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Author Topic: Warhammer 40k - Dark Crusade Impressions and Thoughts  (Read 6854 times)
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Scott
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« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2006, 02:10:08 PM »

1) Necrons are very slow, but I've found them pretty easy so far, at least on the 'normal' difficulty.  The speed has only hurt on the mission that you needed to find 6 servitors (or whatever they are called).

I love the Necron Lord, incredibly powerful.  And the base units are pretty solid as well.  It seems the Necrons can build a very powerful econonmy very quickly.  If you ever get to the Monolith coming out of the ground though, you probably are doing something wrong.

2) The Tau are interesting.  Their biggest fault is that the Kroot branch is probably the best, and that is the least popular branch in the real 40k setting.    The battlesuits don't seem powerful enough right now, or durable enough.  I wish there was another setting instead of assault or ranged stance, maybe a fall back stance, where the battlesuits would jump out of harms way.  If you are playing the Orcs as the Tau, you're in big trouble if you don't watch the battle all the time.

3) The Harlequins are incredible for the Eldar.  They'll chop apart full Space Marine squads, and fight the commanders to a stand still it seems. It is unfortunate that Reliq didn't put the new Wraithlord designs in the game though.

Can't decide which race to really push throught he campaign with.  I just need to do it and then switch up.  All are pretty fun.  I think in the end I still like the Space Marines and their 'fluff' a bit more then some of the other races.  The Necrons just are kind of boring.  The Tau are pretty interesting though.



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« Reply #41 on: October 13, 2006, 03:31:45 PM »

LD,  I should have this next week, so I should be down for some online matches once I get some campaign play under my belt.
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« Reply #42 on: October 13, 2006, 03:48:55 PM »

Excellent Soulchilde.

Let me know when you're ready to go. 

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« Reply #43 on: October 13, 2006, 11:01:30 PM »

i'm around as well.  I wouldn't mind playing either
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« Reply #44 on: October 14, 2006, 02:58:13 AM »

Tried to pick this up tonight.  Two different Best Buys near me show it as in stock, plus they both have the gold pack of the original.  This is good because I apparently lost my copy of Winter Assault, so I may need that, though I'll be looking for Winter Assault by itself, which seems to be a rare thing these days.

Rode the 40 minutes by subway to the closer Best Buy.  It's now about 8:30pm.  Ask sales guy (who sounds like Boris from Rocky and Bullwinkle), he gets a blank look on his face, then goes and looks in the computer.  He tells me they have one, but that they have four at the other Best Buy.  I say, but you have one? He tells me that he doesn't think he'll be able to find it.  I say, but you'll look, right?  Of course, he says.  So we both go look (which I had already done, with my leet "I've worked retail for six years" skillz), and nope, not there.  But, he says, the other store has four in stock, and they don't close until ten (it's now nine).

So off I hustle to the other store.  Another 35 minutes of train.  Get to the second store, which had four in stock.  Again, look through section.  Look again.  Nothing.  Ask sales guy.  He says that they just brought out everything they had, but apparently they're all gone, because they're not there anymore.  I tell him I'll definitely need a raincheck for the sale price.  He goes to three different computers trying to find one that works, and finally finds one.  When he sets up the raincheck, it tells him that the store has four in stock.  I ask him about that, and he says that either they all got stolen, or it's an inventory problem.  Apparently, every Best Buy has inventory problems.  Get the raincheck, and he tells me that they'll email me when they get another copy in.

So I have my raincheck, and I'm not worried, because the Best Buy inventory system is on the case.  On the plus side, I found a copy of Winter Assault at the second store, which saved me a grand total of five bucks, but at least I got something out of the three hour trip.  Of course, now that I'm home, I'm too tired to play anything, so I guess I'll just go watch West Wing.  Hopefully sometime next week...
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Atragon
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« Reply #45 on: October 14, 2006, 07:14:57 PM »

One thing I have to say about the Necrons, they're as tough as nails.

Spoiler for Hiden:
In the single player campaign, when you assault the Eldar home territory you have to capture 3 large warpgates and hold them for 10 minutes. The gates are laid out in a triangle and in the middle is the Eldar main base, which consists primarily of 4 aspect shrines, 3 support portals, and a ton of Fire Prisims, Aspect Warriors, and Wraithlords. (We're talking seeing 8 Fire Prisims at a time.)

Instead of capturing the 3 warpgates and holding them, I poked my nose into the middle with a full army (about 4 squads of Crypt warriors, 2 of Crypt immortals, 3 of Catacomb flayed ones, 8 squads of Flayed ones, a squad of Crypt Pariahs, 7 heavy destroyers, my Necron Lord, and a Restored Monolith). I literally left a carpet of bodies storming the ramps, thankfully the ressurection orb and skillful timing of mass resurrection let me slowly work my way through their base... 10 minutes, 1 Restored Monolith, 8 new squads of Flayed Ones, 10 new Destroyers, and much disbelief of the fact that my assault force hadn't been wiped out. In fact, by the time I cleared out their main base I had just about doubled my initial force of honor guard units.

With a lord equipped with the ressurection orb they're hard to kill for good, and they hit hard.
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Chaz
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« Reply #46 on: October 14, 2006, 08:16:06 PM »

Managed to track down a copy today.  Called two more Best Buys this morning, and the first was another one where their computer said they had two in, but none actually there.  Fourth store had it.  Fourth store also had a bunch of jewel case stuff on sale, and I picked up Sacred for $2.  They also had Missing for $2, which I would've gotten if I didn't already have it.

I haven't installed yet, but I do like that I managed to fit the discs and manuals for the entire series into the case for Dark Crusade.  I'll get around to installing after I clean up around the apartment.
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« Reply #47 on: October 14, 2006, 08:36:26 PM »

The Necron rock and all, but a skilled player can quickly handicap them early in the game. Scarabs are so weak, and the Necron warrior squads don't hit for enough....if you can get in, blow up their plasma generators, you've effectively handicapped them for awile.

On a related note, anyone know how in the fuck you are suppossed to stop Orcs on Normal with the Imperial Guard? Right now Ive got a major slug fest going on between the Orcs, Imperial Guard (me), and the Necrons, and Im losing ground to both of em. No matter territory I attack, its two entire bases and armies vs me, and they just rush my ass with tons of orcs or flayed ones. Heavy weapon teams help stem the tide, but not long enough to get Hellhounds or the Baneblade. Tips?
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Kobra
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« Reply #48 on: October 14, 2006, 09:44:18 PM »

They REALLY increased difficulty I am finding.

Also there seems to be some big balance issues that need addressing.. Necrons and Tau can't really stand up to the older generation factions.  Taus battlesuits go down like candy to even lower end tanks the other teams have.  Necrons get hit early, hard and fast, and their units are paper targets a good portion of any match, and their later units cannot stand up to the bigger and tougher units other the other factions.

Overall, I DO like the new factions, but feel they didn't balance them well enough.
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« Reply #49 on: October 14, 2006, 10:26:46 PM »

Yea they really upped the ai I'm playing as the tau in a campaign on normal and getting my ass handed to me by the orcs.
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Kobra
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« Reply #50 on: October 14, 2006, 10:46:59 PM »

Orks are exceptionally strong now..  They destroy me pretty badly.

I just played as Orks and slaughtered the AI which was playing Necrons difficulty=Hard.  I cannot believe how powerful orks are.. LOL

Definately some underpowered issues with Necrons and Tau with this release, the old school factions are much much more powerful imo.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2006, 11:51:28 PM by Kobra » Logged

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« Reply #51 on: October 15, 2006, 12:02:12 AM »

I wanted to add.. Playing DOW again makes me *REALLY* appreciate the Army-Manager in Paraworld!  Its like I got my dick chopped off when I play DOW, the entire time I am moving my mouse over to click an army-manager that isn't there.

Ugh.
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« Reply #52 on: October 15, 2006, 01:17:13 AM »

I'm playing as the Space Marines and enjoying it.  Good balance between offense and defense however, I have never been able to beat the Necron even when I have the advantage. 
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Scott
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« Reply #53 on: October 15, 2006, 02:33:05 AM »

Quote
Necrons and Tau can't really stand up to the older generation factions.
I agree that Tau seems to have issues, but the Necrons are pretty easy so far.  In a lot of the scenarios, the fact that you don't have to leave your base as the Necrons for quite a while is huge I'm finding.  I don't have to protect the base, and capture resource points as I would have to do with non-Necron armies.  So far, I have the hero and build a couple warrior squads, while constantly pumping the generators.  I've been able to hold fairly well for the most part, sometimes with the help of a turret.  On missions that it is fairly even, I "rush" (slow walk with necrons) the enemy base and do either massive damage or win outright.  This is all on normal, fyi.

I've tried some of the other factions, and have had a rough time on some of the maps.  I thought I was decent with the Space Marines, but so far the Necrons just seem easier, especially when rushed.
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« Reply #54 on: October 15, 2006, 10:51:05 AM »

Scott, you need to move up to Hard or Harder when skirmishing, if you haven't already.  You are too good for Normal.

 drillsergeant 

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« Reply #55 on: October 15, 2006, 03:40:56 PM »

A comment re marines vs necrons: Dreadnaughts, Grey Knights, Terminators, Space Marines and Scouts with plasma guns, Close Combat Heroes.

Those will kill them dead.

The only problem I have facing off against necrons in SP is that when they have multiple bases they have multiple lords. And I've found it takes a lot of plasma fire to drop a lord... either that or a full grey knight squad. Side note: It'd be sweet if we could get Grey Knight Terminators.
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« Reply #56 on: October 16, 2006, 12:23:27 AM »

Quote from: Lockdown on October 15, 2006, 10:51:05 AM

Scott, you need to move up to Hard or Harder when skirmishing, if you haven't already.  You are too good for Normal.

 drillsergeant 



Is it just me or does Dark Crusade skirmish seem much easier after playing CoH.  I routinely get my clock cleaned on normal in CoH.  Yet I win pretty consistantly on normal in Dark Crusade.
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« Reply #57 on: October 16, 2006, 12:44:02 AM »

I'm finding Normal to be almost effortless in Dark Crusade.  Maybe the AI doesn't even build units on Easy.
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« Reply #58 on: October 16, 2006, 01:47:12 AM »

My impressions:

I put all the DoW stuff in the Dark Crusade case.  Everything fit perfectly on the big spindle and the manuals go in nicely as well.  Perfect! A+ case. thumbsup

Now if only I had made time this weekend to play the game. paranoid
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« Reply #59 on: October 16, 2006, 02:32:21 AM »

The Tau are worthless against combined forces of any other race.
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« Reply #60 on: October 16, 2006, 03:45:16 AM »

Quote from: Thin_J on October 16, 2006, 02:32:21 AM

The Tau are worthless against combined forces of any other race.

Ask CSL to send you some replays,  he's a beast with the Tau.
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« Reply #61 on: October 16, 2006, 02:32:24 PM »

Quote from: denoginizer on October 16, 2006, 12:23:27 AM

Is it just me or does Dark Crusade skirmish seem much easier after playing CoH.  I routinely get my clock cleaned on normal in CoH.  Yet I win pretty consistently on normal in Dark Crusade.

Deno, I would agree it is much easier on Normal.  If I remember correctly though, DoW has 5 A.I. settings, whereas CoH has only 3. 

The funny thing about Dark Crusade is that the difficulty people have playing versus someone else is about more than just a player's skill level.  There are at least 2 other things that can dramatically turn the tide:

1. Certain Race vs. Certain Race.  There are some races that just inherently have a very difficult time dealing with other races, and there is no way around this.

2. Certain Maps.  There are certain map setups that are either wide open or amazingly maze-like.  Certain races are much better at dealing with these types of map differentials than others.  Not to mention map size being a factor.

I'm sure there are more, but those two come to mind immediately.  And don't take this post as a complaint, as I'm not complaining at all.  But it does make you appreciate how difficult it must be to balance a tactical-level RTS game with 7 unique armies and a very large selection of maps.
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Thin_J
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« Reply #62 on: October 16, 2006, 10:30:44 PM »

Quote from: SuperHiro
Ask CSL to send you some replays,  he's a beast with the Tau.

I don't know what would convince me. The only race their units seem to do well against early on are the Eldar.

I'd swear the armor in the battlesuits is made of paper or something. Even after the health/armor upgrades they still get the crap knocked out of them even by lower level IG stuff.
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« Reply #63 on: October 17, 2006, 04:16:42 AM »

Quote from: Thin_J on October 16, 2006, 10:30:44 PM

Quote from: SuperHiro
Ask CSL to send you some replays,  he's a beast with the Tau.

I don't know what would convince me. The only race their units seem to do well against early on are the Eldar.

I'd swear the armor in the battlesuits is made of paper or something. Even after the health/armor upgrades they still get the crap knocked out of them even by lower level IG stuff.

The Crisis battlesuits and such seem far too weak I agree, but I don't use them at all. I do use the other ones a bit, but entrenching is not a good idea simply because they select their own targets and you cant override them then. However as anti-vehicle they do alright - though Stealthsuits are also good in this role when upgraded. No, I always choose the non-battlesuit path, "the patient hunter". It may be Kroot heavy but it gives you some important overall benefits from Optics and Metallugry upgrades - Firewarriors become long range beasts at that time.

Likewise most people dont do Tau correctly - they forget to upgrade Firewarriors to have a shield drone, which gives large defense against ranged attacks. Also they don't put down snare traps which let Firewarriors dance out of range. Just a spew of things, some of which I still haven't tried.
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« Reply #64 on: October 17, 2006, 02:06:07 PM »

I'm trying the Tau on hard now, and having more luck.  As CSL mentioned, definitely use the Kroot a lot more.  The Kroot are great in the game, especially with superleap.  They'll engage enemy troops leaving the Firewarriors open to attack.  Firewarriors with all the upgrades are pretty deadly as well, and have incredible range.

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« Reply #65 on: October 17, 2006, 11:06:51 PM »

Will, I finally got Dark Crusade and I install just fine, but when I try to add my CD for my original DOW it tells me it's invalid.   I see no help topic on the official forums.   crybaby


Problem solved.  I just uninstalled DOW and Winter's Assault and reinstalled them both.


Loving th campaign so far
« Last Edit: October 18, 2006, 12:40:19 AM by Soulchilde » Logged

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« Reply #66 on: October 18, 2006, 12:04:37 AM »

My issues with the Tau are pretty much still there. I always go the Kroot heavy route, but even with upgrades (and shield drones... yes, I build one in each squad of firewarriors and activate the shields when ever combat starts) They still seem to fail against equal size forces from other races. I seem to have special trouble against IG in late game, and Necrons pretty much from start to finish.

Speaking of Necrons.. the game changes pretty drastically when playing as them. They don't require nearly as much map control to get a full power force going, and all their units seem to be really effective. I like the simplicity of their tech and how easy it is to get the hang of things.
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« Reply #67 on: October 18, 2006, 12:15:41 PM »

I am convinced that the AI cheats.  The Space Marines who I thought I was pretty comptent using are getting thier asses handed to the by the IG.  By the time I get on of two squads up the IG are rushing me with 5-6.   I'm playing on normal, so I think I am going to drop the difficulty to easy to see how that goes


edit to add the IG teams are backed up by Mortar Teams.
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« Reply #68 on: October 18, 2006, 01:16:35 PM »

Quote from: Soulchilde on October 18, 2006, 12:15:41 PM

whining and moaning...



I have more boxes if you wish to continue. 

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« Reply #69 on: October 18, 2006, 02:11:49 PM »

Quiet, LD.  Give me a few days to get my bearings.  I just installed the game last night.  I think I may have solved my issue with the IG.  Will test it tonight
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« Reply #70 on: October 18, 2006, 09:04:30 PM »

Quote from: stiffler on October 16, 2006, 01:47:12 AM

My impressions:

I put all the DoW stuff in the Dark Crusade case.  Everything fit perfectly on the big spindle and the manuals go in nicely as well.  Perfect! A+ case. thumbsup

Now if only I had made time this weekend to play the game. paranoid

Why didn't I think of that!  Great idea for using the case like that, thanks!
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« Reply #71 on: October 19, 2006, 12:46:47 PM »

Quote
The Space Marines who I thought I was pretty comptent using are getting thier asses handed to the by the IG.  By the time I get on of two squads up the IG are rushing me with 5-6.   I'm playing on normal, so I think I am going to drop the difficulty to easy to see how that goes
Are you playing the campaign?  Sometimes you'll get rushed by the opposing hero unit and his bodyguards that he's earned from map conquests.  If you invade in a neutral space, or just play the skirmish mode, you probably won't get invaded.

IG Guardsman are very quick to build as well, and very cheap.  They come right out of the headquarters I think, versus the Space Marines building a barracks and then the longer load time for space marines.

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« Reply #72 on: October 19, 2006, 08:06:27 PM »

What are the roles of the Chaos vehicles? I build them, but I apparently am not using them correctly. They certainly don't do well vs. other vehicles, that much I DO know.

Also, I kinda wish the Daemon Prince was more than just a super big melee guy. I have a better iteration of that in the Bloodthirster, who I can get pretty close to when I can get the Daemon Prince. I so wish they'd gotten Nurglings instead  icon_biggrin
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« Reply #73 on: October 19, 2006, 08:19:00 PM »

Quote from: Scott on October 19, 2006, 12:46:47 PM

Quote
The Space Marines who I thought I was pretty comptent using are getting thier asses handed to the by the IG.  By the time I get on of two squads up the IG are rushing me with 5-6.   I'm playing on normal, so I think I am going to drop the difficulty to easy to see how that goes
Are you playing the campaign?  Sometimes you'll get rushed by the opposing hero unit and his bodyguards that he's earned from map conquests.  If you invade in a neutral space, or just play the skirmish mode, you probably won't get invaded.

IG Guardsman are very quick to build as well, and very cheap.  They come right out of the headquarters I think, versus the Space Marines building a barracks and then the longer load time for space marines.




Actually, I replayed it and went aggressive.  The IG have two bases up, should have read the briefing, but after a few Space Marine pushes I was able to damage both thier enconomies.  I beat it.  Now I'm in  the middle of trying to take the Space Port from the Necrons
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« Reply #74 on: October 20, 2006, 11:56:20 AM »

Quote from: Brinstil on October 19, 2006, 08:06:27 PM

What are the roles of the Chaos vehicles? I build them, but I apparently am not using them correctly. They certainly don't do well vs. other vehicles, that much I DO know.

Their role is to get their arse kicked by other vehicles - so you pretty much figured it out.  From what little I know about Chaos though:

Their spider walker thing is actually hell for most enemy infantry to deal with due to throwing a 3-pronged attack at them.  First, their big jaw arms of death.  Second, their chaos fire.  Third, and the most annoying, their insanely inaccurate mortar rounds that knocks infantry all over the damned place.  In general, they do not hold up long versus other vehicles, especially the space marines, who eat these defilers for lunch.

Their chaos tank is sort of like a weaker version of the space marines predator - with the advantage that chaos can usually get to it earlier and therefore often have above-average armor on the field earlier than other races.

I don't even remember what other vehicles they get though.
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« Reply #75 on: October 20, 2006, 01:05:24 PM »

Chaos seems to get its walkers/tanks quicker, at least in the skirmish I had last night with Chaos.  Those walkers were crushing my troops and really outnumbered me for a bit.  When I finally got a Land Raider and a couple preditor tanks out though, it was game over for Chaos, as they couldn't stop the Land Raider.  I really don't like the Chaos units in the game, it seems they could have played the demon side up a little more and had more fun.

I'm slowly burning out on this, after playing it a lot lately.  I think I really like the Tau the most these days, though the Necrons and Space Marines continue to be fun.
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« Reply #76 on: October 20, 2006, 09:02:43 PM »

I would like to point out that the Defiler (chaos spider walker thing slywink) also gets utterly destroyed by Necron Immortals. Even if you only have two squads.. they'll take one out. the last few times I saw a Defiler while playing Necron it never even got to attack, much less do any damage.

And Immortals are available really early.
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« Reply #77 on: October 20, 2006, 09:35:55 PM »

that would have been good to know a week ago when I couldnt beat the chaos player in the campaign.  his Defilers were just creaming my units.  Oh well.  he's gone.  My new enemy is The Orks, and The IG. 
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« Reply #78 on: October 21, 2006, 02:18:14 PM »

Seriously. The IG's like a damn swarm. With two Baneblades.
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Thin_J
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« Reply #79 on: October 22, 2006, 01:49:14 AM »

Playing single as the Necrons I pretty much just ran right over Chaos first thing, with IG going down next.

The Tau and Eldar players have not done anything all game except lose territories to the Orks, and the Space Marines lost one territory to the IG which they then regained after I'd killed off IG's main territory anyway.

I'm currently trying my best to kill the damnable Orks but it seems like wherever I attack they spread into another territory. I think I'm going to just have to make a run straight for their main territory and take it out or I'll be chasing him around the map forever.
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