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Author Topic: Xbox One Discussion  (Read 71535 times)
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Purge
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« Reply #1360 on: June 20, 2013, 06:17:48 AM »

Quote from: Destructor on June 19, 2013, 11:47:41 PM

Family Sharing could NEVER have worked as described.

"Yes, you can take this one game you bought and allow up to TEN OTHERS play it when you're not."

The smart publishers would be all, "This is worse than Blockbuster. No way I'm allowing this." Either that or 'a multiplayer component' would be in every single game made period in an attempt to keep people playing instead of Family Sharing.

If you had ten games in your library, then your ten family members, on different consoles, could play those ten games simultaneously.

Not 10 people playing the SAME GAME. It's a library ... you know, check out, check in?

As for cloud computing being axed, I think you may have missed a key part of Don's message:

Quote
An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games

Any game requiring cloud computing will be an "online game" - eg: Forza 5 will require an internet connection. How much of one, who knows  but if they continue with Drivatars, it certainly will be. Nowhere does it say they're scrapping online games or their server farms.

They've added:
a) offline mode (after single internet "registration-like-step" at initial startup)
b) disc-based licenses in addition to their "downloadable" version. (basically, what we have today except the download titles are generally older - new games will still be available through digital distribution according to that email)


They've removed:
a) streaming disk-purchased games from the cloud
b) the ability to subsidize developers on re-sold games (which may or may not have helped keep servers up and prices down)
c) family sharing of disk-purchased games via cloud
d) disk-free operation of disk-purchased games.
e) region locking <-- not sure if this is related to console, or content specific locks.
f) install-only media - games can be run off the disk (if I read that correctly)

I suppose they may still salvage some of their plans with the downloadable versions of disk install titles. As some people have mentioned that the DRM may not be dead (merely delayed) I'd put forth they'd introduce it with some compelling title that people will buy regardless (Halo, for instance).

To the rest of the comments here, clearly there is some investment in the product, or you wouldn't be discussing it. We'll see who wants to join the XBL One Live Gamertag thread come launch. slywink
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« Reply #1361 on: June 20, 2013, 06:22:41 AM »

Quote from: CeeKay on June 19, 2013, 11:22:28 PM

I am happy they listened to customers and will reward them with my money!
But you were rewarding them already when they were assholes. So just what lesson are you teaching them exactly? smile
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« Reply #1362 on: June 20, 2013, 06:25:10 AM »

Dammit, Tilt stole my zinger.
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« Reply #1363 on: June 20, 2013, 06:51:29 AM »

Quote from: Purge on June 20, 2013, 06:17:48 AM

[To the rest of the comments here, clearly there is some investment in the product, or you wouldn't be discussing it. We'll see who wants to join the XBL One Live Gamertag thread come launch. slywink

That is a strange thing to say - of course there is interest/Investment in the product - No one has denied it. We just said the Xbox One was the lesser of the two consoles, and the more restrictive one. Now that they've removed those restrictions, its getting more people interested, which of course is what Microsoft wants with this. All that remains now to be seen, is if they will renege on their decision say, a year after launch and re-implement the restrictions. To reverse a strategy as big as this one, has not only cost heads, but also direction and momentum, which is why I think they will be tempted to reinstate those restrictions down the road.
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« Reply #1364 on: June 20, 2013, 07:00:59 AM »

Let's be realistic here. Both Sony and Microsoft will release a version of their respective consoles without a disc drive halfway through this coming generation. Microsoft was trying to lay the groundwork too early, and is now having to clean up after itself. This generation will become the true transition into pure digital distribution. This isn't a conspiracy, it's the way the market is moving.
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« Reply #1365 on: June 20, 2013, 07:21:52 AM »

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 06:22:41 AM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 19, 2013, 11:22:28 PM

I am happy they listened to customers and will reward them with my money!
But you were rewarding them already when they were assholes. So just what lesson are you teaching them exactly? smile

that I like naughty people.
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« Reply #1366 on: June 20, 2013, 10:42:14 AM »

Quote from: PR_GMR on June 20, 2013, 05:26:45 AM

I was glad to read that announcement from Microsoft today. They have had sense knocked into them. The Xbox One now has a fighting chance. I'm still leaning heavily towards a PS4 as my next console.. but this now makes Xbox One a possible option in the future.

That seems to be the attitude that most people are having now with the Xbox One....which is an improvement from what Microsoft was seeing with it. Of course, going from..."I'm never ever getting that POS!" to "Thanks, but no thanks.....you are still $100 more expensive and less powerful than the PS4" isn't exactly great....I'm sure MS will take it at this point! smile

I've gone from "No way in Hell am I getting that thing" to "I'll pick one up at some point in 2014, provided they don't screw something else up."  icon_biggrin

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« Reply #1367 on: June 20, 2013, 11:23:40 AM »

Analysts are saying basically the same thing, all due to the price. It makes no sense to price the console for $100 more than a more powerful console. I still think that they NEED to make a version without the Kinect and price it at $399 or lower.

 http://www.edge-online.com/news/ps4-vs-xbox-one-sony-retains-upper-hand-after-microsoft-drm-u-turn-say-analysts/

Quote
PS4’s lower price will give it the upper hand against Xbox One despite Microsoft’s decision to backtrack on its DRM policies last night, analysts have told us.

Senior research analyst at Ascendiant Capital Markets Edward Woo expects Xbox One and PS4 to each sell two million units in 2013, with PS4 pulling ahead of its rival significantly next year. Woo had forecast unit sales of 10 million for the Sony console in 2014, and five million for Xbox One. He told us this morning that his forecasts haven’t changed, despite Microsoft’s U turn on Xbox One DRM.
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« Reply #1368 on: June 20, 2013, 11:59:47 AM »

My internet goes down for 24 hrs,and all i could think off is this time next year if it happened i would have to play on my PS4 rather than XB1

I am not going to thank Microsoft for this,my thanks goes to SONY Tongue
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« Reply #1369 on: June 20, 2013, 01:06:43 PM »

There is no way they will release a version of the Xbone without Kinect.  Apart from the tech not being up to snuff, that was the biggest hurdle with the Kinect to begin with.  No one did anything with it because not everyone had it and it would limit sales of your game.  If it is standard on every console, it is freely available for everyone to implement (of course they still have to make it catch on - there's a lot of negativity due to the crappy first version).

Kinect is a key ingredient in MS's vision for the future of our living room(/home?).  It's going to be working its way into our laptops and tablets (maybe phones down the road).  They're not going to back off of it.  And making it an option kills it for this gen.

A price drop is possible, but it entirely depends on how much of a loss it would be and whether they can stand it (MS does have a little bit of money).  To take over your house, it may be worth it.
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« Reply #1370 on: June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM »

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?
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« Reply #1371 on: June 20, 2013, 01:18:45 PM »

I'm definitely going with PS4 first, but I'll now most likely get an XBox One sometime further down the road.  Before it was a non-starter due to the online requirements and because I like being able to buy used games from time to time.

My biggest issue is what to do with the previous iteration of both consoles though.   icon_confused

Sell them?  Give them away?  Use them as planters?
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« Reply #1372 on: June 20, 2013, 01:38:37 PM »

Quote from: hepcat on June 20, 2013, 01:18:45 PM


My biggest issue is what to do with the previous iteration of both consoles though.   icon_confused

Sell them?  Give them away?  Use them as planters?

I still have my PS2 and first gen Xbox collecting dust in my mom's basement.  I guess the 360 will join them since I don't have the space in my apartment
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« Reply #1373 on: June 20, 2013, 02:28:31 PM »

I would have no problem dumping my 360 if I upgrade to the Xbox one, except for my rock band library. Not being able to import that over to the next console is going to suck.
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« Reply #1374 on: June 20, 2013, 03:53:23 PM »

So, if this is real, the family share was not anywhere near as good as people thought it would be:

http://pastebin.com/TE1MWES2

Quote
When your family member accesses any of your games, they're placed into a special demo mode. This demo mode in most cases would be the full game with a 15-45 minute timer and in some cases an hour.  This allowed the person to play the game, get familiar with it then make a purchase if they wanted to.  When the time limit was up they would automatically be prompted to the Marketplace so that they may order it if liked the game.
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« Reply #1375 on: June 20, 2013, 05:28:19 PM »

Quote from: Teggy on June 20, 2013, 03:53:23 PM

So, if this is real, the family share was not anywhere near as good as people thought it would be:

http://pastebin.com/TE1MWES2

Quote
When your family member accesses any of your games, they're placed into a special demo mode. This demo mode in most cases would be the full game with a 15-45 minute timer and in some cases an hour.  This allowed the person to play the game, get familiar with it then make a purchase if they wanted to.  When the time limit was up they would automatically be prompted to the Marketplace so that they may order it if liked the game.

I've read the entire post/blog and maybe because I'm a cynic at heart I have a hard time believing it's a MS Employee.   Nonetheless, the post does have it's merits as MS failed miserably in explaining their vision for the XB1
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« Reply #1376 on: June 20, 2013, 05:35:45 PM »

Quote from: Teggy on June 20, 2013, 03:53:23 PM

So, if this is real, the family share was not anywhere near as good as people thought it would be:

http://pastebin.com/TE1MWES2

Quote
When your family member accesses any of your games, they're placed into a special demo mode. This demo mode in most cases would be the full game with a 15-45 minute timer and in some cases an hour.  This allowed the person to play the game, get familiar with it then make a purchase if they wanted to.  When the time limit was up they would automatically be prompted to the Marketplace so that they may order it if liked the game.

Not that I am that surprised....but wow...

I don't want to believe that this is a real employee....but given Microsofts track record with the XBone, I wouldn't put it past them at all to do this.
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« Reply #1377 on: June 20, 2013, 05:44:16 PM »

Quote from: Bullwinkle on June 20, 2013, 01:06:43 PM

There is no way they will release a version of the Xbone without Kinect.  Apart from the tech not being up to snuff, that was the biggest hurdle with the Kinect to begin with.  No one did anything with it because not everyone had it and it would limit sales of your game.  If it is standard on every console, it is freely available for everyone to implement (of course they still have to make it catch on - there's a lot of negativity due to the crappy first version).

Kinect is a key ingredient in MS's vision for the future of our living room(/home?).  It's going to be working its way into our laptops and tablets (maybe phones down the road).  They're not going to back off of it.  And making it an option kills it for this gen.

A price drop is possible, but it entirely depends on how much of a loss it would be and whether they can stand it (MS does have a little bit of money).  To take over your house, it may be worth it.

I think they may end up taking the hit.  Even a $50 price drop could be enough to sway people on the fence.
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« Reply #1378 on: June 20, 2013, 05:48:12 PM »

Read that MS plans on bringing Kinect to the PC, to be able to control PCs via voice and gestures. Can't see that being successful, especially in light of all the privacy concerns with Kinect 2.
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« Reply #1379 on: June 20, 2013, 06:05:32 PM »

Quote from: Hetz on June 20, 2013, 05:35:45 PM

Quote from: Teggy on June 20, 2013, 03:53:23 PM

So, if this is real, the family share was not anywhere near as good as people thought it would be:

http://pastebin.com/TE1MWES2

Quote
When your family member accesses any of your games, they're placed into a special demo mode. This demo mode in most cases would be the full game with a 15-45 minute timer and in some cases an hour.  This allowed the person to play the game, get familiar with it then make a purchase if they wanted to.  When the time limit was up they would automatically be prompted to the Marketplace so that they may order it if liked the game.

Not that I am that surprised....but wow...

I don't want to believe that this is a real employee....but given Microsofts track record with the XBone, I wouldn't put it past them at all to do this.

It is kind of odd that if this was a great feature they weren't talking about it on stage but instead left it as this mysterious thing. Major Nelson talked a little about it, but he seemed strangely misinformed about everything xbone (MGSV being an exclusive, for example).
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« Reply #1380 on: June 20, 2013, 06:14:01 PM »

probably fake, but LOL:

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« Reply #1381 on: June 20, 2013, 06:21:41 PM »

yeah, that's a joke account.
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« Reply #1382 on: June 20, 2013, 08:13:47 PM »



The right way to introduce and implement cloud based, no-disc, no sharing gaming to the consumers is to wait a year or two into this lifecycle and do the following:

Offer cloud base download new titles at $45 or something simliar, whilst disc based games remain $60. 

This strategy would move consumers that direction due to the enticement of lower prices.    They better damn well make sure the next next generation (after PS4 and Xbone) has backward compatibility of those cloud games though, or it would be consumer backlash all over again.
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« Reply #1383 on: June 20, 2013, 09:33:27 PM »

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« Reply #1384 on: June 20, 2013, 09:57:16 PM »

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« Reply #1385 on: June 20, 2013, 10:31:59 PM »

Yeah, I realize those images are just in fun, but blindly attacking each of the products/companies isn't really doing anyone in here any good. 
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« Reply #1386 on: June 20, 2013, 10:44:07 PM »

Xbone is expensive.  
Xbone has a sexy design.
Xbone has cool voice/gesture features.
Xbone has the benefit of the doubt because of last generation.
Xbone has a good looking interface.

PS4 has a strange look.
PS4 is more affordable.
PS4 will have great exclusives if last generation is any predictor.
PS4 sharing looks cool.
PS4 appears more powerful.


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« Reply #1387 on: June 20, 2013, 10:57:45 PM »

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?

Amazon is still showing Ps4 launch bundles available.
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« Reply #1388 on: June 20, 2013, 11:03:12 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 10:57:45 PM

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?

Amazon is still showing Ps4 launch bundles available.

that is for the standard edition, which they clearly state is not guaranteed to be available on launch day. They do, however, have bundles still available. I grabbed the Killzone bundle with PSN.
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« Reply #1389 on: June 20, 2013, 11:09:49 PM »

Quote from: Dante Rising on June 20, 2013, 11:03:12 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 10:57:45 PM

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?

Amazon is still showing Ps4 launch bundles available.

that is for the standard edition, which they clearly state is not guaranteed to be available on launch day. They do, however, have bundles still available. I grabbed the Killzone bundle with PSN.

yeah, the page links to the standard which is why I made it a point to mention the launch bundles.  I could probably find direct links to the bundles themselves but it isn't worth the time when all someone needs to do is click on the bundle they want.
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« Reply #1390 on: June 20, 2013, 11:59:26 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 11:09:49 PM

Quote from: Dante Rising on June 20, 2013, 11:03:12 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 10:57:45 PM

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?

Amazon is still showing Ps4 launch bundles available.

that is for the standard edition, which they clearly state is not guaranteed to be available on launch day. They do, however, have bundles still available. I grabbed the Killzone bundle with PSN.

yeah, the page links to the standard which is why I made it a point to mention the launch bundles.  I could probably find direct links to the bundles themselves but it isn't worth the time when all someone needs to do is click on the bundle they want.

On that same note, here is the best price on the Xbox One I've found

link
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« Reply #1391 on: June 21, 2013, 12:14:52 AM »

Quote from: msduncan on June 20, 2013, 11:59:26 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 11:09:49 PM

Quote from: Dante Rising on June 20, 2013, 11:03:12 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 10:57:45 PM

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?

Amazon is still showing Ps4 launch bundles available.

that is for the standard edition, which they clearly state is not guaranteed to be available on launch day. They do, however, have bundles still available. I grabbed the Killzone bundle with PSN.

yeah, the page links to the standard which is why I made it a point to mention the launch bundles.  I could probably find direct links to the bundles themselves but it isn't worth the time when all someone needs to do is click on the bundle they want.

On that same note, here is the best price on the Xbox One I've found

link

duncan trolling with a blank google link?
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« Reply #1392 on: June 21, 2013, 12:53:27 AM »

FWIW I wasn't trying to start anything with the pic, console wars were 1990's for me.  I am amazed by Microsofts poor showing though, and interested in how it all turns out.
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« Reply #1393 on: June 21, 2013, 01:20:12 AM »

Quote from: Harkonis on June 21, 2013, 12:14:52 AM

Quote from: msduncan on June 20, 2013, 11:59:26 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 11:09:49 PM

Quote from: Dante Rising on June 20, 2013, 11:03:12 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on June 20, 2013, 10:57:45 PM

Quote from: Canuck on June 20, 2013, 01:11:37 PM

How many days since E3 and the pre-order version of Xbox still hasn't sold out. When did Sony sell out? Like two days after E3?

Amazon is still showing Ps4 launch bundles available.

that is for the standard edition, which they clearly state is not guaranteed to be available on launch day. They do, however, have bundles still available. I grabbed the Killzone bundle with PSN.

yeah, the page links to the standard which is why I made it a point to mention the launch bundles.  I could probably find direct links to the bundles themselves but it isn't worth the time when all someone needs to do is click on the bundle they want.

On that same note, here is the best price on the Xbox One I've found

link

duncan trolling with a blank google link?

I could probably find direct links to the deal but it isn't worth the time when all someone needs to do is search.
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« Reply #1394 on: June 21, 2013, 05:09:31 PM »

Family
If that MS employee is legit, then family sharing is alright, I guess. There are huge opportunities in the market to change how things work when one authenticates - for instance if someone in your "family" were to play a free, saved-progress hour off your library, then offer them a discount, or even offer kickbacks to the "refer-ee" for selling a product. As is, offering a streaming version of the full game kinda sucks, especially for a game like MGS, where you'll get 1 hour into the opening video and then not even finish the other 45 minutes before you can even try the game. slywink

Online pricing
I will say this: online gaming versions will need to be cheaper to entice - I totally agree that they need to start looking at fluctuating prices to entice buyers, and well as offering occasional deep discount sales to help move licenses and give gamers a reason to shop their online store.

Online/Install version
As to a disk-less version? I doubt it, this gen. BD is too important at this juncture - I could see them selling disk versions that require install beside the "trade-in" kind, with a difference in price.

If a 60/game price sits beside a 45/game price (install only, online DRM), and the buyer is always online, what kind of value proposition is 15 bux? Better than trade, and if you decide to keep it indefinitely you're ahead of the legacy sales method.

24 Hour Check-in time
I get the method they just repealed - but I don't know if they'd thought it through. You need your console to check in to confirm your licenses are correct. Someone could conceivably unplug their XB1 from the internet, go and trade a license in at the local GameStop, and continue playing it. If they gave us a week instead, gasp, they'd have an extra week to play it.

But wait, think about that. If you're bringing a game in to sell, you're likely buying a new game. That new game, by virtue of installation, needs to call home once to validate and work. The person BOUGHT the first game. What really is the harm in the gamer who continues to play the game that they paid at the till for to be able to finish up that last POS boss that just wouldn't die? I mean, as soon as they plug in to install the new game, their old game dies.

I just don't see the need, unless there is a technical issue with their engineered solution.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2013, 05:12:14 PM by Purge » Logged

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YellowKing
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« Reply #1395 on: June 21, 2013, 06:28:51 PM »

I'm kind of laughing at the "console war" insinuations. I've read the entirety of the PS4 and 360 threads here and at OO and they're among the most civil discussions of two competing consoles I've ever read in my life. I remember some ugly, ugly battles over the 360/PS3/Wii wars.

Maybe we all just got old and mature.  icon_biggrin
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« Reply #1396 on: June 21, 2013, 06:32:13 PM »

Quote from: YellowKing on June 21, 2013, 06:28:51 PM

I'm kind of laughing at the "console war" insinuations. I've read the entirety of the PS4 and 360 threads here and at OO and they're among the most civil discussions of two competing consoles I've ever read in my life. I remember some ugly, ugly battles over the 360/PS3/Wii wars.

Maybe we all just got old and mature.  icon_biggrin

I think both consoles, last-go-round, let down their fanboys in one way or another. Tongue
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« Reply #1397 on: June 21, 2013, 06:49:11 PM »

I never really felt like the 360 let me down.  I was fortunate to never experience the rrod. 

I definitely feel like the 360 was the right choice for me, with the only thing I missed being the Uncharted Series, which I ended up playing through anyway at a friends house.
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« Reply #1398 on: June 21, 2013, 07:26:36 PM »

I went through 10 consoles all told. Several were by choice (drive was a little noisy, used ext. warranty on my first and second ones) and some were MS's fault (RROD replacement sent back which worked fine by itself, but if the front USB ports had anything in them when it booted it would crash - YAY for refurb quality control!). They did end up sending me a second console as I was one of the original RRoD victims, and they had initially denied warranty - I had extended through EB games. Months later I received a replacement console in the mail with an apology. I didn't have to send in any back.

Since I only bought two all told, I suppose it could have been worse (my current S model was purchased when I traded my 360 for my bro-in-laws elite for HDMI support - which subsequently got the E74 aka RRoD). That was three years ago. It's still going strong (dammit, I bet that just jinxed it).
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« Reply #1399 on: June 21, 2013, 08:03:01 PM »

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