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Author Topic: Ouch...Valve boss lets loose on PS3  (Read 3306 times)
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metallicorphan
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« on: October 11, 2007, 05:28:34 PM »

Gabe Newell..hates the PS3

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=173540

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Valve Software boss Gabe Newell has slagged off PS3 calling it "a waste of everybody's time" in a latest attack on the console.

"Investing in the Cell, investing in the SPE gives you no long-term benefits. There's nothing there that you're going to apply to anything else. You're not going to gain anything except a hatred of the architecture they've created", Newell told Edge magazine.

"I don't think they're going to make money off their box. I don't think it's a good solution."

It's not the first time Newell has slammed PS3. Earlier in the year he called it "a total disaster on so many levels... I think it's really clear that Sony lost track of what customers and what developers wanted".


"I'd say, even at this late date, they should just cancel it and do a do over", he said in January.

Despite his negative reactions to PS3, Newell says that he thinks PS3 owners who buy The Orange Box are going to be happy with their game experience and that EA - which is handling the PS3 version - will make it a good product.

"But I think it's harder to get it to the same standard as the 360 and PC versions", Newell said.

You can read Edge's full interview with Gabe Newell in its newly launched blog.

from a players point of view(as in MY point of view) these comments seem a bit over the top..definetly the 'do over' bit(even though he said that as far back as January when the console was only a few months old),sure i can see problems ....but from a developers point of view....maybe they really are having a harder time,a harder time than we players are aware off,some people say its the developers being lazy,but,should they(all developers) put more effort into the PS3 versions of their games?
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« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2007, 05:37:34 PM »

My thoughts (as if they really matter to Mr. Newell or anyone else in the "biz"):

1. Effort and attitude have a lot to do with the "problems" related to programming for the Cell. From what I have heard, the resources and information, from Sony, are available to developers, but many don't seem willing to want to work with them. Is that Sony's fault? I'm not so sure.

2. There is no question it is different architecture, and as such, there will be a learning curve. Does that mean it sucks? Does that mean they should call a "do over"? I don't think so. Maybe the developers are just a bit spoiled and complacent since the 360 is easy to program for, and since the PS3 is a bit challenging, they are naturally gonna squawk about it.

3. The comment about them "not making money" seems really out of place, and an excessively low blow, considering Microsoft's own issues with making money on consoles. Not sure what his point was there.

4. Total disaster? That is way over the top. Underachieving? Disappointing? Absolutely, but a total disaster? No, way too soon to say that.
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metallicorphan
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« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2007, 05:47:12 PM »

Quote from: jblank on October 11, 2007, 05:37:34 PM

2. There is no question it is different architecture, and as such, there will be a learning curve. Does that mean it sucks? Does that mean they should call a "do over"? I don't think so. Maybe the developers are just a bit spoiled and complacent since the 360 is easy to program for, and since the PS3 is a bit challenging, they are naturally gonna squawk about it.


i would of thought,if a company(and all companies).go through the said learning curve,then that would benefit for their future software releases,get to grips with it now,and next time will be easier,etc....the way some developers have gone on,it would seem they have to go through the learning curve everytime...although note: that i know NOTHING of developing video games
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« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2007, 05:47:35 PM »

It's not so much what Sony has done wrong from a technical perspective as it is what MS has done right.  Of course primarily PC developers are going to prefer the XBox architecture over the 360 one.  As Gabe said, it's easy and applicable to what they've already done.  If they learn a new technique in the course of programming, they can apply it to everything they do in the future for DirectX.  The PS3 is, for all intents and purposes, a specialized closed platform.  It is likely more powerful than the 360, and for a *console only* developer, the programming differences between the 360 and PS3 are negligible because they are basically new to both.

I don't think Newell is doing much more than pointing out the obvious here.

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« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2007, 05:49:05 PM »

I've certainly heard plenty of comments like this off the record from several developers.  They just find the whole thing a big pain in the ass to code for.  I agree though - newness is likely a large factor in that.
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« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2007, 06:17:22 PM »

No surprise- Newell has been very critical about consoles in general, especially the PS3.  I sense that they are only grudgingly putting Orange Box on 360 and PS3 due to financial pressures.  Even playing it on 360 (and technically it's a superb port) there is a feeling that they are marching to their own drummer with little things like the way the game doesn't look to the saved control preferences to decide if controls should default to inverted, they list the screen resolution and aspect ratio even though you can't change them ingame, etc.  Plus, Steam Community is obviously a direct shot at Xbox Live and they are bringing the achievements over to that as well. 
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« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2007, 06:26:52 PM »

My PS3 is used for watching movies, I haven't played a game on it for months.
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« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2007, 06:48:56 PM »

Here's the funny thing, these comments are like 4 months old, kind of weird that they've recently resurfaced on the intarwebs.
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« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2007, 07:48:44 PM »

Quote from: Tebunker on October 11, 2007, 06:48:56 PM

Here's the funny thing, these comments are like 4 months old, kind of weird that they've recently resurfaced on the intarwebs.

I remember reading this in a GI issue several months ago.  Was wondering why it's suddenly become newsworthy again.
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« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2007, 08:11:46 PM »

I think he just pointed out a crucial key to getting exclusives on both the Wii and the PS3. They both suck for ports, therefore they (in theory) might get more original exclusives? (maybe? hell if I know if that was intentional, it's seems like the type of bizarro thinking an exec would have)

From what I've seen games made specifically for either one of these consoles are done quite well, and I don't hear a lot of complaining about the difficulty of CREATING games for the PS3.

It's PORTING games that's a bitch. Just like it was with the PS2.

Now that the PS3 is out in the wild in pretty big numbers, I think we'll see developers starting on the PS3 and porting to the other platforms.

9 times out of 10 it's the weird exclusives like folklore that inerest me anyway. That coupled with people like Crytek saying they figured out some things they can only do on the PS3 makes me think there might be something to the Cell after all. Or maybe Sony paid them to say that. Hard to tell these days.

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« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2007, 08:56:49 PM »

Porting pretty much sucks regardless of platform.  The only ports that I'd imagine are easier are the 360 -> PC and vice versa.

gellar
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« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2007, 09:34:17 PM »

Quote from: Sparhawk on October 11, 2007, 06:26:52 PM

My PS3 is used for watching movies, I haven't played a game on it for months.

Ditto-except occasionally I play PS2 games, and Heavenly Sword.
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« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2007, 09:35:33 PM »

every thursday night has a PS3 hour...thats right,switching on to see what the store has to offer

heard this week its R and C demo
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« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2007, 10:27:13 PM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on October 11, 2007, 09:35:33 PM

every thursday night has a PS3 hour...thats right,switching on to see what the store has to offer

heard this week its R and C demo

Yeah it is for sure, and I will GLADLY turn on my PS3 for that-I gotta go check what time the demo comes up.
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« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2007, 10:38:23 PM »

I didn't bother reading what Gabe even said, he's been bagging on the PS3 since the beginning. All this trash talk, and they haven't even done a console-only game yet.
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« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2007, 11:11:25 PM »

Quote from: Ridah on October 11, 2007, 10:38:23 PM

I didn't bother reading what Gabe even said, he's been bagging on the PS3 since the beginning. All this trash talk, and they haven't even done a console-only game yet.

and it doesn't sound like they will anytime in the near future.
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« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2007, 01:01:18 AM »

Quote from: somoflange on October 11, 2007, 08:11:46 PM


Now that the PS3 is out in the wild in pretty big numbers, I think we'll see developers starting on the PS3 and porting to the other platforms.


I'm sorry, but what the hell are you talking about in the Bold? Have you even looked at the NPDs? Big numbers? Compared to what? At the same time in their lifespans the Gamecube outsold the PS3... Big numbers...Even with their "price drop" the PS3 barely moved up in sales.

Sorry, but I think you will continue to see the 360 as the lead High-def sku, the Wii is its own beast.

I like my PS3 and all, but like a lot of folks I really boot it up for the weekly demos, and to play some Warhawk now and then.
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« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2007, 03:58:12 AM »

Teb, have you looked at the NPD numbers?

5 million.  That's a lot of units, and pre-Halo 3 it was half the 360 for half the time on market.  No one, not even the big analysts expects Sony to have the same or higher numbers, but the system moving forward.  I really want to see what the 40gb $400 version does for sales.

Somoflange wasn't saying that all developers were going to go rushing to the PS3, but already there are developers and publishers taking notice of the PS3.  Not to mention there's a lot of first and second party titles coming on the PS3 in 2008.
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« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2007, 03:19:13 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on October 12, 2007, 03:58:12 AM

Teb, have you looked at the NPD numbers?

5 million.  That's a lot of units, and pre-Halo 3 it was half the 360 for half the time on market.  No one, not even the big analysts expects Sony to have the same or higher numbers, but the system moving forward.  I really want to see what the 40gb $400 version does for sales.

Somoflange wasn't saying that all developers were going to go rushing to the PS3, but already there are developers and publishers taking notice of the PS3.  Not to mention there's a lot of first and second party titles coming on the PS3 in 2008.

And the 360 was supply constrained for what, 6 months after launch? The PS3 never was (despite what their head idiot constantly said about poor sales).

And developers are definitely taking notice of the PS3 - they're running away from it. Capcom just announced recently that Monster Hunter 3 will be Wii exclusive. This is HUGE (in Japan), as the prequel on the PSP sold 500k copies in the first week.

The only publishers that are sticking with the PS3 fully at this point are the truly hardcore Sony devs - Squenix and Konami (with Final Fantasy and Metal Gear). Most other devs are splitting away from PS3 exclusives, and some are avoiding the console altogether (or doing really shoddy ports to it (see EA and this year's EA Sports lineup)).

As far as the $400 PS3 does for sales - it'll be a tossup. The idiotic parents will buy the console (and then their kids will be pissed it won't play PS2 games), while the hardcore gamers already own the thing (and their fully backwards compatible system). For the rest of the gaming population - it's still too expensive (and doesn't have any killer exclusives until 2008).
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« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2007, 08:25:15 PM »

Quote from: Destructor on October 12, 2007, 03:19:13 PM

As far as the $400 PS3 does for sales - it'll be a tossup. The idiotic parents will buy the console (and then their kids will be pissed it won't play PS2 games), while the hardcore gamers already own the thing (and their fully backwards compatible system). For the rest of the gaming population - it's still too expensive (and doesn't have any killer exclusives until 2008).

What's really going to happen is that the parents are going to purchase the system and then try to return it when they find out that it isn't backwards compatible saying that they got a defective model.
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« Reply #20 on: October 12, 2007, 08:31:59 PM »

Quote from: Graham on October 12, 2007, 08:25:15 PM

Quote from: Destructor on October 12, 2007, 03:19:13 PM

As far as the $400 PS3 does for sales - it'll be a tossup. The idiotic parents will buy the console (and then their kids will be pissed it won't play PS2 games), while the hardcore gamers already own the thing (and their fully backwards compatible system). For the rest of the gaming population - it's still too expensive (and doesn't have any killer exclusives until 2008).

What's really going to happen is that the parents are going to purchase the system and then try to return it when they find out that it isn't backwards compatible saying that they got a defective model.

You really think that's going to happen?  It didn't with the 360.

gellar
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« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2007, 08:51:33 PM »

Quote from: gellar on October 12, 2007, 08:31:59 PM

Quote from: Graham on October 12, 2007, 08:25:15 PM

Quote from: Destructor on October 12, 2007, 03:19:13 PM

As far as the $400 PS3 does for sales - it'll be a tossup. The idiotic parents will buy the console (and then their kids will be pissed it won't play PS2 games), while the hardcore gamers already own the thing (and their fully backwards compatible system). For the rest of the gaming population - it's still too expensive (and doesn't have any killer exclusives until 2008).

What's really going to happen is that the parents are going to purchase the system and then try to return it when they find out that it isn't backwards compatible saying that they got a defective model.

You really think that's going to happen?  It didn't with the 360.

gellar
Well, if a game is backwards compatible on the 360, then it will be backwards compatible with all 360s.  Sony has been touting that the PS3 has backwards compatibility with PS2 games for so long, parents who aren't paying attention are going to purchase the system expecting little Timmy to be able to play his old games on it.  There has been some press in gaming circles about the 40 GB PS3 not being backwards compatible, but those people who aren't paying attention are going to be expecting it to be BC because the other ones are BC.
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« Reply #22 on: October 12, 2007, 08:54:15 PM »

uh, how are these 'idiotic' and clueless parents going to know it was BC in the first place?

if that's your whole argument that they don't know anything to begin with
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« Reply #23 on: October 12, 2007, 09:12:19 PM »

Do I like my PS3?... Yes,
Do I love watching Blue Ray movies on my PS3?... Yes,
Do I play PS3 games... sometime
Do I love PS3 games?... I did like Resistance and Lair is ok...
Is there PS3 game that I am dying to play?... maybe MGS4..?

Do I think price of PS3 is too expansive?... Hell ya!
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« Reply #24 on: October 12, 2007, 09:14:53 PM »

Quote from: KePoW on October 12, 2007, 08:54:15 PM

uh, how are these 'idiotic' and clueless parents going to know it was BC in the first place?

if that's your whole argument that they don't know anything to begin with

Indeed.  Also MS promised BC a long time ago and never 100% delivered on it either, I bet no more than a handful (if that) 360s were returned for that reason.

Let's face it, BC just isn't as big a deal to most as it is to us.  It's a convenience, not a requirement.

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« Reply #25 on: October 13, 2007, 01:19:45 AM »

I know it has been said before.  But Microsoft never promised 100% compatibility.  Sony did. 

Personally I really don't give a shit about BC.  But the fact that Sony promised 100% BC all during the build-up for PS3 and now has released a model without it 10 months after launch tells me they don't know what the hell they are trying to do.

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« Reply #26 on: October 13, 2007, 01:23:32 AM »

cracks me up. the 360 people ignore they bought a game system with critical design flaw and all first gen 360 will have to be replaced at some point as they ALL will fail, plus you have a dead man walking high def platform HD.

Those in glass houses.

so yeah ps3 has problems, but so does the 360.  Both systems leave A LOT to be desired.
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« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2007, 01:34:19 AM »

Quote from: denoginizer on October 13, 2007, 01:19:45 AM

I know it has been said before.  But Microsoft never promised 100% compatibility.  Sony did. 
And whereas MS has continuously added to their BC list, Sony is stripping it out altogether.
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« Reply #28 on: October 13, 2007, 01:44:12 AM »

Quote from: denoginizer on October 13, 2007, 01:19:45 AM

I know it has been said before.  But Microsoft never promised 100% compatibility.  Sony did. 

Personally I really don't give a shit about BC.  But the fact that Sony promised 100% BC all during the build-up for PS3 and now has released a model without it 10 months after launch tells me they don't know what the hell they are trying to do.

Agreed.  I used to care about BC, but all it has allowed me to do is keep my PS2/PS1 games on a shelf (and never play them) while my old XBox games were boxed up and put in the garage.  I still don't play either of them much if at all.

Quote from: TC Weidner on October 13, 2007, 01:23:32 AM

cracks me up. the 360 people ignore they bought a game system with critical design flaw and all first gen 360 will have to be replaced at some point as they ALL will fail, plus you have a dead man walking high def platform HD.

Those in glass houses.

so yeah ps3 has problems, but so does the 360.  Both systems leave A LOT to be desired.

Also agreed... but both systems have far more good things about them than bad.  I'm glad to own both.

gellar
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« Reply #29 on: October 13, 2007, 03:25:38 AM »

For all the talk of BC, what happened when we all upgraded from the NES to the SuperNES. As I recall, 16-bit cartridge-based machine couldn't run 8-bit cartridges all that well. I'm a big fan of BC though in the current generation of optical media, but I guess all this means is sooner or later I'll own all my console games again but on PC.
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« Reply #30 on: October 13, 2007, 04:05:24 AM »

Quote from: denoginizer on October 13, 2007, 01:19:45 AM

Personally I really don't give a shit about BC.  But the fact that Sony promised 100% BC all during the build-up for PS3 and now has released a model without it 10 months after launch tells me they don't know what the hell they are trying to do.
This seems to be the bind Sony is in.  All the detractors screamed at Sony that they were going the wrong direction with expensive features that no one asked for.   Then they screamed that Sony didn't listen to the consumers and they were killing the platform.  Now Sony changes leadership and changes direction toward what the critics wanted (streamlined and cheaper), and the same people claim that Sony is flip flopping and rudderless (and probably hypocritical).

I'm sure people would love to hear Sony's mea culpa, but I don't expect that out of a large Japanese company.  At the risk of being culturally insensitive, it seems that those companies tend to change personnel and pretend they were going in the new direction all along.  Perhaps it saves face.  But as Negroponte points out, "Saving face, I fear, means having two of them."
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« Reply #31 on: October 13, 2007, 05:50:25 AM »

Compared to a US company that knowingly releases faulty hardware, keeps absolutely silent as it keeps producing said hardware?  The only thing MS has on them in this department is that MS is more experienced with this kind of public relations, aka they keep their mouth shuts, even when we want them to say something about the system's problems.

I'm willing to bet on MS's failure rate numbers being horrendous, but we don't see the gaming media crucify MS for this because their keep their mouth shut.  Meanwhile Sony gets lambasted by click-hungry news sites over any tiny little infraction.

Frankly, I'd rather see Sony react to market trends rather than staying on one set course and getting slaughtered.

And the fact is, they did give us 100% BC.  The problem?  No one bought the system because it cost too much.  People complained and complained and the BC didn't really help the sales.  So, now we get a system without BC, and then people raise a stink about that even though this 40gb model will likely be a lot less.

They had to cut out parts to get the price lower.  With the internal PS2 hardware costing them anywhere from $35-$55 dollars a unit, cutting that out makes good sense when you need to cut down on costs.
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« Reply #32 on: October 13, 2007, 02:15:57 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on October 13, 2007, 05:50:25 AM

I'm willing to bet on MS's failure rate numbers being horrendous, but we don't see the gaming media crucify MS for this because their keep their mouth shut.  Meanwhile Sony gets lambasted by click-hungry news sites over any tiny little infraction.

Or is it just that MS is fulfilling their obligation to the customer and fixing or replacing all the failed consoles?
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« Reply #33 on: October 13, 2007, 03:20:13 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on October 13, 2007, 05:50:25 AM

They had to cut out parts to get the price lower.  With the internal PS2 hardware costing them anywhere from $35-$55 dollars a unit, cutting that out makes good sense when you need to cut down on costs.

I thought somebody else worked out the price of the PS2 hardware in the PS3, and the price only came out to a couple of bucks.

That said - yes, I completely agree that what Microsoft did was wrong. Their early consoles have a 100% failure rate (you will get hit with it eventually - it's just a question of when), and to allow something like that in the industry is just unheard of. Microsoft will be feeling the hit of that with the general public for YEARS to come.
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« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2007, 03:35:18 PM »

Quote from: denoginizer on October 13, 2007, 01:19:45 AM

I know it has been said before.  But Microsoft never promised 100% compatibility.  Sony did. 

Personally I really don't give a shit about BC.  But the fact that Sony promised 100% BC all during the build-up for PS3 and now has released a model without it 10 months after launch tells me they don't know what the hell they are trying to do.



They know what there doing finally...at least more than in the past. They are on a mission to cut costs no matter what. To parrot another long time comment they made a giant blunder with the price of the machine and are paying for it now. They are now going to be dropping the price by a full 1/3 within a year of release. I guarantee that wasn't in their long term plans years ago when the PS3 was originally laid out. So they have to find anyway possible to cut costs now so BC gets the axe.
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Turtle
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« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2007, 07:31:24 PM »

Yeah, but you shouldn't have to be dealing with it, and with a failure rate that high there is no way MS didn't know about these problems ahead of time.  And, once again, they went ahead and released the elite model, which all it had was more glue, despite knowing that their systems were failing at an amazingly high rate.  MS isn't filling an obligation to the consumer, they're running damage control to try and stop the class action lawsuits before they happen.  Fulfilling the obligation to the consumer would have meant them delaying the launch by at least 6 months, which meant either releasing in the middle of 2006, or releasing alongside the PS3.  Or, they'd probably have to increase the price by a bit to pay for higher quality components.

Also, people even have problems with replacing their systems, especially with things like like accounts and the content of the hard drive.

Real analysts have priced the BC components around $35-$55.  That's due to the chips being kind of old, especially the old 32mb of rambus RAM, that stuff is really expensive since they have to buy it from Rambus, not manufacture it themselves.  It's also based on the 85nm die size, which means much lower yields.  Remember, that's basically a full PS2 inside the PS3, or in other words, if the parts were really just a few dollars, the PS2 would cost $50 or less at retail new.

I actually think Sony was really stupid for announcing BC has gone away completely.  They should have just said that they were working on a full software BC solution but that it would take time.  Then start those BC lists just like MS does and put a small team (probably hired right out of the PS2 emulation scene) on the task.
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Brendan
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« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2007, 07:37:17 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on October 13, 2007, 07:31:24 PM

Yeah, but you shouldn't have to be dealing with it, and with a failure rate that high there is no way MS didn't know about these problems ahead of time.  And, once again, they went ahead and released the elite model, which all it had was more glue, despite knowing that their systems were failing at an amazingly high rate. 

This is totally and completely false.  I've enjoyed your misdirection in this thread  ("Gabe Newell says the PS3's screwed?  Well, Microsoft hates everyone!"), but this is just too ridiculous to let stand.  If you seriously think that we'd ship product knowing that a billion dollar charge would be the outcome, you have no business sense whatsoever.  Yeah, we're going to intentionally piss off our customer base and lose the goodwill and momentum we'd generated to that point by shipping faulty product.  Genius!  That's how we'll win!
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mytocles
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« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2007, 08:12:50 PM »

Quote
That said - yes, I completely agree that what Microsoft did was wrong. Their early consoles have a 100% failure rate (you will get hit with it eventually - it's just a question of when), and to allow something like that in the industry is just unheard of. Microsoft will be feeling the hit of that with the general public for YEARS to come.

Destructor, is this really true (the 100% failure rate part)? I don't follow the stats on how many have failed, vs. how many are still going strong - though I'd have to be deaf and blind, both, to not know there have been many problems - I'm just curious if it is quite that bad. I have one launch 360 and one bought about 4 months later, and both are still going strong. Of my three friends who own them, they all have launch models and have had no problems either, btw.

I know I'd be unhappy if one of mine died, but I think I'd also consider that I've gotten my money's worth. As most of you know, lol, one of them ran almost 24/7 for a year and a half, just on one particular game. (Addicted? Me?) For $400, I really would feel I'd gotten my money's worth.

As for the PS3, I didn't get one for two reasons, and one was the price.  The reason the price was so important though, is because of the second reason: I have the three major systems, in some form or other, and yet I am almost always playing an XBox game, so the price combined with game preference is what kept me from shelling out the dough for the PS3.  That may change if I see more games I'd like, after the price drop - I still have a couple of PS2's so the BC doesn't affect me... but, for now, no deal.
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Mytocles (MY-toe-cleez)

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- I don't remember who said it, and probably neither do they...
jersoc
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« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2007, 08:16:38 PM »

Quote from: gellar on October 12, 2007, 08:31:59 PM

Quote from: Graham on October 12, 2007, 08:25:15 PM

Quote from: Destructor on October 12, 2007, 03:19:13 PM

As far as the $400 PS3 does for sales - it'll be a tossup. The idiotic parents will buy the console (and then their kids will be pissed it won't play PS2 games), while the hardcore gamers already own the thing (and their fully backwards compatible system). For the rest of the gaming population - it's still too expensive (and doesn't have any killer exclusives until 2008).

What's really going to happen is that the parents are going to purchase the system and then try to return it when they find out that it isn't backwards compatible saying that they got a defective model.

You really think that's going to happen?  It didn't with the 360.

gellar

Well, remember way back when MS announced that the BC was going to be software based and limited to some extent? Now, I seem to recall a little known company gave them shit for this. I believe it was...Oh yes it was SONY. Oh my the plot thickens. Not only did Sony give MS shit(how competitive of them, no?), but then they kept sayign that BC is a major thing for a new console. They kept hammering and hammering at this for months and months. Claiming they would beat MS because of this BC they got will work with ANYTHING.

Now, what do they do? They back out. See that's the problem with sony. They can't make up their fucking mind on what they want the ps3 to be and do. It's becoming frustrating as a consumer. Do I want a ps3? Sure, give me a solid price and solid games. Do I want a shitty ass budget ps3 for 400 bucks? Fuck no. My ps2 was a launch unit. It died within 8 months thanks to the DRE. You know what sony told me? Give us 100 bucks. You know what I told them? Fuck yourself. Now they come back and piss in our face with a crap ass version of a ps3 and expect us to buy it? Eat a bag of hell, sony.

So yes, it very well could happen.
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Lee
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« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2007, 11:26:02 PM »

Quote from: mytocles on October 13, 2007, 08:12:50 PM

Destructor, is this really true (the 100% failure rate part)? I don't follow the stats on how many have failed, vs. how many are still going strong - though I'd have to be deaf and blind, both, to not know there have been many problems - I'm just curious if it is quite that bad. I have one launch 360 and one bought about 4 months later, and both are still going strong. Of my three friends who own them, they all have launch models and have had no problems either, btw.
No one knows, MS won't release the numbers. I have a Dec 05 model and it still works fine, but I am not a hardcore gamer and rarely play anything for more than 2 hours.
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