Profile
« Reply #114 on: April 02, 2005, 02:16:27 PM »

Actually L/E went as far to say that WoW was "dead to him".
Logged
unbreakable
Guest
« Reply #115 on: April 04, 2005, 02:55:33 AM »

apparently it still holds SOME sort of emotional attachment.
Logged
olaf
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 582


View Profile
« Reply #116 on: April 07, 2005, 02:08:41 AM »

Here are some bootleg patch notes for 1.4.0.  Not sure if these are the real deal or not.

http://home.comcast.net/~ambiencedrone/Patch_Notes.txt

olaf
Logged
Skeld
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 60


View Profile
« Reply #117 on: April 07, 2005, 01:26:21 PM »

Looks pretty plausible to me, and nothing really out of wreck.

The priest changes (on the assumption of this is a real patch note) seems to be pretty underwhelming again, but I am in an opinion of that priests are fine the way they are and just glad that there isn't any nerfs.

Warlock epic mount quest? Whoa, how do you justify a 900g quest reward?

Like the baroness change. Maybe now five manning Stratholme UD side would be possible, and I can get my argent crusader!... maybe.
Logged
Toe
Gaming Trend Senior Member

Offline Offline

Posts: 1493


View Profile
« Reply #118 on: April 07, 2005, 02:08:07 PM »

Quote from: "Skeld"
Looks pretty plausible to me, and nothing really out of wreck.

The priest changes (on the assumption of this is a real patch note) seems to be pretty underwhelming again, but I am in an opinion of that priests are fine the way they are and just glad that there isn't any nerfs.

Warlock epic mount quest? Whoa, how do you justify a 900g quest reward?


Yeah, if they are made-up patch notes, they did one hell of a job, thats for sure, especially on the minor things.

Yeah, its seems like the casting time change is a slight indirect nerf to one of the high discipline talents (which of course means a lot of priests will freak totally out) and some priests do not like that the anti-agro component is being removed from Holy Nova. Although I am curious how they can think that adding a non-agro damage spell will not cause problems. If you damage a mob with it and it has no other agro, does it instantly heal back up since its not agroed? Or, is there in fact a small agro component? Could a few priest Holy Nova a bunch of neutral creatures dead at no risk?

As for the epic mount quest, I am guessing it is going to require some materials that end up costing quite a bit of gold, like close to 900 smile
Logged
Skeld
Gaming Trend Reader

Offline Offline

Posts: 60


View Profile
« Reply #119 on: April 07, 2005, 07:12:05 PM »

Official Coming Soon Preview

Whoa, from what Blizzard posted, as well as tiny details on the "leaked" patch note, it seems like the note might after all, be authenticate.

About holy nova, if they kept the same damage amount (110 to 190), the only neutral creatures I can be AoEing to death is probably in the beginner's zone  :lol:

I am guessing that holy nova will not add any additional aggro when used. Still, I would rather have something that reduce aggro besides fade even if it's flaky at best. I doubt by changing that one talent would make people jump into holy tree (holy fire doesn't count  Tongue ).
Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.167 seconds with 103 queries. (Pretty URLs adds 0.044s, 2q)