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Author Topic: It's Official: KOTOR II is HALO 2's Daddee  (Read 2590 times)
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ATB
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« on: January 11, 2005, 02:12:41 PM »

KOTOR II is so good I don't know what do with myself.  It has amazing character development, a WOW story and has had gaming moments that were, and are, amongst some of the very best I've ever had.

HALO2 was a good game, but other than a graphics upgrade (executed in a questionable manner <can you say pop-in?>) wasn't anything spectacular and had among the worst endings in my gaming experience.

Some have said that KOTOR II's ending is bad...but, at this stage, that seems inconceivable.  I'll find out when I get there...but that may be a while.

At 27 hrs in with a good character, I've started over with an evil character to catch up to where I am with the good one.

This is an unprecedented occurence for me, as I did not even do that with the original and replayability has never interested me in very few games.

HALO2 is pwned by KOTOR II
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« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2005, 02:33:45 PM »

Well to be fair neither of them had great endings but I bet you will change your tune after you finish.  

Post back in here after you are done and let us know how you feel.
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« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2005, 03:55:41 PM »

I felt like KOTOR 2 was a phenomonal game, up until the last 2 hours.  It really falls apart, sadly, which takes it from being a great game to a good game for me.
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« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2005, 04:27:00 PM »

Quote from: "ATB"
[Halo2]had among the worst endings in my gaming experience.

Some have said that KOTOR II's ending is bad...but, at this stage, that seems inconceivable.  I'll find out when I get there...but that may be a while. [...] HALO2 is pwned by KOTOR II


Yeah. Uhm, where to begin.

Halo2 is a middlepiece storyline with twists and innovation. Ambitious in nature, and pushing the absolute limit of a GeForce3.5 on a 700mHz processor. Bungie worked their damnedest with the hardware to deliver as much as possible; they have no reason to apologize.

KOTOR2, for me, was worse than Fable. At least Lionhead had the guts to apologize for what they wanted to give us but had to leave out. Plus, they built their engine.

Obsidian takes the full working engine and breaks it. KOTOR2 freezes, crashes, has MAJOR SHOWSTOPPING BUGS such as being able to cast heal (or any support function like Force Shield) and if you time it right, you can execute any attack WHILE the animation is showing you heal, and your very next move will do BOTH at the same time (Flurry of Blows + Master Heal in 1 round = Damned near unstoppable) The thing is, you may have already triggered this bug accidentally, especially if you don't use any autopause function.

Excessively long load times, conversation thread failures, accidental item duping, messed up storyline threads and plot holes big enough to throw a mule through *really* hurts this game.  First you start wondering why they show you plot stuff that no one acknowledges in normal conversation to where you get railroaded for the end section.

Basically, the last 1/4 of the game horrible. It's like you've just gotten to the middle of a tootsie pop to discover the fudge has been replaced with dogshit and vinegar.

If you want to keep loving this game play until you *know* who's behind the dark side. Then stop, start over, and go to the same point. Seriously, I freakin' loved the game for the first while. <sigh> KOTOR2 has fallen to the dark side.
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« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2005, 04:41:18 PM »

Played the second game for about 5-6 hours. It just didn't grab me like the first one. Its not like I hated it, but it just felt like MOTS in about every fashion as if it was just a stand alone expansion pack. I will probably go back to the game at a later date but with so many other things I'm interested in it will be awhile.
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« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2005, 05:47:08 PM »

Quote from: "Jumangi"
...but it just felt like MOTS in about every fashion as if it was just a stand alone expansion pack...


I had to respond to the More of the Same (MOTS) statement that I see quite often with games and their sequels.  MOTS is never an issue for me with games.  I view games like I view books.  If you are reading a "series" of books I never hear people exclaim that book numbers 2, 3, 4 etc. in the series is MOTS.  Why?  Because you know its a series and you expect it to be a continuation.  Each book is simply a continuation of the story with developing characters, new characters and locations etc. presented by the author.  Games and their sequels are the same way to me.  KOTOR 2 is like book No. 2 of the series.  At least for me, this is what I wanted.  I view Halo 2 the same way.  Halo 2 is "book No. 2" of a continuing series of "books" I want to "play."  As with a series of books some catch your attention better than others (i.e., book 2 was fantastic but book 3 was a little flat).

As far as endings go, both KOTOR 1 and Halo 1 were nothing spectacular and both were very short, but I enjoyed both and experienced great satisfaction and accomplishment with them.  I also think that "ending" needs to be defined.  Is it the final climactic encounter or the final closing scene that one is referring to?  The KOTOR 1 ending (no spoiler here) with my character standing there next to all his companions he adventured with and the Star Wars music in the background was absolutely perfect.

I'm glad I'm not experiencing any of the "technical issues" with the game that purge and others are having.  I know I'm only on Telos but I have already logged over 30hrs with zero problems.  The load times between "areas" doesn't bother me either.  They are only about 20 seconds long, give or take a few seconds.

My biggest worry right now is hoping and praying a KOTOR 3 is in the planning stages.
 biggrin
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« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2005, 06:59:39 PM »

I have not had one crash or lockup on my game and I just love it.

I have finished the Light Side and now I am going through playing as a Dark Side Character.

Yea the load times may be a little long but they are not anything that makes me hate the game or even dislike it.

Like any game out there though, if you want to find something wrong with it.. you can.   There is no perfect game out there and we can all find something wrong in even the best of them.

Btw, as for comparing KOTOR1 to KOTOR2... I do not think that I am enjoying #2 as much as the first one, but I think that is only because the first one was so new and thus I do not have the "newish surprise" factor in this one.
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« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2005, 08:05:18 PM »

I have played limitedly to be honest, but I have had no problems with locking or crashing at all. MOTS is not a problem with a game like this though. The first one was a resounding success, obviously, and there was no need to change much of it. Its coming from star wars too, all this stuff was prewritten, its not like they cant think of anything else to do, they are following the plan.
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« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2005, 08:11:09 PM »

Quote

Halo2 is a middlepiece storyline with twists and innovation. Ambitious in nature, and pushing the absolute limit of a GeForce3.5 on a 700mHz processor. Bungie worked their damnedest with the hardware to deliver as much as possible; they have no reason to apologize.

Besides pushing the graphics (granted they are good... for a console), I can't think of anything Halo 2 does that hasn't been done multiple times in previous PC FPS games.

Obviously Halo 2 has a nice multiplayer portion, and runs well on it's console, but nothing IMHO about the gameplay is innovative.  Compare it to any reasonably good PC FPS and it's lightyears behind the curve.

s
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« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2005, 08:23:57 PM »

Basically the ending sequence of the game IS the ending, rather than having an ending video like KOTOR 1 did.  I would've liked to have had a decent cinematic, but I liked the overall story so much that the ending sequence/lack of a decent video didn't really destroy my enjoyment.  

So I don't think ATB's going to be devastated by the ending like farley2k apparently is.  I've actually had interesting discussions with people about the KOTOR2 story; that really wasn't possible with KOTOR 1's pretty straightforward story.
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« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2005, 09:07:55 PM »

Quote from: "El Guapo"
Basically the ending sequence of the game IS the ending, rather than having an ending video like KOTOR 1 did.  I would've liked to have had a decent cinematic, but I liked the overall story so much that the ending sequence/lack of a decent video didn't really destroy my enjoyment.  

So I don't think ATB's going to be devastated by the ending like farley2k apparently is.  I've actually had interesting discussions with people about the KOTOR2 story; that really wasn't possible with KOTOR 1's pretty straightforward story.



El Guapo, I would love to hear more about your thoughts on the ending.  If you want post them in this thread so spoilers all stay out of this one.


I will say that it had nothing to do with a lack of video for the ending but the shear number of incomplete stories.
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« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2005, 10:22:26 PM »

Quote from: "Stardrifter"
I'm glad I'm not experiencing any of the "technical issues" with the game that purge and others are having.  I know I'm only on Telos but I have already logged over 30hrs with zero problems.  The load times between "areas" doesn't bother me either.  They are only about 20 seconds long, give or take a few seconds.

My biggest worry right now is hoping and praying a KOTOR 3 is in the planning stages.
 biggrin



It gets worse as it goes. Like I said, I loved this game initially. 4 planets in I still loved the game, but had a few crashes. Some advice: Save often.

Oh, and the plotlines are fine while it's still simple (and Telos is still simple).
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« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2005, 10:43:41 PM »

Quote from: "Sepiche"
Obviously Halo 2 has a nice multiplayer portion, and runs well on it's console, but nothing IMHO about the gameplay is innovative.  Compare it to any reasonably good PC FPS and it's lightyears behind the curve.

s


Lets see, the 4 big FPS games of 2004 :

Halflife2 - MOTS. Fun online, single player was (for me) a single trip. Grav gun enhancement; graphics are impressive and the game was done right.
Everything else is the same. Hell, the multiplayer portions are fundimentally identical to games we were playing 7 years ago. Counter-strike Source? Nice, but not really innovative.
Doom3  -I got through it, but it was NOT fun. Tripolectometronic Bootstrapbumped Vertile Shadelighting so we can enjoy BLACK. Yeah. No other improvements.
UT2k4   - It's like a sports game that gets updated every year. Headshot, Headshot. Rampage. *yawn* Monster Kill. I own it; it collects dust. Added vehicles; Halo1 had them. Tribes had them; no big advancement here.  It's online community keeps this afloat, and it is the defacto FPS shooter.
Far Cry - once you get past the jungle idea, it's a linear shooter that has you following a preset path (or you can sit in jungle by yourself, your call). Played the demo, played the retail for a couple hours at a buddies place; no big deal. I didn't see advancement beyond MOTS.

Halo2 - A straightforward shooter with (what I found to be)an engaging story, a terrific selling record and a very active online gaming community(very impressive for a pay-to-play service). Added vehicle jacking, dual wielding, and melee weapon. Nothing truly revolutionary, but impressive that they managed to keep the game balanced. As to physics, play Halo1 and watch how your character reacts to driving. He rolls forwards when stopping, and gets pinned back while accelerating. Halo2 added to that level of detail in more than just physics. Listen to the marines, check out the talents actors and actresses that helped voice the game.

You can chalk it up to MOTS, but MOTS is not "lightyears behind". That's not even a reasonable statement. Given the list above, Halo2 is in with it's peers. Just because it doesn't have a keyboard / mouse interface doesn't make it subpar. Widescreen on a nice set blows away the tunnelvision a monitor offers, and a controller is a middleground compromise between the mediocre controls of a keyboard and the fluid controls of the mouse. Oh, and if you want to play it with kbd/mouse, go visit http://www.lik-sang.com and ask em for a Smart-Joy frag. I've tried it, it works.

But this thread isn't about HALO2 VS. PC FPS, or PC elitism. It's about KOTOR2 being Halo2's Daddee. Drunken embarrassing step-father, maybe. He's a nice guy at first, but wait till you get to know him.

KOTOR brand name has held substantial value; #1 was game of the year for a lot of the critics out there. KOTOR2 had clout coming to market; they didn't live up to it. Oh, I can see the effort is there, but this one came out half-baked to make a christmas rush. That's not to say other games (including H2) don't face the same challenges, but I mean REALLY. They already had the engine and only had to tweak it. Obsidian didn't add much else to it other than a more complex workbench and some jedi classes and weapon forms. I'd also put forth that they added a story, but since the whole thing isn't there, and not all Tab "A"s fit into their Slot "B"s, it's a choose-your-own-adventure book with the a third of the pages ripped out.

Maybe Obsidian is happy with their game; I am not. I'm a pre-order kind of guy and unless they can convince me otherwise, KOTOR3 will wait until I'm confident I won't be getting another rotten Tootsie Pop.
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« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2005, 05:19:03 PM »

If you have a widescreen monitor, HL2 will run widescreen.  Just in case you were wondering.
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« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2005, 05:42:10 PM »

Quote from: "Stardrifter"
Quote from: "Jumangi"
...but it just felt like MOTS in about every fashion as if it was just a stand alone expansion pack...


I had to respond to the More of the Same (MOTS) statement that I see quite often with games and their sequels.  MOTS is never an issue for me with games.  I view games like I view books.  If you are reading a "series" of books I never hear people exclaim that book numbers 2, 3, 4 etc. in the series is MOTS.  Why?  Because you know its a series and you expect it to be a continuation.


Well I think its fair to expect some new things and improvements to the game with a sequal. The general gameplay the same? Yes. KOTOR was not a perfect game. It was very good overall but it had some issues which have been discussed many times. KOTOR II solved none of them. Its literally more levels and a add-on story put together. They changed nothing about it. I expect more from a game(any game) when it has a II after it myself. Just my opninion of course.
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« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2005, 05:47:02 PM »

Quote from: "Sepiche"


Obviously Halo 2 has a nice multiplayer portion, and runs well on it's console, but nothing IMHO about the gameplay is innovative.  Compare it to any reasonably good PC FPS and it's lightyears behind the curve.


You'll have to tell me of all these PC FPS that are "light years" ahead of Halo 2 because I havn't played them and I like FPS allot and have played or at least tried most of them(mostly on the PC). Halo 2 isn't the second coming that its been hyped about I'll agree there, but its a quality, fun shooter that stands up to the others out there.
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« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2005, 07:18:12 PM »

Quote from: "ChrisGwinn"
If you have a widescreen monitor, HL2 will run widescreen.  Just in case you were wondering.


Yeah. I don't have 51" worth of space on my desk for what I'm playin' Halo2 on.. or Sith lords for that matter. slywink I know there are some nice gaming rigs out there; they generally cost more than a low-mid home theatre. biggrin
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« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2005, 08:12:15 PM »

Quote from: "Jumangi"
Halo 2 isn't the second coming that its been hyped about I'll agree there, but its a quality, fun shooter that stands up to the others out there.

ahhhh Exactly. Finally someone who sees things my way. This is what I wanted to say. Great multiplayer, more power to ya, single player was decent. Contrary to what people say, Master Cheif is not Jesus.
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« Reply #18 on: January 12, 2005, 09:22:51 PM »

Quote from: "Jumangi"
Quote from: "Sepiche"


Obviously Halo 2 has a nice multiplayer portion, and runs well on it's console, but nothing IMHO about the gameplay is innovative.  Compare it to any reasonably good PC FPS and it's lightyears behind the curve.


You'll have to tell me of all these PC FPS that are "light years" ahead of Halo 2 because I havn't played them and I like FPS allot and have played or at least tried most of them(mostly on the PC). Halo 2 isn't the second coming that its been hyped about I'll agree there, but its a quality, fun shooter that stands up to the others out there.

There's almost too many that are better to even know where to begin, but... smile

Even as well regarded as the multiplayer mode is in Halo 2, Tribes 1 had much more depth, innovation, and better teamplay than H2 in multiplayer.  From all reports the latest version Tribes: Vengence is a good sequel to the original.  Tribes had fortified bases with defenses, attack craft, transport craft, different classes, customizable weapon loadouts, jet packs.  Very, very cool.

Day of Defeat for the original Halflife stands well as one of the FPS experiences out there.  Great feel, nice controls, well balanced, innovative.  Day of Defeat: Source is supposed to be released soon.

While not my personal favorite, the Battlefield series has excellent team play battles, vehicles, (including battleships, destroyers, aircraft, landing craft).  Very cool multiplayer.

If story is your thing HL2 is excellent.  Also I have not personally played it, but I know that many say No One Lives Forever 2 is an excellent story based FPS.

While not a true FPS the recent Vampire: Bloodlines is an excellent game. It has some bugs, but as long as you don't mind those or that it's a roleplaying game at heart it's mighty fun.

Just a few off the top of my head.

What just really amazes me is that there are so many interesting things that have been done for multiplayer FPS games in the last couple years and yet some console games like Halo are still stuck in a Deathmatch/CTF world.  I got bored of those game modes not too long after Quake 1 came out. biggrin

Honestly that's probably what annoys me the most about it.  It's multiplay is just so darn unimaginative compared to the great team based stuff out there.  So I suppose if endless deathmatch is your thing... smile

s
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« Reply #19 on: January 12, 2005, 10:10:23 PM »

Quote from: "Purge"
Quote from: "ChrisGwinn"
If you have a widescreen monitor, HL2 will run widescreen.  Just in case you were wondering.


Yeah. I don't have 51" worth of space on my desk for what I'm playin' Halo2 on.. or Sith lords for that matter. slywink I know there are some nice gaming rigs out there; they generally cost more than a low-mid home theatre. biggrin


I'm sorely tempted by one of these: http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?sku=320-4111&c=us&l=en&cs=19&category_id=2999&page=external
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« Reply #20 on: January 12, 2005, 11:27:51 PM »

Quote from: "Sepiche"
Quote from: "Jumangi"
Quote from: "Sepiche"


Obviously Halo 2 has a nice multiplayer portion, and runs well on it's console, but nothing IMHO about the gameplay is innovative.  Compare it to any reasonably good PC FPS and it's lightyears behind the curve.


You'll have to tell me of all these PC FPS that are "light years" ahead of Halo 2 because I havn't played them and I like FPS allot and have played or at least tried most of them(mostly on the PC). Halo 2 isn't the second coming that its been hyped about I'll agree there, but its a quality, fun shooter that stands up to the others out there.

There's almost too many that are better to even know where to begin, but... smile

Even as well regarded as the multiplayer mode is in Halo 2, Tribes 1 had much more depth, innovation, and better teamplay than H2 in multiplayer.  From all reports the latest version Tribes: Vengence is a good sequel to the original.  Tribes had fortified bases with defenses, attack craft, transport craft, different classes, customizable weapon loadouts, jet packs.  Very, very cool.

Day of Defeat for the original Halflife stands well as one of the FPS experiences out there.  Great feel, nice controls, well balanced, innovative.  Day of Defeat: Source is supposed to be released soon.

While not my personal favorite, the Battlefield series has excellent team play battles, vehicles, (including battleships, destroyers, aircraft, landing craft).  Very cool multiplayer.

If story is your thing HL2 is excellent.  Also I have not personally played it, but I know that many say No One Lives Forever 2 is an excellent story based FPS.

While not a true FPS the recent Vampire: Bloodlines is an excellent game. It has some bugs, but as long as you don't mind those or that it's a roleplaying game at heart it's mighty fun.

Just a few off the top of my head.

What just really amazes me is that there are so many interesting things that have been done for multiplayer FPS games in the last couple years and yet some console games like Halo are still stuck in a Deathmatch/CTF world.  I got bored of those game modes not too long after Quake 1 came out. biggrin

Honestly that's probably what annoys me the most about it.  It's multiplay is just so darn unimaginative compared to the great team based stuff out there.  So I suppose if endless deathmatch is your thing... smile

s


But you are missing the point here. All of the games you mentioned have strong qualities, but you failed to name one game which is light years ahead of Halo 2 on all fronts. Or even on more then one front. In fact not on any fronts. And you obviously havnt played Halo 2 very much either. There are many different multiplayer modes then just deathmatch and ctf. While it definatly could use more, how many of the games you mentioned have a rally mode?

Does tribes have single player? No, So how is that light years ahead of Halo 2?
Sure NLF2 has a great story, but is its multiplayer with vehicles and differnet game modes very good? No. How is it light years ahead of Halo 2?

Battlefield, now that is comparable to Halo 2.
You simply pointed out games with a single (or possibly two) strong points. If you meshed every game together and got only the best attributes out of them I would say you are right, Halo 2 is light years lbehind. But that is like 5 individual game syou mentioned, all of which Halo 2 in terms of an all inclusive FPS beats. And still you couldnt find an FPS with the excellent co op halo 2 has.

Halo 2 is not the best game evar!! But to put it down simply because it was released on a console and not a PC is just plain silly. I remember back in the day I used to say how PCs were better because everything was bigger etc... No console game could challenge a PC game in my mind. Then I got into consoles. I was wrong. They are very different games, no doubt about it. But the argument is a stupid one. Great games come out on consoles and PCs.

Halo 2 stand up there with the best FPS games of this year. Best FPS ever? No. Most innovative? No. But a very well rounded FPS with lots of options. Its a fun shooter and to say it is years behind is a silly statement. One which anyone who plays Halo in all its aspects would know is false. It does an excellent job of offering many play types.
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« Reply #21 on: January 12, 2005, 11:33:03 PM »

Quote from: "Chrisoc13"
Quote from: "Sepiche"
Quote from: "Jumangi"
Quote from: "Sepiche"


Obviously Halo 2 has a nice multiplayer portion, and runs well on it's console, but nothing IMHO about the gameplay is innovative.  Compare it to any reasonably good PC FPS and it's lightyears behind the curve.


You'll have to tell me of all these PC FPS that are "light years" ahead of Halo 2 because I havn't played them and I like FPS allot and have played or at least tried most of them(mostly on the PC). Halo 2 isn't the second coming that its been hyped about I'll agree there, but its a quality, fun shooter that stands up to the others out there.

There's almost too many that are better to even know where to begin, but... smile

Even as well regarded as the multiplayer mode is in Halo 2, Tribes 1 had much more depth, innovation, and better teamplay than H2 in multiplayer.  From all reports the latest version Tribes: Vengence is a good sequel to the original.  Tribes had fortified bases with defenses, attack craft, transport craft, different classes, customizable weapon loadouts, jet packs.  Very, very cool.

Day of Defeat for the original Halflife stands well as one of the FPS experiences out there.  Great feel, nice controls, well balanced, innovative.  Day of Defeat: Source is supposed to be released soon.

While not my personal favorite, the Battlefield series has excellent team play battles, vehicles, (including battleships, destroyers, aircraft, landing craft).  Very cool multiplayer.

If story is your thing HL2 is excellent.  Also I have not personally played it, but I know that many say No One Lives Forever 2 is an excellent story based FPS.

While not a true FPS the recent Vampire: Bloodlines is an excellent game. It has some bugs, but as long as you don't mind those or that it's a roleplaying game at heart it's mighty fun.

Just a few off the top of my head.

What just really amazes me is that there are so many interesting things that have been done for multiplayer FPS games in the last couple years and yet some console games like Halo are still stuck in a Deathmatch/CTF world.  I got bored of those game modes not too long after Quake 1 came out. biggrin

Honestly that's probably what annoys me the most about it.  It's multiplay is just so darn unimaginative compared to the great team based stuff out there.  So I suppose if endless deathmatch is your thing... smile

s


But you are missing the point here. All of the games you mentioned have strong qualities, but you failed to name one game which is light years ahead of Halo 2 on all fronts. Or even on more then one front. In fact not on any fronts. And you obviously havnt played Halo 2 very much either. There are many different multiplayer modes then just deathmatch and ctf. While it definatly could use more, how many of the games you mentioned have a rally mode?

Does tribes have single player? No, So how is that light years ahead of Halo 2?
Sure NLF2 has a great story, but is its multiplayer with vehicles and differnet game modes very good? No. How is it light years ahead of Halo 2?

Battlefield, now that is comparable to Halo 2.
You simply pointed out games with a single (or possibly two) strong points. If you meshed every game together and got only the best attributes out of them I would say you are right, Halo 2 is light years lbehind. But that is like 5 individual game syou mentioned, all of which Halo 2 in terms of an all inclusive FPS beats. And still you couldnt find an FPS with the excellent co op halo 2 has.

Halo 2 is not the best game evar!! But to put it down simply because it was released on a console and not a PC is just plain silly. I remember back in the day I used to say how PCs were better because everything was bigger etc... No console game could challenge a PC game in my mind. Then I got into consoles. I was wrong. They are very different games, no doubt about it. But the argument is a stupid one. Great games come out on consoles and PCs.

Halo 2 stand up there with the best FPS games of this year. Best FPS ever? No. Most innovative? No. But a very well rounded FPS with lots of options. Its a fun shooter and to say it is years behind is a silly statement. One which anyone who plays Halo in all its aspects would know is false. It does an excellent job of offering many play types.

Actually every single one of those games I mentioned IS light years ahead of Halo 2 in gameplay... IN MY OPINION. smile

s
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« Reply #22 on: January 12, 2005, 11:41:40 PM »

Well, that is why it is opinion, at least we can differ  biggrin .

My smilie is bigger.

Edit: to stay on track, I havnt played Kotor 1 or 2. Someday they will be $5 games I will pick up and say "How did I miss this?"
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« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2005, 03:11:47 AM »

Quote from: "Sepiche"
Actually every single one of those games I mentioned IS light years ahead of Halo 2 in gameplay... IN MY OPINION. smile

s


Now *that* is a cop-out. You stated it as fact, and change it to opinion like we were all retard for thinking otherwise.

Halo1 was one of my most anticipated titles for PC FPS. Ever. It switched to console, and I went for it. As a hard-core PC gamer starting at about ~1987 (within the last 5 years I was hosting 30+ person lan parties in my basement). Halo1 took me, hook line and sinker. Can any of the games you mentioned let you play in an immersive co-op mode? Are they well-balanced and fast-paced with a solid graphics/sounds/control/physics/fun factor?

Tribes Vengeance is an empty shell; worse than UT2K4. It is soulless and barren. Tribes was a great game, but it was never as engaging as the Rainbow 6 line (PC) or Ghost Recon (PC).

Day of Defeat was still standing on the shoulders of Half-Life and what it brought to the table. Single player? No. DoD:Source? Puhleez. Sell me a product I already own with a new engine. Same thing with Counterstrike. I'm done with shooting the radio and then sniping down the alley. In 1998.

Battlefield was by far the ugliest game I've seen in some time. There were a lot of people who loved it and I don't begrudge them that. I never got into it; it seemed unpolished and a whole lot of not-fun.

Vampires is a FPRPG. Not an FPS. That's like saying Lego Racing is better than Sim Copter. Well, they both have a third person view in vehicles, right?

The list of "FPS games off the top of your head" contains a fair amount of legacy titles (not "todays games") and some you either haven't played or aren't really in the same category. We're comparing apples to oranges and complaining there isn't enough citrus in the apple category. Or that these apples don't taste as good as the ones in them good old days.

Back on topic.

KOTOR2 is a big pile of smelly poo.
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« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2005, 03:50:08 AM »

Quote
Halo1 was one of my most anticipated titles for PC FPS.


Incorrect. It was the most anticipated PC/MAC RTS before it was ever a FPS.

Yes you hear me right, it was a RTS before it was ever a FPS.

The let down still hurts to this day for me.  People were frothing at the mouth at a Myth type game with a futuristic setting and an incredible story to boot.

I'm still upset we aren't playing Halo 1/2 over Bungie.net with Myth type gameplay and statistics tracking. *sigh*
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« Reply #25 on: January 13, 2005, 10:47:35 PM »

Quote from: "Sparhawk"
Quote
Halo1 was one of my most anticipated titles for PC FPS.


Incorrect. It was the most anticipated PC/MAC RTS before it was ever a FPS.


Regardless of it's original concept /design, the game *is* an FPS and my statement is not incorrect.  I don't anticipate RTS games, so I don't really mind the change. <shrug> And really, Halo is a Marathon game. (which were first person shooters)

My statement still stands.
KOTOR 2 is a smelly pile of poo.
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« Reply #26 on: January 13, 2005, 11:18:33 PM »

Quote from: "Purge"
Quote from: "Sepiche"
Actually every single one of those games I mentioned IS light years ahead of Halo 2 in gameplay... IN MY OPINION. smile

s


Now *that* is a cop-out. You stated it as fact, and change it to opinion like we were all retard for thinking otherwise.

Halo1 was one of my most anticipated titles for PC FPS. Ever. It switched to console, and I went for it. As a hard-core PC gamer starting at about ~1987 (within the last 5 years I was hosting 30+ person lan parties in my basement). Halo1 took me, hook line and sinker. Can any of the games you mentioned let you play in an immersive co-op mode? Are they well-balanced and fast-paced with a solid graphics/sounds/control/physics/fun factor?

Tribes Vengeance is an empty shell; worse than UT2K4. It is soulless and barren. Tribes was a great game, but it was never as engaging as the Rainbow 6 line (PC) or Ghost Recon (PC).

Day of Defeat was still standing on the shoulders of Half-Life and what it brought to the table. Single player? No. DoD:Source? Puhleez. Sell me a product I already own with a new engine. Same thing with Counterstrike. I'm done with shooting the radio and then sniping down the alley. In 1998.

Battlefield was by far the ugliest game I've seen in some time. There were a lot of people who loved it and I don't begrudge them that. I never got into it; it seemed unpolished and a whole lot of not-fun.

Vampires is a FPRPG. Not an FPS. That's like saying Lego Racing is better than Sim Copter. Well, they both have a third person view in vehicles, right?

The list of "FPS games off the top of your head" contains a fair amount of legacy titles (not "todays games") and some you either haven't played or aren't really in the same category. We're comparing apples to oranges and complaining there isn't enough citrus in the apple category. Or that these apples don't taste as good as the ones in them good old days.

Back on topic.

KOTOR2 is a big pile of smelly poo.

Well.. they are facts in my opinion. Tongue

Besides, since when have people actually had to back up anything they say on the internet? smile

I was just throwing out games that are generally considered to be the best in their areas, including some I don't like myself, but other are quite fond of.  Also note that I was not comparing graphics.  I was picking the games that have the best gameplay.  I could give 2 $hits about graphics. slywink

s

P.S. - Okay I admit I was a bit grouchy this week and took it out on Halo, but come on... it was asking for it... Tongue
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« Reply #27 on: January 13, 2005, 11:58:59 PM »

Quote from: "Sepiche"
Well.. they are facts in my opinion. Tongue

Besides, since when have people actually had to back up anything they say on the internet? smile

I was just throwing out games that are generally considered to be the best in their areas, including some I don't like myself, but other are quite fond of.  Also note that I was not comparing graphics.  I was picking the games that have the best gameplay.  I could give 2 $hits about graphics. slywink

s

P.S. - Okay I admit I was a bit grouchy this week and took it out on Halo, but come on... it was asking for it... Tongue


To point number one, LOL.
To point number two, ROFL.
To point number three - Graphics are part of immersion, and as long as everything jives then it doesn't matter to me that much. I *am* superficial though, and I won't take Doom2 graphics seriously in 2005.

See, I don't see Halo2 as the second coming, but there is a lot of H2 bashing that goes on for the sake of people's wildly disproportioned expectations of a game (any game). I just vehemently objected to the "Sith Lords" as being rated higher than H2, it's truly a broken game. Oh, and I like saying things like "The sith lords is a big pile of smelly poo".

Can ya tell? slywink
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