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Author Topic: IGN Civ IV review  (Read 3965 times)
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siege
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« on: October 22, 2005, 01:33:42 AM »

http://pc.ign.com/articles/660/660495p1.html

9.5    Presentation
The most approachable game in the history of the series. Stays true to the original without feeling like a sequel.
8.0    Graphics
Beyond the standard we expect from the 4x genre. Great animations and personality and a (mostly) elegant interface.
8.5    Sound
The sound effects are pretty good. The music and Leonard Nimoy's voiceover work are amazing.
9.5    Gameplay
Complex but not complicated. Streamlines the exhausting elements of the prior games without sacrificing detail.
10    Lasting Appeal
There's a nearly endless variety in the single player game. Multiplayer is as convenient and enjoyable as ever.
9.4    OVERALL
(out of 10 / not an average)

GOTY?
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ioticus
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« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2005, 01:55:25 AM »

Good review. I was disappointed to read that the old problem of knights taking out helos, spears taking out tanks, etc., is still present.
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siege
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« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2005, 01:57:29 AM »

Quote from: "ioticus"
Good review. I was disappointed to read that the old problem of knights taking out helos, spears taking out tanks, etc., is still present.


Supposedly it's a lot more rare than before. Still, disappointing to hear none the less.
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« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2005, 02:08:05 AM »

I'm with that guy in the review. In fact, it never bothered me all.  It actually made it a little more "gamey". As long as it doesn't happen too much, for me, big deal...

Looking forward to the game, spearmen taking out tanks (occasionally) and all. smile
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« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2005, 02:24:53 AM »

Fan-freakin-tastic!

Can not wait.  I mean it... I can not wait!  

I am predicting a 9.2 minimum from Gamespot also.  

Absolutely Game of the Year candidate.  (my prediction anyway).

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« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2005, 02:38:20 AM »

Quote from: "siege"
Quote from: "ioticus"
Good review. I was disappointed to read that the old problem of knights taking out helos, spears taking out tanks, etc., is still present.


Supposedly it's a lot more rare than before. Still, disappointing to hear none the less.


Wouldn't this be painfully simple to fix?  I can imagine simple ways of doing it in the two seconds it took me to read that post.  With all the unit data you think they could add a simple >/< flag or something in there.

Maybe there is a reason they left that in.  I'd sure love to hear it.
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Semaj
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« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2005, 03:53:52 AM »

Durnit, In now...
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« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2005, 05:17:11 AM »

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Durnit, In now...
Chill, bro.  It's an EARLY review by IGN.  Credibility is getting into the negatives here.
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Luke
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« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2005, 06:27:53 AM »

LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  Course there's always the editor's choice award to tack onto a game they just can't bring themselves to award with a 9+.  

Does IGN care if a game is legitimately good?  No.  Can they even tell if it is?  Doubtful.  As long as the hits keep coming.

Pardon my cynicism, which, for the record, is not directed at anyone in particular, but let's all just be aware of reality here.  We still don't really know if Civ 4 is great or not.  Next week will clarify.
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Calvin
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« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2005, 07:21:12 AM »

I am very tentatively cautious after this review. It seems good, but I need a more critical source to review it before I am convinced.
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Semaj
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« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2005, 07:21:51 AM »

Dont know if its great or not, but unless they decided to change the fundementals of the game, it's probably stilla buy for me... It looks like the same game I still play religously, and have to un-install when work needs ot be done.
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siege
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« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2005, 07:39:39 AM »

Quote from: "Luke"
LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  


SWAT 4
Guild Wars
Freedom Force 2
Brothers in Arms
Nascar SimRacing
FEAR
GTA:San Andreas
Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

The short list of games that have scored a 9 or higher this year from IGN PC.
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Calvin
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« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2005, 08:22:23 AM »

Quote from: "siege"
Quote from: "Luke"
LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  


SWAT 4
Guild Wars
Freedom Force 2
Brothers in Arms
Nascar SimRacing
FEAR
GTA:San Andreas
Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

The short list of games that have scored a 9 or higher this year from IGN PC.


Man, that is worth a SNAP! methinks.
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« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2005, 08:58:47 AM »

Quote from: "siege"
Quote from: "Luke"
LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  


SWAT 4
Guild Wars
Freedom Force 2
Brothers in Arms
Nascar SimRacing
FEAR
GTA:San Andreas
Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

The short list of games that have scored a 9 or higher this year from IGN PC.

The short list IGN defenders don't like to talk about:
-Doom 3 (8.9)
-Deus Ex 2: Invisible War (9.0)
-Master of Orion 3 (9.2) (also an early review)
-Black & White (9.7) (also an early review)

Not saying Civ4 sucks, just saying, we sure as hell can't tell until a real journalistic source reviews it.
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« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2005, 01:13:03 PM »

IGN gave MOO3 a 9.2? But but... that's just unholy!

I think I may never read another IGN review again after hearing that. I mean really, MOO3 was a 0.2 out of 10 MAX. Wait, maybe I'm being to generous, it wasn't even a game, it was just a badly organized bunch of spreadsheets.
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« Reply #15 on: October 22, 2005, 02:24:51 PM »

To be fair, MOO 3 and Black and White are a good while ago. This years selection of PC games looks pretty good, but they did give Jade Empire 9.8, so I'd still be weary.
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« Reply #16 on: October 22, 2005, 03:45:11 PM »

Quote from: "ioticus"
Good review. I was disappointed to read that the old problem of knights taking out helos, spears taking out tanks, etc., is still present.

But a spear tossed directly into the cannon while the operator is firing could possibly cause a chain reaction thus resulting in the destruction of the tank.  :roll:

biggrin

And it has Leonard Nimoy in it? Best game of the year, hands down. biggrin

And IGN game MOO3 a 9.2? How the holy hell did they do that? Must've been the money hat. Or the McIGN syndrome.
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« Reply #17 on: October 22, 2005, 06:24:42 PM »

Quote from: "-Lord Ebonstone-"
Quote from: "siege"
Quote from: "Luke"
LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  


SWAT 4
Guild Wars
Freedom Force 2
Brothers in Arms
Nascar SimRacing
FEAR
GTA:San Andreas
Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

The short list of games that have scored a 9 or higher this year from IGN PC.

The short list IGN defenders don't like to talk about:
-Doom 3 (8.9)
-Deus Ex 2: Invisible War (9.0)
-Master of Orion 3 (9.2) (also an early review)
-Black & White (9.7) (also an early review)

Not saying Civ4 sucks, just saying, we sure as hell can't tell until a real journalistic source reviews it.


Then, my friend, we are going to be waiting for a source that is not an internet website or magazine to review it, and we will be waiting for some time smile
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« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2005, 06:25:27 PM »

Quote from: "Destructor"
Quote from: "ioticus"
Good review. I was disappointed to read that the old problem of knights taking out helos, spears taking out tanks, etc., is still present.

But a spear tossed directly into the cannon while the operator is firing could possibly cause a chain reaction thus resulting in the destruction of the tank.  :roll:

biggrin

And it has Leonard Nimoy in it? Best game of the year, hands down. biggrin

And IGN game MOO3 a 9.2? How the holy hell did they do that? Must've been the money hat. Or the McIGN syndrome.


Wasn't it a Tom Chick review? And he spent like months ardently defending his review in ways that made no sense to anyone that ever played that mess?
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Luke
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« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2005, 06:41:56 PM »

Quote from: "-Lord Ebonstone-"
Quote from: "siege"
Quote from: "Luke"
LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  


SWAT 4
Guild Wars
Freedom Force 2
Brothers in Arms
Nascar SimRacing
FEAR
GTA:San Andreas
Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

The short list of games that have scored a 9 or higher this year from IGN PC.

The short list IGN defenders don't like to talk about:
-Doom 3 (8.9)
-Deus Ex 2: Invisible War (9.0)
-Master of Orion 3 (9.2) (also an early review)
-Black & White (9.7) (also an early review)

Not saying Civ4 sucks, just saying, we sure as hell can't tell until a real journalistic source reviews it.


To be fair, a perusal through IGN's review lists show them to be fairly reasonable about most games that come out.  But they still manage to unleash some really questionable, hyperbolic (this is one of the ones that spurred my comment quoted above) early reviews.  They're also skilled in the art of score inflation.  Nothing as controversial as the stuff listed by LE, but reviews like these come from IGN frequently enough to make their journalistic integrity questionable.  As he said, I'll hold off until a real reviewer weighs in.

Edited to correct inaccuracies.
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« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2005, 06:47:53 PM »

Quote from: "Calvin"
Quote from: "Destructor"
Quote from: "ioticus"
Good review. I was disappointed to read that the old problem of knights taking out helos, spears taking out tanks, etc., is still present.

But a spear tossed directly into the cannon while the operator is firing could possibly cause a chain reaction thus resulting in the destruction of the tank.  :roll:

biggrin

And it has Leonard Nimoy in it? Best game of the year, hands down. biggrin

And IGN game MOO3 a 9.2? How the holy hell did they do that? Must've been the money hat. Or the McIGN syndrome.


Wasn't it a Tom Chick review? And he spent like months ardently defending his review in ways that made no sense to anyone that ever played that mess?


Yes.


I'm still very excited about Civ 4.Though, I'm in a pickle here.

We have:

F.E.A.R.

Age of Empires 3

Call of Duty 2

Quake 4

and now Civ 4 is coming out?

This is plenty to hold me until the X360 arrives at my doorstep, but damn...

I mean this is Civ 4, the game that can make 2pm turn into 4am in 1 second. It is fucking quantum baby.
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« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2005, 06:54:37 PM »

Quote from: "Sparhawk"
Quote from: "Calvin"
Quote from: "Destructor"

And IGN game MOO3 a 9.2? How the holy hell did they do that? Must've been the money hat. Or the McIGN syndrome.


Wasn't it a Tom Chick review? And he spent like months ardently defending his review in ways that made no sense to anyone that ever played that mess?


Yes.


No.  Barry Brenesal.  Whoever that is.
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« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2005, 07:20:46 PM »

Quote from: "Luke"
Quote from: "Sparhawk"
Quote from: "Calvin"
Quote from: "Destructor"

And IGN game MOO3 a 9.2? How the holy hell did they do that? Must've been the money hat. Or the McIGN syndrome.


Wasn't it a Tom Chick review? And he spent like months ardently defending his review in ways that made no sense to anyone that ever played that mess?


Yes.


No.  Barry Brenesal.  Whoever that is.


Ok then, Tom Chick reviewed it somewhere else (PCGamer?) and then explained the absurd score away for months. It happened, I just guess not for IGN smile
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Luke
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« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2005, 07:49:20 PM »

It never happened.  Chick damned the game just like almost everyone else.

Quote from: "Tom Chick"
There's no denying Master of Orion 3 is a complex game. Complexity itself isn't a bad thing, but poorly organized complexity can be the kiss of death. What's worse is poorly organized complexity that serves as a substitute for gameplay. This is exactly what you get with Master of Orion 3, an indecipherable pile of dense self-absorbed data that completely fails to understand why we loved our first MOOs.
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« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2005, 07:51:38 PM »

Chick was a moron about Deus Ex, but that's the extent of his sins.
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« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2005, 08:04:27 PM »

Quote from: "Calvin"
Quote from: "Luke"
Quote from: "Sparhawk"
Quote from: "Calvin"
Quote from: "Destructor"

And IGN game MOO3 a 9.2? How the holy hell did they do that? Must've been the money hat. Or the McIGN syndrome.


Wasn't it a Tom Chick review? And he spent like months ardently defending his review in ways that made no sense to anyone that ever played that mess?


Yes.


No.  Barry Brenesal.  Whoever that is.


Ok then, Tom Chick reviewed it somewhere else (PCGamer?) and then explained the absurd score away for months. It happened, I just guess not for IGN smile

Ok. Hey. I admit it, I was just straight up wrong with this one. I am not sure which semi famous reviewer I was thinking of (I know I was thinking of someone), but I was wrong about this one.
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« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2005, 08:05:39 PM »

Quote from: "-Lord Ebonstone-"
Chick was a moron about Deus Ex, but that's the extent of his sins.


I have to say, I find him one of the most overrated "internet celebrity reviewers" out there. Tries far too hard to be edgy and cool for my tastes, and don't find his writing anything particularly special.
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« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2005, 08:42:23 PM »

Now we're reviewing reviewers?

We all know what we're getting with IGN.  No need to even bring it up anymore really.

The naysayers can "blah blah" all you want to.  Civ IV has been played by numerous people for months and months now, through a number of builds.  The consensus is the same "universally".  For fans of the previous games, this is going to be a slam dunk.  End of story.

LD
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« Reply #28 on: October 22, 2005, 08:47:53 PM »

Tom Chick's a solid 8.3 out of 10.  His Presentation is exceptional, but his Lasting Value is questionable.
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« Reply #29 on: October 22, 2005, 08:52:45 PM »

Quote from: "Calvin"
Ok. Hey. I admit it, I was just straight up wrong with this one. I am not sure which semi famous reviewer I was thinking of (I know I was thinking of someone), but I was wrong about this one.


It happens smile  I admit that I'm probably being a bit too harsh on IGN.  Like I said, most of their reviews are decent enough, it's just the already mentioned standouts that come a couple times a year that make me apprehensive about trusting what they say.  Plus all the ads, the Fox buyout, McIGN...ok, I'm done bitching about them.  At least we have a good idea of what to expect when the other Civ 4 reviews come in.

Lockdown: I have high hopes for Civ 4.  Hope you're right and my pre-order won't have to be canceled.
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« Reply #30 on: October 22, 2005, 08:58:13 PM »

Quote from: "Luke"
Quote from: "Calvin"
Ok. Hey. I admit it, I was just straight up wrong with this one. I am not sure which semi famous reviewer I was thinking of (I know I was thinking of someone), but I was wrong about this one.


It happens smile  I admit that I'm probably being a bit too harsh on IGN.  Like I said, most of their reviews are decent enough, it's just the already mentioned standouts that come a couple times a year that make me apprehensive about trusting what they say.  Plus all the ads, the Fox buyout, McIGN...ok, I'm done bitching about them.  At least we have a good idea of what to expect when the other Civ 4 reviews come in.

Lockdown: I have high hopes for Civ 4.  Hope you're right and my pre-order won't have to be canceled.


McIGN has only been equalled for pure horror in recent memory by the full page ad that was the background for every page of gamespots site when they redisgned (and made everything impossible to find and slow as hell). I dont remember what game it was for, but it was ugly, absurd, and slowed the whole site down. Did I mention it covered the ENTIRE site?
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« Reply #31 on: October 22, 2005, 08:59:31 PM »

Luke -  Slam Dunk.  Trust me.  ( famous last words   ninja )  

Honestly though, the previews out there with people who have been playing it and describing in detail what's coming:  The Praise vs. Concern scale is leaning so far on the side of praise, it's not funny.  Unless everyone is smokin' the same stuff, we are all in for a treat in a few days.

LD
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« Reply #32 on: October 22, 2005, 09:27:26 PM »

Really, in a world of glorified adsites like IGN and their clearly-payola reviews, Tom Chick's pretty damn good.  When you put him in the perspective of journalism as a whole, and not just gaming journalism, he's just average, and maybe not even that, but for the weak gaming journalism that's out there, he's one of the best we've got.
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« Reply #33 on: October 22, 2005, 09:44:02 PM »

Quote from: "Luke"
It never happened.  Chick damned the game just like almost everyone else.

Quote from: "Tom Chick"
There's no denying Master of Orion 3 is a complex game. Complexity itself isn't a bad thing, but poorly organized complexity can be the kiss of death. What's worse is poorly organized complexity that serves as a substitute for gameplay. This is exactly what you get with Master of Orion 3, an indecipherable pile of dense self-absorbed data that completely fails to understand why we loved our first MOOs.

Now that is an excellent review of a craptacular game. And as one person said before - it was right about this time when EB stopped taking back games. Thankfully I returned this piece of shit before that happened.

Anyway, back to Civilization. First review is a positive one, so that's a good thing.
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« Reply #34 on: October 23, 2005, 12:51:20 AM »

Quote from: "Luke"
Tom Chick's a solid 8.3 out of 10.  His Presentation is exceptional, but his Lasting Value is questionable.


Luke's Chick review is barely adequate. He doesn't explain why he feels that the presentation deserves the rating that he gives, and discusses inadequate lasting value without any form of explanation . Sorry to say that I can only give Luke's review 4/10.
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« Reply #35 on: October 23, 2005, 12:59:00 AM »

Quote from: "Luke"
Tom Chick's a solid 8.3 out of 10.  His Presentation is exceptional, but his Lasting Value is questionable.


I simply can't imagine a Civ game without lasting value.  It seems as if these two factors should be reversed.  Short on presentation and long on lasting value.  Just my experience from the earlier Civs.
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« Reply #36 on: October 23, 2005, 02:06:46 AM »

My problem with Civ3 was that it just felt...burdensome. Hundreds of units to move, dozens of cities, bazillions of buildings and improvements to be built in every city, and so and so forth. I just got frustrated with it all much quicker than I ever did with Civ2 for some reason.
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« Reply #37 on: October 23, 2005, 02:24:26 AM »

Autobuild smile
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« Reply #38 on: October 23, 2005, 02:28:21 AM »

Quote from: "Luke"
LE is spot on.  Have we not learned anything yet?  IGN tells the gaming masses what they want to hear.  If the game has sufficient hype and IGN perceives that gamers want it to be good, it'll get a 9+.  Course there's always the editor's choice award to tack onto a game they just can't bring themselves to award with a 9+.  

Does IGN care if a game is legitimately good?  No.  Can they even tell if it is?  Doubtful.  As long as the hits keep coming.

Pardon my cynicism, which, for the record, is not directed at anyone in particular, but let's all just be aware of reality here.  We still don't really know if Civ 4 is great or not.  Next week will clarify.


Its Civilization...  It is good.
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« Reply #39 on: October 23, 2005, 04:01:41 AM »

Quote from: "stiffler"
Quote from: "Luke"
Tom Chick's a solid 8.3 out of 10.  His Presentation is exceptional, but his Lasting Value is questionable.


I simply can't imagine a Civ game without lasting value.  It seems as if these two factors should be reversed.  Short on presentation and long on lasting value.  Just my experience from the earlier Civs.
Luke was reviewing Tom Chick himself.  This wasn't Tom Chick's review of Civ4.

Quote from: "Jack Burton"
Its Civilization...  It is good.


It's Master of Orion... it is good.
It's Peter Molyneux... it is good.
It's Deus Ex... it is good.
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