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Author Topic: IGN Jak 3 review. 9.6  (Read 2351 times)
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Caine
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« on: November 07, 2004, 08:18:42 PM »

well, they gave Jak 3 a 9.6 and recommend it highly.  

with this and R&C:UYA out, which is the better game?  i played jak 1 and R&C2 and loved both.  R&C was such a better experience for me though, that i tend to lean towards that over jak.  i know that the jak series took a different approach with 2 and now 3, but i'm wondering of anyone who played both sequels and/or these current sequels; which is the better game in your opinion and why?
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Calvin
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« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2004, 08:33:54 PM »

Put links to the reviews in yo posts please!!!
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2004, 08:43:25 PM »

That's a tough one.

Which is a better game?  Objectively, Ratchet & Clank and its sequels.  Brilliant levels and weapon design, especially for a platformer.  The creativity on display here is insane and the fact that Insomniac has been able to creat so many new and creative worlds and levels with only a year in between games is one of the great acheivments of this gaming generation IMO.

Personally, I prefer the Jak games to R&C's.  Jak 2 does take the series (and platformers) in a very different direction.  Its much more story oriented than any platformer before it and takes a lot of cues in structure from the GTA series.  While it still has a great variety of gamplay it just doesn't compare to the Ratchet & Clank series.

What I appreciate about Jak 2 though is its world and atmosphere.  I was really drawn in by Haven City and its surroundings so when Jak 2 got its hooks in me I played it nonstop until I beat it.  

Jak 2 received excellent reviews (though below those of R&C:GC) but received a fair amount of justified criticism for its brutal difficulty and convoluted city design.  From reading the IGN review it sounds like those criticisms have been rectified and the story is even better.  

Both Jak 2 and R&C:GC are greatest hits so I would try them both.  If you only have time and funding for one, however, I'd go with Going Commando- its a much safer bet.
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stiffler
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« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2004, 09:41:49 PM »

IGN's Jak 3 review.  9.6

IGN's R&C: UYA review.  9.5

Edit: Didn't see Caine updated his with a link.  Oh well, here's both.
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« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2004, 12:40:06 AM »

IN!
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Caine
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« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2004, 05:40:02 AM »

thanks for the input kevin.  been wondering if i should go rc3 first and then pick up jak with 2 and then 3.  absolutely loved rc2 and would play through it again if 3 wasn't out.  it's the game i use to 'get away' from the more serious games like san andreas and smt:  nocturne.  

Quote from: "Rage"
Put links to the reviews in yo posts please!!!

hey rage, you did see this right?
Quote from: "Caine"
well, they gave Jak 3 a 9.6 and recommend it highly.  
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2004, 05:45:56 AM »

Caine, not having opened UYA yet the only negative I can see is the game is arguably MOTS although very superior MOTS.  With Jak 2 you will be getting a fairly fresh experience that is fairly different from Jak 1 and most other platformers.  

If you're looking to "get away" though UYA is probably the better pick.  Its reportedly relatively easy and Jak 2's frustration would probably be counter productive.
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Pong
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« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2004, 02:06:14 PM »

Quote from: "Kevin Grey"
Caine, not having opened UYA yet the only negative I can see is the game is arguably MOTS although very superior MOTS.  With Jak 2 you will be getting a fairly fresh experience that is fairly different from Jak 1 and most other platformers.  

If you're looking to "get away" though UYA is probably the better pick.  Its reportedly relatively easy and Jak 2's frustration would probably be counter productive.


I prefer R&C myself. Played through all Jak and R&C games and I think R&C is the better series. Jak 2 was brutal and honestly it pissed me off smile
But it sounds as if Jak3 is going to be the same without the annoying stuff which in my book = good.

No matter which you decide to play first you have to play the other one too. There's no excuse for a PS2 owner not playing these games smile
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weeskwee
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« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2004, 02:57:59 PM »

i just read someone say they beat it in 6 1/2 hours the first time through. others claimed less than 8. so i'll be waiting for a $20 greateast hits price in half a year or so.
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« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2004, 12:31:47 AM »

IGN will institue a different scale next year... they will have to go to 20, cause all games are almost 10 now... they are a little much eh?
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« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2004, 12:45:27 AM »

I played it for a few hours. and it's soooooo much better than Jak 2.
1. You don't have to travel so much just to get to a mission
2. If you die ona  mission, you start halfway (assuming you reached it off course :p) unlike in Jak2 where you had to it all over again.

I love it. It's a lot more enjoyable than Jak2. Won't compare it to R&C:UYA since they are totally different games.
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Andrew Mallon
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« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2004, 04:31:15 PM »

My advice to anyone thinking about picking up Jak 3 is: wait until it hits the bargain bin. The game is strictly a $50 dollar expansion pack. I started playing it on Saturday after finishing Halo 2. I've put in 11 and a half  hours or so, so far, and my completion percentage is around 60%, of which at least a third of the time is spent doing some of the optional challenges.

The game isn't horrible, but it's lost a lot of what made the first game special. First off, it's way, way too easy. We can go around for hours discussing whether Jak II was too hard or not, but the bottom line with the current game is that they went way too far in the opposite direction. I breezed through the first half of the game barely dying at all, and in a lot of the timed missions they tack on additional time every time you die. I played one mission last night where the instructions on what to do weren't clear, so I died three or four times quickly until I realized what I was supposed to do. Originally, I had 1:15 to complete the challenge. By the time I figured out why I was supposed to do, the game gave me 2:45 to complete it. 1:15 would have been challenging and fun. 2:45 made it ridiculously easy.

The other major complaint is the story. The game isn't as funny as Jak II, and they don't really explain the story that well. I think they didn't have time to do all the cut-scenes that would have explained the game better.  I was about third of the way through the game before I figured out that there are actually two factions attacking the city, rather than just one. It's hard to really care about  the story when the game just barely touches on major events without fleshing them out.

Finally, there's too much to do in this game. At about the 45% mark, they were still introducing major gameplay elements. I love the dune buggies and the Mad Max style elements in the game. Just when I'm really starting to master it and have fun, they whisk me out of the desert and into a temple for jetboarding gameplay. Just as I get the hang of that, they whisk me back to Haven City. This is definitely a case where less would have been more. They should have concentrated on really fleshing out the new elements, rather than recycling so much from the second game.

Jak 3 isn't bad, but it's definitely not worth $50. Rent it or wait for the inevitable Greatest Hits release. If they had another year of development on the title, it could've been really great.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2004, 04:40:11 PM »

Interesting comments.  Haven't played my copy of Jak 3 yet- MGS 3 and HL2 have sapped any desire I have to play other games- but I'm surprised by your comment on the story and dialogue.  Everything I've read is that both are excellent and better than in Jak 2 (I think they brought someone on who was responsible for the writing in the Soul Reaver games).  

I don't mind the introduction of new gameplay elements though.  I love games that are constantly introducing new and varied gamplay throughout.

[EDITED TO CLARIFY LAST COMMENT] I should add that I only enjoy new gameplay elements if they aren't at the expense of previous ones- ie don't introduce some cool new ability that I only get to use once in the game which will be disappointing if its the case for Jak 3.
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UConnBBall
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« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2004, 05:46:27 PM »

I think IGN reviews are way to forgiven and are pushed out the door many times just to be first.

An example http://www.gametab.com/pc/master.of.orion.3/1047/
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« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2004, 05:58:52 PM »

Quote from: "Andrew Mallon"
Jak 3 isn't bad, but it's definitely not worth $50. Rent it or wait for the inevitable Greatest Hits release. If they had another year of development on the title, it could've been really great.

Well, the game isn't $50, it's $40 biggrin
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Andrew Mallon
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« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2004, 06:05:17 PM »

Quote
Interesting comments. Haven't played my copy of Jak 3 yet- MGS 3 and HL2 have sapped any desire I have to play other games- but I'm surprised by your comment on the story and dialogue. Everything I've read is that both are excellent and better than in Jak 2 (I think they brought someone on who was responsible for the writing in the Soul Reaver games).


Kevin, don't get me wrong, the story in the game is interesting. I just feel like I'm getting the Cliff Notes version. Oftentimes I'll see a cut-scene and then I'll sit there and go, "Whaaa?" until I stop and think about it and piece together what's happening from bits and pieces that were mentioned off-hand in other cut-scenes. In other words, I have to do the work for the story to make sense.

It feels like they're trying to take a thirty-hour story and cram it into a fifteen hour game. I'm happy playing short games like this, but they're doing too much in too little time.
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Andrew Mallon
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« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2004, 11:15:11 PM »

Finished the game this afternoon and there is a revelation ( I hesitate to call it a twist) that had me rolling on the floor laughing. That scene alone was almost worth the purchase price and the last 15% or so of the game is absolutely fantastic. Unfortunately, it can't quite make up for the fact that the game was obviously rushed out. And the ending is unsettling in that it completely ignores certain elements from the first two games without any explanation whatsoever.

I think all my criticisms above hold true. The first 60% of the game feels like a loose collection of disparate mini-games. It tightens up at the end, but the story feels completely rushed and there is just too much that isn't fleshed out. It took me about twenty hours to complete, but they either needed to expand the game's length or cut out some of the elements to make the pacing better. Also, the game is just way too easy. Naughty Dog completely overcompensated for Jak II's difficulty in this game.  

If I had to rate it, I'd give it a 7. I might have rated it slightly higher, but it locked up on me just after I beat the final boss, forcing me to replay it. Only glitch I encountered, but it's just completely unforgivable for something like that to happen at the end of the game.

One of the cooler things about the game is that you can unlock developer commentaries. The animators comment on all the cut scenes during the game. It was fun to listen to some of their insights. I wish more titles would do this.
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« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2004, 12:31:03 AM »

More than GTA, these two games (Jak and R&C) make me want to snag one of those new-fangled PStwos.  I've always been jealous of you guys for them because they looked like so much fun - from characters to weapons to levels.  I wish they were "exclusive" like GTA and Splinter Cell are "exclusive" - come on guys straight ports aren't always bad if the games are so entertainin!
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Caine
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« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2004, 01:36:48 AM »

the reason these series are exclusive is because sony has them.  their basically 2nd party games, not directly made by sony, but wholly owned by them.  like ms and bungie, rare.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2004, 02:04:56 PM »

Put some time into this yesterday evening.  I disagree with Andrew on several points- chiefly that it feels like an expansion pack.  The Wasteland is an all new and huge environment and so far (36% done) I haven't seen anything reused from Jak 2.  I am just about to get back into Haven and I expect to see some familiar environments at that point but given the level of new content I've already seen this game doesn't feel any more like an expansion pack than the Ratchet & Clank sequels.  It does use the same engine so the visuals are similar but considering the engine is among the best on the PS2 I can hardly blame them for that.  Plus they've upgraded it in several areas, most notably some new reflective surfaces (specular highlighting or whatever) that are used to great effect.  The day/night effects, scale of the desert, and level architecture make this not only one of the best looking games on the platform but provide the game an epic feel and sense of mystery lacking in the previous two installments.


Story so far has been fine though there haven't been many plot developments yet- most of it has been laying some obvious groundwork.

Level design has been fantastic.  There have already been some really stellar platforming sections and the new Light Jak abilities are fun to use and well integrated into the levels.  

I also have to disagree with Andrew on the difficulty- so far its been perfect to me.  My platforming skills must pale next to him because I've died several times in several different areas.  Unlike Jak 2, however, Naughty Dog seems to have done some playtesting to determine these tough areas and I am restarted almost immediately before where I died.  Its  a nice change from Jak 2 where you would likely have to replay the entire level up until that point.  

Pacing is outstanding.  Many of the missions are multistaged, unlike Jak 2, that give a really natural progression as you move through them.  The Wasteland City is laid out in a much less confusing manner than Haven and getting around via lizard mount is simple and fun.  In 5 hours of play I've already unlocked 1/3 of the game (with several optional challenges) but it feels like I've played even more- there is a lot of content here.  

Jak 3 isn't the same leap gamplay wise that Jak 2 was but it refines pretty much everythign great about Jak 2 while getting rid of a lot of the frustration.  So far I'm having a blast.
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