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Author Topic: Tales of Vesperia announced  (Read 21973 times)
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Farscry
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« Reply #200 on: September 15, 2008, 05:48:14 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 15, 2008, 01:06:48 AM

And Tales of Vesperia sold a humiliating 33,000 units on the Xbox 360. I hereby claim Microsoft's platform dead to JRPGs. When a very solid game with an actual pedigree can't put up any numbers whatsoever, it becomes increasingly obvious that the hardcore gamer is the only audience keeping the Xbox alive.

I haven't bought or been interested in a Tales game since Symphonia on the Cube. After 25 hours on that finally quitting the game (rare for me to quit a jrpg that far into it) I haven't looked at the franchise again. Lost Odyssey is fantastic, I really enjoyed Blue Dragon, Culdcept is a permanent spot in my 360 library, I'll be snagging FFXIII on the 360, and the console is my primary jrpg platform outside of the DS/PS2 -- just because Tales sold poorly doesn't mean the platform is dead to JRPG's. It's just dead to Tales games. icon_wink
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« Reply #201 on: September 15, 2008, 06:13:58 PM »

Quote from: Farscry on September 15, 2008, 05:48:14 PM

just because Tales sold poorly doesn't mean the platform is dead to JRPG's. It's just dead to Tales games. icon_wink

Dante's larger point was that every JRPG so far has had disappointing sales with the possible exception of LO and even then 500k worldwide is nothing to write home about. 
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« Reply #202 on: September 15, 2008, 06:57:54 PM »

Outside of the major jrpg franchises (basically the Square-Enix heavy hitters) I didn't think many jrpg's generated big sales. I could be wrong.
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« Reply #203 on: September 15, 2008, 07:45:11 PM »

Quote from: Farscry on September 15, 2008, 06:57:54 PM

Outside of the major jrpg franchises (basically the Square-Enix heavy hitters) I didn't think many jrpg's generated big sales. I could be wrong.

It's all relative of course but even by those standards these games are generally considered failures. And Tales is the fourth most popular JRPG series in Japan and the most popular non Square-Enix franchise.   

The big change here is the platform- by virtue of the 360's tiny install base in Japan, these franchises aren't selling what they would have in their PS2 iterations so that puts a lot more pressure on the rest of the world to make up for those lost sales. 
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« Reply #204 on: September 15, 2008, 10:25:15 PM »

Quote from: Destructor on September 15, 2008, 03:16:44 PM

Quote from: Misguided on September 15, 2008, 02:42:42 AM

Something you need to understand, and I know some folks are vehemently against pre-ordering or feel like it gets shoved down their throats, but GS (and probably other retailers as well) is ordering most titles more conservatively than usual because of the economy. If people don't pre-order, we don't get copies in big quantities. Case in point. Rock Band came out on 360 today. My store got 4 copies.

Yeah, I've seen that as well at my local GS. If you want a game, preorder the bloody thing! Yeah, I know everybody here hates GS. I still say you're all nuts. Just give them your $5 and be done with it.

I hate pre-ordering from GS simply because you are doing them a great service for their inventory and ordering control, yet they pass none of that over to the customer. You should get something like a 5% discount for saving them some money.
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« Reply #205 on: September 15, 2008, 10:36:32 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Grey on September 15, 2008, 06:13:58 PM

Quote from: Farscry on September 15, 2008, 05:48:14 PM

just because Tales sold poorly doesn't mean the platform is dead to JRPG's. It's just dead to Tales games. icon_wink

Dante's larger point was that every JRPG so far has had disappointing sales with the possible exception of LO and even then 500k worldwide is nothing to write home about. 

Exactly. Most have bombed, Blue Dragon was anemic, and Lost Odyssey only did moderately well. Tales of Vesperia looks like it will fare no better. It will be interesting to see how The Last Remnant and Infinite Undiscovery perform. So far only Western RPGs like Oblivion and Mass Effect have done well on the Xbox.

I'm hoping that Microsoft takes the long view with Lost Odyssey and, as the rumor mill is stating, makes it one of their flagship RPGs. Even Final Fantasy took a few iterations to really take off.
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« Reply #206 on: September 16, 2008, 01:22:12 AM »

Ah, I understand now guys.

Also, yes, I really hope MS gives Lost Odyssey time to grow into a proper franchise; for a first outing, it's very, very impressive.
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« Reply #207 on: September 16, 2008, 02:59:38 AM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 15, 2008, 10:25:15 PM

I hate pre-ordering from GS simply because you are doing them a great service for their inventory and ordering control, yet they pass none of that over to the customer. You should get something like a 5% discount for saving them some money.

Personally, I do think the customer benefits by getting the game they want, however,
I don't disagree. There have been a few games where you DID get a price break
and I thought it was awesome. I'd like to see that happen more.
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« Reply #208 on: September 16, 2008, 04:06:00 AM »

Quote from: Farscry on September 16, 2008, 01:22:12 AM

Ah, I understand now guys.

Also, yes, I really hope MS gives Lost Odyssey time to grow into a proper franchise; for a first outing, it's very, very impressive.

I'm not sure I'd call it "very, very impressive" (repetitive environments and enemies, dull story outside of the memories, not a terribly exciting combat system), but it was certainly a very good start.  I'd probably buy a sequel, if the reviews were decent.
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« Reply #209 on: September 17, 2008, 12:28:33 PM »

Quote from: Gratch on September 16, 2008, 04:06:00 AM

Quote from: Farscry on September 16, 2008, 01:22:12 AM

Ah, I understand now guys.

Also, yes, I really hope MS gives Lost Odyssey time to grow into a proper franchise; for a first outing, it's very, very impressive.

I'm not sure I'd call it "very, very impressive" (repetitive environments and enemies, dull story outside of the memories, not a terribly exciting combat system), but it was certainly a very good start.  I'd probably buy a sequel, if the reviews were decent.

so let me see:

-repetitive environments
-repetitive enemies
-dull story
-mediocre combat

.....and you call that "a good start"? icon_eek
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« Reply #210 on: September 17, 2008, 02:37:11 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 17, 2008, 12:28:33 PM

Quote from: Gratch on September 16, 2008, 04:06:00 AM

Quote from: Farscry on September 16, 2008, 01:22:12 AM

Ah, I understand now guys.

Also, yes, I really hope MS gives Lost Odyssey time to grow into a proper franchise; for a first outing, it's very, very impressive.

I'm not sure I'd call it "very, very impressive" (repetitive environments and enemies, dull story outside of the memories, not a terribly exciting combat system), but it was certainly a very good start.  I'd probably buy a sequel, if the reviews were decent.

so let me see:

-repetitive environments
-repetitive enemies
-dull story
-mediocre combat

.....and you call that "a good start"? icon_eek

Yep.   The enemies and environments were very well designed, there just wasn't enough variety to keep it interesting.  And the main reason the story was dull was because they doled it out at such a ridiculously slow pace.  If they had simply tightened up the story, cut out a lot of the filler crap, and mixed in a bit of variety in the enemies, Lost Odyssey would have been a brilliant game.  As is, it's simply an OK one, with a ton of potential.
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« Reply #211 on: September 17, 2008, 03:11:23 PM »

Quote from: Gratch on September 17, 2008, 02:37:11 PM

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 17, 2008, 12:28:33 PM

Quote from: Gratch on September 16, 2008, 04:06:00 AM

Quote from: Farscry on September 16, 2008, 01:22:12 AM

Ah, I understand now guys.

Also, yes, I really hope MS gives Lost Odyssey time to grow into a proper franchise; for a first outing, it's very, very impressive.

I'm not sure I'd call it "very, very impressive" (repetitive environments and enemies, dull story outside of the memories, not a terribly exciting combat system), but it was certainly a very good start.  I'd probably buy a sequel, if the reviews were decent.

so let me see:

-repetitive environments
-repetitive enemies
-dull story
-mediocre combat

.....and you call that "a good start"? icon_eek

Yep.   The enemies and environments were very well designed, there just wasn't enough variety to keep it interesting.  And the main reason the story was dull was because they doled it out at such a ridiculously slow pace.  If they had simply tightened up the story, cut out a lot of the filler crap, and mixed in a bit of variety in the enemies, Lost Odyssey would have been a brilliant game.  As is, it's simply an OK one, with a ton of potential.

I agree.  I was hooked immediately, but then things slowed down sooooo much that I stopped playing.
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« Reply #212 on: September 17, 2008, 03:16:55 PM »

+1 to the "Lost Odyssey started well but then fell apart" comments.  I'd certainly be up for LO2 if they can fix the issues. 
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« Reply #213 on: September 17, 2008, 03:19:12 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 15, 2008, 10:25:15 PM

Quote from: Destructor on September 15, 2008, 03:16:44 PM

Quote from: Misguided on September 15, 2008, 02:42:42 AM

Something you need to understand, and I know some folks are vehemently against pre-ordering or feel like it gets shoved down their throats, but GS (and probably other retailers as well) is ordering most titles more conservatively than usual because of the economy. If people don't pre-order, we don't get copies in big quantities. Case in point. Rock Band came out on 360 today. My store got 4 copies.

Yeah, I've seen that as well at my local GS. If you want a game, preorder the bloody thing! Yeah, I know everybody here hates GS. I still say you're all nuts. Just give them your $5 and be done with it.

I hate pre-ordering from GS simply because you are doing them a great service for their inventory and ordering control, yet they pass none of that over to the customer. You should get something like a 5% discount for saving them some money.

Exactly. I'm not trying to upset anyone by saying this, but I have such strong feelings about Gamestop's pre-order system that I'll give up gaming before I ever pre-order another game from them.
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« Reply #214 on: September 17, 2008, 04:09:52 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Grey on September 17, 2008, 03:16:55 PM

+1 to the "Lost Odyssey started well but then fell apart" comments.  I'd certainly be up for LO2 if they can fix the issues. 

Ah, ok, I should disclaimer that I'm only about fifteen hours into the game, and so far I love it and am very impressed. That may or may not continue from the sounds of it. icon_wink I should've been clearer in my earlier praise of the game that it was on a conditional "so far" basis!
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« Reply #215 on: September 17, 2008, 04:28:33 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 15, 2008, 10:25:15 PM

You should get something like a 5% discount for making them some money.

Fixed that for you.
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« Reply #216 on: September 17, 2008, 08:04:29 PM »

Quote from: Bullwinkle on September 17, 2008, 04:28:33 PM

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 15, 2008, 10:25:15 PM

You should get something like a 5% discount for making them some money.

Fixed that for you.

Absolutely. They win on both ends. The get your business AND you are helping them eliminate unnecessary inventory, forecasting and ordering costs when you pre-order. A small discount would go a long way toward showing some appreciation. With Amazon doing discounts on pre-orders, coupled with no taxes, an increasing amount of my business is headed their way.
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« Reply #217 on: September 17, 2008, 09:28:09 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 17, 2008, 08:04:29 PM

With Amazon doing discounts on pre-orders, coupled with no taxes, an increasing amount of my business is headed their way.

Technically you're breaking the law with you not paying taxes to the government. You're supposed to send an additional amount of taxes to your state based on your out of state purchases.

Yes, NOBODY does it, but that's the law. And it's a law that the government is trying to 'fix'.
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« Reply #218 on: September 17, 2008, 10:02:13 PM »

I get taxed on Amazon purchases. I believe that has something to do with having a distribution center in my state though(Kansas). I'd still pre-order from there before Gamestop. What's even more amusing to me is there's a Gamestop right next door to the Best Buy in my town, and I'll walk in there to get a game, they won't have it as usual and preach to me about how I really need to preorder games I want to get. I just walk next door and grab a copy from Best Buy. I find no benefit to shopping at Gamestop.

Back to the game, I haven't got a chance to play much lately. Have some people finished up? I'm wondering how consistent the game is? Did people find it maintained the level of the first portion throughout?
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« Reply #219 on: September 17, 2008, 10:25:18 PM »

Quote from: Gertbeef on September 17, 2008, 10:02:13 PM

there's a Gamestop right next door to the Best Buy in my town, and I'll walk in there to get a game, they won't have it as usual and preach to me about how I really need to preorder games I want to get. I just walk next door and grab a copy from Best Buy. I find no benefit to shopping at Gamestop.

See, THAT'S the problem. The message a guy (person) like you
gets is "Why should I go there when they never have it anyway?"
That's certainly not what I want my store to be known for.
It's important that customers see the value in preordering.
There needs to be something in it for them. Preorder spiffs rock
but I mean above and beyond that. Though, to be honest, when
we have had dollar off promotions, they haven't been received
with a lot of cheers from customers.

I also think, contrary to what some of you might believe,
that the only reason they charge for preorders is to weed out
people that aren't seriously interested in the games and to encourage
people to come pick them up. They actually flirted with ten dollar
reserves a while back to see if it would increase the pickup rates.
I guess it didn't because we haven't heard much about that lately.
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« Reply #220 on: October 06, 2008, 09:27:01 PM »

Just finished the game (about 50 hours for me). Had a good time pretty much all the way through. Go pick it up.
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« Reply #221 on: January 06, 2009, 09:19:51 PM »

I've been playing this and think it is very well done.  I am enjoying the story and the characters (for the most part) and really enjoy the tweaks they've made to the battle system.  One gripe I have, though, is that they put cut scenes before boss battles that aren't skippable.  I'm not sure why devs insist on doing this, but they did it here.  I had to do a boss fight about 3 times last night and had to watch some long cut scenes and even fight a minor battle followed by more cut scenes on each attempt.  Ugh.  Other than that, though, I think it might be the best JRPG I have played on the 360.
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« Reply #222 on: January 09, 2009, 05:53:33 AM »

I really have a love/hate relationship with this game.  I love almost everything about it....except the fucking unskippable golden monkey cock cut scenes.  I'm at a part right now where you fight these guys and they teach you how to do a blast arte.  The problem is I keep dying in the battle.  What that means is that I have to keep going through the 18 million cut scenes before this battle because there is no way to save right before this battle (after all the cut scenes).  So, I have to go through all of those and then also go through the part where they teach you how to pull off this move.  If they're trying to teach me something in the game, why are they punishing me for failure?
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« Reply #223 on: January 09, 2009, 07:16:07 PM »

Wow... I have this sitting around waiting for me to get a chance to play it but the idea of unskippable cutscenes in a game with set save points is making me not want to get into it.
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« Reply #224 on: January 09, 2009, 07:31:18 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on January 09, 2009, 07:16:07 PM

Wow... I have this sitting around waiting for me to get a chance to play it but the idea of unskippable cutscenes in a game with set save points is making me not want to get into it.

It takes a man with much patience.  I finally just set the battle difficulty to easy (at least you can change difficulties on the fly) and just got the hell past it.  I had been mashing A to get past all the text, but you can just hold down X+A to do it with less effort.  Still, it seemed like it would take me 5 minutes to get back to the battle once I died.  That's pretty unacceptable, but the rest of the game is so great, I can overlook it.
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« Reply #225 on: January 09, 2009, 07:33:56 PM »

I'm 5-6 hours in and I'm really enjoying it so far. The combat system is excellent and the characters are a lot more charming then I expected. Haven't had a very difficult time yet (just got done with the City of Scholars) so I haven't had to repeat any unskippable cutscenes.
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« Reply #226 on: January 09, 2009, 08:22:39 PM »

I finally picked this up earlier this week too. The dialogue is great so far. Only about an hour into so far. Still getting the hang of combat and timing the blocking.
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« Reply #227 on: January 09, 2009, 08:31:13 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on January 09, 2009, 07:16:07 PM

Wow... I have this sitting around waiting for me to get a chance to play it but the idea of unskippable cutscenes in a game with set save points is making me not want to get into it.

In the 40 or so hours of Vesperia I played before burning out on it, I don't think most of the boss battles were particularly difficult so it was never really an issue.
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« Reply #228 on: January 09, 2009, 08:36:29 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Grey on January 09, 2009, 08:31:13 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on January 09, 2009, 07:16:07 PM

Wow... I have this sitting around waiting for me to get a chance to play it but the idea of unskippable cutscenes in a game with set save points is making me not want to get into it.

In the 40 or so hours of Vesperia I played before burning out on it, I don't think most of the boss battles were particularly difficult so it was never really an issue.

I'm not very good with this combat system, so it really just depends.  I've had to fight some boss battles 3 or 4 times.
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« Reply #229 on: January 09, 2009, 08:43:55 PM »

If you're still new to the combat I would recommend two things:

1) Set boss battles to easy, if need be, as mentioned above

2) Set regular battles to hard.  On normal they go by so fast that it's hard to learn combos and they are so easy that you can button mash through them.  Taking longer on regular enemies will help teach the various systems
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« Reply #230 on: January 09, 2009, 09:21:38 PM »

Quote from: Misguided on August 20, 2008, 06:44:11 PM

Looks like MS finally found an RPG Japan likes.
According to an Engadget/Joystiq blogger, the 360 is sold out across the nation.

The homoerotic clothing and character designs must resonate with them.

I would never, EVER have a heart-shaped hole cut in a cape I wore that exposed my ass. That's just the wrong kind of advertising.
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« Reply #231 on: January 09, 2009, 10:03:12 PM »

Hey, I had some questions on the artes in the game.

I've levelled up these guys enough that they have tons of artes.  What is the strategy here on this?  I think it must be a waste to have them all set to on.  Should I be getting rid of some of the older ones and only using the newer ones?  What are your strategies with regards to which ones you enable and which you disable?

So you guys ever control the other characters manually or do you pretty much only stick with Yuri?  I only manually control Yuri and set the others to Auto, but wondering if it might be better to play as one of the other characters.
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« Reply #232 on: January 10, 2009, 03:22:52 AM »

Quote from: The Grue on January 09, 2009, 10:03:12 PM

Hey, I had some questions on the artes in the game.

I've levelled up these guys enough that they have tons of artes.  What is the strategy here on this?  I think it must be a waste to have them all set to on.  Should I be getting rid of some of the older ones and only using the newer ones?  What are your strategies with regards to which ones you enable and which you disable?

Most new artes are unlocked by performing existing artes a set number of times (usually between 50-150 times).  So you want to use most artes at least that much before retiring them.  Beyond that, different artes work better for different enemies.  Also, as you go along there is another system that unlocks where you can essentially do finishing strikes depending on which artes you use but you probably haven't got to that stage of the game yet (there will be a tutorial when you do). 

Quote
So you guys ever control the other characters manually or do you pretty much only stick with Yuri?  I only manually control Yuri and set the others to Auto, but wondering if it might be better to play as one of the other characters.

For the most part I just stick with Yuri.  However the advantage to using other characters is that you learn their Artes selection better and that will let you direct them more effectively in combat even when you are controlling Yuri.  So it's worth experimenting with other members but personally I found it very hard to get used to controlling another character. 
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« Reply #233 on: January 14, 2009, 11:01:41 PM »

I'm about 12 hours in now. This game is damn jawesome. i wish I bought it first over UI, heh. The voice acting is top notch, as a few are from persona 3, so no surprise there. I love the little skits they have. Some of them are absolutely hilarious. The victory cries are pretty funny at times too.

Slowly getting the hang of combat now. I did 2 hours of battles for gaald on hard and that helped a crap ton. Since you can't really just spam attacks on hard. Dropping back down to normal made things seem a bit easy, heh. Best hits so far is 34, not too bad. But I just got the powerful arcane attack you can do once you overdrive it. Which totally makes bosses easy mode.

the music and cel shading are nice. i know cel shading bothers a lot of people, but I thought it worked well in zelda and it's absolutely good looking now. the cut scenes look really nice especially. When you restored the barrier of halure that's when the graphics really shined.

I'm addicted to gaining skills and synthesizing weapons for them. combat is so much fun that grinding it's boring. since I just try to chain as much as I can for grade.
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« Reply #234 on: January 26, 2009, 04:59:00 PM »

well, after a few hours of play the whole 'old school' execution was really getting to me so I've officially given up on it and traded it.  sure, the graphics were beautiful, but it still felt like I was playing a Gamecube game on the 360, especially with very little voice acting and the unskippable cutscenes.  I could accept that if it was indeed a GC game, but for a 360 title I expected alot more.
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« Reply #235 on: January 26, 2009, 07:36:56 PM »

very little voice acting? wtf are you talking about? about 80% of the game is VO. I'd rather no NPCs be voiced than have 2 guys doing it ala oblivion.
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« Reply #236 on: January 26, 2009, 07:40:34 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on January 26, 2009, 04:59:00 PM

well, after a few hours of play the whole 'old school' execution was really getting to me so I've officially given up on it and traded it.  sure, the graphics were beautiful, but it still felt like I was playing a Gamecube game on the 360, especially with very little voice acting and the unskippable cutscenes.  I could accept that if it was indeed a GC game, but for a 360 title I expected alot more.

I agree with you about the unskippable skits, but there was a ton of voice acting in ToV - most of which was extremely well done imo. 
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skystride
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« Reply #237 on: April 13, 2009, 03:05:55 PM »

Only about 5 hours in but I'm enjoying it.  A lot better than Eternal Sonata which I hated.  I didn't know there was a Persona connection until I read this thread but I felt it while playing (makes me want to go back to Persona IV which I never completed).

Does anyone know if it's possible to switch control to another character during battle?  The battlebook says it's possible but I tried the Y and then LB + Down and it doesn't work.  That just lets me change tactics.
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jersoc
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« Reply #238 on: April 13, 2009, 06:35:18 PM »

I believe you need to buy an item first to switch characters
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Chaz
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« Reply #239 on: May 19, 2009, 03:08:20 PM »

More thread resurrection! It's the year of the zombie threads for me!

Started this a week or two ago, and I'm about 25 hours in.  So far I'm liking it, but I'm not totally in love.  I think my main thing is that I'm having trouble grabbing onto a central plot point.  There's a bunch of threads, but it seems like every time I get someplace that it seems like they're going to start tying things together, they send you off somewhere else.  I'm sure they'll pull things together, but it's a bit disjointed right now, with more than a few things hanging loose.

Mechanics-wise, I quite like the combat.  Took me a little while to get into, but once you adjust to being more selective about where and who you engage within the battles, it flows very well.  Something that's bugging me is that I frequently miss the fatal strike opportunities.  Seems like if one pops up while I'm in an animation, even if I hit the trigger while it's up, I don't actually do the strike, which is annoying. 

The other thing that's constantly amazing me about this is how (it's been said before) utterly charming all the characters are.  While I'm normally annoyed to death by the naive sheltered girl and the enthusiastic little kid anime cliches, I can't do it in this.  Karol is much to sincere to hate.  Estelle somehow manages to be cute and enthusiastic, but never crosses the line to annoying.  I love everything about her.  Rita though, is my favorite.  I especially like the skits.  The graphics for them bugged me at first, but they've since grown on me, especially how they use the positions of the portraits to effectively convey physical position.  It works surprisingly well.

The surprising bit is how the story is happy, happy, happy, and then Yuri goes and does something utterly dark.  Hopefully it'll keep my interest for the next 35 hours.
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