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Author Topic: The 360 Killed the previous Generation  (Read 3480 times)
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Farscry
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« Reply #40 on: September 11, 2006, 08:31:16 PM »

Quote from: coopasonic on September 11, 2006, 08:13:08 PM

Quote from: Jancelot on September 11, 2006, 08:01:57 PM

On a similar note I almost bought a PS2 just for Guitar Hero.  But I had to admit to myself that it just wouldn't get much play time due to the graphics.  I suppose it's a little shallow, but the 360 has spoiled me.  So, yes, the previous generation is pretty much done for me.  But I got my time in as I started with a PS2, then switched to a GC and finally an X-Box.  I had good times with each of them.

I'm a graphics whore... however Guitar Hero absolutely transcends graphics, you don't look at it, you experience it. I re-bought a PS2 for GH alone and consider it money very well spent.

No kidding; I love sweet graphics too.  But games like Guitar Hero don't need HD graphics or anything.  I mean, really, how high-res do you need a bunch of frets on a scrolling guitar neck to be? retard It's like saying you won't watch an utterly classic and awesome movie because it's in black-and-white instead of color, or was only filmed in 1.85 widescreen rather than 2.35.
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« Reply #41 on: September 11, 2006, 08:53:46 PM »

For me it's also the achievement points. Now it just seems weird playing games without it.
Also, it is more of who has more achievement points than who beat the game first.
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« Reply #42 on: September 11, 2006, 09:15:08 PM »

Quote from: biggercup on September 11, 2006, 08:53:46 PM

For me it's also the achievement points. Now it just seems weird playing games without it.
Also, it is more of who has more achievement points than who beat the game first.

Unless you're playing King Kong...then they're the same thing.  icon_wink
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« Reply #43 on: September 11, 2006, 09:23:56 PM »

Quote from: Farscry on September 11, 2006, 08:31:16 PM

Quote from: coopasonic on September 11, 2006, 08:13:08 PM

Quote from: Jancelot on September 11, 2006, 08:01:57 PM

On a similar note I almost bought a PS2 just for Guitar Hero.  But I had to admit to myself that it just wouldn't get much play time due to the graphics.  I suppose it's a little shallow, but the 360 has spoiled me.  So, yes, the previous generation is pretty much done for me.  But I got my time in as I started with a PS2, then switched to a GC and finally an X-Box.  I had good times with each of them.

I'm a graphics whore... however Guitar Hero absolutely transcends graphics, you don't look at it, you experience it. I re-bought a PS2 for GH alone and consider it money very well spent.

No kidding; I love sweet graphics too.  But games like Guitar Hero don't need HD graphics or anything.  I mean, really, how high-res do you need a bunch of frets on a scrolling guitar neck to be? retard It's like saying you won't watch an utterly classic and awesome movie because it's in black-and-white instead of color, or was only filmed in 1.85 widescreen rather than 2.35.

Yes I agree with all of what you both said.  But I guess the cost of entry for what would've amounted to one game is what kept me away from GH.  I was unclear in that I meant I don't think I could've justified the price because I just wouldn't have played any other games on it.  Hopefully the GH2 to 360 rumors are true and I'll be able to experience it.  Either that or I'll wait until the PS3 comes down and pick them both up for it.
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« Reply #44 on: September 11, 2006, 09:43:18 PM »

I haven't played an XBox game for almost 6 months, and I rarely ever play my PS2, even with 2-3 games that I really want to play sitting in the backlog. The 360 just takes priority.
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« Reply #45 on: September 11, 2006, 10:53:27 PM »

Quote from: Scott on September 11, 2006, 12:56:38 PM

I also like the achievment points at times more then I should.

for real: if ever the day arrives that i find myself getting sucked into the world of 'achievement points', that is the day i stop gaming...
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« Reply #46 on: September 11, 2006, 11:28:02 PM »

Quote from: semiconscious on September 11, 2006, 10:53:27 PM

Quote from: Scott on September 11, 2006, 12:56:38 PM

I also like the achievment points at times more then I should.

for real: if ever the day arrives that i find myself getting sucked into the world of 'achievement points', that is the day i stop gaming...

It depends.  If you're sucked into it because you want to prove how hardcore you are because of your score, that's one thing.  I see no problem with being into them, though, because they extend the life of a game by basically giving you little mini-games and goals to complete that you probably never would have done before, thereby giving your game even more depth.  Why you would stop gaming because of this puzzles me.
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Nth Power
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« Reply #47 on: September 11, 2006, 11:53:11 PM »

I've pretty much reserved my PS2 gaming to RPGs and a select few others, but with the 360 dipping into the JRPG market, there's not much left for my PS2 other than to deal with a pile of backlog.  In the future I see myself buying the next Guitar Hero, Rogue Galaxy and probably FFXII.  Everything else I'm anticipating is on the 360.
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« Reply #48 on: September 12, 2006, 12:14:00 AM »

Quote from: semiconscious on September 11, 2006, 10:53:27 PM

Quote from: Scott on September 11, 2006, 12:56:38 PM

I also like the achievment points at times more then I should.
for real: if ever the day arrives that i find myself getting sucked into the world of 'achievement points', that is the day i stop gaming...
agreed.
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« Reply #49 on: September 12, 2006, 12:43:26 AM »

I don't see how achievement points are any different than competing for a high score or collecting all 215.64 stars to unlock a new costume...
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« Reply #50 on: September 12, 2006, 01:59:01 AM »

Quote from: wonderpug on September 12, 2006, 12:14:00 AM

Quote from: semiconscious on September 11, 2006, 10:53:27 PM

Quote from: Scott on September 11, 2006, 12:56:38 PM

I also like the achievment points at times more then I should.
for real: if ever the day arrives that i find myself getting sucked into the world of 'achievement points', that is the day i stop gaming...
agreed.

I know I can't compete so I don't.  That doesn't mean some of them I don't like going for, like "All Ferrari's" in PGR3.  Not because it makes my e-peen grow, but because it sounds like fun and I think it's a cool achievement to have.  As far as points, I'm so far behind most of the people on my list I don't even care.  I can't afford to keep up.  If anything I would go for quality over quantity, but even then I'm not hardcore enough to go for the insane goals like GRAW on realistic or some of those.  They set a goal which I might try to achieve, that's it.

Let's not turn this into an "I love/hate achievements!" thread.  Please.  (Glad to do my part. icon_wink)
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« Reply #51 on: September 12, 2006, 02:17:42 AM »

Quote from: Laner on September 12, 2006, 12:43:26 AM

I don't see how achievement points are any different than competing for a high score or collecting all 215.64 stars to unlock a new costume...

It's not.  They're both goddamned retarded and you never ever want to admit to a girl that you have interests in that you do this.
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« Reply #52 on: September 12, 2006, 02:39:37 AM »

Quote from: Nth Power on September 11, 2006, 11:53:11 PM

I've pretty much reserved my PS2 gaming to RPGs and a select few others, but with the 360 dipping into the JRPG market, there's not much left for my PS2 other than to deal with a pile of backlog.  In the future I see myself buying the next Guitar Hero, Rogue Galaxy and probably FFXII.  Everything else I'm anticipating is on the 360.
I just wanted to say that this is exactly the role that my PS2 plays and is going to continue playing. I have..three games? that are not RPGs that I want to play eventually-Rachet and Clank UYA, Gran Tourismo 4, and Okami (will definately play this when comes out). Other than that, its all RPGs, all the time (well, other than as my dvd player for my computer room tv, which it serves as nearly constantly).
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« Reply #53 on: September 12, 2006, 02:51:44 AM »

Quote from: ATB on September 11, 2006, 04:31:54 PM

The games for the 360 cannot be better from a perspective of story, pacing, gameplay and writing than these PS2 releases...so the people you're talking about must all be about the graphics.

saywhat 1st gen Ps2 games were not even CLOSE to the quality that the 360 games are. Fantavision? Seriously?? The term "cannot be" indicates to me an absolute; you are comparing games and saying that Oblivion isn't better in story, pacing, and gameplay then any other FPRPG on PS2? This has nothing to do with graphics mind you, I'm talking GAME. Seriously. PGR3 doesn't have a lot of soul; most racing games don't. Their technical aspects are where they get their points. For those who love racing games, PGR3 ain't bad. MotoGP is another outstanding game.

The cross-platform games delivered to the PS2 are generally cut down. For instance, some of the Tom Clancy titles (R6 IIRC) couldn't have working doors with the size of it. So in terms of quality, the PS2 is lagging behind the xbox1, which is behind the 360.

Burnout Revenge is another obvious comparison. Which would you play? Come on now, put down that Dual Shock....

Now whether the japanese devs are banking on the PS3 and keeping the titles exclusive for now is not in question. I think in the next 2 years we are going to see a SIGNIFICANT shift. But that's not the point of this thread; the PS2 titles that are coming out are no more diverse than the titles that have been released over the past two years; they just have some exclusives that aren't found anywhere else.

Quote from: ATB on September 11, 2006, 04:31:54 PM

Wombat on CAG has a great point in one of the Cagcasts. The games coming out for 360 wouldn't be getting hardly any of the pub or buzz if they were coming out for any other system. However, because 360 is the new kid there's a disproportionate raving about anything that's even half-way good on that system.
And with this, I think that's over-simplifying it, just like 360love=GFXWhore. There is a fluidity in the 360 implementation. The Live integration, achievement points and the marketplace all have wormed their way into the hearts of gamers. Having demos available for free (silver requires no cost) means that ANY 360 owner can reap the benefits of online gameplay.
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« Reply #54 on: September 12, 2006, 02:55:10 AM »

Quote from: Canuck on September 12, 2006, 02:17:42 AM

Quote from: Laner on September 12, 2006, 12:43:26 AM

I don't see how achievement points are any different than competing for a high score or collecting all 215.64 stars to unlock a new costume...

It's not.  They're both goddamned retarded and you never ever want to admit to a girl that you have interests in that you do this.

And you brag to her about winning arguments on the internet?

It's bragging rights to those who care. Mikagami and I both play DW5: Empires... he saw how far I got and dropped some hours into it to "catch up". Gaming, ANY GAMING, whether it be sports, bar games (pool/darts/skirts) or videogames all have an element of competition. I don't put 3000+ points WOOT on my business cards.
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« Reply #55 on: September 12, 2006, 03:31:37 AM »

Achievements rule. They make me play games more than I normally would, and totally fulfill their design and purpose.
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« Reply #56 on: September 12, 2006, 01:02:12 PM »

Quote from: Purge on September 12, 2006, 02:51:44 AM


saywhat 1st gen Ps2 games were not even CLOSE to the quality that the 360 games are.

Irrelevant.  The point of the thread is that the PS2 Generation is 'dead' because of the shiny new graphics charged 360.  I countered saying that the releases for the PS2 in the next six months are at least is strong if not stronger than that of the 360. 

Quote
The cross-platform games delivered to the PS2 are generally cut down. For instance, some of the Tom Clancy titles (R6 IIRC) couldn't have working doors with the size of it.

Again, irrelevent. Sure the technical capability of the PS2 and even the XBOX is well behind the 360, but I see lots of classic cars still on the road and they're no less marvelous because of the technology incorporated into modern ones.  And they're not 'OMG DEAD. KILLT!' 

Quote
So in terms of quality, the PS2 is lagging behind the xbox1, which is behind the 360.

Quality of processor? Quality of workmanship? Quality of Games? No, just technologically.  I've not read nor heard about any game on the 360 comparing to any of the blockbuster classics on the PS2.  Not even a whisper. Sure 360 is in it's first year so there's no chance of that happening though progress will hopefully be made with some of the larger releases due within the next six months.  This fact should also preclude hyperbolic statements like the previous gen being dead from being made also.

Quote
There is a fluidity in the 360 implementation. The Live integration, achievement points and the marketplace all have wormed their way into the hearts of gamers. Having demos available for free (silver requires no cost) means that ANY 360 owner can reap the benefits of online gameplay.

And that's fine.  I definitely applaud MS' implementation of the online features for the 360. No doubt it's brilliant (with some flaws to still be worked out). However, there are still far more SP gamers than MP gamers (and don't ask me for a source cause I don't have one- I think it's indisputable though).  I would bet this is even true of those with a 360. 
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« Reply #57 on: September 12, 2006, 02:17:30 PM »

Quote from: ATB
The point of the thread is that the PS2 Generation is 'dead' because of the shiny new graphics charged 360.

I have to disagree.  The point is that the complete next-gen experience, which certainly includes shiny new graphics, has made it difficult for many of us to go back.  And besides just shiny grahpics there are more of them (look at Dead Rising for the sheer number of zombies on the screen and draw distance).  The seemless online integration including Live Arcade, demos, content download, friends list and the bevy of multiplayer matching options is outstanding.  The ability to stream media from my computer and a pile of other small little touches that just make it very enjoyable.

Quote
I countered saying that the releases for the PS2 in the next six months are at least is strong if not stronger than that of the 360.

I don't think anyone's saying that the 2nd gen console aren't any fun anymore or aren't worth it.  And I'm not going to argue that a console that's been around for 5+ years isn't going to have some great games for it. But I've got a list of 9 games here I'll be picking up before the end of the year for the 360 that'll keep me plenty busy.  icon_smile
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« Reply #58 on: September 12, 2006, 03:10:54 PM »

Quote from: ATB on September 12, 2006, 01:02:12 PM

Quote from: Purge on September 12, 2006, 02:51:44 AM

saywhat 1st gen Ps2 games were not even CLOSE to the quality that the 360 games are.
Irrelevant.  The point of the thread is that the PS2 Generation is 'dead' because of the shiny new graphics charged 360.  I countered saying that the releases for the PS2 in the next six months are at least is strong if not stronger than that of the 360. 

I disagree with the "irrelevant" comment; perhaps I didn't illustrate as clearly as I needed to. PS2 games have had 4+ years in development on "familiar" equipment. All the games coming out on the 360 are still "rookie" status. They may not have the polish that the PS2 games have, but they are also accountable to stand 'head-and-shoulders above'. Games for 360 aren't just "games" and compared as such; they are held against the 'next gen' expectation that each of us carries. As it stands, the PS2 with it's market share isn't going anywhere with the gamer that has the ps2 and no 360. For you to really be in this discussion, you would need an older console and the 360 to truly 'get' what the thread is speaking to. (that's not to say that you don't, but the majority of PS2 owners do NOT fall into this category).

As to the releases on the PS2, there is no question that they NEED to be as strong as the 360. There IS no PS3 for most gamers this year. With the context of this thread in mind, does this have the 360/ps2/xbox1/gc users chomping at the bit more for the next legacy console game, or the next blockbuster 360 game? That, my friend, is an apples-to-apples comparison. As one of those people, I'm pretty stoked for the next 360 release. Hell, I don't even look at xbox1 games anymore, even IF they were on the BC list. They'd have to be outstanding games to "step back in time".

Quote from: ATB on September 12, 2006, 01:02:12 PM

Quote from: Purge on September 12, 2006, 02:51:44 AM

The cross-platform games delivered to the PS2 are generally cut down. For instance, some of the Tom Clancy titles (R6 IIRC) couldn't have working doors with the size of it.
Again, irrelevent. Sure the technical capability of the PS2 and even the XBOX is well behind the 360, but I see lots of classic cars still on the road and they're no less marvelous because of the technology incorporated into modern ones.  And they're not 'OMG DEAD. KILLT!' 
Here's the relevance: with users who have both systems and are standing in EB Games looking at multi-platform releases, where do their gaming dollars go? Most, if not all pf the sports games being released multiplatform right now. You tell me how that ISN'T relevant. Custom soundtracks, online ranking, matchmaking and the fluidity of the Live integration blows away the older systems. THEN theres the Dolby Digital and the graphics. There is no percieved loss-of-depth to games developed for 360 over the ps2, xbox, gc releases. If there was, those games would get panned by the 360 users unless it was a must-have title (MGS2 for Xbox1 springs to mind with inexplicable slowdowns during rain scenes).

Quote from: ATB on September 12, 2006, 01:02:12 PM

Quote from: Purge on September 12, 2006, 02:51:44 AM

So in terms of quality, the PS2 is lagging behind the xbox1, which is behind the 360.
Quality of processor? Quality of workmanship? Quality of Games? No, just technologically.  I've not read nor heard about any game on the 360 comparing to any of the blockbuster classics on the PS2.  Not even a whisper. Sure 360 is in it's first year so there's no chance of that happening though progress will hopefully be made with some of the larger releases due within the next six months.  This fact should also preclude hyperbolic statements like the previous gen being dead from being made also.
Oblivion. Right there is an AAA title that blows away any western RPG on the PS2. Can you name another? The 360 hasn't been out for a year. What exclusive PS2 FPS touches GRAW or even Perfect Dark Zero (which is a flawed game, make no mistake) SOCOM/2? Please.

DOA4 is just as good as any PS2 fighting game. People have their favorites, and maybe you're a Soul Caliber fan or a Tekken fan (I don't like any of them) but that doesn't take away from the quality of the game itself. Just because there have been B titles released for the 360 doesn't mean they all are. Hell, if you were to look at the volume of games on the PS2 and were to average them all out (or even take the MEAN value to scoring) you'd find the games overall are likely no better or worse.

I recognize that due to the volume of games on the PS2 that there are unique games that can't be found anywhere else. Ico, God of War, Shadow of the Colossus, Kingdom Hearts, etc. That is to their benefit. Also, the "classics" you mention may fall into genres which have traditionally not been strong on the MS platforms. Think of this comment not just in a PS2 sense, but also to GC and Xbox1. Those genres (JRPGs, platformers and japanese quirk games, for the most part) and the lack of their prominence in the 360 portfolio are consistant with the prev. gen.

WARNING: the next comment rests on two IF statements... please bear with me. If those games were NOT Sony exclusives and made it onto the xbox1, and if the BC list included them for the 360, would you play them on the PS2? The point of this question is to bring to light the fact that you don't CARE about the hardware, just the titles. The exclusive titles are what you want, and most of them aren't even SONY titles. They're 3rd party who have signed on exclusively with Sony due to kickbacks, development costs or brand/national loyalty. The IF's are likely to happen in this next generation rather than the last. I don't expect a pancake flipping here, but a gradual adoption as Japanese developers want more foreign dollars, and publishers wanting to take advantage of larger target audiences (look at GTA4 as an example).

Quote from: ATB on September 12, 2006, 01:02:12 PM

Quote from: Purge on September 12, 2006, 02:51:44 AM

There is a fluidity in the 360 implementation. The Live integration, achievement points and the marketplace all have wormed their way into the hearts of gamers. Having demos available for free (silver requires no cost) means that ANY 360 owner can reap the benefits of online gameplay.

And that's fine.  I definitely applaud MS' implementation of the online features for the 360. No doubt it's brilliant (with some flaws to still be worked out). However, there are still far more SP gamers than MP gamers (and don't ask me for a source cause I don't have one- I think it's indisputable though).  I would bet this is even true of those with a 360. 

As to the SP vs. MP question, most achievements are based on SP games. I'd state that I play 85% SP gaming. There is less than 50% of the MS footprint that is "online". I think the Silver/Gold adoption rate (that being how many owners have either or) is in the 40-45% range. I don't recall where I saw that; it may have been Major Nelson's site. I think the 360 and its online capabilities naturally draw the broadband users more as it lets them truly use their internet connection.

The comment made in this thread is from one 360 owner who has stated that his PS2 is going unplayed due to the 360. I agree with that statement; I haven't played many xbox1 games since the 360 (including Halo/2, crimson skies, phantom dust, strangers wrath etc...). I sold my GC (kept the games so I can play them on a Wii eventually). It's not because I advocate visuals above all (although I do enjoy the graffix, make no mistake), but the immersion factor is unmistakably there. Not just for me, but for my friends too. I can tell you this with certainty; every night I see at least 12 of them online at any given time. smile
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« Reply #59 on: September 12, 2006, 04:40:57 PM »

Quote from: Canuck on September 12, 2006, 02:17:42 AM

Quote from: Laner on September 12, 2006, 12:43:26 AM

I don't see how achievement points are any different than competing for a high score or collecting all 215.64 stars to unlock a new costume...

It's not.  They're both goddamned retarded and you never ever want to admit to a girl that you have interests in that you do this.
My wife is addicted to getting achievement points, FWIW smile
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« Reply #60 on: September 12, 2006, 05:58:59 PM »

Fuck graphics. 

There, I said it.  Fuck graphics.

The 360 is pretty in all the ways the PS2 is ugly.  It's also boring in all the ways the PS2 is enthralling.

So far there's one game on the 360 that's impressed me, and that's Dead Rising.  It's next-gen hardware being used to make a game that just couldn't exist on another console.

All the rest of the crap on the 360 is graphic patches for games we played anywhere from five to twenty years ago.
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« Reply #61 on: September 12, 2006, 06:10:56 PM »

yes yes, you can't have engaging games and impressive graphics in the same game.  The universe would implode on itself or something.
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« Reply #62 on: September 12, 2006, 07:45:33 PM »

Quote from: Jancelot on September 11, 2006, 09:23:56 PM

Yes I agree with all of what you both said.  But I guess the cost of entry for what would've amounted to one game is what kept me away from GH.  I was unclear in that I meant I don't think I could've justified the price because I just wouldn't have played any other games on it.  Hopefully the GH2 to 360 rumors are true and I'll be able to experience it.  Either that or I'll wait until the PS3 comes down and pick them both up for it.

Ah, I gotcha; thought you were saying you wouldn't play GH due to the graphics, not that you wouldn't play enough PS2 games to make it worthwhile. icon_smile
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« Reply #63 on: September 12, 2006, 08:02:25 PM »

Wow; I just read Purge's diatribe, and I partially agree with it.

Most of my gaming time is currently spent on my PS2 and my 360.  Of the games coming out this fall, I have three must-buys: FFXII (PS2), FFIII (DS), and Forza 2 (360).  Viva Pinata is a likely purchase, that's another 360 game.  The good old Cube doesn't have any must-buy titles coming out this fall other than Zelda, but I'll pick that up on the Wii when I get one of those.

For multi-platform releases, I pick up the best version.  In the last gen that was generally either the Cube or X-Box version (I preferred the Cube controls, but the X-Box had true surround support).  Now, it's the 360 version.

However, the 360 hasn't killed the PS2 for me.  I'm just as excited about a few new PS2 releases coming up (FFXII & Rogue Galaxy) as anything else coming down the pipe, and in the case of Rogue Galaxy, maybe even MORE excited.  I've got my 360, PS2, and Cube all hooked up to my entertainment system, and I enjoy them all.  The PS2 is getting as much playtime as the 360 right now, and soon the Cube will be back in the rotation.  I pull out the SNES, Dreamcast, and NES at times when I want to play those games, and I still pop PS1 games into my PS2 when I want to play one of those (Final Fantasy Tactics is due for a playthrough soon...).

I play games, not systems.

If one system has a better version of a game then I play it on that system.  If not, I play the game on whatever system it's on.  Playing Project Gotham Racing 3 on the 360 hasn't magically made F-Zero X (N64) or Gran Turismo 3 (PS2) look bad.  Those games look the same as they always have, good or bad.  Banjo-Kazooie is still a blast to play and looks quite excellent regardless of how nice the graphics in Kameo might be.  If Banjo-Kazooie were re-released on the 360 with the visuals and audio upgraded but everything else the same, I'd repurchase it for the 360 to get the better version of the game I love (In fact, B-K being my favorite Mario-esque 3-d platformer ever, I'd love nothing more than to see the game re-released with a graphics & audio overhaul but retaining everything else about the game unchanged with the exception of reworking the camera to utilize the right analog stick).
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« Reply #64 on: September 12, 2006, 11:09:15 PM »

Quote from: -Lord Ebonstone- on September 12, 2006, 05:58:59 PM

Fuck graphics. 

There, I said it.  Fuck graphics.

The 360 is pretty in all the ways the PS2 is ugly.  It's also boring in all the ways the PS2 is enthralling.

So far there's one game on the 360 that's impressed me, and that's Dead Rising.  It's next-gen hardware being used to make a game that just couldn't exist on another console.

All the rest of the crap on the 360 is graphic patches for games we played anywhere from five to twenty years ago.

Boring to YOU, add that caveat, not boring to 99% of the millions of gamers who have bought the system. Also your comment in the final sentence borders on laughable.

I know you like to be bombastic, controversial, I get that, its fine, doesn't bother me, but come on man, COME ON, give the system and its games some credit, rather than making it sound like all the games are junk, because thats not the case.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2006, 11:14:54 PM by jblank » Logged

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« Reply #65 on: September 13, 2006, 12:07:44 AM »

Quote from: -Lord Ebonstone- on September 12, 2006, 05:58:59 PM

Fuck graphics. 

There, I said it.  Fuck graphics.

The 360 is pretty in all the ways the PS2 is ugly.  It's also boring in all the ways the PS2 is enthralling.

I guess that could be considered a deeply compelling statement to the "hard core" gamers around here.  But I would much rather play my games on the 360.  The previously mentioned gamer points, community aspects of Live, and yes, graphics have made me virtually forget about the PS2.  There are some Japanese niche games and RPGs that some may like on the PS2, but for what the majority of people want out of a game console the 360 gets my vote.  My wife who has never shown even a mild interest in gaming now regularly fires up the 360 to play UNO online.  My brother who always thought playing video games was too "geeky" now regularly plays Ghost Recon online on the 360 with guys he was stationed with in Iraq.
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« Reply #66 on: September 13, 2006, 12:18:04 AM »

ATB, you are still in the "honeymoon" stage of your PS2 days.  If you had all the systems, I believe you'd think differently.  It's hard to go to the PS2 after playing the Xbox 360.  Not to mention that the Xbox 360 wireless controllers are so good that I don't want to get out the PS2 wired controllers.  Not to mention the Xbox Live experience and the achievements.  If I can play something on my own free time, I go for the Xbox 360.
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« Reply #67 on: September 13, 2006, 10:46:02 AM »

Quote from: Graham on September 13, 2006, 12:18:04 AM

ATB, you are still in the "honeymoon" stage of your PS2 days.  If you had all the systems, I believe you'd think differently.  It's hard to go to the PS2 after playing the Xbox 360.  Not to mention that the Xbox 360 wireless controllers are so good that I don't want to get out the PS2 wired controllers.  Not to mention the Xbox Live experience and the achievements.  If I can play something on my own free time, I go for the Xbox 360.

Bah! I'm not in the honeymoon stage anymore. I reserve that for my precious....my DS (oh how I love you Polar White).

Your last sentence is the one I'll focus on.  Purge makes many good points, obviously, and mentions multi-platform games as well to good effect.  However-

It seems that we're missing a key factor here: does the 360 prevent you from wanting to play great games on different systems?

For example: One of the first games I played on the PS2 was Chrono Trigger.  Now, I could easily make the assertion that the PS2/XBOX effectively killed alll previous gaming generations. However, Chrono Trigger as a gameplay experience and story far surpasses much of any generation.   I did the same thing for MGS1. Oh and Shadow Hearts, and Devil May Cry...

Why are so many people chomping at the bit to get the virtual arcade on the Wii if previous gens are no longer playable?  Are any of you 360 owners even interested in the Wii? It's not exactly 'next gen' on the graphics front.

What about other classic games? There are no game points in those! You mean to tell me you'll never go back to play any of the Zeldas, Marios, Fallouts, Jagged Alliances, Warcrafts, Starcrafts, Mike Tyson Punchouts, Kid Icaruses, etc because of the 360? 

So the 360 has basically shut the door on every game ever made prior to the 360s release?  I find that claim very hard to believe.

Someday I'll probably have a 360-  If I haven't played through my backlog, I don't see how it's possible for me not be able to go back to the PS2/DS. But then again, maybe I'm missing the point.
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« Reply #68 on: September 13, 2006, 11:07:34 AM »

Quote from: ATB on September 13, 2006, 10:46:02 AM

Your last sentence is the one I'll focus on.  Purge makes many good points, obviously, and mentions multi-platform games as well to good effect.  However-
It seems that we're missing a key factor here: does the 360 prevent you from wanting to play great games on different systems?
[...]
Why are so many people chomping at the bit to get the virtual arcade on the Wii if previous gens are no longer playable?  Are any of you 360 owners even interested in the Wii? It's not exactly 'next gen' on the graphics front.

What about other classic games? There are no game points in those! You mean to tell me you'll never go back to play any of the Zeldas, Marios, Fallouts, Jagged Alliances, Warcrafts, Starcrafts, Mike Tyson Punchouts, Kid Icaruses, etc because of the 360? 

So the 360 has basically shut the door on every game ever made prior to the 360s release?  I find that claim very hard to believe.


You are right. There is nothing on the 360 that makes me NOT want to play older games. But I have played those games, and generally once you've played them, you'll reminisce, you'll miss em, but you don't power them up over the new game you just bought. You ARE in the honeymoon stage if you have a backlog of AAA titles that have been out for years... you haven't moved passed them yet, and to you they are still NEW. To others who have played them, they have reaped the benefit of their collective gaming experience.

When "new" PS2 games come out, they are being compared to the new technology, and it's a yardstick that they fall short of. Like I said with multiplatform, they are going to be 360 games (or PS3 games whenever that comes out). A or B titles on PS2 are going to (IMHO) fall to the wayside for a lot of 360/ps2 owners for the A and B titles on the 360. The PS2 AAA titles will still be budgeted in though; that is completely normal.

Wii is new, just as the 360 is. Wii are curious as to gameplay. I couldn't give a rats-ass about legacy gaming; I want to see what wii can do with the wiimote.

As it stands, I don't go out and get that many older games. It doesn't shut the door; it just shows how closed it already is.
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« Reply #69 on: September 13, 2006, 06:25:30 PM »

Quote from: ATB on September 13, 2006, 10:46:02 AM

So the 360 has basically shut the door on every game ever made prior to the 360s release?  I find that claim very hard to believe.
No, it hasn't...but if you ask me what game I've loaded onto my PS2 besides Guitar Hero since the 360 came out that I didn't have to review for the site....about the only game I can think of is Shin Megami Tensei: Digital Devil Saga 1 when I was sick for a few days.  While the system isn't dead, support of the system will most likely drop next year similarly as it did for the Xbox this year.

The thing that is great about Xbox Live Arcade is that I can play a game without having to put in a DVD and can play something quick for only a few minutes.

As far as the Wii goes, I'm not sold on it yet.  I will reveal my thoughts on why sometime.
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« Reply #70 on: September 13, 2006, 07:13:04 PM »

Quote from: Purge on September 13, 2006, 11:07:34 AM

You ARE in the honeymoon stage if you have a backlog of AAA titles that have been out for years... you haven't moved passed them yet, and to you they are still NEW. To others who have played them, they have reaped the benefit of their collective gaming experience.

That makes perfect sense. I often forget how late to the party I am on things.

But but but: no one has played Okami.  If it turns out to be the greatest game at 'the end of PS2's run' you won't play it simply because it's on the PS2 and doesn't have achievements or HD graphics?
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« Reply #71 on: September 13, 2006, 07:48:22 PM »

Quote from: ATB on September 13, 2006, 07:13:04 PM

That makes perfect sense. I often forget how late to the party I am on things.
But but but: no one has played Okami.  If it turns out to be the greatest game at 'the end of PS2's run' you won't play it simply because it's on the PS2 and doesn't have achievements or HD graphics?

No, as I stated above that AAA titles are always welcome. In this case I don't have a PS2 so this is a non-issue for me. But that AAA title if it goes up against a AAA 360 title (lessay Viva Pinata turns out to be AAA) and I'm on a budget, then Okami just MIGHT get overlooked. The achievements and the graphics are a factor in that measurement, but by no means is that the only criteria.

For me the 360 didn't slam the door on the next gen last gen; it just illustrates how closed it already is.

And when it comes to graphics, I do prefer the 360 (duh); it is only trumped by my PC. If you wear glasses you might understand this analogy deeper than just the words: I have a fairly mild prescription, and I can function without my glasses with no problems. When I am doing something that is visual, however, I will put them on. That, to me, is what gaming on the 360 is. The conveniences provided enrich the experience beyond what you'd expect. Once you go with it for a while, there is a real disconnect when you step back, and you find yourself saying stuff like :
- "damn I wish I could play my music over this Koei chinese rock crap"
- "I wonder if any of my friends are online? I'd chat with one of them while grinding in this SP game cuz this part is tedious."
- "I just saved; I could go for a quick game of Texas Hold'em and then come back to this"
- "The damn controller doesn't reach where I want to sit"
- "Man I'm tired... do I HAFTA get up to turn this off? Maybe I could hit it with the pillow. F*$# I missed!"
- "Man I wish I could read this map. If only it were a sharper pic"
« Last Edit: September 13, 2006, 07:59:14 PM by Purge » Logged

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« Reply #72 on: September 13, 2006, 10:35:31 PM »

Quote from: Purge on September 13, 2006, 07:48:22 PM

- "Man I'm tired... do I HAFTA get up to turn this off? Maybe I could hit it with the pillow. F*$# I missed!"

Sounds like you need Arkon's weightloss thread  retard
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« Reply #73 on: September 14, 2006, 12:29:00 AM »

Quote from: ATB on September 13, 2006, 10:35:31 PM

Quote from: Purge on September 13, 2006, 07:48:22 PM

- "Man I'm tired... do I HAFTA get up to turn this off? Maybe I could hit it with the pillow. F*$# I missed!"

Sounds like you need Arkon's weightloss thread  retard

Do you go to your cable box and manually change the channels? Do you walk over to your TV to turn it up or down?

Didn't think so. Convenience isn't always used out of laziness. thumbsup icon_wink
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