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Author Topic: Madden 360 issues.  (Read 2989 times)
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denoginizer
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« on: November 26, 2005, 11:42:00 PM »

I've been playing Madden 360 for a few days now.  A few observations:


-No Practice mode ?????  Even the PSP version has practice mode.

-New kick meter is BRUTAL on all-pro or all-madden and doesn't seem to correspond to where you actually aim it

- No field goal nets when kicking field goals (with all the attention to stadium detail, how was THIS missed).

- Was the camera really not supposed to zoom back in when you go to coach cam? Or is this a bug?

- In every footbal game for the last 2 seasons when you look at the play diagrams, the first down line is shown so you can see what patterns will get first down yardage. Not on this game.

- When a QB is hit while throwing and the ball comes out, which seems to happen quite often, it is ALWAYS called a fumble. Even when the play is clearly an incomplete pass. I have seen this happen quite a few times.  See below.

- When playing online, many times the game does not show the offensive personel group when your opponent calls a play. Thus you have no clue what defensive formation to call. (nickle, dime, etc)

- The DB AI needs alot of work. It makes 2K5's DBs look like pro-bowlers.

- You can use auto dropback like in 06, but if you don't move the QB in some way, the computer will throw it for you, so you are better off dropping back yourself. They had it working right in 06 for the Xbox, now it goes back to NCAA style. Why?

- Remapping the controls causes all sorts of problems. I have given up on it. I will just have to get used to the defaults.

- If an opponent does hurry up and lets the animations run pre snap, there is almost NO time to make ANY defensive adjustments (you have to wait until the offense is set). Years past you got to see the whole field and adjust the whole time the offense was setting up.

-Formation subs are all messed up, especially at running back.

-Major clipping problems.  See below.

http://tinypic.com/hu5dex.jpg ...in this picture, Tomlinson is breaking a tackle from behind. Due to his engagement with this defender, the second defender isn't detected at all, so he effectively runs through the safety. This probably happened in regular Madden 06, but it seems to be much more frequent with 360



http://tinypic.com/hrycg9.jpg ...here, the defender is making a deflection through the receiver...no PI call



http://tinypic.com/hu5cp1.jpg ...this wacky pic shows Brees releasing a ball and due to the blocker in front of him, the ball reverses direction resulting in a fumble. I got a kick out of this one because of the big man dance challenge that ensued on the fumble recovery: http://tinypic.com/hu5d2t.jpg


Another funny thing to do is watch a replay of your "wedge" blockers on a kickoff. Many times they do 360 spins trying to find someone to block and end up running into each other.

The more I play it, the more I see that this game is a train wreck.
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stiffler
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« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2005, 01:57:27 AM »

Quote from: "denoginizer"
The more I play it, the more I see that this game is a train wreck.


But it sure looks nice!
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« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2005, 04:12:13 AM »

This game is getting crucified on OpSports.  Even the Maddenites are somewhat upset.  The list of problems being reported in franchise mode alone is pretty unsettling.  

How can EASports make such a fantastic baseball game and also make this?  I just don't get it.  

But yeah... it DOES look nice... there is no doubt about that.
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Ralph-Wiggum
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« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2005, 04:25:31 AM »

It's obvious that they cut major features in order to get the game ready for launch. As for the QB throw/ball knocked down/always a fumble problem, I wouldn't be surprised if the team had coded in those sorts of plays so that they could reversed on a challenge. Of course, that doesn't work when they didn't implement a challenge system. Too bad EA doesn't have to make good football games anymore since there is no competition. That said, I bet almost every problem listed (along with many others) will be fixed for the 2007 version.
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TheMissingLink
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« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2005, 04:31:59 AM »

Quote from: "Ralph-Wiggum"
That said, I bet almost every problem listed (along with many others) will be fixed for the 2007 version.


 :lol:
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denoginizer
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« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2005, 04:56:51 AM »

"New" in Madden 2007  !!!!

Defensive hot routes.

Offensive line slide protection.

Custom Camera Angles.




I can see it on the box already

 biggrin
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Ralph-Wiggum
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« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2005, 05:34:12 AM »

Quote from: "TheMissingLink"
Quote from: "Ralph-Wiggum"
That said, I bet almost every problem listed (along with many others) will be fixed for the 2007 version.


 :lol:


Hey, I'm not saying it shouldn't have been fixed for this version (I sure as hell ain't buying it. Not that I have a 360 anyway). But if they let this stuff slip into next year's version, all hell will break loose. Hell hath no fury like the scorn of a million internet geeks.  :wink:
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Calvin
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« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2005, 06:55:17 AM »

Quote from: "TheMissingLink"
Quote from: "Ralph-Wiggum"
That said, I bet almost every problem listed (along with many others) will be fixed for the 2007 version.


 :lol:

Heh.
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WinoMcCougarstein
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« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2005, 07:53:34 AM »

I agree that Madden has its problems.  Its hard to believe what they had to sacrifice.  The graphics are a great start, but there is so much missing that it is hard to believe they even released the game.  No defensive hot routes is what gets me the most.  It cant be that hard to put in can it?  Seriously?  They are still way behind 2k in presentation.  No half time show, no end of game run down.  Cant view all of the replays in the gamecast.  Maybe, hopefully, next years edition will have the ESPN license in full effect.
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Captain Caveman
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« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2005, 01:34:36 AM »

After previous installments of Madden added such slight modifications such as the QB cone and the ability to set the price of each individual condiment that goes on a hot dog, maybe EA just ran out of ideas about what else to add to the Madden series. Now, since their first offering for the 360 is so bare-bones, they can start "adding" features that were already in previous versions and claim that it's an upgrade. Hopefully, everyone will catch on to this scheme and boycott the product once EA releases Madden 2011 for the Xbox 720 that doesn't have a challenge feature, defensive hot routes, and a solid stat engine.  biggrin
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Devil
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« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2005, 02:11:00 AM »

I still think it's better than last year.
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Eco-Logic
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« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2005, 04:38:05 PM »

I just have to show my presense in this thread.  Carry on.
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WinoMcCougarstein
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« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2005, 04:49:41 PM »

Quote from: "Eco-Logic"
I just have to show my presense in this thread.  Carry on.


Well, I am enjoying it quite a bit more than NFL2k6 on my 360... They could have taken the 2k route and made the graphics and everything pretty much the same(nhl).  Thankfully they didnt do that and the game actually looks next gen.  Sure it is watered down and has its problems, but it is still better than the NFL game 2k put out this year.  Still dont quite understand why you want it to fail so badly.  I guess you just dont really like NFL games and you would rather laugh at this one and play nothing.
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Eco-Logic
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« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2005, 04:56:02 PM »

Quote from: "GatorFavre"
Quote from: "Eco-Logic"
I just have to show my presense in this thread.  Carry on.


Well, I am enjoying it quite a bit more than NFL2k6 on my 360... They could have taken the 2k route and made the graphics and everything pretty much the same(nhl).  Thankfully they didnt do that and the game actually looks next gen.  Sure it is watered down and has its problems, but it is still better than the NFL game 2k put out this year.  Still dont quite understand why you want it to fail so badly.  I guess you just dont really like NFL games and you would rather laugh at this one and play nothing.


I don't have a 360.  Sold it for $750.

And I am still playing ESPN with updated rosters.

I do want Madden to fail.  I want people to wake up and quit buying it and EA to eat the billions they spent on the NFL license.  

But that's just me.  

With that said, I do feel bad that it sucks because if I had a 360 I would be royally pissed that there isn't a football game on it worth a shit.  When the psp's football game has more options than the 360 you know you're in trouble.
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denoginizer
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« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2005, 05:05:44 PM »

Quote from: "GatorFavre"
but it is still better than the NFL game 2k put out this year.  Still dont quite understand why you want it to fail so badly.  I guess you just dont really like NFL games and you would rather laugh at this one and play nothing.


You're kidding right?    Umm.  That's pretty funny.

I love NFL games.  Football games are the main reason why I play consoles.  If we allow EA to put out garbage like this unfinished piece of rubbish and reward them with $60 of our money than what motivation is there for them to improve?

What is amazing to me is that if you compare the feature sets both offline and online between NFL2K5 and Madden 360 it is laughable. Especially when you realize that you are camparing a $60 "next gen' game to a game that's 2 generations old and sold for $19.95. Yeah the graphics are nice, but that wears off in about 4 or 5 games. Then the shallowness really starts to show.
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« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2005, 05:23:29 PM »

I am guessing he is not joking, which is really sad.

I would like an honest answer from you Madden players though, if you're willing to give it.  How do you enjoy running the ball in Madden for the 360?  Do I have to slice a part of my frontal lobe off or something in order not to laugh out loud at how utterly horrific the running game is?  

And just to add a positive comment... This game looks INCREDIBLE on my tv!
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denoginizer
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« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2005, 05:33:05 PM »

The sticky blocking is back in 360 so the best way to run the ball is on counters or other play where your linemen lead you outside.  They will suck the defenders to them and then once that happens speed burst to the sideline.  I have used primarily this technique to lead the league in rushing through 8 games with Reubin Droughns, who is anything but an ouside runner. This is in my All-Pro franchise with my Browns.  It's important that you don't speed burst too early.  Running between the tackles is pretty useless.
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« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2005, 05:38:21 PM »

I bought it this weekend at Costco.  My 360 arrives sometime this week.  I fully expect to be disappointed, but somehow I had to have it.

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« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2005, 05:50:23 PM »

I guess I'm in the minority, but I like the 360 version of Madden.  I don't care about no practice mode or any of that other shit.  I just want a game that I can play solo or with my buds.

Hell, I love my PSP version and the 360 version as well.  I am a die-hard football fan, but dealing witht he salary cap , practicing my players  is just something I could really care less about when I am playing a football game.

Just my opinion
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« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2005, 06:28:10 PM »

Quote from: "denoginizer"
Quote from: "GatorFavre"
but it is still better than the NFL game 2k put out this year.  Still dont quite understand why you want it to fail so badly.  I guess you just dont really like NFL games and you would rather laugh at this one and play nothing.


You're kidding right?    Umm.  That's pretty funny.

I love NFL games.  Football games are the main reason why I play consoles.  If we allow EA to put out garbage like this unfinished piece of rubbish and reward them with $60 of our money than what motivation is there for them to improve?

What is amazing to me is that if you compare the feature sets both offline and online between NFL2K5 and Madden 360 it is laughable. Especially when you realize that you are camparing a $60 "next gen' game to a game that's 2 generations old and sold for $19.95. Yeah the graphics are nice, but that wears off in about 4 or 5 games. Then the shallowness really starts to show.


My post wasnt directed at you.  What I am saying is why laugh at the fact that they may have failed when we should be hoping they can put out a better game.  I agree that Madden 360 has issues, I'm in no way protecting it.  I just dont understand why anyone would want it to fail other than a personal grudge.  I would only want it to improve and get better. I understand that EA dropped the ball on this year, but instead of pledging my hate for them and making a point to state that in every Madden realated thread, I'm going to stay hopeful that EA will add all the features back in next year and improve on what they have built so far.
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« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2005, 07:25:38 PM »

GF:  Not to belabor a point that doesn't necessarily merit it, nor end what is so far a "peaceful" discussion, but...

1) Eco's point is partially out of anger that the much inferior (in some people's minds, certainly not all) football game got the official license and has a history of making minor changes year to year because they KNOW the sheep will buy the game no matter what they do or do not fix.

2) Personally, I look at what 2kSports is doing with their lineup of sports games, and am frankly pissed off that EA didn't do the same with Madden.  God knows I haven't been a fan of the Madden franchise for many years, but I certainly would have liked them to hit a home run with this game.  The fact of the matter is (graphics aside), they screwed the pooch in a massively craptacular way, especially for those of us that like to run franchises as well as play the game.  Some of us find that inexcusable is all.  I can't imagine EA having less resources at their disposal than Visual Concepts, and yet they give us this?  I'm not exactly sure why people shouldn't have the right to be extremely pissed off.

But again... it sure does look INCREDIBLE on my tv!   :wink:

All that nonsense being said... EA does have a chance to redeem themselves to some degree with their upcoming boxing and college baseball titles.  We shall see how that goes.
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Eco-Logic
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« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2005, 08:30:34 PM »

Quote from: "Lockdown"
GF:  Not to belabor a point that doesn't necessarily merit it, nor end what is so far a "peaceful" discussion, but...

1) Eco's point is partially out of anger that the much inferior (in some people's minds, certainly not all) football game got the official license and has a history of making minor changes year to year because they KNOW the sheep will buy the game no matter what they do or do not fix.

2) Personally, I look at what 2kSports is doing with their lineup of sports games, and am frankly pissed off that EA didn't do the same with Madden.  God knows I haven't been a fan of the Madden franchise for many years, but I certainly would have liked them to hit a home run with this game.  The fact of the matter is (graphics aside), they screwed the pooch in a massively craptacular way, especially for those of us that like to run franchises as well as play the game.  Some of us find that inexcusable is all.  I can't imagine EA having less resources at their disposal than Visual Concepts, and yet they give us this?  I'm not exactly sure why people shouldn't have the right to be extremely pissed off.

But again... it sure does look INCREDIBLE on my tv!   :wink:

All that nonsense being said... EA does have a chance to redeem themselves to some degree with their upcoming boxing and college baseball titles.  We shall see how that goes.


Very well said.  That is my point exactly.

  I know I let my emotion come through on all my posts regarding football games, which probably prevents many from realizing my ultimate point.
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« Reply #22 on: December 13, 2005, 09:27:29 PM »

Late to the thread, but I'm enjoying Madden.  Sure, there are numerous issues, but I can't think of a previous football game that didn't have issues as well.  Madden feels fairly balanced to me.  I wish blockers picked up their assignments better, or adjusted better, as well as some other issues, but overall its a fairly solid playing football game.

Is it perfect?  No.  Its pretty good though.

I don't miss any of that presentation stuff from the Visual Concepts and ESPN games.  Sure, Berman was amusing to awtch once or twice, but then, he was just a skip.  Not sure what wowed everyone visually about those games.

Everyone loves an underdog, so its easy to take potshots at EA and Madden.  I've had similar discussions with Devil before.  All these sports games are just a bunch of algorithms.  Once you figure out the patterns, you beat the game.  None of the sports game really get close to the real thing.  

How can you represent Tom Brady, Manning, or any of those guys with 8 numerical ratings?  Please.  At that point, Madden, and most every other sports game is a videogame, and really is far from representing the real sport.  Just enjoy the game, and its rules, as sports games are far, far away from representing real life.

The sports games we play today have more in common with Atari's Pong game then they do with the actual sport they represent.
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« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2005, 10:51:18 PM »

Quote from: "Scott"
Everyone loves an underdog, so its easy to take potshots at EA and Madden.  I've had similar discussions with Devil before.  All these sports games are just a bunch of algorithms.  Once you figure out the patterns, you beat the game.  None of the sports game really get close to the real thing.  


Scott.... what the hell are you talking about?  I think the Ice Queen cast a spell on you.  

If you think for one millisecond I take potshots at Madden because I like the underdog, you have lost your mind.  And regarding you algorithm statement... I suppose that could be true (maybe) if you are really good at these games, but for me... that has never ever been the case.  I am so laughably horrible at most games, I wouldn't recognize an algorithm if it came up to me on the field and smacked me in the face.  

 biggrin
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« Reply #24 on: December 14, 2005, 12:49:48 AM »

Quote
Scott.... what the hell are you talking about? I think the Ice Queen cast a spell on you.

I just think its crazy to complain about these games in comparison to the real sports.  They are so far away from what they try and represent, that its nuts to to pick on them because you can't execute one particular play type.

Maybe the ice queen did get me today, to much work smile
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denoginizer
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« Reply #25 on: December 14, 2005, 06:45:16 AM »

Quote from: "denoginizer"
at if you compare the feature sets both offline and online between NFL2K5 and Madden 360 it is laughable. Especially when you realize that you are camparing a $60 "next gen' game to a game that's 2 generations old and sold for $19.95. Yeah the graphics are nice, but that wears off in about 4 or 5 games. Then the shallowness really starts to show.


Who's comparing it to real football?

I'm comparing Madden 360, a supposed next -gen game, to ESPN 2K5.  With all the power of the 360, how is it that EA can release a game with LESS features and gameplay elements then a nearly 2 year old game?  Hell even Madden 06 for the PSP has more features and smoother gameplay than Madden 360.

Of course there are patterns and some things work better than others in all football games.  But Madden 360 gives you no ability to counter these things.  At least in previous versions of Madden or NFL 2K you could use defensive hot routes to counter certain things.  

In Madden 360 I can basically run comebacks, corner routes and counter plays all day.  You can stop it manually on one side of the field, but there is no way the AI can stop it on the other side.  Playing against the computer is like shooting fish in a barrel.  I went 17-0 with the Browns in my franchise on All Pro.  I am going to try All-Madden next season.  I hope the game plays better, because it is all I have for football on the 360 till next fall.
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« Reply #26 on: December 14, 2005, 01:46:09 PM »

Quote
But Madden 360 gives you no ability to counter these things. At least in previous versions of Madden or NFL 2K you could use defensive hot routes to counter certain things.

But in NFL 2k and other version of Madden, there were other holes.  There are always holes in the game.

I didn't say Madden 360 is a better game necessarily, or more representative of football, just it is what it is.  Madden 360 is a videogame, not football, and if you look at it that way, its a fun game.  I'm enjoying it.  I have no real illusion that it really represents what I watch on Sundays I guess.

I do like the overall feel of the game, so I'm interested in next years version.

I've also taken the tact of not reading Operation Sports boards about the game.  That way, if I don't notice a problem, it won't bother me smile.  I'm sure there are tons of things I'm missing, but so far, I'm enjoying what is there.
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