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Author Topic: Sony: 'Publishers Are Getting the Living Crap Kicked Out of Them by Microsoft'  (Read 757 times)
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corruptrelic
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« on: September 03, 2011, 02:08:24 AM »

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Last week, a story came to the forefront regarding Microsoft’s Content Submission and Release Policy, obtained by Eurogamer. The gist of it is that Microsoft has some very strict policies on what they're willing to publish on retail discs or on Xbox Live Arcade, and if it arrives on a Sony platform first or has more content on a Sony platform, Microsoft won't publish it. What does Sony have to say about all this? A lot, apparently...

IndustryGamers chatted with Sony Computer Entertainment America's SVP of Publisher Relations Rob Dyer, who was more than happy to highlight what he feels are very damaging policies for Microsoft.

"I think what [Xbox Europe boss] Chris Lewis was referring to was something that we’ve known about for quite some time, that we’ve been dealing with, and trying to deal with - in the spirit of competition, more than anything, we look for ways to give our consumer reason to have the PS3. I think what Chris and the other representatives at Microsoft are doing is protecting an inferior technology. I think they want to dumb it down and keep it as pedestrian as possible so that if you want to do anything for Blu-ray or you have extra content above 9 gigs or you want to do anything of that nature, you’d better sure as heck remember that Microsoft can't handle that," Dyer began with his all-out attack.

"And that’s a huge problem with them. It first started on the smaller pubs, and we can talk about what’s happened on XBL and the policy they have there that requires publishers to have a whole litany of things in order to get onto their network or they have to go through and be published by Xbox, by Microsoft, which essentially lets them dictate how long they’ll be exclusive and whether or not they own the IP, etc, etc. They - for instance, if you want to be able to do something on XBL, you need to have an office, there’s all kinds of restrictions. We don’t do that. We don’t have any kind of policy like that. We’re not pushing that. In fact, we’ve gone the other way to try and encourage publishers through our Pub Fund... We want to welcome the indies and we've seen that become a very big part of our business because indies are recognizing that we aren’t demanding a pound of flesh in order for them to get a game published on our network."

And Dyer stressed that this is no longer just a problem for the "little guys." It's something that even top tier publishers have to contend with. Naturally, Sony feels this gives them an edge when it comes to developer relationships.


http://www.industrygamers.com/news/sony-publishers-are-getting-the-living-crap-kicked-out-of-them-by-microsoft/
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« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2011, 03:39:18 AM »

well damn, you convinced me to cancel my Vita order.
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leo8877
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« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2011, 03:56:44 AM »

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 03:39:18 AM

well damn, you convinced me to cancel my Vita order.

You got it wrong.
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« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2011, 04:25:01 AM »

Quote from: leo8877 on September 03, 2011, 03:56:44 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 03:39:18 AM

well damn, you convinced me to cancel my Vita order.

You got it wrong.

so this isn't pointing out Sony negativity and isn't a rally cry to put a stop to it no matter what?
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leo8877
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« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2011, 04:36:07 AM »

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 04:25:01 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on September 03, 2011, 03:56:44 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 03:39:18 AM

well damn, you convinced me to cancel my Vita order.

You got it wrong.

so this isn't pointing out Sony negativity and isn't a rally cry to put a stop to it no matter what?

No you cancel your XBL membership!
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2011, 05:12:03 AM »

And get a PSN membership! (No monthly fee needed!  ninja)

Actually think he brought up some good points, especially about the 9GB limit on Xbox. Seems very childish that Microsoft wouldn't allow a game on their system if the PS3 version got bonus blu-ray content due to the PS3's superior disc size.
Since several developers themselves have already brought this up, seems like a legit enough issue to bring up.
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« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2011, 07:38:49 AM »

Good or bad, its the same thing Sony did when they had the market leverage.   icon_lol

But look at it from Microsofts position: they are doing what they can to keep Sony's disk capacity advantage minimized, and if that means forcing publishers to promise to to give Sony "extras" then so be it.  And if you think Sony didn't do the same thing back when the XBox had some advantages over the PS2, then you don't know how this industry works.  The rest of it about maximizing revenue, and again, Microsoft is simply taking advantage of its market position.  You can do that when the publishers can't afford to say no.  If MS is too harsh about it then they will ultimately lose out.


« Last Edit: September 03, 2011, 07:40:20 AM by Sarkus » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2011, 09:11:00 AM »

Quote from: leo8877 on September 03, 2011, 04:36:07 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 04:25:01 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on September 03, 2011, 03:56:44 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 03:39:18 AM

well damn, you convinced me to cancel my Vita order.

You got it wrong.

so this isn't pointing out Sony negativity and isn't a rally cry to put a stop to it no matter what?

No you cancel your Uncharted 3 pre-order!

right-o!  biggrin
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Laner
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« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2011, 12:29:35 PM »

Quote from: Sarkus on September 03, 2011, 07:38:49 AM

Good or bad, its the same thing Sony did when they had the market leverage.   icon_lol


Yup.  That just means Sony has to do better in other areas.  Competition is good.
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TiLT
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« Reply #9 on: September 03, 2011, 01:06:53 PM »

Quote from: Laner on September 03, 2011, 12:29:35 PM

Quote from: Sarkus on September 03, 2011, 07:38:49 AM

Good or bad, its the same thing Sony did when they had the market leverage.   icon_lol


Yup.  That just means Sony has to do better in other areas.  Competition is good.

That's a bit too simplistic. What Microsoft is doing in this console "war" isn't good for the consumers. When they pay for exclusivity for something (usually a piece of DLC that would otherwise have been released to everyone), people who are unable or unwilling to purchase a 360-version of the game are left in the cold, including PC users who may not even have an interest in consoles and their conflicts. When Microsoft demands that games on the 360 must be the same or better quality than on other platforms, customers on other platforms end up receiving a worse product than they otherwise might have, even if they have absolutely no interest or customer relationship to Microsoft. When Microsoft demands that games must be on their platform first or at the same time as other versions or not be released at all, their own, paying customers end up not getting games that might otherwise have been ported to the 360 eventually. As it is, there's no chance in hell that 360-owners will ever get Demon's Souls, for example.

So tell me, how are these things good for the consumers? The way I see it, everyone suffers, whether they are Microsoft customers or not.
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leo8877
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« Reply #10 on: September 03, 2011, 01:24:43 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 09:11:00 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on September 03, 2011, 04:36:07 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 04:25:01 AM

Quote from: leo8877 on September 03, 2011, 03:56:44 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on September 03, 2011, 03:39:18 AM

well damn, you convinced me to cancel my Vita order.

You got it wrong.

so this isn't pointing out Sony negativity and isn't a rally cry to put a stop to it no matter what?

No you cancel your Uncharted 3 pre-order!

right-o!  biggrin

You only do this if you hate gaming!
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Dante Rising
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« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2011, 04:27:58 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on September 03, 2011, 01:06:53 PM

Quote from: Laner on September 03, 2011, 12:29:35 PM

Quote from: Sarkus on September 03, 2011, 07:38:49 AM

Good or bad, its the same thing Sony did when they had the market leverage.   icon_lol


Yup.  That just means Sony has to do better in other areas.  Competition is good.

So tell me, how are these things good for the consumers? The way I see it, everyone suffers, whether they are Microsoft customers or not.

Exclusive content for the 360= Good for Xbox consumers
MS saying their customers should get the same content as Sony= Good for Xbox consumers

Honestly, I prefer that MS and other companies try to be somewhat strict on their content. The iOS gaming landscape is a nightmare of trash with only a minority of quality games. For the Wii, Nintendo loosened their standards and sh!t flooded the console.

The first priority of Microsoft isn't the consumer, it is their consumer. Additionally, Microsoft said they reserve the right not to allow the game on their system. They didn't state anything in absolutes. From the Escapist:

"Microsoft also seems to play fast and loose with its own rules depending on the size of the franchise in question. The 360 version of Mortal Kombat, for example, comes with absolutely no bonus content, while the PS3 version has surly egghead Kratos from God of War as an on-disc bonus character."
« Last Edit: September 03, 2011, 04:37:45 PM by Dante Rising » Logged
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« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2011, 05:02:33 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on September 03, 2011, 04:27:58 PM

Exclusive content for the 360= Good for Xbox consumers

How exactly? People keep throwing around this argument as if it's gospel, but nobody seems to bother to stop and think about it. I own both a 360 and a PS3, and it annoys me that Gears of War 2 is only available on the 360 since I prefer to play my games on the PS3. The benefit is strictly Microsoft's, never the customer's. If you only own a 360, an exclusive on that platform isn't going to affect you one way or the other. If you've got more than one console or don't own a 360, your choices are being artificially limited or even removed completely. Are you really trying to say that this benefits any of us?

Quote
MS saying their customers should get the same content as Sony= Good for Xbox consumers

Again, how? To use your Mortal Kombat example, the situation for 360 owners wouldn't have changed an iota regardless of Kratos' presence or lack of on the PS3. In fact, if Microsoft hadn't buckled under the pressure in this case, we'd have one of two situations: 1) No Kratos for PS3. Bad for PS3 owners. No difference for 360 owners. 2) No Mortal Kombat for 360. Bad for 360 owners, and in this case slightly good for PS3 customers since they would get Kratos for it. Still mostly a bad situation, and neither situation would lead to any positives for Microsoft's customers.

You're throwing conclusions at the wall here to see what sticks, but you're not telling us how you got to these conclusions, and I certainly can't see it on my own. Indulge us.
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Harkonis
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« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2011, 05:23:17 PM »

his conclusions are 100% true.  He says it's good for XBOX OWNERS.  I think you're missing that point. 

I suppose there is a subset of XBOX OWNERS WHO WISH THEY ONLY HAD A PS3 AND EVERYTHING WAS AVAILABLE ON IT INSTEAD.  But that's a smaller portion.

It's a good deal because for now, publishers continue to cater to what MS is demanding, making it a win for xbox owners.  If publishers decide to not publish on the xbox due to these, then you'll get stuff only on the PS3 and that's fine as well.

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TiLT
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« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2011, 05:32:05 PM »

Quote from: Harkonis on September 03, 2011, 05:23:17 PM

his conclusions are 100% true.  He says it's good for XBOX OWNERS.  I think you're missing that point. 

No, I'm not missing the point. It's not good for owners of any console. The only thing we're measuring here is to what degree it is BAD for various console owners. In other words: It's not good for 360 owners because they're not getting a single benefit. Microsoft benefits from this, not consumers. Is that really so hard to see? Are people really this indoctrinated by MS/Sony's marketing speech?

The only "benefit" I can see to exclusivity is that "fanbois" on one side or the other can feel a sense of misplaced superiority, and what the fuck kind of benefit is that?
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« Reply #15 on: September 03, 2011, 06:32:20 PM »

I see, so Sony's Pub Fund to publish indie games is a real charity case, and they're allowing those games on 360 as well?  Hell no they aren't. 

You mention Gears of War and sucking for being an Xbox exclusive, but what about Ratchet & Clank?  Infamous?  Sly Cooper?  Killzone?  Resistance?  Motorstorm?  All games developed by independent companies but exclusive to Sony.  Most of those companies have also been bought by Sony (Insomniac being the only holdout).  Sony may not pay for exclusive DLC these days, but they sure as hell buy exclusivity.
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« Reply #16 on: September 03, 2011, 07:43:22 PM »

Quote from: EngineNo9 on September 03, 2011, 06:32:20 PM

I see, so Sony's Pub Fund to publish indie games is a real charity case, and they're allowing those games on 360 as well?  Hell no they aren't. 

You mention Gears of War and sucking for being an Xbox exclusive, but what about Ratchet & Clank?  Infamous?  Sly Cooper?  Killzone?  Resistance?  Motorstorm?  All games developed by independent companies but exclusive to Sony.  Most of those companies have also been bought by Sony (Insomniac being the only holdout).  Sony may not pay for exclusive DLC these days, but they sure as hell buy exclusivity.

You may notice I'm bashing both Sony and Microsoft when I'm talking about exclusivity in my posts above.

Having said that, I believe there is a fundamental and very important difference between their tactics. Sony invests in fledgling projects that might not otherwise have been made, taking part in the development process from an early stage. They help indie developers or developers with risky projects (like Heavy Rain, to take an extreme example that turned out very well) realize their visions where normal development might not have been possible. Microsoft only steps in after a game is nearly done, when the risk is minimal and the money less needed. In essence, while Sony invests in game developers, Microsoft bribes them, to the detriment of many consumers out there.

For the same reasons as these, I also have no problems with Microsoft's XBLA and XBLIG, two approaches to encouraging new games development that I wholeheartedly endorse.
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« Reply #17 on: September 03, 2011, 08:03:47 PM »

So even if Insomniac said they wanted to get Resistance 3 on the 360 by December, thanks to Microsoft's "rules" they wouldn't be allowed to do it.
On the other hand, if Microsoft lost the exclusivity to Gears of War and Epic decided to port over to PS3, Sony would allow it. (And maybe even throw in mouse/keyboard support, since Sony also officially supports that.) There are a number of games that came to 360 first and later to Playstation that if Sony had gone by Microsoft's same rule set, PS3 users never would have had the chance to play.
Likewise, there's a number of PS3 games that are actually fairly good, but will never see the light of day on Xbox because they went to PS3 first.
Modern Combat Domination is one such game. (By Gameloft who is linked to neither MS or Sony.)

Having enjoyed the hell out of Section 8 Prejudice on PS3, I'm sure as hell glad Sony didn't pull a Microsoft and say they didn't want it because it was on the competition's system first.
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« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2011, 08:49:05 PM »

Is corruptrelic the new SDF?   icon_twisted
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« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2011, 09:13:53 PM »

Quote from: pr0ner on September 03, 2011, 08:49:05 PM

Is corruptrelic the new SDF?   icon_twisted

Looks like it. I imagine Michele Bachmann will soo be a 360 fangirl biggrin
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #20 on: September 03, 2011, 09:43:33 PM »

I could never take Hetz's spot!

I have both systems but no denying I prefer PS3 over 360 if none other than I don't have to 'pay to play' the games I already bought.
You don't have to be a fanboy to see that some of the issues brought up in the article above are just common sense.
If Sony blocked Section 8 Prejudice because it was on Xbox first, how would that benefit the consumer?
Almost as if Xbox is holding the PS3 back if none other than disc size, developers are forced to either make the 'same' game and sacrifice what could have been so much more to fit it on an Xbox disc, pay extra money to MS to put it on multiple dvds, or go the PS3-only route and lose a good number of sales.

Both systems have their advantages and disadvantages, that's why I own both. And clearly as CK pointed out, since Michelle Bachmann is a 360 fangirl, you know it's a system for nuts and extremists so that says a lot about the people defending MS at every turn! If you want to support a system with known links to extremists, then that's on you.
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« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2011, 10:04:08 PM »

Quote from: corruptrelic on September 03, 2011, 09:43:33 PM

Both systems have their advantages and disadvantages, that's why I own both. And clearly as CK pointed out, since Michelle Bachmann is a 360 fangirl, you know it's a system for nuts and extremists so that says a lot about the people defending MS at every turn! If you want to support a system with known links to extremists, then that's on you.

I heard Obama is on her friends list as xxDaBigO69xx, and so is Romney as TheRominator.
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leo8877
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« Reply #22 on: September 03, 2011, 10:52:13 PM »

PS3 FO' LIFE
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corruptrelic
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« Reply #23 on: September 04, 2011, 06:29:40 PM »

What kind of people show up to Sarah Palin rallies?

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