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Author Topic: Daily Tech says R600 kicks 8800's arse  (Read 1926 times)
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Daehawk
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« on: January 01, 2007, 10:10:59 PM »

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=5524

Beats it by 4% - 43% or so.
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« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2007, 11:32:12 PM »

I really wish they could find some better system than just random numbers for their naming conventions.  How do they go from 800s up to 1900s and now back to 600?  Then you have the MX, GT, GTS, GTX, etc.  How the hell is anyone but a dedicated enthusiast supposed to know which ones are actually better than older models?  The best is when they re-release an older, slower chipset using new naming conventions which basically implies it is faster than the fast chips of the older named chipset. 
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« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2007, 11:39:53 PM »

It may kick nVidia's ass, but I've never been impressed with ATI's drivers.  The only time I've had to roll back drivers (multiple times) was when I had a Radeon 9600 card.  I was so glad to get back to nVidia.
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« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2007, 11:43:13 PM »

Quote
When DailyTech contacted the site owner to get verification of the benchmarks, the owner replied that the benchmark screenshots could not be published due to origin-specific markers that would trace the card back to its source

Yeah, that sounds reliable.  Why waste our time with this?

Secondly, ATI could release a video card that gives blowjobs and I still wouldn't buy one.  Been burned, often, won't be back - ever. Besides, I would have to be pretty sadistic to put myself through endless driver headaches that come hand in hand with ATI.
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« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2007, 11:47:55 PM »

Everyone says they have been having driver issues with ATI...I never once experienced them...Last ATI card I sold was an X800XL.  I don't have any brand loyalty, I just go with what is the best (or close to the best). 
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« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2007, 02:49:59 PM »

Same here no issue with ATI drivers ever.

Used an Nvidia for along time and had to deal with some sort of incompatibility between their drivers and my turtle beach santa cruz sound card drivers.

Both companies are reliable and do a good job.
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« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2007, 03:44:27 PM »

I've never had issues with ATI drivers, but have to admit there is a bit of upkeep involved. However, as long as you follow directions it goes smoothly. Furthermore, ATI does not crack down on alternate drivers, and I think that's beautiful. The OMEGA drivers don't seem to be any sort of miracle, but they're out there and give power users some extra control over the hardware.

NVIDIA, on the other hand, has a small branch of RIAA tactics when it comes to their drivers. And they have a patent infringement lawsuit against them which may explain why they don't want anyone messing with them. The good part to this is tight control and not a lot of mess when it comes to Nvidia drivers which a majority of users attribute to stability.
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« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2007, 04:18:16 PM »

The main thing which solidified my feelings toward ATI and nVidia were a statement from John Carmack.  He said something to the effect that if he has a problem with something he wrote not displaying properly, if the machine is using ATI he assumes it's an error in the drivers, and if it's nVidia, he assumes he made a mistake in his programming.

Having said that, I've been using ATI cards for a long time (it just works out that way).  I stick to using Omega Drivers exclusively, and haven't had many problems.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2007, 04:20:47 PM by unbreakable » Logged
Destructor
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« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2007, 05:53:36 PM »

I have absolutely no problems with my ATI drivers either, short of ATI not allowing you to use their drivers on any and all laptops that have an ATI card inside.
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« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2007, 07:10:52 PM »

Quote from: Destructor on January 02, 2007, 05:53:36 PM

I have absolutely no problems with my ATI drivers either, short of ATI not allowing you to use their drivers on any and all laptops that have an ATI card inside.
The chip in the laptop is not equal to an ATI video card. Though I suspect some of it is licensing too. I have the same gripe with my 1705 in wanting a few more FPS out of WoW, but none of the latest Catalyst or OMEGA drivers do any better; in fact, sometimes worse.

Perhaps its a graphical memory limitation?
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« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2007, 08:42:42 PM »

Quote from: javahead on January 02, 2007, 07:10:52 PM

Quote from: Destructor on January 02, 2007, 05:53:36 PM

I have absolutely no problems with my ATI drivers either, short of ATI not allowing you to use their drivers on any and all laptops that have an ATI card inside.
The chip in the laptop is not equal to an ATI video card. Though I suspect some of it is licensing too. I have the same gripe with my 1705 in wanting a few more FPS out of WoW, but none of the latest Catalyst or OMEGA drivers do any better; in fact, sometimes worse.

No, it's something that ATI has integrated in the last set of driver revisions. At the point where they stopped supporting the 8000 line of cards (I think), they stopped supporting any and all laptop based cards. I used to use the standard ATI drivers in my older laptop (which was a dedicated 9600 Pro with 64MB of RAM) until that driver revision.
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« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2007, 08:48:29 PM »

But I have a dedicated x1400 in my lappy and have the same issues. The hardware is not the same (laptop vs dedicated pci-e or agp card). Cooling is different, voltage is different, # of transistors is probably different, but I don't know how deeply the drivers affect those things.

My AGP 9800SE from Power Color still runs the latest Catalyst just fine.
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« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2007, 08:54:31 PM »

I prefer nVidia myself. Though if a substantially faster card came out from ATI and was a lot cheaper then Id probably at least try it. But I loves me some nVidia. Ever since I switched from Diamond and got a nVidia TNT2 Ultra.

BTW The one time I tried those Omega drivers I hated them. They crashed crashed crashed and did all kinds of crap. I never ever want them on ym machine again.
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« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2007, 12:08:38 AM »

Quote from: javahead on January 02, 2007, 08:48:29 PM

But I have a dedicated x1400 in my lappy and have the same issues. The hardware is not the same (laptop vs dedicated pci-e or agp card). Cooling is different, voltage is different, # of transistors is probably different, but I don't know how deeply the drivers affect those things.

I'm still confused as to why my Compaq's 9600 Pro then worked just fine with ATI's official drivers until just recently then. It's like asking how many licks there are to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop. The world will never know. *shrugs*

What you're saying does make sense though, don't get me wrong. I'm just a confused gamer.
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« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2007, 05:11:59 AM »

I no longer have an ATI, but you may want to make sure you are selecting the Mobility Radeon in their driver selection screen and not just the regular Radeon.  As stated above they are not the exact same and do use different drivers.  My guess is they previously bundled the drivers for the Mobility line in with the full Radeon pack and have recently switched them to be two separate downloads. 
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« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2007, 05:16:04 AM »

Quote from: Kobra on January 01, 2007, 11:43:13 PM

Secondly, ATI could release a video card that gives blowjobs and I still wouldn't buy one.

I would buy two of them and run them in their buggy Crossfire mode.  I could finally justify the cost.

I have both an ATI and an nVidia card.  I have been happy with both and would probably buy the fastest available at the time of purchase.  Of course I'd read plenty of reviews before hand to make sure there aren't any major issues.
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« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2007, 12:49:29 PM »

Quote from: EngineNo9 on January 03, 2007, 05:11:59 AM

I no longer have an ATI, but you may want to make sure you are selecting the Mobility Radeon in their driver selection screen and not just the regular Radeon. 
And they've just totally revamped their web site so the Mobility stuff is easier to find (was quite a pain a couple months ago). So I'll have to try that when I get home from work today.

http://ati.amd.com/support/drivers/xp/mobility-xp.html  But Dell isnt on the supported list  icon_evil
I'll have to try it anyway.
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« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2007, 01:28:01 PM »

Quote from: javahead on January 03, 2007, 12:49:29 PM

Quote from: EngineNo9 on January 03, 2007, 05:11:59 AM

I no longer have an ATI, but you may want to make sure you are selecting the Mobility Radeon in their driver selection screen and not just the regular Radeon. 
And they've just totally revamped their web site so the Mobility stuff is easier to find (was quite a pain a couple months ago). So I'll have to try that when I get home from work today.

http://ati.amd.com/support/drivers/xp/mobility-xp.html  But Dell isnt on the supported list  icon_evil
I'll have to try it anyway.

You're wasting your time. The 'installation verification software' the site forces you to run will happily tell you to visit your manufacturer to get your drivers, as ATI's aren't supported for whatever crazy idea.

"Certain mobile products are blocked from downloading the Catalyst® Mobility™ software driver available from the AMD web site. This is to protect systems from installing drivers that may disable features or functionality provided by the system manufacture."

What a load of bullcrap. Complete and total bullcrap.
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« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2007, 01:46:40 PM »

Quote
You're wasting your time. The 'installation verification software' the site forces you to run will happily tell you to visit your manufacturer to get your drivers, as ATI's aren't supported for whatever crazy idea.

"Certain mobile products are blocked from downloading the Catalyst® Mobility™ software driver available from the AMD web site. This is to protect systems from installing drivers that may disable features or functionality provided by the system manufacture."

What a load of bullcrap. Complete and total bullcrap.
Yes, bastids! I blame Dell and I am preparing to flame the customer service department on the scale of "Royal Fashion."
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« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2007, 06:28:50 PM »

That concept pretty much defeats the purpose of "reference drivers", doesn't it?
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« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2007, 09:21:45 PM »

Quote from: unbreakable on January 03, 2007, 06:28:50 PM

That concept pretty much defeats the purpose of "reference drivers", doesn't it?

Tell me about it. I love ATI, don't get me wrong, but this 'feature' pisses me off to no end.
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« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2007, 10:08:44 PM »

Daehawk, I used to have issues with the omegas too, but recent releases (in the last year or two), have been rock solid. And the integrated extras make for a very nice package. Might wanna give them another shot. I'm using the latest right now with zero issues.

Atomic

(edit) assuming you still have any radeons laying around, that is. All that said, I'm probably switching back to nvidia going forward from here. my x800xl has been nice, but I think nvidia 'has it' for awhile. we shall see. It'll be interesting to see what amd-ati does, in the future.
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« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2007, 01:29:26 AM »

Someone PM me someday if ATI starts offering cards that give oral sex, then I will take a look at whatever they got, but no promises.  icon_lol
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« Reply #23 on: January 12, 2007, 03:58:31 AM »

I go where the performance is. If the R600 comes out and rocks the house and has solid driver support.. then sure I'll buy one.

For the moment though.. my 8800GTX arrives tomorrow.
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« Reply #24 on: January 12, 2007, 08:38:13 PM »

I only concern myself with video cards once something going twice as fast as my current card falls into the $250 range.
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