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Author Topic: Triumph of the Wii: How Fun Won Out in the Console Wars  (Read 1904 times)
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« on: June 11, 2007, 01:48:37 PM »

http://www.wired.com/gaming/hardware/news/2007/06/wii

It's an interesting but short look at the Wii and its success.

Quote
The shake-up in the console market has been great for Nintendo's fortunes, but has left gamemakers off balance. Most third-party game developers bet that the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 would be selling the most titles by summer. Electronic Arts had only two games at the Wii launch in November, versus five for PS3. And when they did ramp up their efforts, EA's game designers found that creating games that utilize the Wii's controller is challenging.

Quote
Tony Key, vice president of Ubisoft, offers a more optimistic spin. "Designing a game around the Wii controller doesn't add cost, just opportunity," he says. Ubisoft recognized the Wii's potential early on, and was the first publisher to get a Wii development kit, says Key. Consequently, Ubisoft had nine games on the Wii by the end of 2006, which netted the company 11 percent of Wii software sales that year.

"You really had to make a commitment back in the spring of 2006 to be involved" in the Wii launch, says Nintendo's Harrison. "Many publishers didn't ... understand that there would be a market for Wii."

I was in Gamestop yesterday and there still wasn't a Wii to buy anywhere.  They had probably 10 360's and 10 more PS3's though.  I really think as the Wii's sales continue and the worry about it being a "fad" starts to fade we'll see a lot more developer support for the system.  The thing is, people are used to the high standard set by games like Wii Sports so if 3rd party developers slap something together quickly to cash in I doubt it will sell much.
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« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2007, 01:53:55 PM »

I think its great. I love Nintendo, Mea Culpa, I didnt see it coming, I thought PS3 was a lock this generation. Shows what I know.
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« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2007, 02:00:35 PM »

Not to take anything away from the big N, but I still think this whole thing simply boils down to price.  If the 360 and PS3 were even in the same price ballpark as the Wii (or even at a reasonably sane price point), I firmly believe this console generation would look much, much different.  As it is, Sony and MS have simply priced themselves out of most homes, and have been replaced by the Wii.
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« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2007, 02:04:09 PM »

I find it odd to see a post in here about how succesful the Wii is.

Strange that people haven't picked up on it.

 slywink
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« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2007, 02:11:21 PM »

"Triumph of the Wii" = lol. Film reference ftw. icon_lol
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« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2007, 02:11:25 PM »

Quote from: Devil on June 11, 2007, 02:04:09 PM

I find it odd to see a post in here about how succesful the Wii is.

Strange that people haven't picked up on it.

 slywink
I'm kinda with Devil, I mean, how many of these articles can we see?

I think Gratch is partially right, there really is a big difference between 250 and 400, it's not so much the actual dollar amount, but the association that 400 is just so much more money. Because when the Cube launched at 199, and the PS2/Xbox were 299, eventhough they were only $100 more, they were in that mythical number range. People see $299 and think 200 bucks. However, I don't think price matters if you don't have product and marketing to back it up. That's where the Cube failed and the Wii is succeeding.
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« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2007, 02:11:39 PM »

Dammit!  Why didn't anyone tell me I wasn't having fun with all my non-Wii consoles?
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« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2007, 02:12:17 PM »

Devil, your sarcasm hurts us all.

The Wii is the least-played video game console in my house right now.
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« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2007, 02:18:21 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 02:12:17 PM

The Wii is the least-played video game console in my house right now.

Nintendo only cares that you ponied up the cash to buy it.
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« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2007, 02:20:21 PM »

Do they have a legitimate chance to come in second in the console wars with this? It sure seems like it, if I remember right, they had a hold of the second spot behind xbox360 about 3 months ago. Although the ps3 was still getting off the ground at that point.
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« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2007, 02:22:53 PM »

Quote from: jimmyorr99 on June 11, 2007, 02:20:21 PM

Do they have a legitimate chance to come in second in the console wars with this? It sure seems like it, if I remember right, they had a hold of the second spot behind xbox360 about 3 months ago. Although the ps3 was still getting off the ground at that point.
um, they have a legitimate shot at surpassing the 360 by November of this year...
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« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2007, 02:36:19 PM »

Quote from: Tebunker on June 11, 2007, 02:22:53 PM

Quote from: jimmyorr99 on June 11, 2007, 02:20:21 PM

Do they have a legitimate chance to come in second in the console wars with this? It sure seems like it, if I remember right, they had a hold of the second spot behind xbox360 about 3 months ago. Although the ps3 was still getting off the ground at that point.
um, they have a legitimate shot at surpassing the 360 by November of this year...

I think next Christmas is going to be key for the Wii (hey it rhymes!).  By that point they will have hopefully ironed out the supply side of things.  They should have a pretty decent library by then with (I'm guessing) a lot more 3rd party titles announced.  They'll be competing against a mature 360 with its heavy hitters (Halo 3, Mass Effect, whatever else) and hopefully Sony will have figured out how to get the ship back on course.

In that environment if the Wii still sells like hotcakes I think it'll be telling.
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« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2007, 02:39:27 PM »

If the Wii is the future of gaming, then it may be time for me to give up the hobby all together.  I have played the Wii many times at my brothers place... the games just aren't fun for me.  I can't stand the control scheme.  It is a great product but it isn't even remotely interesting to me.
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« Reply #13 on: June 11, 2007, 02:40:08 PM »

Jesus christ its been just over a year since the start of "new-gen". What a bunch of crap. No one ha proven yet that the Wii (or any other console) is going to have the kind of longevity at this level of sales necessary to give them a "win". And oh yeah-incredibly smug smarmy Wired writer-I have plenty of fun with every machine I own, and none of them are the Wii. I think "fun" has been around for a while.
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« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2007, 02:40:38 PM »

Quote from: Gratch on June 11, 2007, 02:00:35 PM

Not to take anything away from the big N, but I still think this whole thing simply boils down to price.  If the 360 and PS3 were even in the same price ballpark as the Wii (or even at a reasonably sane price point), I firmly believe this console generation would look much, much different.  As it is, Sony and MS have simply priced themselves out of most homes, and have been replaced by the Wii.

Price is huge.  The difference between $250 and $400-$600 for most middle-class families with kids is enormous.

So why hasn't Microsoft dropped the price of the 360 then?  Do they think they wouldn't pick up enough sales to offset the money lost from the price drop?
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« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2007, 02:45:34 PM »

Quote from: warning on June 11, 2007, 02:40:38 PM

So why hasn't Microsoft dropped the price of the 360 then?  Do they think they wouldn't pick up enough sales to offset the money lost from the price drop?

Which version? Microsoft needs to drop the core unit altogether, price the premium at $299 and have the Elite version be priced at whatever. But then again that's rational thinking and we can't have that.
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« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2007, 03:11:50 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 02:12:17 PM

Devil, your sarcasm hurts us all.

The Wii is the least-played video game console in my house right now.

It was the least played in mine also, hell, my DS got more play before I sold the Wii.

I'm fine with it being succesful, really, I think its great, and I applaud Nintendo for what they have done............But, lets not kid ourselves here, as someone else said, this is more price than anything. Game-wise, there is very little that would be interesting to me on the Wii, from this point forward, the controls didn't do much for me, and multi-platform titles will ALWAYS lag badly on the Wii. Still, people are buying it, trying it, and thats great because it sends a message to Sony and Microsoft that price matters, and they need to get the consoles out of the $400-$600 range, and back down to $300 or so.
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« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2007, 04:34:51 PM »

Quote from: whiteboyskim on June 11, 2007, 02:45:34 PM

Quote from: warning on June 11, 2007, 02:40:38 PM

So why hasn't Microsoft dropped the price of the 360 then?  Do they think they wouldn't pick up enough sales to offset the money lost from the price drop?
Which version? Microsoft needs to drop the core unit altogether, price the premium at $299 and have the Elite version be priced at whatever. But then again that's rational thinking and we can't have that.

What I've been saying for...well, a long time now. And it's something that Microsoft needs to do before the Wii outpaces them by around the end of the year, not before.
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« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2007, 04:43:57 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 02:12:17 PM

Devil, your sarcasm hurts us all.

The Wii is the least-played video game console in my house right now.

All of my consoles have been gathering dust lately.  I fired up the 360 to grab some demos on Friday night but beyond that it's been a couple of weeks since I've played it or the Wii.  NWN2 FTW!
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« Reply #19 on: June 11, 2007, 04:50:21 PM »

Quote from: warning on June 11, 2007, 02:40:38 PM

Quote from: Gratch on June 11, 2007, 02:00:35 PM

Not to take anything away from the big N, but I still think this whole thing simply boils down to price.  If the 360 and PS3 were even in the same price ballpark as the Wii (or even at a reasonably sane price point), I firmly believe this console generation would look much, much different.  As it is, Sony and MS have simply priced themselves out of most homes, and have been replaced by the Wii.

Price is huge.  The difference between $250 and $400-$600 for most middle-class families with kids is enormous.

So why hasn't Microsoft dropped the price of the 360 then?  Do they think they wouldn't pick up enough sales to offset the money lost from the price drop?

As crazy as it sounds, I'm still not sure Sony & MS view the Wii as competition.  We keep hearing about how the Wii is for the "casual gamer" and that it is for a completely different demographic.   While this is somewhat true, what MS and Sony refuse to acknowledge is that most of these "casual gamers" who purchase a Wii will are purchasing it instead of buying a PS3 or 360 simply because it's cheaper.  If the price were lowered on their hardware, they would probably be getting a good chunk of these sales.

It seems like Sony & MS are so focused on beating each other, that they are simply ignoring the Wii altogether.  As if the fact that it's not being sold to this nebulous "hardcore gamer" that they're both after somehow makes the Wii a non-threat.
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« Reply #20 on: June 11, 2007, 05:19:58 PM »

Quote from: Arkon
If the Wii is the future of gaming, then it may be time for me to give up the hobby all together.

Hyperbole much? icon_wink

I don't think the Wii market and the 360/PS3 market are the same markets, though there's certainly a fair bit of cross-over. There's no reason the Wii's success necessarily means that the 360/PS3 will have to fail.
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« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2007, 05:20:22 PM »

Quote from: Gratch on June 11, 2007, 04:50:21 PM

Quote from: warning on June 11, 2007, 02:40:38 PM

Quote from: Gratch on June 11, 2007, 02:00:35 PM

Not to take anything away from the big N, but I still think this whole thing simply boils down to price.  If the 360 and PS3 were even in the same price ballpark as the Wii (or even at a reasonably sane price point), I firmly believe this console generation would look much, much different.  As it is, Sony and MS have simply priced themselves out of most homes, and have been replaced by the Wii.

Price is huge.  The difference between $250 and $400-$600 for most middle-class families with kids is enormous.

So why hasn't Microsoft dropped the price of the 360 then?  Do they think they wouldn't pick up enough sales to offset the money lost from the price drop?

As crazy as it sounds, I'm still not sure Sony & MS view the Wii as competition.  We keep hearing about how the Wii is for the "casual gamer" and that it is for a completely different demographic.   While this is somewhat true, what MS and Sony refuse to acknowledge is that most of these "casual gamers" who purchase a Wii will are purchasing it instead of buying a PS3 or 360 simply because it's cheaper.  If the price were lowered on their hardware, they would probably be getting a good chunk of these sales.

It seems like Sony & MS are so focused on beating each other, that they are simply ignoring the Wii altogether.  As if the fact that it's not being sold to this nebulous "hardcore gamer" that they're both after somehow makes the Wii a non-threat.

I don't know about that: Microsoft doesn't want hardcore rep.
Quote
I don't want to be pigeonholed as a hard-core machine.

I think you guys are still underestimating the power of game like Wii-sports, Wii-play, Warioware, Cooking Mama, Trauma Center etc. Nintendo has the mainstream price and mainstream software. It doesn't look like a killer lineup to us, but to the average person these are the kind of games they enjoy. On top of that, it looks like the Wii is slowly but surely getting more titles that the "hardcore" want as well. Fully online Madden and Fifa? Who would've ever thought that on a Nintendo platform? Manhunt 2, Scarface on a Nintendo platform? It will definitely be interesting to see what else gets announced.

I truly think that Nintendo caught the perfect storm, they caught their competitors off guard, they had the right kind of software, the right pricing and just the right marketing to launch the system right. Now the next six months will confirm whether or not they are capable of maintaining the wave. A lot of reports point to yest
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« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2007, 05:56:50 PM »

Demand for the Wii has gone off the hook again since school let out.
Here's the key, I think:

There are arguably only two titles you could call "great" on the system and both were available at launch.
The Wii needs AAA titles.
The Wii needs AAA titles from publishers whose names aren't Nintendo.
Publishers should have enough incentive at this point to dedicate the resources to doing so, but will they?
The good news is that I think Nintendo's first party lineup between now and the end of the year is going to
be really good. I expect Nintendo to sell every unit they produce between now and the end of the year as quickly as they
can get them out the door. This means that the install base should be that much bigger by the time the publishers catch up.

I think if publishers will take some of their top talent and put them onto the Wii, they'll be well rewarded.
It's still a risk, though, because of the third party "curse" on Nintendo hardware.
Still, it can be done, as from what I can tell Ubisoft is doing pretty darned well.
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« Reply #23 on: June 11, 2007, 06:16:18 PM »

Quote from: Laner on June 11, 2007, 02:11:39 PM

Dammit!  Why didn't anyone tell me I wasn't having fun with all my non-Wii consoles?

We didn't want to make you feel badly for wasting your money.  icon_wink

The Wii is my only game console. I am not disappointed in the least,  but I have come to terms that I am a casual gamer now. This past weekend I played Zuma and did not have a chance to fire up the Wii. I still have not opened Super Paper Mario, nor have I finished Zelda. I am completely happy about all of that though. Of course I wish I had more time to play, but when I do get to play I really enjoy it.

Nintendo's success with the Wii is definitely partly due to price, but there are several other critical factors at work. First, there is the "word of mouth" factor, or in this case that people see other people's Wiis and want their own because it is cool. Although the current library of games is not staggering, the virtual console library is awesome. I am sure people are buying it just to play some of those old games again, without any emulation problems or having to find the old consoles. With the upcoming rest of the year game lineup I can only see the Wii becoming more popular.
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« Reply #24 on: June 11, 2007, 07:21:15 PM »

How many cars are sold world-wide, and how many bicycles? I'm sure some people give up cars for bicycles, and both are modes of transport that get you from point A to B; people still buy cars though.

The only flaw in that thinking is MS&Sony are seeing the Wii as the two-wheeled non-powered competitor... I just think they've overestimated themselves by thinking they're cars and not just motorcycles (which have a much more limited use than a car/truck/van).

I love my 360, and I don't think I'll ever give it up for a Wii ... given the PS3's current games I can't see it taking away my 360 time. My Wii is there and I'm not going to sell it; it just isn't the console of choice. For a home that has NO OTHER GAME SYSTEMS, of course it's going to sell.

The only game on the Wii worth owning right now is the one it came with. It's online solution is a joke, and any cross-platform games are IMHO better on the competing platforms. (it's not like the Wii games are any cheaper so the price point becomes moot).
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« Reply #25 on: June 11, 2007, 07:28:59 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 07:21:15 PM

it's not like the Wii games are any cheaper so the price point becomes moot

I don't have a Wii but I thought its games were US $50 vs US $60 for 360 and PS3 games?
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« Reply #26 on: June 11, 2007, 07:31:15 PM »

i hardly touch my Wii now(last turned it on 2 weeks ago to see the VC titles).....maybe if they brought some decent games out for it....maybe that would change
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« Reply #27 on: June 11, 2007, 07:38:22 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 07:21:15 PM

The only game on the Wii worth owning right now is the one it came with.

The current Wii lineup isn't exactly a powerhouse but I'm quite happy to own:

Zelda
Super Paper Mario
Rayman Raving Rabbids
Trauma Center

and to a much lesser extent- SSX Blur.

Quote from: warning on June 11, 2007, 07:28:59 PM

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 07:21:15 PM

it's not like the Wii games are any cheaper so the price point becomes moot

I don't have a Wii but I thought its games were US $50 vs US $60 for 360 and PS3 games?

Correct. 

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« Reply #28 on: June 11, 2007, 07:38:43 PM »

That may be the case, but I'm talking about significant price difference (like the hardware).

35 vs 60 type of thing.

Also, on release weeks most big box shops here offer cheaper prices.
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« Reply #29 on: June 11, 2007, 07:40:52 PM »

Zelda - BB rental for a month. Completed everything except collecting all the bugs (got about half of them).
Got EVERYTHING else. I doubt I'll ever go back to it again.

Trauma Center didn't grab me at all; Raving Rabbids was the same (and it's cross-platform).

Haven't played Paper Mario yet so no comment on it. Same goes for SSX Blur.

KG did you guy all of those full-price?
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« Reply #30 on: June 11, 2007, 07:47:28 PM »

super paper mario still hasnt been released here

zelda i finished i did everything except the poes and one piece of heart

mario strikers looks decent enough...but nothing that would make me run to the shops
i think the next game i want for the Wii,or at least try out is resident evil4...and thats a few years old now,and of course mario galaxy and metroid3..whenever they are due
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« Reply #31 on: June 11, 2007, 08:29:48 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 11, 2007, 07:40:52 PM

Zelda - BB rental for a month. Completed everything except collecting all the bugs (got about half of them).
Got EVERYTHING else. I doubt I'll ever go back to it again.

Trauma Center didn't grab me at all; Raving Rabbids was the same (and it's cross-platform).

Haven't played Paper Mario yet so no comment on it. Same goes for SSX Blur.

KG did you guy all of those full-price?

Sorta full price- Target had a "Buy 3 get a $20 Gift Card" on launch day so I purchased Zelda, Trauma Center, and Rayman that day. They all were certainly worth full price to me (and to be fair, I think any game that you spend a month with and provides as many gameplay hours as Zelda does is "worth owning"- most people consider rental games in the 8-10 range, not 40-50 hours). 

Super Paper Mario was also full price.  I do sort of regret paying full price for SSX- $30 seems more reasonable for it.

And I wouldn't really call Rayman cross- platform anymore than you could say that you don't need to own GRAW on the 360 because there is technically an Xbox 1 port.  Rayman is a Wii game through and through and I've never seen anyone recommend playing the other ports of the game.

I also expect to buy (at discounted rates) Metal Slug collection and Sonic someday as well but no hurry on those. 

So I'm generally satisfied with the Wii's lineup so far.  Yeah, it's not in constant use but that's the case for *all* of my consoles.  Owning every home console, portable, and a decent PC means that at any given moment most of them are being "neglected" so it's not something I lose any sleep over.
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« Reply #32 on: June 11, 2007, 08:42:14 PM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on June 11, 2007, 07:31:15 PM

i hardly touch my Wii now(last turned it on 2 weeks ago to see the VC titles).....maybe if they brought some decent games out for it....maybe that would change

Having almost played POP:RS to completion -damn that last boss- currently unlocking the crypt in MK:A and my ongoing game play with DBZ: BT2, SSX Blur and a slew of VC titles, the Wii is about the only console in my home that's on these days. I don't own a 360 or PS3, just a XBox and PS2, so that might be the difference between myself and others. Although there are still great games coming out for the PS2 as many threads in this forum would attest. I just prefer the gameplay on the Wii more.
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« Reply #33 on: June 11, 2007, 09:04:10 PM »

For me, Rayman was just another mini-game-laden NiM$ game. It felt like SMB / Mario Party etc except without the accessible gameplay.

Trauma centre was a little annoying and I didn't care for the story. The gameplay was neat, but I found that the reliance on the thumbstick often had me grabbing the wrong tools.

As for Zelda, the only reason I played it through was waiting for the WOW moment (that never really materialized for me). Inflated expectations? Perhaps. I would have regretted keeping it on my shelf. If the game rental policy only allowed a week, it would have gone back unfinished or until one became available on teh cheap.

That isn't me saying the system isn't worth owning; I'm just stating that the idea that Big_N has a monopoly on Fun is a sad misnomer. The games that are out sofar don't have me the least bit interested in crowning the system the "wiinner".
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