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Author Topic: The Revolution has begun...(IGN chan, specs, launch date?)  (Read 10455 times)
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #40 on: December 06, 2005, 08:38:24 PM »

Depward, take a breath and relax buddy! It's just a friendly discussion. You seem to be taking this way too personally.

I've played the games you mentioned (with the exception of Castlevania) and really don't care for them. Nothing from Nintendo seems to impress me much anymore. I've had a gamecube and just recently traded in my DS due to it's poor graphics.
Nintendo, IMO is too much of a kid's system. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but being over 20 and not really caring for the never-end of new Marios and other kids games, it just doesn't interest me. Now Halo, Killzone, and upcoming games like Gears of War are in my boat. We'll never see games like that on ANY nintendo system, especially come next generation (well it's already here..) when games really start demanding high hardware specs to put out awesome looking games like Gears of War. The Revolution just can't handle those types of games. So much for the "multiplatform" support, not that Nintendo would really allow many mature games on their systems anyway.

How are we going to control a FPS game with that revolution controller anyway?

I grew up with Nintendo, it was my first system. Loved Mario back in the days, when I was a kid.. but I've outgrown that phase a long time ago.
The gamecube was slightly more powerful than the ps2 sure (since it came out later), but it still lacks online play, dvd support, and a good 3rd party base. Where's battlefield 2 modern combat for the gamecube? Or starwars battlefront 2?

Revolution a decent system, probably.. but I know I'll be joining the next generation with the xbox 360 and ps3, not being stuck in yesterday with an outdated system long before it even comes out.
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« Reply #41 on: December 06, 2005, 08:38:58 PM »

You hear that, GamingTrend?

Shhhhhh...listen carefully.......






That's the sound of a Revolution.
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« Reply #42 on: December 06, 2005, 08:53:02 PM »

Quote from: "corruptrelic"
I've had a gamecube and just recently traded in my DS due to it's poor graphics.


.

Quote from: "corruptrelic"
Nintendo, IMO is too much of a kid's system.


This was trendy to say....

in 2003.

Quote from: "corruptrelic"
Now Halo, Killzone, and upcoming games like Gears of War are in my boat. We'll never see games like that on ANY nintendo system, especially come next generation (well it's already here..) when games really start demanding high hardware specs to put out awesome looking games like Gears of War.


This, and the quote above, pretty much confirms the fact that you're a graphics-whore.  And that's cool, not that there's anything wrong with that.  But better graphics do not equal better games.


Quote from: "corruptrelic"
So much for the "multiplatform" support, not that Nintendo would really allow many mature games on their systems anyway.


 :?:

(Resident Evil's, Eternal Darkness, Geist, Prince of Persia, Soul Calibur, Metroid Prime, Timesplitters, MGS:Twin Snakes, Hitman 2, Mortal Kombat, Gun, Call of Duty, etc. etc. etc.)  (and what's the big deal with "mature" games anyways?)

Quote from: "corruptrelic"
How are we going to control a FPS game with that revolution controller anyway?


There are a few articles out there about how Metroid Prime was demo'ed using the controller.


Quote from: "corruptrelic"
...not being stuck in yesterday with an outdated system long before it even comes out.


It doesn't offer the graphical excellence the PS3/360 offer, but if wi-fi internet capability, full backwards compatibility and the amazing controller = outdated, then you should change your name to John Titor.
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« Reply #43 on: December 06, 2005, 09:08:46 PM »

I mean, yeah, I can understand the fact this console shouldn't be grouped with the 360/PS3.  It doesn't offer their level of graphical power.

And I can understand how people wouldn't want one (at this point in time).  You're going to be getting totally unique games and frankly, we have no clue what they're going to offer.

But slap me sideways if you disagree, but as a gamer, I couldn't be happier with this new console.  It's not just another upgrade, it's entirely new.  My initial thoughts would be that gamers, as a whole, would be excited/interested in the Revolution; that such a large company would be willing to take a risk and try something incredibly new (Microsoft being on the complete opposite end of the spectrum which is perfectly OKAY, so please don't flame me).  

The Revolution doesn't REPLACE any of my next-gen console purchases, but it sure as hell belongs in my household right next to whatever next-gen consoles I decide to purchase.
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Soulchilde
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« Reply #44 on: December 06, 2005, 09:17:16 PM »

Quote from: "TheMissingLink"
I mean, yeah, I can understand the fact this console shouldn't be grouped with the 360/PS3.  It doesn't offer their level of graphical power.

And I can understand how people wouldn't want one (at this point in time).  You're going to be getting totally unique games and frankly, we have no clue what they're going to offer.

But slap me sideways if you disagree, but as a gamer, I couldn't be happier with this new console.  It's not just another upgrade, it's entirely new.  My initial thoughts would be that gamers, as a whole, would be excited/interested in the Revolution; that such a large company would be willing to take a risk and try something incredibly new (Microsoft being on the complete opposite end of the spectrum which is perfectly OKAY, so please don't flame me).  

The Revolution doesn't REPLACE any of my next-gen console purchases, but it sure as hell belongs in my household right next to whatever next-gen consoles I decide to purchase.




While you have some very valid points I think many are just burned out by Nintendo.  While they want to focus on "kiddie" games that in many ways just don't appeal to me.  

Granted RE4, Soul Calibur , Geist and the rest are the exception not the norm.  This might not bother you, but many doesn't like Nintendo tight fisted control.  It was understandable in the mid 80's and 90's when Nintendo was fresh out the gate after the Atari fiasco, i.e. bad games flooding the market.


Ninentdo hasn't appealed to me since I jumped from the orginal Ninentdo to the Sega.
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« Reply #45 on: December 06, 2005, 09:22:18 PM »

Considering how we haven't seen any Revolution screenshots, I can't see how anyone can comment on the graphics as of yet.  Nintendo has always been conservative in terms of boasting about hardware power, but the Gamecube ended up being nearly equal to the Xbox in terms of graphics.  Take a look at Resident Evil 4 and then imagine that with 3x the processing power.  

I predict the Revolution will look just fine against the PS3 and Xbox360.
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« Reply #46 on: December 06, 2005, 10:11:37 PM »

Quote from: "corruptrelic"
Nintendo, IMO is too much of a kid's system. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but being over 20 and not really caring for the never-end of new Marios and other kids games, it just doesn't interest me. Now Halo, Killzone, and upcoming games like Gears of War are in my boat.

...

I grew up with Nintendo, it was my first system. Loved Mario back in the days, when I was a kid.. but I've outgrown that phase a long time ago.


You know, if you're too "grown-up" for Mario games, then you haven't truly grown up yet.  Games like Halo, Killzone, and Gears of War are fun in their own right, yes, but aren't truly any more "mature" than the Mario games, Dragon Quest VIII, or Sonic games.

If anything, the games you quoted are possibly less mature, since their only claim to "mature" content is gratuitous violence and possibly profanity.  Gamers who are only interested in those kinds of games because they've "outgrown" Mario are mostly, from my experience, people who are immature enough that they're self-consciously trying to stick with games that seem "cool" enough for a guy their age.

I can enjoy the "childish" Nintendo games because the gameplay is simply so much fun, and I'm grown-up enough to admit that I'll even play those games on my own, without needing the excuse of "oh, well, I play them with my kids."  I also love games like Halo and Call of Duty for the fun experiences provided there, as well.

The Cube provided a great range of both family-friendly games and grittier games.  There was a better balance between the two styles on the Cube than on the PS2 or X-Box.
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WinoMcCougarstein
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« Reply #47 on: December 06, 2005, 10:22:40 PM »

Quote from: "Farscry_Redux"
Quote from: "corruptrelic"
Nintendo, IMO is too much of a kid's system. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but being over 20 and not really caring for the never-end of new Marios and other kids games, it just doesn't interest me. Now Halo, Killzone, and upcoming games like Gears of War are in my boat.

...

I grew up with Nintendo, it was my first system. Loved Mario back in the days, when I was a kid.. but I've outgrown that phase a long time ago.


You know, if you're too "grown-up" for Mario games, then you haven't truly grown up yet.  Games like Halo, Killzone, and Gears of War are fun in their own right, yes, but aren't truly any more "mature" than the Mario games, Dragon Quest VIII, or Sonic games.

If anything, the games you quoted are possibly less mature, since their only claim to "mature" content is gratuitous violence and possibly profanity.  Gamers who are only interested in those kinds of games because they've "outgrown" Mario are mostly, from my experience, people who are immature enough that they're self-consciously trying to stick with games that seem "cool" enough for a guy their age.

I can enjoy the "childish" Nintendo games because the gameplay is simply so much fun, and I'm grown-up enough to admit that I'll even play those games on my own, without needing the excuse of "oh, well, I play them with my kids."  I also love games like Halo and Call of Duty for the fun experiences provided there, as well.

The Cube provided a great range of both family-friendly games and grittier games.  There was a better balance between the two styles on the Cube than on the PS2 or X-Box.



::slow-clap::
So well put!
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JCC
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« Reply #48 on: December 06, 2005, 10:57:38 PM »

I'm not predicting anything, but I am wondering... While I am sure the Rev. will have greatly inferior graphics to a PS3/XBox360 when those systems' games are played on an HD set. Will the Rev look that much worse than a PS3/XBox360 on a NON-HD set?

My guess is Nintendo thinks the answer to that is "no". And, like it or not, the vast majority of the world is not going to be hooking this gen of consoles up to an HD set. I think this is how Nintendo is cutting costs around graphical power, without really being at a serious competitive disadvantage with the other 2 (in their minds). Again, I'm just speculating here.

I also think that Nintendo firmly believes that they can attract the non-gamer AND cater to existing gamers without alienating either group. I am not sure if I agree with them on that score, but I'll bet they believe it.
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« Reply #49 on: December 06, 2005, 10:58:08 PM »

More tonight:

Quote
Whoa baby. I should put an end to some speculation before it runs out of control.

Tonight's article will be a continuation of last night's. Satoru Iwata has not personally delivered us the full spec breakdown. Nintendo doesn't want to talk specs and I don't think anything we do will really change that.

That said, devs do have official documentation and it has been directly quoted to me over the phone.

Tonight, we'll talk a bit more about CPU / GPU power. We'll also have a clarification on RAM. (And before you go thinking that we messed up and it has 512MBs, think again -- it's the other way.) And we'll reveal the real DVD capacity. That 12GB stuff was completely bogus.

Devs also speculate on a price point.

Can someone do me a favor and pass this along to the guys at the GA Forum before they toss me into the bonfire.

Thanks.

Matt


Eeek...less than 128MB? Not good.
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Scott
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« Reply #50 on: December 06, 2005, 11:08:49 PM »

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And, like it or not, the vast majority of the world is not going to be hooking this gen of consoles up to an HD set.

I don't know about that.  Didn't Toshiba just announce no more tube TVs for them?  Most LCD and plasma screens are HDTV, and 720p capable.  In fact, most people buying new TVs now get TVs capable of 720p.  Prices for HDTVs are way down now.  In two or three years, when the new systems are starting to really hit their primes, HDTVs will be a lot more common then now.  In two or three years, you may not be able to buy a non-HDTV set.  The lack of the an HDTV presentation for the Revolution may really hamper it.

I don't think people that consider Mario as a kids game makes them immature, maybe just tired of playing the same Mario game as they did when they were a kid.  What has really changed with Mario, Mario Kart, etc.?  The mechanics may be incredibly fun to some, but they haven't necessarily evolved tremendously over time.

FPS games on the other hand, are really starting to take off in realism.  CoD2 offers a dramatically different experience over FPS games of a couple years ago, because the graphics and the sound advances present a much more realistic, intense experience, that brings one closer to what the game is representing.  Better AI also makes FPS games significantly better lately.

How have Mario's graphic advances improved the gameplay lately?  Mario doesn't look any more realistic then before, nor do all the mushrooms or coins he collects.  I don't see how Mario Karts graphics have really upped the gameplay either, or made it better.  I just don't see the big advances in some of Nintendo's games, where some other genres have moved along further.  To me, its not about playing 'kiddy' games, but wanting something more then I played 10 years ago.

Of course, I'm the same guy who keeps buying Madden smile.  Then again, I actually got screen passes to work this year, a big jump in realism as a Patriots fan! smile
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #51 on: December 06, 2005, 11:52:39 PM »

High definition should be an option (ie, xbox 360 and ps3) for the customer, if anything. It's a shame nintendo doesn't want to support it.

My problem with Mario? Well, in all honesty, what's the point of it? Yeah it was fun jumping around on those little brown guys and going down the tunnels back in the old days, but it's just more of the same again and again. The main thing that makes me buy a game these days (I never even mentioned the word "maturity") is replayablity. Replayablity would come in the form of bots and online play for first person shooters (ie, Starwars battlefront 2 - which is rated teen) and skirmish modes for games like RTS games. Even The Warriors for example - has the "quick rumble" which adds a lot of replayablity.
Starwars battlefront 2 adds an incredible amount of replay value in that you can play anything available to the online portion of it - offline with up to 31 bots.
So even long after you beat the singleplayer campaigns - your game lives on by going online or by practicing with bots.

Perfect dark zero picked up on that tradition and I'm sure Gears of War will as well. Wish Halo had bots, maybe Halo 3 will whenever it comes out.
So it's not so much as a kids game - it's just that IMO, games like Mario are boring and offer very little replayablity once you beat the singleplayer campaign. How about adding an AI-controlled Luigi to help you out for the entire game? Now that might tempt me a tiny bit.. but until then, it's just the same thing over and over with better graphics.
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« Reply #52 on: December 07, 2005, 01:22:18 AM »

:roll:

I know it's a friendly discussion and all, but the obvious discontent for Nintendo is always ever-present in this forum.  There are people who like Nintendo.  And others who don't.  There just isn't any sort of common ground.

But that's the beauty of having three different home platforms I suppose.
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« Reply #53 on: December 07, 2005, 01:34:12 AM »

Quote
I know it's a friendly discussion and all, but the obvious discontent for Nintendo is always ever-present in this forum. There are people who like Nintendo. And others who don't. There just isn't any sort of common ground.

I don't know about that.  When people bash Nintendo, they are called immature gamers, who can't just have fun with games anymore.  Yet, I rarely see any of Nintendo's supporters discuss how Mario has evolved over time?  I mean, the story is usually the same, the dumbest, or most naive princess in the world continues to get captured, and only swift jumping can save her smile.

I haven't seen that many great uses of the duel screen either for the basic Nintendo games, beyond showing the map.  Granted, I think the DS looks pretty neat, and has potential, but mostly to play older games.

Devil is right (and I can't believe I'm saying that, he'll never let me live it down smile), a lot of the Nintendo games are rehashes.  At least when I play Sly Cooper and hop my way through various levels, I have completely different objectives and a fleshed out story, as well as other characters to play.  Give me a choice of Sly Cooper 4, running at 1080p, with a detailed story, multiple fun play styles, and kid friendly game play, and I'll take that over any of the Marios that exist today, or potentially in the future, if Mario doesn't evolve.  Have people seen kids play console games?  They don't need simpler controllers, they are quite nimble.

The Revolution may be a hit, but I just hope we don't see more Mario games that require saving the princess, through hoping on mushrooms, but with just a different controller.  Innovation is great, and I hope the new controller is a hit (god knows my wrists could use it).
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« Reply #54 on: December 07, 2005, 01:47:47 AM »

Quote from: "Scott"
Give me a choice of Sly Cooper 4, running at 1080p, with a detailed story, multiple fun play styles, and kid friendly game play, and I'll take that over any of the Marios that exist today, or potentially in the future, if Mario doesn't evolve.


Played Paper Mario 2?  I love Sly Cooper very, very much but PM2 has better writing, gameplay, and production design than any of the Sly games which is saying a lot.  

And while I didn't like it quite as much as Sly, Mario and Lugi (the first game) is pretty damn fantastic and once again has wonderful writing.  And the sequel looks to be carrying the tradition.

Nintendo has certainly milked the Mario brand but in terms of the  core franchise there have only been two in the last two generations- Mario Sunshine and Mario 64 so Nintendo is hardly pumping them out.  And while Sunshine was anything but innovative, Mario 64 was one of the most influentional games of the last decade.  We'll have to see what Nintendo has in store for Mario on Revolution but I would hope for it to be a flagship for the system's capabilities in the same way that Mario 64 was.
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« Reply #55 on: December 07, 2005, 01:53:26 AM »

nintendo is still the only console company that is making a profit.   i'm guessing the cheaper-to-produce hardware is one of the contributing factors.

also, the custom control interfaces (DS: dual screen, touch screen - Revolution: special controller) have a bonus side effect of making piracy and emulation much* more difficult.
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Devil
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« Reply #56 on: December 07, 2005, 02:08:19 AM »

First:

Quote
Devil is right (and I can't believe I'm saying that, he'll never let me live it down)


Damn right!

Second:
Quote
nintendo is still the only console company that is making a profit...

We have a winner!!!!

biggrin

For the record: I don't buy the 'kiddie game' theory. If the gameplay is there, I don't care if it's a plumber, hooker or oven mitt as the main character in a game (It would be nice to have all 3!).

I have a probelm with the virtually unchanged rehashes.

Do I buy NHL every year - YEP. If you guys say that it's crap because it's the virtually the same game every year my response would be "Yes, but I like it"

The simple answer to the same old Mario Kart is: "Yes, but I like it"

No Double Dash, no 64, no dual screens, no GBA! The answer is "I know it's the same stuff over and over again, Devil, but I like it!"

The difference is nobody else is making a system that's dependant on the ongoing appeal of the same old stuff to survive!

Are they going to rely on an innovative, little used, control scheme to carry them from the DS forward?
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« Reply #57 on: December 07, 2005, 02:58:38 AM »

It will all be interesting to see how this plays out, but you all should check out the follow up to the Specs article.

Looks like the Revolution will only have 104Mb of Ram, and a lot of Ram on the chips, but still. Most developers are commenting that it looks like Nintendo is shooting for truly 2 to 3 times more powerful than the Gamecube. Okay, I can live with that graphically, as games like MGS Twin Snakes and Resident Evil 4 and Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess look amazingly good, so while graphically the Revo won't do Gears of War, it will still look nice.

Don't know how I feel about the No-Hd support. Then again the Cube only does 480p, and I don't think it does anything else, and that looks good enough to me for now.

I won't argue gameplay, except that I hate when people call games rehashes , and you can tell they haven't played the game. Just for example, Star Fox Assault actually drastically changed the gameplay from previous titles, and a lot of you called it more of the same without even playing it.

 Nintendo has a history of making marginal changes to some of their bigger franchises or basing them around a few new gameplay mechanics. Everyone does that, each Ratchet was marginally better than the next, and all of them had a sameness. Jak drastically changed and lost it's soul. Sly has done a good job adding new gameplay, and well Microsoft would kill to have either Sony or Nintendo's stable of mascots.

I am hoping that Nintendo continues the trend of farming out series to outside developers, and hopefully those developers will bring new ideas to the table.

Lastly, going back to the second Article, Developers and Publishers are expecting Nintendo to price the machine from $99 to $149. At that price range, with the downloadable games, you really would be hard pressed to find a gamer that wouldn't pick it up. I know that if it launches at $149 I will get it day one, anymore and I'd have to wait and see how they work it out like the DS.


Quote
The difference is nobody else is making a system that's dependant on the ongoing appeal of the same old stuff to survive!


I have a problem with that. Look at the launch titles for the 360, tell me which game on that list brings something new to the gaming world? Or are they just all polished versions of existing gameplay styles or series etc. Hell some of them are completely broken and aren't even full featured, *cough* Live 1006 *cough* But isn't COD2 more of the same, heck Perfect Dark 0 is being called Perfect Dark with better graphics and good online mp, that's no different than Nintendo adding a new gameplay mechanic to Mario Kart, but You are saying it's okay, or at least it looks like you are saying it is.

So it makes your comment total BS, Every console manufacturer is banking on the appeal of same old stuff to survive, or we wouldn't be getting another Halo, another Project Gotham or another Perfect Dark or another Kill Zone or another The Getaway or another Gran Turismo(really, how many Ultimate Racing Simulators can there be?) etc. etc. etc. Don't fool yourself just because you like that kind of ad nauseum gameplay better that it makes it okay.


And just on a personal note: Nintendo hurt me to a good degree with the Cube, they had made a lot of nice sounding promises and they all fell through. I got burned a bit and was very skeptical of them. I though the DS was a joke and to be honest wasn't expecting much from them anymore. It sucked because at one time they got me back in to console games with the Cube and at the same time sent me looking for something more.

However, like a sucker, I am back because the way they've handled the DS; from software releases and support to interesting and new gameplay they've got me thinking that they may be on to something. Then again they could just be crazy, hence why I will get a 360 once it goes down in price, unless of course the PS3 is price competitive  :o  :lol:  biggrin
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« Reply #58 on: December 07, 2005, 03:43:05 AM »

Quote
I have a problem with that. Look at the launch titles for the 360, tell me which game on that list brings something new to the gaming world? Or are they just all polished versions of existing gameplay styles or series etc. Hell some of them are completely broken and aren't even full featured, *cough* Live 1006 *cough* But isn't COD2 more of the same, heck Perfect Dark 0 is being called Perfect Dark with better graphics and good online mp, that's no different than Nintendo adding a new gameplay mechanic to Mario Kart, but You are saying it's okay, or at least it looks like you are saying it is.



That's fine, but when your exculsives are the same game as it was 10 years ago and you aren't getting any multi-platform love (worst version or none at all), that might not draw people back.
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« Reply #59 on: December 07, 2005, 04:04:49 AM »

Quote
But isn't COD2 more of the same

I felt that while CoD2 was a shooter, it upped the realism and intensity enough that I felt I was playing something new.  The smoke effects in particular really made the battlefield seem alive to me, something I hadn't felt before.  

Quote
Then again the Cube only does 480p, and I don't think it does anything else, and that looks good enough to me for now.

But in 3 years it may not, against the 360 and PS3, that also may have lowered their prices.


Quote
Hell some of them are completely broken and aren't even full featured, *cough* Live 1006 *cough*

But at least there are games to play, as opposed to Nintendo releasing just a few.  Still, sucks that developers skimped out on this first release.

Quote
At that price range, with the downloadable games, you really would be hard pressed to find a gamer that wouldn't pick it up.

I'm running out of TV connections, shelf space, and time to play games, as I imagine a lot of the gaming crowd might be (time thing in particular).  A few years ago, I bought everything, but I've cut down now.  I'd love to grab a DS, I think some of the games look fun, like the surgeon game, but no time to play means no buy for now.  Games have to be pretty good/unique for me to grab them now.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to the Revolution.  I think its cool that someone is trying to innovate, but I'm not excited about rescuing Princess Peach! smile

Quote
Played Paper Mario 2? I love Sly Cooper very, very much but PM2 has better writing, gameplay, and production design than any of the Sly games which is saying a lot.

Almost, almost picked that up.  Didn't have the time back then, but I looked at it a lot.  I read there was a fair amount of back tracking in the game, and that turned me off enough to not pick it up right then.  The humor / attitude of the Sly games also appeal a lot more to me then the Mario stuff, at least the advertising I saw for Mario, and the tone from the reviews.  Sly vs Mario is an easy win for Sly for me any day of the week.
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« Reply #60 on: December 07, 2005, 04:10:37 AM »

Quote from: "Scott"
Almost, almost picked that up. Didn't have the time back then, but I looked at it a lot. I read there was a fair amount of back tracking in the game, and that turned me off enough to not pick it up right then. It looked good. How'd it sell?


Eh, the backtracking everyone complains about is one segment, very late in the game that isn't really as bad as most make it out to be.  I can't remember specifically but I think the segment only took me about 30 minutes in a game that I spent over 45 hours with.  Otherwise there isn't anymore backtracking than a typical RPG.

*EDIT*- it sold very well.  Over 500k at last count I believe and I think it did better than Paper Mario 1.  I'm sure we'll see PM3 on the Revolution.
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« Reply #61 on: December 07, 2005, 04:54:34 AM »

This is funny, was thinking about this while walking home from class in 5 degree (YES, 5 DEGREE) weather freezing my FACE off...

Anti-Revolution people here have been talking about how they don't want to keep playing all these old games, too much BEEN THERE DONE THAT, better graphics PWN...all that sort of stuff...

But what's one of the most popular things about the 360?

Live Arcade.  I've seen as much excitement about co-op Guantlet and Joust as the "next-gen" games.

And rumors say the Revolution will feature many, many, many old Nintendo games.  Soooooo...isn't that a plus?
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« Reply #62 on: December 07, 2005, 05:12:46 AM »

Have'nt read the thread through so sorry if its posted in it.

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Revolution's Broadway CPU, developed by IBM, is an extension of the Gekko CPU in GameCube, according to official Nintendo documentation passed to us by software houses. The Hollywood GPU, meanwhile, is believed to be an extension of the Flipper GPU in GameCube. Since developers have not gone hands-on with the GPU, they can only go on Nintendo documentation, which is limited.
Exact clock rates were not disclosed, but one development source we spoke to had this to say of the Revolution CPU and GPU: "Basically, take a GameCube, double the clock rate of the CPU and GPU and you're done."

We presented that description to another informed studio, which clarified that the clock rates may even fall short of doubling those on GameCube.

"The CPU is the same as Gekko with one and a half to two times the performance and improved caching," said a source. "Our guys experimented with it and think they'll be able to get about twice the performance as GameCube."

"It's a gamble for the Big N," said another source. "It's not about horsepower for them -- it's about innovation and gameplay."



http://revolution.ign.com/articles/673/673799p1.html
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« Reply #63 on: December 07, 2005, 05:50:02 AM »

Quote from: "Temjin"

I predict the Revolution will look just fine against the PS3 and Xbox360.


Not if the rumors are anywhere close to correct. Having double or about double the power of the GC won't put it anywhere near the other two.
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« Reply #64 on: December 07, 2005, 06:21:39 AM »

After reading the IGN article that Dae posted, I am worried about the power of the unit. I didn't like reading the quote above. I don't want me a "weak" system. But, as Tebunker also posted, this cheered me up:

Quote
Software houses we spoke with also waxed on the immediate advantage to Nintendo's approach with Revolution, which is, of course, system price. Every developer was in agreement that Revolution should launch with a price tag of $149 or lower. Some speculated that based on the tech, a $99 price point would not be out of the question.


Should launch at $150, huh? I wonder what Nintendo thinks about that. Like I said before, with that kind of price point, you're going to have many more people willing to give the Revo a try than if it was four hundred bucks. That puppy launches at $100? I could see it flying off the shelves.
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« Reply #65 on: December 07, 2005, 06:36:45 AM »

Selling their DS at half the price of the PSP, it would seem, has been working wonders.
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« Reply #66 on: December 07, 2005, 06:59:52 AM »

Yet when you compare everything side by side on the DS and PSP, the PSP is a clear winner. From graphics, to online web browsing, listening to mp3s, watching movies, playing games online, and some decent games you'll never see with nintendo. (Battlefront 2, Battlefield 2, GTA, etc.)
Had them both at one point and after seeing the graphics on the PSP (yeah I'm a graphics whore) compared to the DS, I just coudn't go back to the DS ever again, and ended up trading it.
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« Reply #67 on: December 07, 2005, 07:36:43 AM »

Quote from: "corruptrelic"
Yet when you compare everything side by side on the DS and PSP, the PSP is a clear winner. From graphics, to online web browsing, listening to mp3s, watching movies, playing games online, and some decent games you'll never see with nintendo. (Battlefront 2, Battlefield 2, GTA, etc.)
Had them both at one point and after seeing the graphics on the PSP (yeah I'm a graphics whore) compared to the DS, I just coudn't go back to the DS ever again, and ended up trading it.


 I compared side by side and...I kept the DS and got rid of the PSP. And, get this...I`m getting a 2nd DS for the wife.
 
 The PSP was/is a buggy handheld that tried to do too much, and didn`t do much of it that good IMHO. I do admit the graphics are better on the psp. But that`s it. I don`t want to read on the internet on my handheld.

 My PC is right down the hallway...And loading screens... UG!!! I never was fussy about loading screens but, sheesh the PSP changed that. Lots of waiting.

  It`s not a bad system and it will have some good games, but the key word is will. I just found it overpriced, buggy and aside from it`s graphics, lackluster. Metoes ownes lumines, MK:DS ownes ridge racer, and so on and so on. Nintendogs is a good title too.

 It`s NOT bad to try different things. The DS is doing that really well, and I`m assuming the REV will too. Before the DS came out (just about a year ago) the best handheld graphics were GBA... The psp does have the best graphics, but come on. Mario 64 on a handheld blew me away last year and MK:DS blew me away this year. The DS may not have the psp`s graphic ability, but it`s not too shabby either.

 I just know why people don`t  like ANYTHING new. Oh, well. To each his/her own.  :wink:

 Did I miss something...I usually do. I thought you had a PSP until I read this...http://www.gamingtrend.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10222
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« Reply #68 on: December 07, 2005, 11:19:41 AM »

The PSP isn't a portable gaming machine.  Hell, I can't carry that thing around with me like I can with my DS.  If I carried it around like what a portable machine, it would have broken.  That's one thing I HATED about the PSP - having to always "baby" it around.  Oh no!  A thumbprint on the screen!  *smudge smudge*

I don't see how the PSP is a clear winner?  The games suck.  I mean, seriously - suck balls.  Yeah!  I want to play a watered-down GTA game based on Grand Theft Auto III with horrible control!   :roll:   And let's see . . . I'll play that . . . console port . . . with worse graphics and horrible load times . . .  :roll:   Where's the originality?  No where to be seen.

Decent games we'll never see with Nintendo.  Funny you mention those games you did.  I can play those on a home console.

Listening to MP3s?  Seriously?  I know you can, but that thing isn't an MP3 device.  Who wants a horribly clunky thing rattling around in their pocket worrying that their screen would be scratched by a dime?

Yeah I agree Harpua - he does sound like he owns a PSP.  Then I read that and thought, "Really?  He doesn't have one . . .?"  Odd.  Pretty bold statements for not even having owned a PSP.

**Yeah yeah, I know, it's a "friendly conversation" - but I don't want to just see the DS get slammed left and right**
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« Reply #69 on: December 07, 2005, 11:40:19 AM »

Well, I use my PSP everyday! I listen to MP3 on my way work since I take Mass Transit.  Also, when I break it out to play Madden or Xmen Legends it seems to impress everyone around me.  


Lets not forget the the DS is now just considered coming into its own.  I'm sure if I looked I can find tons of threads bashing it due to its weak initial line up of games.  Some of the better PSP games are just now being released.

Some of you have some very short memories when it comes to the DS.  Heck, the WiFi feature of the DS just got support if I'm correct.  The PSP had it since launch and is only getting better
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« Reply #70 on: December 07, 2005, 12:32:58 PM »

Quote from: "tru1cy"
Heck, the WiFi feature of the DS just got support if I'm correct.  The PSP had it since launch and is only getting better

Actually the DS has supported ad-hoc (playing games in the same room with other DS users) wifi since launch.  What just arrived for the DS is infrastructure (over the internet, worldwide) wifi for Mario Kart, Animal Crossing and Tony Hawk.

I just got a PSP and am very pleased with it.  But I really bought it as a portable media player.  The games I've played are average to very good and I'm sure will get better.  But it is very annoying waiting for things to load on it.  I played Mario Kart last night and there is literally a second or two between races.  I play Burnout Legends and I have to wait 20-25 seconds between races.  Not a deal breaker but it certainly takes some getting used to after the DS.
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« Reply #71 on: December 07, 2005, 01:19:31 PM »

http://revolution.ign.com/articles/673/673799p1.html

Quote
In yesterday's article, we wrote that Revolution would include 128MBs of RAM, or possibly less. Developers have clarified the makeup based on officially released Nintendo documentation. Revolution will build on GameCube's configuration of 24MBs 1T-SRAM and 16MBs D-RAM (40MBs) by adding an addition 64MBs of 1T-SRAM. The result is a supply of memory in Revolution that totals 104MBs.


It only has 104MBs of memory, not 128MB. frown

Oh and the clock rates of the CPU and GPU are probabily not even going to be twice as fast as the Gamecube.

Quote

Exact clock rates were not disclosed, but one development source we spoke to had this to say of the Revolution CPU and GPU: "Basically, take a GameCube, double the clock rate of the CPU and GPU and you're done."

We presented that description to another informed studio, which clarified that the clock rates may even fall short of doubling those on GameCube.


Quote
We cannot stress this enough: Revolution is not being positioned as a competitor to either Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3. Nintendo has instead chosen to design a console that will be very affordable for consumers.



Yuck. I have a feeling that Nintendo is going to be hurting in the next gen. Once people see what the PS3 and 360 can do, they will laugh at the Gamecube 1.5 with it's silly remote control.

Not even the downloadable NES/SNES/N64 games will save this I feel, I may still get it, just for that....but most others won't.
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« Reply #72 on: December 07, 2005, 01:19:43 PM »

Quote from: "Dafones"
After reading the IGN article that Dae posted, I am worried about the power of the unit. I didn't like reading the quote above. I don't want me a "weak" system. But, as Tebunker also posted, this cheered me up:

Quote
Software houses we spoke with also waxed on the immediate advantage to Nintendo's approach with Revolution, which is, of course, system price. Every developer was in agreement that Revolution should launch with a price tag of $149 or lower. Some speculated that based on the tech, a $99 price point would not be out of the question.


Should launch at $150, huh? I wonder what Nintendo thinks about that. Like I said before, with that kind of price point, you're going to have many more people willing to give the Revo a try than if it was four hundred bucks. That puppy launches at $100? I could see it flying off the shelves.



The 100$ price point doesnt give me a warm and fuzzy... it means the spec WILL be really low.

That wont make them fly off the shelves if its not AMAZING.... Price point is important, but people dont buy something inferior cause its cheap.
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« Reply #73 on: December 07, 2005, 01:27:41 PM »

Quote
Live Arcade. I've seen as much excitement about co-op Guantlet and Joust as the "next-gen" games.

And rumors say the Revolution will feature many, many, many old Nintendo games. Soooooo...isn't that a plus?


Nope.

If the biggest release on the 360 was "Joust 360" with no changes from the original Joust then you might be on to something.

How would you be able to tell the difference between the 'classic' Mario Kart and the 'new' Mario Kart?
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« Reply #74 on: December 07, 2005, 01:42:17 PM »

Hey, what about that old track & field game where you had to hit the two buttons as fast as you could to run the 100 meters...  That would be fun to play with people multiplayer, wouldn't it?
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« Reply #75 on: December 07, 2005, 01:59:18 PM »

Quote
Live Arcade. I've seen as much excitement about co-op Guantlet and Joust as the "next-gen" games.

And rumors say the Revolution will feature many, many, many old Nintendo games. Soooooo...isn't that a plus?

I like the Arcade games like Geometry Wars and Outpost Kaluki.  Both are running at 720p, and very visual in nature.  I don't see the appeal of playing the older Live games like Joust or Gauntlet, and don't understand the appeal.  Geometry Wars, and some of the others, look great at hires, and are very colorful.  There are also some advanced 3d games coming down the pipe.

Live Arcade to me isn't so much about playing old arcade games, but pretty new ones that look new.  I don't think I'd get excited about playing Metal Gear Solid 1, or Mario Kart 1, with the dated graphics.  If Nintendo really soups them up though, or lets developers add new games, ala Live Arcade, then I'd be happy.

Why'd this turn into a PSP vs DS bash?  Give the PSP another 6-8 months, and we'll see.  The DS took a long time to come into its own, the PSP should be given the same chance I think.
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« Reply #76 on: December 07, 2005, 02:04:13 PM »

I just don't get it.  When discussing the PS3 vs. the 360 people go on and on about how it isn't power which matters this generation but games, on-line stuff, etc.  (basically whatever MS is good at) but when discussing the Revolution is is all about horsepower again.


I am really left with the conclusion that people see what they want to see.

There has been a lot of dissatisfaction with the Cube and its lineup of games and it is fashionable to dis Nintendo.  Not without cause because they don't appear to be trying to hard to create new games and seem to be happy milking what they got.
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« Reply #77 on: December 07, 2005, 02:06:19 PM »

Quote from: "Scott"

Why'd this turn into a PSP vs DS bash?  Give the PSP another 6-8 months, and we'll see.  The DS took a long time to come into its own, the PSP should be given the same chance I think.



So if I understand right we should give an existing system (the PSP) a few more months before we declare it a failure but we can declare a system which isn't even out yet (the Revolution) a failure right now?
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« Reply #78 on: December 07, 2005, 02:23:22 PM »

Quote from: "farley2k"
Quote from: "Scott"

Why'd this turn into a PSP vs DS bash?  Give the PSP another 6-8 months, and we'll see.  The DS took a long time to come into its own, the PSP should be given the same chance I think.



So if I understand right we should give an existing system (the PSP) a few more months before we declare it a failure but we can declare a system which isn't even out yet (the Revolution) a failure right now?


 I don't think anyone is declaring the Revolution a failure, but most of us being savvy gamers just don't seem to be buying into Nintendo new direction.  


For a next-gen console to many of us it just doesn't seem very nextgen.  Unless you call a "wacky" new controller next-gen that is?
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« Reply #79 on: December 07, 2005, 02:37:04 PM »

Quote
So if I understand right we should give an existing system (the PSP) a few more months before we declare it a failure but we can declare a system which isn't even out yet (the Revolution) a failure right now?

Did I say the Revolution was a failure farly2k?  Where did I mention that?  

Quote
I just don't get it. When discussing the PS3 vs. the 360 people go on and on about how it isn't power which matters this generation but games, on-line stuff, etc. (basically whatever MS is good at) but when discussing the Revolution is is all about horsepower again.

The 360 and PS3 will be fairly similar in horsepower, so to differentiate themselves, they need to other things.  

The Revolution, and a lot of the concern about it here, comes from the fact that the Revolution looks to be substantially less powerful then the two competitor machines.  It remains to be seen if cheap pricing, and a different controller scheme will allow a much less powerful machine to compete.

Seems fairly simple.
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