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Author Topic: haha @ WOW  (Read 8545 times)
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Falator
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« on: November 24, 2004, 04:19:34 AM »

I was right, the fanbois were wrong! the server problems didn't just magically disapear after beta ended, from the fury on the wow boards, they are back with a vengence. Many people seem unable to log on because of long queues and what is blizard's response? are they saying they are sorry that people cannot use the product they payed money for? nope, they are spouting out bullshit by the shovel load about how queues are helpful. The funny part is that about 5 fanbois are running around trolling threads where people are complaining about paying customers being unable to play the game they payed for.

I am so glad that I didn't buy this game early on as it looks like i would have been ripped off.

oh and to those who bought it already, i am sorry for you and hope that the problems are resolved soon.
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Andy22
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« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2004, 04:26:02 AM »

Quote
are running around trolling threads


Speaking of trolling...
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« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2004, 04:47:14 AM »

strange, i've been playing intermittently all day and haven't had to wait in line at all.  been a lot of fun so far!  smile
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Toe
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« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2004, 05:38:30 AM »

I got on before the main crowd (around 11:30am CST). Played for several hours ok, then that database lag started hitting again (where you get "stuck" looting or doing anything else that involves your inventory). I logged out for 2 hours and watched some TV with the wife, then played for 4 more hours with no problems without waiting for any ques.

All in all, a pretty smooth first day for me. Sorry to hear some folks are having a rough time. My priest is 11th, pushing 12th.

I have to admit their heavy-handed "you should go to this server policy" is rather lame. I understand what they are trying to do, but you end up pissing off your best clients (the ones that are gonna play for years).
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« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2004, 06:19:22 AM »

If you are insistent upon playing on a specific server, especially an EST or CST one, then yeah your experience could easily rate as horrible.  The queue stuff blows.

But if you just want to play, hop on a low pop PST/MST server and its fine.  I havent noticed any lag or performance problems of any kind in those situations.

olaf
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Valhuerdi
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« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2004, 06:21:31 AM »

Queue time on Central PvP servers is close to four hours.
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Valael
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« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2004, 06:43:59 AM »

The CST and EST servers are a little laggy, but my play experience was far from unenjoyable.  Occasionally, it would take a few seconds to loot or release, but not near as bad as troll that started the thread would have people believe.
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« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2004, 06:46:03 AM »

no problems or lag at all tonight. west coast RP server "silver hand".
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« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2004, 07:30:02 AM »

Picked up the game and logged on this afternoon with not much problem. After about 3 hours server started getting incredibly laggy, worse then anytime during my time in Closed Beta. Solid minute or more to loot at times.
Played on for awhile then logged out for dinner, attempted to log back in after eating dinner and I get this queue message BS. Now here is the thing that I find ironic, Blizzard went on for months about how forced server localization was being implemented because it would severely reduce lag, most folks didnt believe it but this was the party line and all the "blue text" posters swore up and down this was the case. 1) Lag is/was pretty god awfull at times tonite 2)When I tryed logging in after dinner and got the queue message there was a huge notice asking folks to choose a server NOT in the Eastern or Central timezones and a statement to the effect that picking a timezone other then your own WOULD NOT RESULT IN LAG, ummm anyone else see the contradiction here?
The server I chose was in Central Timezone, my queue time was about an hour to get in game earlier and once I finally managed to log in the lag just kept getting worse and worse. At one point I had a mob beating on me while my character just stood there for about a minute and half doing nothing. I finally logged off after my 3rd lag death tonite, again something that never occured even once during beta.
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Falator
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« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2004, 07:45:06 AM »

Bah i don't see how you say this is a troll. Fanbois just piss me off. If someone can't play and you just past a canned Blizzard response, well... you really are just being an ass.

Oh and i do plan to buy wow once they iron out these problems, but 2 things about this situation are sort of funny. 1) fanbois always assume that the beta servers are made laggy for a reason and that after release the lag will magically disappear (they are nearly always wrong of course), and 2) Blizzard's response to these issues is really bad. telling people they can't play on the server they pick or that they have to wait hours to play is totally unacceptable. Shadowbane did similar things (telling people to play on other servers when the server they were on had "issues") and look where it is now.
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Valhuerdi
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« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2004, 07:57:04 AM »

The loot lag is worse than in the open beta, if you can believe that.

Of course, I need to qualify this by saying that I'm on Archimonde, which may be the most crowded PvP server.
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« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2004, 08:20:12 AM »

1) i love wow.  been playing for over a year now
2) i love blizzard.  even though i get free copies of their games, i always run out and buy one just to support them
3) im not pleased with the way things are going right now with wow.  seems like they underestimated the demand that there would be for the game, and the customers are paying for it.
4) i understand the reason for a queue but i also understand how people could be upset that they have to wait in line to play.  
5) i have faith that things will get worked out, though their margin for error is pretty short right now.
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« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2004, 08:22:27 AM »

Quote from: "Falator"
Bah i don't see how you say this is a troll. Fanbois just piss me off. If someone can't play and you just past a canned Blizzard response, well... you really are just being an ass.

Oh and i do plan to buy wow once they iron out these problems, but 2 things about this situation are sort of funny. 1) fanbois always assume that the beta servers are made laggy for a reason and that after release the lag will magically disappear (they are nearly always wrong of course), and 2) Blizzard's response to these issues is really bad. telling people they can't play on the server they pick or that they have to wait hours to play is totally unacceptable. Shadowbane did similar things (telling people to play on other servers when the server they were on had "issues") and look where it is now.

Hmm, I dont see where the schandenfreude is coming from, why you are deriving so much pleasure from Blizzard's difficulties.

FYI, I played quite a while, had to get off a highly crowded server (with a two hour wait after dinner); once I picked wisely, there were no problems whatsoever.
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« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2004, 03:27:44 PM »

I'm not a fanboy, I'll tell you if something is broken - When I logged on last night I had zero lag and zero queue time.  Its not a canned response, its just the truth.  *shrug*  Am I being an ass?
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« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2004, 03:36:08 PM »

I played for about 10 hours yesterday and had zero problems.  Zero lag.

s
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« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2004, 03:52:07 PM »

I don't have wow yet (waiting for these troubles to be fixed), but it is impossible to deny that many people are having these problems and yes, i think that if you just give them a canned response about how servers help the game when they can't play the game they paid for, you are being an ass.

Its like if a game has copy protection that won't work on many peoples' computers and i paste the copy protection maker's mission statement every time someone says something about it.
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« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2004, 04:12:46 PM »

I played on a CST server last night and had to wait about 7 or 8 minutes in the queue. There was definitely lag but not nearly as bad as the ridiculous lag there was in the Beta. I'd wait maybe 5-10 seconds for a loot sometimes, but that was about the extent of it.

And I don't see why there's such a hubub about Blizzard saying go play on other servers. I'd rather wait 10 minutes in a queue than play on a severely overloaded server and not be able to do anything.

I have a feeling once the holiday weekend is over things will settle down a bit.
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« Reply #17 on: November 24, 2004, 05:20:05 PM »

I think it was the sense of glee and delight at Blizzard's misfortunes that made the first post seem like a troll post. Still do, as a matter of fact.

And official Blizzard forums are always full of raging 12 year olds spewing vitriole. One should know better than to base any sort of opinion on anything you see there.
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Falator
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« Reply #18 on: November 24, 2004, 06:24:35 PM »

Quote from: "Gryndyl"
I think it was the sense of glee and delight at Blizzard's misfortunes that made the first post seem like a troll post. Still do, as a matter of fact.

And official Blizzard forums are always full of raging 12 year olds spewing vitriole. One should know better than to base any sort of opinion on anything you see there.

No, my glee and delight is about the fanbois being wrong. They said the same thing in shadowbane and I also doubted their "fanboism" then (and i was right of course).

So someone is a 12 year old because they are upset that they can't play the game they payed for? I guess i am a raging 12 year old too because when I buy something, I expect it to work, period. I don't like wasting my money and i don't see how someone is a 12 year old because they demand to get what they payed for.
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« Reply #19 on: November 24, 2004, 06:30:24 PM »

Maybe I've just gotten to where I'm too jaded to expect any PC game to work correctly for everyone on it's release day-jaded enough that it astonishes me that people are surprised that a game has bugs on release. Sure it's frustrating to be one of the people having problems but the launch day forums of a MMORPG are always full of these people ranting about how they're never going to play, how they want their time credited back to them, yada yada yada. At least it provides me some amusement reading them while I'm waiting for my server to come up Tongue
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Falator
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« Reply #20 on: November 24, 2004, 07:57:57 PM »

Quote from: "Gryndyl"
Maybe I've just gotten to where I'm too jaded to expect any PC game to work correctly for everyone on it's release day-jaded enough that it astonishes me that people are surprised that a game has bugs on release. Sure it's frustrating to be one of the people having problems but the launch day forums of a MMORPG are always full of these people ranting about how they're never going to play, how they want their time credited back to them, yada yada yada. At least it provides me some amusement reading them while I'm waiting for my server to come up Tongue

We have all become too jaded. Mmmorpgs are expected not to work decently post release for a while and we as gamers just bend over and take it. Same is true with other pc games, but to a lesser extent.

If you bought a car from information on the maker's site (lets assume you can't test drive it, look at it or otherwise get any other information on it) and the car had power windows which didn't work, you would be pissed, no? If a gamer buys a game and certain features don't work (or there are just a lot of bugs in the game), well... the gamer just takes it since it is the norm.
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« Reply #21 on: November 24, 2004, 08:23:44 PM »

Quote from: "Falator"
Quote from: "Gryndyl"
Maybe I've just gotten to where I'm too jaded to expect any PC game to work correctly for everyone on it's release day-jaded enough that it astonishes me that people are surprised that a game has bugs on release. Sure it's frustrating to be one of the people having problems but the launch day forums of a MMORPG are always full of these people ranting about how they're never going to play, how they want their time credited back to them, yada yada yada. At least it provides me some amusement reading them while I'm waiting for my server to come up Tongue

We have all become too jaded. Mmmorpgs are expected not to work decently post release for a while and we as gamers just bend over and take it. Same is true with other pc games, but to a lesser extent.

If you bought a car from information on the maker's site (lets assume you can't test drive it, look at it or otherwise get any other information on it) and the car had power windows which didn't work, you would be pissed, no? If a gamer buys a game and certain features don't work (or there are just a lot of bugs in the game), well... the gamer just takes it since it is the norm.


That is the difference between a $20,000 hardware appliance in a well-established market and a $50 software product in a relatively new and very volitile market.  If you want to hear about bad customer experiences just look back to the first cars for some of the worst ever!

PS- I'm not saying it is OK that games have bugs or issues or whatever, just that it is a very two-edged sword.  Either they throw a lot more time and money at the problems trying to make everything "perfect" before release (and still coming up short because of the limits of testing) or they release it as best they can and try to fix any issues that crop up as soon as they can.  

I only ran into one or two looting lags and no queues during my sessions yesterday, and I would assume that if people were smart enough not to jump on servers with super-high traffic they could have had a similar experience.
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« Reply #22 on: November 24, 2004, 11:19:17 PM »

I haven't experienced the "loot lag" yet, but those queue piss me off.  And the longest I've waited is 20 mins.  Four hours is ludicrous!
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« Reply #23 on: November 25, 2004, 12:38:35 AM »

Quote from: "Falator"
Quote from: "Gryndyl"
Maybe I've just gotten to where I'm too jaded to expect any PC game to work correctly for everyone on it's release day-jaded enough that it astonishes me that people are surprised that a game has bugs on release. Sure it's frustrating to be one of the people having problems but the launch day forums of a MMORPG are always full of these people ranting about how they're never going to play, how they want their time credited back to them, yada yada yada. At least it provides me some amusement reading them while I'm waiting for my server to come up Tongue

We have all become too jaded. Mmmorpgs are expected not to work decently post release for a while and we as gamers just bend over and take it. Same is true with other pc games, but to a lesser extent.

If you bought a car from information on the maker's site (lets assume you can't test drive it, look at it or otherwise get any other information on it) and the car had power windows which didn't work, you would be pissed, no? If a gamer buys a game and certain features don't work (or there are just a lot of bugs in the game), well... the gamer just takes it since it is the norm.


That  analogy doesn't hold up as a car is a "set and stable" thing that doesn't rely on factors beyond the manufacturer's control to work. A better analogy for a PC game would be a car radio manufacturer making a model of radio and consumers expecting it to work in every single model and style of car on the road straight out of the box. Not going to happen.
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« Reply #24 on: November 25, 2004, 01:12:24 AM »

My question for this whole thread is when did "fanboy" become "fanboi"...did I miss something?
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« Reply #25 on: November 25, 2004, 02:10:55 AM »

I'm sorry, I'm very unimpressed.
First of all I got on tonight (yes I realize it's a holiday night)
I picked a low usage "normal" server that had low usage.  It took awhile for it to get me to create a character but soon I was finished.  Tried to log in...says the world server is down...okay.  I go back and it says it is up, try again, says it is down.
I move to another server.  I create another character, it takes about 4 minutes for it to come up after I log into the game.  I kill my first wolf, 5 minutes later I still can't get my loot.  What a mess.  I can see lag on logging in, but this loot lag...I've never seen that before in any MMORPG like in this game.
Don't get me wrong, the game looks really good, but it has to be playable first.
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« Reply #26 on: November 25, 2004, 02:55:31 AM »

Its becoming one of the worse MMO launches to date and if you measured them by number of disappointed customers I imagine it vaults right to the top of the list.  Its certainly the worst launch week MMO experience I have had (DAoC, AC2, Lineage 2, EQ2, WoW).

The login server is down a lot.  Individual servers are down a lot, or have hour long queues to get on.  When you do get on, the backend lag (loot lag, npc lag, etc.) is worse than it ever was during the closed beta I participated in.

olaf
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« Reply #27 on: November 25, 2004, 03:55:20 AM »

Im surprised. This loot lag was horrible in the open beta and Blizzard knew that it was thier single item database server that was the cause. I cant believe they did'nt add more item servers to cover for it. At least in the beginning months of release. Just follows the normal trend of MMOs hoping it sorts itself out later. And no I still dont own it cause im broke.
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« Reply #28 on: November 25, 2004, 04:05:11 AM »

The guild server was pretty much unplayable, but I've been on Gilneas (EST) the entire night without one bit of lag. And the place is packed too.
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« Reply #29 on: November 25, 2004, 04:28:57 AM »

Quote from: "Daehawk"
Im surprised. This loot lag was horrible in the open beta and Blizzard knew that it was thier single item database server that was the cause. I cant believe they did'nt add more item servers to cover for it. At least in the beginning months of release. Just follows the normal trend of MMOs hoping it sorts itself out later. And no I still dont own it cause im broke.

They have one shared item database between all servers?  That's just idiotic.
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« Reply #30 on: November 25, 2004, 04:33:33 AM »

Quote from: "weeskwee"
no problems or lag at all tonight. west coast RP server "silver hand".


What's your character name weeskwee? My guild is on Bleeding Hollow, but I've also got an indie on Silver Hand. Moonsing the Night Elf druid.

Ale
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« Reply #31 on: November 25, 2004, 05:07:35 AM »

Quote from: "Vesper"
Quote from: "Daehawk"
Im surprised. This loot lag was horrible in the open beta and Blizzard knew that it was thier single item database server that was the cause. I cant believe they did'nt add more item servers to cover for it. At least in the beginning months of release. Just follows the normal trend of MMOs hoping it sorts itself out later. And no I still dont own it cause im broke.

They have one shared item database between all servers?  That's just idiotic.

I have heard that said before, but there is just no way that is the case.  They have 75 realms open now.

olaf
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« Reply #32 on: November 25, 2004, 08:11:17 AM »

Quote from: "Gryndyl"
Quote from: "Falator"
Quote from: "Gryndyl"
Maybe I've just gotten to where I'm too jaded to expect any PC game to work correctly for everyone on it's release day-jaded enough that it astonishes me that people are surprised that a game has bugs on release. Sure it's frustrating to be one of the people having problems but the launch day forums of a MMORPG are always full of these people ranting about how they're never going to play, how they want their time credited back to them, yada yada yada. At least it provides me some amusement reading them while I'm waiting for my server to come up Tongue

We have all become too jaded. Mmmorpgs are expected not to work decently post release for a while and we as gamers just bend over and take it. Same is true with other pc games, but to a lesser extent.

If you bought a car from information on the maker's site (lets assume you can't test drive it, look at it or otherwise get any other information on it) and the car had power windows which didn't work, you would be pissed, no? If a gamer buys a game and certain features don't work (or there are just a lot of bugs in the game), well... the gamer just takes it since it is the norm.


That  analogy doesn't hold up as a car is a "set and stable" thing that doesn't rely on factors beyond the manufacturer's control to work. A better analogy for a PC game would be a car radio manufacturer making a model of radio and consumers expecting it to work in every single model and style of car on the road straight out of the box. Not going to happen.

Your Analogy is terrible too. A better one would be if you ordered the cable HBO package and HBO didn't work. The basic idea is that they sold a product that was missing certain key features (namely the ability to use the product in question for some). The masses aren't complaining about bugs, they are complaining almost entirely about server related problems which blizzard was made aware of in beta.

Ignorance is NOT an excuse! Nearly every mmorpg has terrible launch problems so its not like mmorpg companies don't know that this stuff will happen. It is simply not a priority because gamers constantly put up with it.

Even so, chances are I will be buying Wow this weekend (supposed to be $40 at compusa this weekend). I would like to save my "$40 free month" for when the game is stable, but who knows how long i will be able to hold out heh. Maybe the fact that i will be ordering half life 2 ($34 gogamer special yah!) will help that though biggrin
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« Reply #33 on: November 25, 2004, 08:27:57 AM »

http://www.leagueofpirates.com/sirvival/queuedance.html
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« Reply #34 on: November 25, 2004, 09:20:51 AM »

The problem with the "they should have expected it" mentality is that you are talking about building a 500 lane highway just because it will see a lot of traffic over a holiday weekend.  Not only is it unrealistic to expect such a thing, but it is also economically infeasible.

Yes, Im sure they were planning on having a million users or whatever at lauch.  But likely not all on at the same time.  And even if they DID plan on having that many people on at the same time, many is the slip between the cup and the lip.  They have no control over their physical connection to the internet, for example, or for the routers in between you and their servers, or whatever.  They also cannot test their client on a million different computer configurations, etc.  

And, as everyone says, you can simulate a full capacity load, but simulations never compare to the real thing.  The most you can do is try your best and cross your fingers.  Expecting anything more is just plain silly.

Having said all that, I have yet to experience more than very slight problems.  Comparing WoW to the UO launch, the EQ launch, and the ungoldly AO launch, it is going smooth as silk.  Kudos to Blizzard.

Sometimes its just best to have a little perspective on things, guys.
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« Reply #35 on: November 25, 2004, 09:18:19 PM »

Reading the posts in this thread makes me think of a question for all of you:

I THINK Toe posted that in one day his character is already 11, pushing the 12th level.  Doesn't this scare anyone?  Maybe it's because I'm so used to FFXI that I like it when you have to *earn* levels.  Is leveling really easy in WoW?  What's the level cap?  Sorry to derail the topic a bit, but those are some questions I have when I read through this thread.
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« Reply #36 on: November 25, 2004, 11:02:34 PM »

I played for almost 4 hours last night and had absolutely no lag whatsoever. I had a complete blast and can see myself sticking with it which will be the first MMORPG I have done that with since UO.
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« Reply #37 on: November 26, 2004, 12:02:53 AM »

Quote from: "depward"
I THINK Toe posted that in one day his character is already 11, pushing the 12th level.  Doesn't this scare anyone?  Maybe it's because I'm so used to FFXI that I like it when you have to *earn* levels.  Is leveling really easy in WoW?  What's the level cap?  Sorry to derail the topic a bit, but those are some questions I have when I read through this thread.


Level cap is 60.

I haven't played FFXI, but from what I've heard, I wouldn't compare it to WoW.

Anyway, I've seen guys around level eighteen already, and know there must be those who are higher. Some are sure to powerlevel. And by doing so, they're likely neglecting cash and tradeskills. But it doesn't really matter, I don't think-- someone might make 60 in a couple of weeks, but the average player isn't going to "run out of things to do" in that amount of time, or anything, if that's what you're worried about.

I've personally only been able to make level 12 in about sixteen hours. (On the character, not total across alts and server changes.) Though I'd have been quite a bit faster were it not for lag, mob competition, and limited cash/gear due to the young economy, I think.
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« Reply #38 on: November 26, 2004, 12:18:31 AM »

As far as easy leveling, Blizzard plans a lot of raid content.  The earliest raid content (Onyxia) is for level 60's.  With this in mind, leveling fastish is to be expected so people can end up participating in it all.  Leveling slows down a bit at some of the higher levels, but it's fun always.

Back to the topic at hand, with a free trial extension for the people who had accounts in the downtime I think Blizzard has all their bases covered.  I'm perfectly happy with their solution and can't think of other companies that have done such a thing, can anyone else?
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« Reply #39 on: November 26, 2004, 12:27:26 AM »

I'm averaging about a level an hour at the moment.  Of course, I spent at least an hour and a half maxing out my Tailoring skill, so I technically could be higher if I wanted to.

Remember, between the Closed Beta, the Stress Tests, and the Open Beta, MANY different people have had a TON of exposure to this game.  They already know the paths of least resistance--and they're sure as hell following them.
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