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Author Topic: Xbox 2 and Cartridges might have some teeth?  (Read 2016 times)
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Tebunker
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« on: January 25, 2005, 12:34:18 AM »

After reading Gamespot's rumor control, it looks like the Xbox2 might be going more and more towards a form of solid state media for gaming.

Truth be told, if they can get enough space to affordably do this, I'd be all for it.

Don't have to worry about scratches and what have you, just plug in like Flash media and start playing, no need for any real loadtimes etc. I know that we will eventually head back to solid state as it gets cheaper and cheaper as it is generally more durable and also elminates load times. This could also explain why the Xbox2 probably won't have a hard-drive.

Things like this make me more interested in what MS is upto than less. I'd rather seem them take different directions rather than try to follow Sony like I feel they did this generation.
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stiffler
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« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2005, 12:56:18 AM »

Is there any possible way this could be cost-effective?  With DVD's holding up to 8 GB of data...

I would not mind at all if it were true, but I can't imagine it being anything more than something like a CF card for storage.
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« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2005, 02:47:36 AM »

I would suggest that they go back to a NES style cartridge.  The gripper grooves ensured no slip insertions into the deck.

That was mighty fine!
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Jumangi
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« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2005, 06:53:54 AM »

Thee cost effectivness of any flash media around and a DVD format isn't even in the same galaxy in terms of being close. There is zero reason for them to change from disc media. Its proven, its cheap and it allows the system to do things like be a DVD player too. No idea why people have taken the rumors of MS doing stuff with flash type media meaning that must be how games on the next Xbox will be. There's other much more logical reason for it i.e as a storage medium for the system.
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Dafones
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« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2005, 07:39:31 AM »

What if they managed to cook up a system that used standard USB flash memory sticks as the storage device(s)? Or if they wanted to make money - and gorsh, who don't? - an Xbox2 specific USB memory device that doubled as a memory stick for PCs, like the new iPod?
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Graham
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« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2005, 07:38:49 PM »

Quote from: "Dafones"
What if they managed to cook up a system that used standard USB flash memory sticks as the storage device(s)? Or if they wanted to make money - and gorsh, who don't? - an Xbox2 specific USB memory device that doubled as a memory stick for PCs, like the new iPod?

The problem with this is that it would probably be very easy to hack a way to use regular USB memory devices.  This would make it very easy to pirate games then.

I really have a hard time seeing the Xbox2 using flash memory unless they have a way to figure out a way to make it very cost-effective.
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HankRaptor
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« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2005, 09:19:39 PM »

I would LOVE it.

But it wont happen 37 cents to print a DVD cant be beat... and they make all their butter on software... so forget it. I cant imagine flash being that cheap.
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leo8877
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« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2005, 09:33:08 PM »

There is not a chance in the world this would happen.
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Tebunker
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« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2005, 03:23:32 AM »

Remember, if they use Disk media for the next system it will either be Blu-Ray or HD-DVD and those are not yet cheap enough to make them that much more cost effective.
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AgtFox
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« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2005, 03:25:45 AM »

My guess is that if there is a cartridge system it would be for save games and downloads, not as a game medium.  That's just a guess though.
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Graham
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« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2005, 04:53:58 AM »

Quote from: "Tebunker"
Remember, if they use Disk media for the next system it will either be Blu-Ray or HD-DVD and those are not yet cheap enough to make them that much more cost effective.

Sony has already announced the PS3 will use Blu-Ray. so they can't be all that far from mass production.  Also, building consoles with this technology will help the process get better and hopefully bring costs down.

Also, rumor is that the Xbox2 might not be released at the $300 price point.
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maggie-chow
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« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2005, 06:01:19 AM »

Definitely no chance games will be on flash media.  It will be optical.  It's all about cost.

I'm betting it will be the same standard DVDs.  Many people may not know this, but most Xbox games in the current generation are less than 3 GB in size.  If a few games go over the 4.4GB limit, why not use a second disk?  Change is not needed.

I wish the "superstar geniuses" who came up with the current DVD standard would have put the DVD in a thin plastic case, much like a floppy is a disk in a case.  I'm sure these "superstar geniuses" knew all about the scratches that would make DVDs unplayable and that would force consumers to buy new copies.  Little did they expect us to copy them ...
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Jumangi
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« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2005, 08:55:47 AM »

Quote from: "Tebunker"
Remember, if they use Disk media for the next system it will either be Blu-Ray or HD-DVD and those are not yet cheap enough to make them that much more cost effective.


Yes it would be. Far cheaper. HD and Blue ray costs will come down in time like regular DVD costs have. The cost diffrential between flash media and DVD(even Blue-ray) is allot. Its not even remotely close.


Even if you stick with today's dual-layer DVD's you have about 9GB of storage for 40 cents or so. How much would even a 1GB flash card cost?

This stuff is for a storage medium for saves, and DL's like maps and such.
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Rob_Merritt
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« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2005, 04:32:23 PM »

I think the cartridges are replacements for the harddrive.
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Laner
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« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2005, 05:04:56 PM »

Quote from: "Tebunker"
Remember, if they use Disk media for the next system it will either be Blu-Ray or HD-DVD and those are not yet cheap enough to make them that much more cost effective.

While they very well may use next-gen technology (Sony in particular has a vested interest), since both standards are backwards compatible, I imagine we'll see plenty of DVD-media games for next-gen consoles... the PS2 has many games on CD-ROM, for example.  And there are very few current titles (to my knowledge) that use more space than a single-layer DVD can hold.

Regardless, as others have pointed out, HD-DVD or Blu-ray would still be far cheaper than flash media.
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I wish the "superstar geniuses" who came up with the current DVD standard would have put the DVD in a thin plastic case, much like a floppy is a disk in a case. I'm sure these "superstar geniuses" knew all about the scratches that would make DVDs unplayable and that would force consumers to buy new copies.

Or you could just take care of your media smile
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kong
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« Reply #15 on: January 26, 2005, 07:00:40 PM »

Cost effectiveness means nothing if the media is easy to pirate.  I'm sure Microsoft is going to make some major changes after watching what has happened with the current generation systems.  Plus the extra cost of blu-ray or hd-dvd won't matter since the next gen titles are going to retail for higher prices.
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Punisher
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« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2005, 02:24:36 PM »

Quote from: "kong"
Cost effectiveness means nothing if the media is easy to pirate.  I'm sure Microsoft is going to make some major changes after watching what has happened with the current generation systems.  Plus the extra cost of blu-ray or hd-dvd won't matter since the next gen titles are going to retail for higher prices.


The reality is that there is nothing they can do about piracy, sort of hiring somebody to go home with you when you purchase a game and stay there. I cannot recall ANY media that hasn't been pirated in some way. You can even get pirated gameboy games, which are cartridge based.

I wouldn't want cartridged based as they will probably take up a lot more storage space.

I would like to see flah drives as an option for save games and PC downloaded maps/addons. Also, if they keep the HDD in, I would like a way to access it via my PC to backup savegames and such.
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Chrisoc13
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« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2005, 11:39:03 PM »

Quote from: "kong"
Cost effectiveness means nothing if the media is easy to pirate.  I'm sure Microsoft is going to make some major changes after watching what has happened with the current generation systems.  Plus the extra cost of blu-ray or hd-dvd won't matter since the next gen titles are going to retail for higher prices.


Whoa. Higher prices for next gen titles? Is this confirmed and for sure, or mere speculation? I would hate that. I think $50 is pretty darn expensive as it is, and Im usually hard pressed to pay that much, let alone more.
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Dafones
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« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2005, 10:09:41 AM »

Quote from: "Punisher"
I cannot recall ANY media that hasn't been pirated in some way.


Huh, I thought that the Cube had escaped pirating with its nutty little wafer game disks.
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maggie-chow
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« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2005, 04:40:55 AM »

Pretty sure Gamecube has one mod chip out now.  But I'm not familiar with how well it works.  In any case, I guess by using proprietary discs, the Cube was much more difficult to crack.

HD-DVD could be more secure for XBNext ... given that readers and writers would be so expensive and rare when it came out.  Remains to be seen whether the price for that new technology is worth it.
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