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Author Topic: Xbox One Discussion  (Read 71811 times)
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Turtle
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« Reply #1440 on: June 24, 2013, 09:00:01 PM »

Let there be competition!
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« Reply #1441 on: June 24, 2013, 09:35:42 PM »

It does seem a bit off to hold up Minecraft as a selling point and then in the same breath turn your nose up at indie devs.

"No no no, I'm not prejudiced against indie developers! In fact, I have some very good friends who make me millions of dollars who are indie developers!"
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« Reply #1442 on: June 24, 2013, 09:56:41 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on June 24, 2013, 09:00:01 PM

Let there be competition!

cake too?
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« Reply #1443 on: June 24, 2013, 10:12:22 PM »

Respawn on the Cloud.
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« Reply #1444 on: June 24, 2013, 10:47:58 PM »

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

Ha ha. Lost. I see what you did.

Your argument lacks any real info, since, you know, there is none. You're comparing a digital-only distribution model where costs are drastically different on PC, where the digital market has matured and is competing with itself (Steam, GMG, Origin, MS Store, GOG, etc...). To not expect similar as time passes in the console world seems near-sighted.

You must be blinded by your snarkiness.  Here is what he said  "Looking at the current set up of PC, Xbox and PS its only the PC that has agressive pricing from the off, cheap deals on day one, massive reductions after a few months as well as weekly and daily sales across multiple retailers and etailers. A open platform with lots of choice." 
Seems pretty straight forward and he's right the PC platform has great sales from both retailers and etailers from a games launch until they practically give it away a year later.  Pc games have been like that even before digital distribution took off.  Now not to the extend of some of these digital sales but I have been hunting and succeeding at finding great deals on PC games for the past 15+ years.  Expecting for console games to suddenly be discounted like PC games because of digital distribution is not a guarantee when their entire history of pricing says otherwise.  He's not being near-sighted at all, I would say the exact opposite and there are years of "info" to back up his thinking.


Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

It's been covered above - deals aren't where Steam started - but it's sure given them a leg up since, and it's plainly obvious. Since:
Correct but not sure anyone said different?

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

A) PSN offers free games
No they don't, unless you mean DC universe and games of that ilk?  PSN + cost money

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

B) MS is competing with Sony
Got that right

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

C) both may end up competing with Ouya / Steam Box

They would be stupid not to add value in terms of sales and deals (which they do now for their gold members and have been doing so for at least all of 2013).

They would be (those gold member {and PS+}discounts for the most part suck compared to used pricing of the same games and are pretty limited, though i have dipped my toes in once or twice)

Reemul made some really good points, it's a shame you didn't bother to read them.  Hopefully the above spells it out a little more clearly. 
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« Reply #1445 on: June 24, 2013, 10:52:34 PM »

I have a perhaps newbie-type question, but here goes anyway.

I've always played my X360 on a 24-inch monitor a couple of feet from my nose at 1080p, which I have liked. I might end up with the Xbone being hooked up to a somewhat further away 26-inch TV limited to 720p. How much am I going to notice/hate it?
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« Reply #1446 on: June 24, 2013, 11:05:16 PM »

Quote from: jztemple2 on June 24, 2013, 10:52:34 PM

I have a perhaps newbie-type question, but here goes anyway.

I've always played my X360 on a 24-inch monitor a couple of feet from my nose at 1080p, which I have liked. I might end up with the Xbone being hooked up to a somewhat further away 26-inch TV limited to 720p. How much am I going to notice/hate it?

With that size TV it probably won't be too noticeable of a difference.
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« Reply #1447 on: June 24, 2013, 11:09:58 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on June 24, 2013, 10:12:22 PM


About what I figured.  Nothing revolutionary, just inexpensive (relatively) dedicated servers and the ability to pass the blame to MSFT when shit goes down on launch day.  I mean it's better than having to do it yourself, but this is hardly revolutionary stuff.
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« Reply #1448 on: June 24, 2013, 11:23:29 PM »

Quote from: jztemple2 on June 24, 2013, 10:52:34 PM

I have a perhaps newbie-type question, but here goes anyway.

I've always played my X360 on a 24-inch monitor a couple of feet from my nose at 1080p, which I have liked. I might end up with the Xbone being hooked up to a somewhat further away 26-inch TV limited to 720p. How much am I going to notice/hate it?

You're gonna have to buy a 60" tv.
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« Reply #1449 on: June 25, 2013, 12:15:00 AM »

Quote from: forgeforsaken on June 24, 2013, 11:05:16 PM

Quote from: jztemple2 on June 24, 2013, 10:52:34 PM

I have a perhaps newbie-type question, but here goes anyway.

I've always played my X360 on a 24-inch monitor a couple of feet from my nose at 1080p, which I have liked. I might end up with the Xbone being hooked up to a somewhat further away 26-inch TV limited to 720p. How much am I going to notice/hate it?

With that size TV it probably won't be too noticeable of a difference.


It might at the distance he is sitting.  Why not use the XBONE on the 1080p screen?  The 360 does not render at the higher resolution but the new systems will.  Or go with Wonderpug and get a bigger screen smile
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« Reply #1450 on: June 25, 2013, 12:41:05 AM »

Quote from: morlac on June 25, 2013, 12:15:00 AM

Quote from: forgeforsaken on June 24, 2013, 11:05:16 PM

Quote from: jztemple2 on June 24, 2013, 10:52:34 PM

I have a perhaps newbie-type question, but here goes anyway.

I've always played my X360 on a 24-inch monitor a couple of feet from my nose at 1080p, which I have liked. I might end up with the Xbone being hooked up to a somewhat further away 26-inch TV limited to 720p. How much am I going to notice/hate it?

With that size TV it probably won't be too noticeable of a difference.


It might at the distance he is sitting.  Why not use the XBONE on the 1080p screen?  The 360 does not render at the higher resolution but the new systems will.  Or go with Wonderpug and get a bigger screen smile

I'm trying to avoid buying any new hardware, save the new console. My monitor doesn't have speakers, but I've kludged a pair of external speakers using an old adapter to convert a mini-stereo plug to component jacks, and from there hooked up my launch X360 with it's component output plugs to monitor and speakers.

My TV has HDMI and built-in speakers. Also I can sit farther away from it so I would be able to use the included Xbone connect with it (I don't have Kinect with the 360).

My other option would be a way to adapt the HDMI output from the Xbone to drive the external speakers and the monitor. The monitor supports HDMI and a host of other inputs, but as I said no speakers, and I haven't been able to locate the appropriate Gatesway speaker bar for it. Additionally I'd have to give up using the Kinect, but I really have no interest in Kinect anyway.
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« Reply #1451 on: June 25, 2013, 12:55:30 AM »

Hmm.  I would buy a $300 new tv and hold of on the new console purchase but that is just me.  My nephew has a 360 and plays it on a analog TV because he cant stop buying new $60 games long enough to buy a real tv smile

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889262117

37" 1080p Visio shipped from newegg for $270(reufrbished).
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« Reply #1452 on: June 25, 2013, 01:11:28 AM »

You'll need a bigger monitor so you can see the mirrors in Forza  ninja
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« Reply #1453 on: June 25, 2013, 04:27:06 AM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on June 24, 2013, 08:51:13 PM

Anyway,there is a new rumour in town peeeooooww(that was meant to be the sound of a gun going off in the Wild West,didn't really work did it? icon_confused)
yeah..so,...and that rumour is that Microsoft may change their mind about self publishing

Keep in mind that the original source of that rumor (NeoGAF) also says that this will be a combined Windows 8 and Xbox One initiative that only lets developers create "apps" for them. In practical terms, this means Xbox One indie games won't have access to anywhere near the normal capabilities of the system.
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« Reply #1454 on: June 25, 2013, 05:06:45 AM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on June 24, 2013, 08:51:13 PM

last week you may of heard Phil Fish of Polytron announcing that Fez 2 will NOT appear on Xbox One due to Microsoft's stance on self publishing,Fish said:
Quote
"Whether or not I would develop for it comes down to how the platform holder treats me. With Microsoft they've made it painfully clear they don't want my ilk on their platform,"

nice and to the point


Anyway,there is a new rumour in town peeeooooww(that was meant to be the sound of a gun going off in the Wild West,didn't really work did it? icon_confused)
yeah..so,...and that rumour is that Microsoft may change their mind about self publishing
360a.org

Quote
Microsoft may be preparing for another turn-around, this time in regards to self-publishing.

When the Xbox One was announced, Microsoft said that it would not allow developers to publish their own games on the console, a move which disappointed many independent studios. As a result, the developers of exciting titles like DayZ and Fez II responded by saying they would not bring their games to Xbox One.

However, if the latest rumours are to be believed, that may be about to change.

This Wednesday, Microsoft will be holding its Build Conference in San Francisco. It’s an annual shindig aimed at software developers working with the company’s tech. And it’s here that some are speculating a second change of policy in as many weeks may take place.

Internet sleuth Superannuation tweeted last night, “Some people seem to think Microsoft will announce some self-publishing/indie Xbox One stuff this week at their Build Developer Conference.”

Meanwhile, on the same subject, Markus “Notch” Persson tweeted “I know something about this, but I’m not allowed to say. frown“ The tweet has since been deleted.


Adding a little weight to this speculation is the fact that when invitations were sent out pre-E3 2013, gaming press were assured the event was PC and mobile only. However, now the event has expanded to encompass the Xbox platforms.

It’s worth re-stating that this is currently all speculation. Indeed, if it wasn’t for Notch’s deleted tweet and Microsoft’s recent dramatic turnaround regarding DRM on Xbox One, we wouldn’t have given it much weight.

Fingers crossed. A larger selection of games for Xbox One is always good news.


so,If true,just 'lower the Price' and get rid of that 'need to be connected Kinect'..and we'll have the console of our dreams The Weghted Companion Cube will never threaten to stab you.

that was all that's left,right?...right?

Hmm that pre-order differential must not be evening up as quickly as they like! Perhaps the next change we'll see is the name changed to "PS4" smile
MS has gone from innovators to "just do whatever Sony is doing!"
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« Reply #1455 on: June 25, 2013, 05:19:52 AM »

Quote
MS has gone from innovators to "just do whatever Sony is doing!"

and here I thought most people were complaining that MS should be doing stuff like Sony is icon_lol
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« Reply #1456 on: June 25, 2013, 05:52:31 AM »

What MS was doing wasn't innovation either, it was just following what the PC was doing. slywink

To be honest, good on them if they allow self publishing. But to be frank, they wouldn't have changed the antiquated system they had on the 360 if it hadn't been for Sony's competition.

If this helps make it a better place for small devs, which I will soon be one, that's cool.
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« Reply #1457 on: June 25, 2013, 07:19:08 AM »

Quote from: Turtle on June 25, 2013, 05:52:31 AM

What MS was doing wasn't innovation either, it was just following what the PC was doing. slywink

To be honest, good on them if they allow self publishing. But to be frank, they wouldn't have changed the antiquated system they had on the 360 if it hadn't been for Sony's competition.

If this helps make it a better place for small devs, which I will soon be one, that's cool.
I meant way back in the day with xbla and all of the other cool stuff the 360 introduced.
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« Reply #1458 on: June 25, 2013, 07:20:53 AM »

Quote from: Canuck on June 25, 2013, 05:06:45 AM


so,If true,just 'lower the Price' and get rid of that 'need to be connected Kinect'..and we'll have the console of our dreams The Weghted Companion Cube will never threaten to stab you.

that was all that's left,right?...right?

Hmm that pre-order differential must not be evening up as quickly as they like! Perhaps the next change we'll see is the name changed to "PS4" smile
MS has gone from innovators to "just do whatever Sony is doing!"
[/quote]

Oh yeah the name as well,forgot about that  Tongue
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« Reply #1459 on: June 25, 2013, 07:33:49 AM »

Quote from: morlac on June 24, 2013, 10:47:58 PM

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

Ha ha. Lost. I see what you did.

Your argument lacks any real info, since, you know, there is none. You're comparing a digital-only distribution model where costs are drastically different on PC, where the digital market has matured and is competing with itself (Steam, GMG, Origin, MS Store, GOG, etc...). To not expect similar as time passes in the console world seems near-sighted.

You must be blinded by your snarkiness.  Here is what he said  "Looking at the current set up of PC, Xbox and PS its only the PC that has agressive pricing from the off, cheap deals on day one, massive reductions after a few months as well as weekly and daily sales across multiple retailers and etailers. A open platform with lots of choice."  
Seems pretty straight forward and he's right the PC platform has great sales from both retailers and etailers from a games launch until they practically give it away a year later.  Pc games have been like that even before digital distribution took off.  Now not to the extend of some of these digital sales but I have been hunting and succeeding at finding great deals on PC games for the past 15+ years.  Expecting for console games to suddenly be discounted like PC games because of digital distribution is not a guarantee when their entire history of pricing says otherwise.  He's not being near-sighted at all, I would say the exact opposite and there are years of "info" to back up his thinking.


Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

It's been covered above - deals aren't where Steam started - but it's sure given them a leg up since, and it's plainly obvious. Since:
Correct but not sure anyone said different?

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

A) PSN offers free games
No they don't, unless you mean DC universe and games of that ilk?  PSN + cost money

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

B) MS is competing with Sony
Got that right

Quote from: Purge on June 24, 2013, 01:31:25 PM

C) both may end up competing with Ouya / Steam Box

They would be stupid not to add value in terms of sales and deals (which they do now for their gold members and have been doing so for at least all of 2013).

They would be (those gold member {and PS+}discounts for the most part suck compared to used pricing of the same games and are pretty limited, though i have dipped my toes in once or twice)

Reemul made some really good points, it's a shame you didn't bother to read them.  Hopefully the above spells it out a little more clearly.  

Thanks for that. I am not trying to annoy / wind up / piss off anybody, i am as much a gamer as anyone, i have owned pretty much every console since my zx81 and love gaming and like i mentioned own a wii u, 360 and ps3 along with a gaming pc.

I will have no issue if future gaming on consoles goes down the PC steam route as long as the pricing and everything else is similar to it. I personally dont think it will happen. Its more like the EU wil get to grip with digital resales in law and we will end up with a different market place.

The thing with saying i am short sighted is i am living in the now not the next year and that is more relevant now especially based on buying in to a new system that you could invest in for the next 5 years +. Its no good saying i hope this happens or that changes, you need to go on what you know now as well as what has happened previously. Guessing the future is too hit and miss for me

« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 07:39:42 AM by Reemul » Logged

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« Reply #1460 on: June 25, 2013, 07:51:25 AM »

About the market place comparison. The fact they are not like for like is not relevant as they are all i have to shop in. Its not like there are other choices for me or you or anyone else at present.

And the way MS were going they would have been even less choice at the start, not necessarily a good thing.

Small steps is what is needed at present, but maybe the fact these consoles may be around for 7 years makes small steps a harder choice whereas on PC its simpler as they are upgradeable.

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« Reply #1461 on: June 25, 2013, 09:34:22 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on June 23, 2013, 09:28:23 PM

if it doesn't come with the system I'll just use the Kinect until someone comes out with decent 5.1 or 7.1 headphones.

well, I'll indeed be using the Kinect until someone comes out with decent 5.1 or 7.1 headphones.

Quote
Xbox One does not include a pack-in headset accessory. Each Xbox One includes the new Kinect sensor, with a highly sensitive multi-array microphones designed to enable voice inputs and chat as a system-level capability, both in-game and with Skype and other experiences. For gamers who prefer a headset, we have a variety of offerings that you can find on the Xbox Wire.

[edit] oops, link: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/06/microsoft-reveals-xbox-one-headsets-arent-included-with-base-system/
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 09:39:50 PM by CeeKay » Logged

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« Reply #1462 on: June 25, 2013, 11:32:36 PM »

I was about to type up a post about how even in a best-case scenario Kinect can't match the experience you get with a headset, but then I realized what the real question is.  Will the Kinect voice chat transmitting default to on, or default to off?  Listening to the dregs of the Xbox Live userbase is bad enough when they have to put on their headset first to talk; imagine if you just by default could hear everything anyone in any game match said out loud.   icon_eek
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« Reply #1463 on: June 25, 2013, 11:42:14 PM »

Yeah this is such a comically bad decision.  It's like the designers don't even go on XBL.

So without mandatory headsets, the following will assuredly happen:
1)  Not only do I get to hear the inanities of the XBL user base, but I also get AMPLIFIED BACKGROUND NOISE to boot.  Music, people arguing, kids crying, conversations in living rooms about what's for dinner or when they're going to do their homework... lovely.  This is bad enough today with boom mics, I imagine it being much worse without them.  Now there's a possibility the Kinect microphone has a ridiculous amount of noise isolation, which would be the only saving grace.
2)  Regardless of #1 above, by default my ability to hear my party or game chat would be SHARED THROUGHOUT MY LIVING SPACE.  Super.  So my dog can look confused at all the random voices and my girlfriend can hear the embarrassing banalities of game chat.  Even if I'm playing with people I like, I don't want anyone to hear that.  And god forbid you have a small child... good luck curtailing their vocabulary.
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« Reply #1464 on: June 26, 2013, 12:17:11 AM »

Microsoft knows full well most of their core market will go out and buy the $20-$30 headset.
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« Reply #1465 on: June 26, 2013, 12:24:21 AM »

Whaaaaa? That's just as bad as the PS3's decision, and then the decision to use crappy bluetooth headsets that pickup all the game audio as well as voice.

Physically close placed mics will always beat ones mounted far away, no matter how much sound processing you do. Even the PS4's crappy earbud with inline mic will work better.
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« Reply #1466 on: June 26, 2013, 04:46:15 AM »

I'm not sure you're aware of this, but the xb1 has a setup function that all users go through with initial power on. You can disable Kinect functions on the 360 now,  and per their privacy page they also mention you can do similar things with the xb1.

As for sounds from other consoles coming through, lets hope they got noise cancelling right - maybe the dedicated Kinect core will help with audio isolation.

I still don't want to listen to the inside of a frat-house - and I generally play sans headset (or voice) unless its to the detriment of the team (or I'm playing with people I know).

I can see "Dark day for Dark Master" references coming up already. slywink

Sent from my Nokia 920
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« Reply #1467 on: June 26, 2013, 09:20:15 AM »


gellar:                                Guys, I need some back up on this...
Random Xbox guy's mom:    Jonny, have you finished your homework yet?
Random Xbox guy:              Mom, don't bug me, I'm busy!
Random Xbox guy's Mom:    If you don't stop playing this minute I'm going to give you a spanking!
Random Xbox guy:              Mom, you're embarrassing me in front of all the COD guys!
Someone's cat:                  MEEEEEEAAOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWW!
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« Reply #1468 on: June 26, 2013, 11:20:21 AM »

hey, nothing like the sound of a loud fart to break the tension biggrin
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« Reply #1469 on: June 27, 2013, 07:15:04 AM »

This could be good(I have X11s)

(note the tweet says 'wired')
CVG

Quote
According to a tweet posted via the Xbox Support account, Microsoft is working on adapter to make Xbox 360 headsets compatible with the upcoming Xbox One.

When asked if existing Xbox 360 headsets will work with the Xbox One on Twitter, the Xbox Support account replied that Microsoft are working on an adapter.

Quote
Craig Fellows @craigfellows
@XboxSupport Will current headsets such as X11 and Astro A40 work properly on the new consoles? Haven't seen info on pad connectivity.
 

Xbox Support (1-5)        ✔ @XboxSupport
@craigfellows We are working to develop an adapter for current wired headsets to connect. More details as we approach launch. ^PS
5:28 PM - 26 Jun 2013

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« Reply #1470 on: June 27, 2013, 03:49:15 PM »

According to Eurogamer, MS is no longer charging fees for follow up updates to both XBLA and full release titles.

It's not clear if this will continue to Xbone, but it's still pretty exciting and seems to indicate that MS is trying to extend a helping hand to the smaller game companies.
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« Reply #1471 on: June 27, 2013, 03:57:56 PM »

Quote from: Bullwinkle on June 27, 2013, 03:49:15 PM

According to Eurogamer, MS is no longer charging fees for follow up updates to both XBLA and full release titles.

It's not clear if this will continue to Xbone, but it's still pretty exciting and seems to indicate that MS is trying to extend a helping hand to the smaller game companies.


double edged sword isn't it?,sure its great for the companies,but i hope this doesn't mean we'll get more buggy messes on release with the  attitude "we'll patch it later"

Still hoping for MS to do away with the Publishing rule for the Indies
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« Reply #1472 on: June 27, 2013, 04:33:20 PM »

update on the EG article
Quote
Update: Fez developer Phil Fish is looking into whether Microsoft's new policy is retroactive, so he can finally patch Fez for free. Previously, it would have cost the indie developer "tens of thousands of dollars."

"I will get in touch with them and see if their new policy is retro-active," Fish tweeted.

"But honestly, I feel it's kind of a long shot. Something tells me it won't be," he added.

Fish also noted that "You have no idea how much trouble I got into for talking about this. And you never will. So I'm pretty glad there's a happy ending here."

He then continued to rail against Microsoft for not promoting the game or even getting its digital box art ready in time for release.
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« Reply #1473 on: June 27, 2013, 04:54:10 PM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on June 27, 2013, 03:57:56 PM

Quote from: Bullwinkle on June 27, 2013, 03:49:15 PM

According to Eurogamer, MS is no longer charging fees for follow up updates to both XBLA and full release titles.

It's not clear if this will continue to Xbone, but it's still pretty exciting and seems to indicate that MS is trying to extend a helping hand to the smaller game companies.


double edged sword isn't it?,sure its great for the companies,but i hope this doesn't mean we'll get more buggy messes on release with the  attitude "we'll patch it later"

Still hoping for MS to do away with the Publishing rule for the Indies

Well, they've got exceptions in place so the policy doesn't get abused.

I think it'll mean we'll see patches sooner, so we get rid of the "hold off until we see if something else needs to be patched" attitude.
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« Reply #1474 on: June 27, 2013, 05:49:43 PM »

From recent debacles with patches that spend weeks in Microsoft QA only to quickly show major bug failures anyway (hello State of Decay, or the aforementioned Fez), I'm not sure that their patch verification process has been working all that well as it was anyway.

As far as worrying about more buggy releases, I would ask how bad has it been on Steam in the last several years?  I can't remember the last time I personally had a problem with that.  In the rare cases when there is a bad patch or release, the developer can immediately release a followup fix as soon as they have it, sometimes even the same day as something broken instead of waiting weeks for a platform holder to do bad QA on the patch.
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« Reply #1475 on: June 27, 2013, 07:24:31 PM »

Quote from: Bullwinkle on June 27, 2013, 03:49:15 PM

According to Eurogamer, MS is no longer charging fees for follow up updates to both XBLA and full release titles.

It's not clear if this will continue to Xbone, but it's still pretty exciting and seems to indicate that MS is trying to extend a helping hand to the smaller game companies.

let's see how long it lasts.
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« Reply #1476 on: June 27, 2013, 07:25:22 PM »

Quote from: EngineNo9 on June 27, 2013, 05:49:43 PM

From recent debacles with patches that spend weeks in Microsoft QA only to quickly show major bug failures anyway (hello State of Decay, or the aforementioned Fez), I'm not sure that their patch verification process has been working all that well as it was anyway.

there is that, but you also have to wonder how some of those bugs made it through the developers QA process.
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« Reply #1477 on: June 27, 2013, 07:51:13 PM »

unsurprisingly Unity is coming to the XB1.
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« Reply #1478 on: June 27, 2013, 09:02:45 PM »

Is this the rumored indie initiative Microsoft was supposed to reveal this week? If so, it's incredibly weak. Everyone expected Unity to work for Xbox One, so the only news here is that it'll support the fancier parts of the system, and that you can sell your soul to Microsoft (ie. have them publish your game, making it exclusive to the Xbox ecosystem and giving away some of your most important copyrights) to get the Unity tools for free.

I'm sure the indie developer community passed out from ecstasy once they learned of this.
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« Reply #1479 on: June 27, 2013, 10:53:44 PM »

Did anything come of the rumor that MS was going to drop the restrictive publisher requirements?
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