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Author Topic: So... should I give Thief a second chance?  (Read 3003 times)
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ravenvii
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« on: November 15, 2009, 08:44:12 AM »

About 8 years ago (!!!  eek) I played Thief because of the GGFE. I played through the first two missions (the one in the pub and the one in the mansion) and loved it. Then I hit the level in the mines when zombies showed up. I gave up on the game at that point and sold it.

Fast forward to today, I saw in the trading forum someone's selling Thief 1+2. I'm wondering if I should give it another shot? Am I really missing out by not playing them?
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heloder
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« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2009, 09:46:08 AM »

I did not enjoy a number of the levels from Thief 1 (which I just got around to finishing this year). I don't think you're missing too much, honestly. Lord Bafford's Manor and Break from Cragscleft Prison were my two favorite levels in the game, and if you didn't enjoy Down in the Bonehoard, then I doubt you're going to have a lot of fun with most of the remaining levels, many of which are an even larger departure from the setting and gameplay of the first few levels (as well as being even more protracted).

Return to the Cathedral is pretty highly regarded, and I will say that it's easily the best mission in the latter part of the game, but I'm not sure it would be worth trudging through the levels leading up to it if you weren't enjoying yourself at all.

I can't comment too much on Thief 2 since I've only played a handful of levels, but I'm hoping to finish that one this year as well.

I really enjoyed most of Thief 3, though, and I would highly recommend that you give it a shot if you haven't. The level design is much more straightforward so you won't find yourself constantly wondering where you are and where the hell you're supposed to be going. It is quite long, though, and it may burn you out after a while, but I implore you to at least get to the Robbing the Cradle level, which is exceptional.
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MrDuck
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« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2009, 01:31:05 PM »

*Blackjacks both ravenvii and heloder for great Thiefy justice*

Buy and play and shush.

All 3 Thief games, yus.

 drool

But, srsly, they've not aged well, graphically speaking, but gameplay is still top notch, IMO, and don't be afraid of no zombies!!! biggrin

Favorite Thief overall would be The Metal Age (i.e. 2).

Also, there's a large community of fan mission makers from some forums I've been member for almost a decade (I'll gladly give the addy on PM so as to not break any forum rules or somesuch), got tons of replay value there 'coz a lot of FMs are better than the OMs (Original Missions) in both graphics (new texture/model packs fan-made), gameplay and level design smile

Viva le Thief! biggrin
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Vinda-Lou
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« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2009, 02:46:39 PM »

Quote from: ravenvii on November 15, 2009, 08:44:12 AM

About 8 years ago (!!!  eek) I played Thief because of the GGFE. I played through the first two missions (the one in the pub and the one in the mansion) and loved it. Then I hit the level in the mines when zombies showed up. I gave up on the game at that point and sold it.

Fast forward to today, I saw in the trading forum someone's selling Thief 1+2. I'm wondering if I should give it another shot? Am I really missing out by not playing them?

You MUST give them another try!  Sure the graphics have aged badly, but I still play at least one of these once a year.  This thread is the catalyst for playing them again soon!  If you can get your hands on Thief Gold, it does change some of the Indiana Jones - type exploring in exchange for more thief-like levels, if I remember correctly.  But nonetheless, the atmosphere in some of the non-robbing levels is amazing.  I've yet to find another game with such an awesome mood throughout the whole game.  And there are many websites with user made levels that are simply amazing - some better than the professional levels.  You will get a lot of mileage out of these games.  Get them ASAP and then come rave about them here.  Don't give up for a few zombies.
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Vinda-Lou
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« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2009, 02:49:28 PM »

http://www.thief-thecircle.com/
http://www.shadowdarkkeep.com/
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=100
http://www.thief2x.com/default2.asp
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warning
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« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2009, 04:06:07 PM »

I *really* want GOG to pick these up and make them completely compatible.
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Huw the Poo
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« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2009, 04:12:39 PM »

Quote from: warning on November 15, 2009, 04:06:07 PM

I *really* want GOG to pick these up and make them completely compatible.

thumbsup

These are perfect games for GoG and I'd snap them up.  Like Ravenvii, I was a bit meh when I hit the supernatural elements in the first game and didn't bother to continue.  Since then I've seen world + dog rave about the series and wonder what I've missed.
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Laura
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« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2009, 07:43:21 PM »

There is a way to skip to the next mission if you want to bypass Bonehoard. Thief II is pretty much zombie free. I love these games and have played dozens of the fan missions. It is a pretty simple procedure to get thief playing in XP. Check the TTLG site.
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JohnathanStrange
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« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2009, 07:59:40 PM »

Heh. I played Thief for the zombies! But that was years ago before the zombie renaissance.
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Daehawk
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« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2009, 08:01:00 PM »

I tried Thief 1 but it didn't grab me. then I played all the way through Thief 2 and loved it. I figured I'd give the first one a go again. I really liked it too that time and finished it. Then a year or so later Thief 3 came out and it was awesome so I finished it too smile
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« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2009, 08:45:16 PM »

Thief is pure awesomeness... especially Thief 2.
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Teggy
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« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2009, 10:29:11 PM »

 I would like it if they made a game like Thief, but maybe with a more modern setting and completely realistic. Maybe like a crafty rascal who robs crime lords but gets in over his head. Call it "Catburglar" or something.

I tried playing Theif, and I really liked the mechanics, but it was too nervewracking for me to play. There was also a level (I think it was that Bonehoard level) where you walked through caves and your perspective was all tilted and it made me nauseous. I'm a very sensitive gamer. icon_redface
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Huw the Poo
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« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2009, 10:39:17 PM »

Quote from: Teggy on November 15, 2009, 10:29:11 PM

I would like it if they made a game like Thief, but maybe with a more modern setting and completely realistic.

Well, it isn't first-person but you could always grab an 8-bit emulator and play They stole a Million! icon_biggrin
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Gratch
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« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2009, 11:07:41 PM »

I adored all three Thief games.  As has been mentioned, they haven't aged well graphically, but the gameplay is still rock solid.  I might suggest skipping the first game, as the devs were asked to put in some "action-y" levels that didn't really work at all.  The second and third games are both absolutely fantastic.
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Razgon
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« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2009, 01:17:41 PM »

I just checked back on www.theif4.com, but still nothing interesting there.

I loved the first two games, meh on the 3rd, but that could have been because my computer at the time couldnt run it very well
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Vinda-Lou
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« Reply #15 on: November 16, 2009, 11:34:20 PM »

maybe try thief4.com?
 ninja
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Giles Habibula
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« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2009, 12:53:20 AM »

I'm slightly biased, since I think Thief 1 and 2 were the BEST GAMES EVER!!!!
But I say give 'em a shot.
Alone. In the dark. With no distractions for like, hours.
No light in the room is imperative. Reflections off the screen are a no-no.

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MaxSteele
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« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2009, 03:10:15 AM »

I have yet to find a scarier level in any video game than Shalebridge Cradle Orphanage in Thief 3.
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MrDuck
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« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2009, 08:13:04 AM »

One word:

Haunts!

"Join us, Join USSSS, JOIN US NOWWWWWW!!!"

 eek

Shalebridge was aces high! biggrin
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Razgon
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« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2009, 08:17:37 AM »

Quote from: MaxSteele on November 17, 2009, 03:10:15 AM

I have yet to find a scarier level in any video game than Shalebridge Cradle Orphanage in Thief 3.

the level in System Shock 2 with the insane wrench-wielding monkeys?? other than that - I agree completely!
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kronovan
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« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2009, 10:45:42 AM »

I'd say give it another try as it's an excellent game, but don't play it without 1st applying the fan-made graphical update. The initial dark engine in Thief 1 was fairly weak visually - actually only ran in 256 colors. There's a way to turn on 16-bit (hi-color) textures and there's a complete replacement for the character models and other textures. Sorry, I can't provide a link to where you can download it, but maybe someone else here knows.

As to the level you stopped on, definitely slog through that as the rest of the game is outstanding IMO. I also recommend Thief 2 as another excellent game in the series. I missed Thief 3, but all this talk will probably get me to track down a copy and play it. smile
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cheeba
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« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2009, 11:31:03 AM »

I also got Thief 2 because of the GG forum effect. I regretted the purchase. I'm not too sure why I couldn't get into it - I think it might have been the first-person view. Melee combat just sucks in first-person. Plus I'm the kinda guy that likes to kill indiscriminately, so yeah, not exactly a great game for me slywink.
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Gratch
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« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2009, 12:14:49 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 11:31:03 AM

I also got Thief 2 because of the GG forum effect. I regretted the purchase. I'm not too sure why I couldn't get into it - I think it might have been the first-person view. Melee combat just sucks in first-person. Plus I'm the kinda guy that likes to kill indiscriminately, so yeah, not exactly a great game for me slywink.

There's your first problem.  Melee combat is an absolute last resort.  If you get into it at all, it typically means you've screwed up.
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« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2009, 12:22:13 PM »

Agreed, once the guards are on to you, the fat lady is singing! Gods, I still remember my first fight against a guard in Thief 1 in that fat merchants house...damn I went down fast :-D
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cheeba
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« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2009, 04:22:57 PM »

Quote from: Gratch on November 17, 2009, 12:14:49 PM

There's your first problem.  Melee combat is an absolute last resort.  If you get into it at all, it typically means you've screwed up.
The blackjack was not a last resort. It was also not very accurate and difficult to judge the distance without bumping the guard. I just didn't like the mechanic that 1 guard seeing you = you dead. I liked Splinter Cell much more, where you actually have a chance at killing a couple people if you get into trouble.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2009, 04:31:26 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 04:22:57 PM

Quote from: Gratch on November 17, 2009, 12:14:49 PM

There's your first problem.  Melee combat is an absolute last resort.  If you get into it at all, it typically means you've screwed up.
The blackjack was not a last resort. It was also not very accurate and difficult to judge the distance without bumping the guard. I just didn't like the mechanic that 1 guard seeing you = you dead. I liked Splinter Cell much more, where you actually have a chance at killing a couple people if you get into trouble.

That's what makes the game- just because Garrett is a master thief doesn't make him some kind of uber badass combat guy.  The objective is to not get caught. 
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« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2009, 04:55:15 PM »

You haven't really played Thief until you've ghosted the levels.
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MonkeyFinger
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« Reply #27 on: November 17, 2009, 05:00:40 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Grey on November 17, 2009, 04:31:26 PM

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 04:22:57 PM

Quote from: Gratch on November 17, 2009, 12:14:49 PM

There's your first problem.  Melee combat is an absolute last resort.  If you get into it at all, it typically means you've screwed up.

The blackjack was not a last resort. It was also not very accurate and difficult to judge the distance without bumping the guard. I just didn't like the mechanic that 1 guard seeing you = you dead. I liked Splinter Cell much more, where you actually have a chance at killing a couple people if you get into trouble.

That's what makes the game- just because Garrett is a master thief doesn't make him some kind of uber badass combat guy.  The objective is to not get caught. 

I don't think the blackjack was lumped into the 'melee combat' comment. It's part of his stealth arsenal, an essential tool, I would assume that the melee comment was directed to those times when you felt the need to whip out your sword, the mission was pretty much over at that point.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #28 on: November 17, 2009, 05:05:20 PM »

Quote from: MonkeyFinger on November 17, 2009, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: Kevin Grey on November 17, 2009, 04:31:26 PM

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 04:22:57 PM

Quote from: Gratch on November 17, 2009, 12:14:49 PM

There's your first problem.  Melee combat is an absolute last resort.  If you get into it at all, it typically means you've screwed up.

The blackjack was not a last resort. It was also not very accurate and difficult to judge the distance without bumping the guard. I just didn't like the mechanic that 1 guard seeing you = you dead. I liked Splinter Cell much more, where you actually have a chance at killing a couple people if you get into trouble.

That's what makes the game- just because Garrett is a master thief doesn't make him some kind of uber badass combat guy.  The objective is to not get caught. 

I don't think the blackjack was lumped into the 'melee combat' comment. It's part of his stealth arsenal, an essential tool, I would assume that the melee comment was directed to those times when you felt the need to whip out your sword, the mission was pretty much over at that point.

Yeah, I shouldn't have quoted that part. 

I never had a problem using the blackjack myself.  Wasn't there some sort of visual indication (the blackjack would raise up or something) to indicate you were within melee range, or am I thinking of something different? 
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Giles Habibula
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« Reply #29 on: November 17, 2009, 05:13:46 PM »

Quote from: MonkeyFinger on November 17, 2009, 05:00:40 PM

I would assume that the melee comment was directed to those times when you felt the need to whip out your sword, the mission was pretty much over at that point.

Mostly true, but I've survived many a swordfight in those games. Difficult and hairy, certainly, but survivable in many cases - mostly just make sure you've already knocked out most of the other guards. Taking on two is maximum. More than that, and yeah, it's pretty much over unless you can hightail it to a place you can vault over and lose them.
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Razgon
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« Reply #30 on: November 17, 2009, 05:14:51 PM »

I just want thief redone with Assasins Creed engine....
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kronovan
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« Reply #31 on: November 17, 2009, 05:44:55 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 04:22:57 PM

I liked Splinter Cell much more, where you actually have a chance at killing a couple people if you get into trouble.

Doh...you're not supposed to kill them in 90% of the missions; at least not if you want to max your mission score. slywink If you mean you can knock-out a foe with a left-trigger knee to the body - yeah SC does have that over Thief. For me the difference between the 2 games makes sense - Garrett is a young apprentice (probably in his teens) while Sam Fisher is a seasoned and hardened veteran. I personally prefer the SC games over the Thief games, but I still play them like a stealthy Thief game.
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Daehawk
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« Reply #32 on: November 17, 2009, 09:10:08 PM »

Ha i kill everyone in the Thief games. Lots of bodies in dark corners on every map smile
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« Reply #33 on: November 17, 2009, 10:02:38 PM »

Jesus, guys, I KNOW how I'm SUPPOSED to play Thief. That's what I don't like. I don't want to be pigeonholed into constantly doing what the game wants me to do. I'd rather play a game that gave me options, like just about every RPG out there.
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« Reply #34 on: November 17, 2009, 10:17:43 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 10:02:38 PM

Jesus, guys, I KNOW how I'm SUPPOSED to play Thief. That's what I don't like. I don't want to be pigeonholed into constantly doing what the game wants me to do. I'd rather play a game that gave me options, like just about every RPG out there.

Thief's not a RPG.

Do you expect to be able to negotiate peace treaties in First Person Shooters?   icon_biggrin
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« Reply #35 on: November 17, 2009, 10:36:22 PM »

Quote from: warning on November 17, 2009, 10:17:43 PM

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 10:02:38 PM

Jesus, guys, I KNOW how I'm SUPPOSED to play Thief. That's what I don't like. I don't want to be pigeonholed into constantly doing what the game wants me to do. I'd rather play a game that gave me options, like just about every RPG out there.

Thief's not a RPG.

Do you expect to be able to negotiate peace treaties in First Person Shooters?   icon_biggrin

To be fair, Eidos shouldn't have used such a deceptive title to lure in unsuspecting consumers. 
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Razgon
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« Reply #36 on: November 17, 2009, 11:09:42 PM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 10:02:38 PM

Jesus, guys, I KNOW how I'm SUPPOSED to play Thief. That's what I don't like. I don't want to be pigeonholed into constantly doing what the game wants me to do. I'd rather play a game that gave me options, like just about every RPG out there.

like the responses above mine indicate, I think the game's not for you then. Its a first person sneaker or so it was marketed. If you dont like sneaking, you shouldnt play it I guess :-)
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cheeba
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« Reply #37 on: November 18, 2009, 03:15:13 AM »

You people make it hard to log in here sometimes.

Quote from: Razgon on November 17, 2009, 11:09:42 PM

like the responses above mine indicate, I think the game's not for you then.

Yeah I mighta said something like that in my first post slywink.

Quote from: cheeba on November 17, 2009, 11:31:03 AM

so yeah, not exactly a great game for me slywink.

Quote from: warning on November 17, 2009, 10:17:43 PM

Thief's not a RPG.

I didn't say it was.

Quote from: Kevin Grey on November 17, 2009, 10:36:22 PM

To be fair, Eidos shouldn't have used such a deceptive title to lure in unsuspecting consumers.  

 icon_rolleyes

How was I supposed to know I wouldn't like Thief 2 until I played it? I like sneaking in other games. I almost always play the rogue type character. I just didn't like Thief 2. The melee was clunky, as it is in all FPS. I didn't like the monotonous gameplay. As I already said, it just wasn't for me. Not everyone has to like everything you like. Variety is the spice of life and all.
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« Reply #38 on: November 18, 2009, 05:42:00 AM »

Quote from: cheeba on November 18, 2009, 03:15:13 AM

I just didn't like Thief 2. The melee was clunky, as it is in all FPS.

I'll grant you that point if you'll agree that the stealth sequences in Quake 2 were also very clunky.  Every time I'd try to sneak past an enemy they'd notice me and begin attacking.
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cheeba
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« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2009, 05:44:28 AM »

I never played Quake 2  eek.
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