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Author Topic: Final Fantasy XII replay: on PC in high resolution  (Read 10723 times)
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Autistic Angel
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« on: August 14, 2010, 07:29:17 PM »

I've decided I'm going to start replaying Final Fantasy XII.  I started it a couple years ago but got sidetracked by other things before I finished, and it was so long ago that a lot of it will seem pretty new to me.  I know I'm not the only one who has talked about replaying it here so I thought others might be interested.

Thing is, I want to play it on my PC using PCSX2, a Playstation 2 emulator.  I own the actual game and I own a PS2 so I don't see any legal problems doing this.  And there are a couple of upsides:

1. The ability to use "save states" to essentially save anywhere. Yeah this can be cheesed a lot but I tend to use this when things get busy and I'm nowhere near a save point.  When you're ready, you reload the game, reload the save state and you are instantly back where you left off. Pretty sweet!

2. The ability to play in high resolutions. My Core 2 Quad, GeForce 280, 8-GB RAM, Windows 7 system can more than handle emulating a PS2 game.  I decided to set the game to run at 1920x1080 resolution and it looks amazing, but I knocked it down to 1280x720 for the purposes of the attached screenshots.

Pretty nice for a 2006 PS2 game!  And it runs at 60 fps without a hitch.  While the emulator doesn't do great with every PS2 game, it apparently runs Final Fantasy 12 (and also 10 - but that's for another time) perfectly from start to finish.


If you want to play along feel free.  Your PS2 is good enough but if you want, you can download the emulator at the link above.  You'll also need a PS2 BIOS file.  Google is your friend for this.  There's a guide to configure the emulator here.  I'm actually using my wired 360 controller which is connected to my PC.  As for the game, I made an ISO of the original disc using Roxio 9 and that's how I'm playing.


I'm really just plugging along while I'm at work and things are slow, so it'll probably take me a while to make any real progress.  I'm currently just a couple hours in.  People familiar with FF12 know that it's a very, v-e-r-y thinly disguised reimagining of the original Star Wars trilogy, so when I say that I'm still on Tatooine where Luke and Wedge are returning from Toshi Station with the power converter, you'll know how early I am in the story.

So, anyone else up for this?

-Autistic Angel
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metallicorphan
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« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2010, 07:42:26 PM »

it was Biggs who was on Tatooine with Luke(that got cut from the film),Wedge is the X-wing pilot who survives the Death Star,Hoth attack and Death Star II(and is also Ewan McGregors uncle..film fact fans)

Final Fantasy 7 and Final Fantasy 8 both had characters in them called Biggs and Wedge



i have been thinking recently of replaying Final Fantasy 12,even though the story wasn't one of my favourites...but my next FF game will be FF9 playing along side Myto when she starts it
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« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2010, 08:03:02 PM »

Two questions:  can you copy the saves using the USB connector they sold to transfer them to the ps3 and how do the graphics compare to the ps3 upscaling?  I am kind of curious to try this with some of my backlog.   
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« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2010, 08:38:25 PM »

I still think FF12 is the best one of the bunch. I'm tempted to play this via my PC.
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Chaz
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« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2010, 11:17:05 PM »

Tell me it's less complicated to setup than that guide made it out to be.  I'd love to try this since I have a few PS2 games that I want to play, and would love to have them in high res, but that makes it look fairly complicated.
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« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2010, 11:50:54 PM »

I took the defaults during the setup. Not sure if it works yet as the DVD drive is still fubar but the setup is pretty easy.
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Autistic Angel
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« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2010, 12:05:58 AM »

Quote from: Chaz on August 14, 2010, 11:17:05 PM

Tell me it's less complicated to setup than that guide made it out to be.  I'd love to try this since I have a few PS2 games that I want to play, and would love to have them in high res, but that makes it look fairly complicated.


The guide is practically a full manual, delving into subscreens and configuration options you probably won't need to access.  I found it pretty easy to map the Dualshock 2 buttons onto my wired 360 controller, point the program at the .ISO I made, and adjust the video settings to produce the right 16:9 aspect ratio.  The end result is even sharper than the screenshots I took, and it looks *awesome* in motion. nod

Assuming you have Vista or Windows 7, I also highly recommend setting the video renderer to "DirectX 10 Hardware" mode.  It produces much better framerates than the default "DirectX 9 Hardware" mode.

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2010, 12:15:02 AM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 14, 2010, 07:29:17 PM

While the emulator doesn't do great with every PS2 game, it apparently runs Final Fantasy 12 (and also 10 - but that's for another time) perfectly from start to finish...

as always, any hd images of lulu will be appreciated smile ...

&, as always, really hope some developers besides sony get into hd redos of some of their ps2 titles (because, for those (few?) of us without souped-up pcs, that's our only option, unfortunately)...
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« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2010, 12:45:51 AM »

damn those look way better than what i remember originally.
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Chaz
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« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2010, 12:55:43 AM »

Okay, I'm gonna give this a try.  I'm ripping an iso of FF12 now.  We'll see what happens...
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« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2010, 01:08:05 AM »

I actually got PCSX2 set up last week (it's not for the faint of heart believe me) so that I could play MGS2 but unfortunately it ran like crap.  Even my 2009 laptop had trouble running a PS2 game! I wonder if FF12 would be any different.  My problem is the grainy graphics, it's the horrible backwards camera controls.  I wonder if there's any way to fix that on the PC.  Anyways I'm curious to see how my laptop can handle it so I might give it a try as well.
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« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2010, 01:48:24 AM »

Quote from: Canuck on August 15, 2010, 01:08:05 AM

I actually got PCSX2 set up last week (it's not for the faint of heart believe me) so that I could play MGS2 but unfortunately it ran like crap.  Even my 2009 laptop had trouble running a PS2 game! I wonder if FF12 would be any different.

I haven't messed with PCSX2 much, but FFX and FF12 are supposed to be two of the easiest games to get working perfectly. 
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Chaz
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« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2010, 02:06:27 AM »

Okay, configuration took a little fiddling, but I've seen worse.  There have been some updates to the program since that guide was written, I think, so it wasn't exact.  Once I figured out where to set a custom resolution and enable smoothing, it does indeed look fantastic.  I'm going to throw Ico (which apparently might have issues) and Shadow of the Colossus on here to try out.  This might actually get me to finally start playing my PS2 games.
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« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2010, 05:48:21 AM »

I've been successful in getting FFXII to run well (and look fantastic!) on this, but haven't tried messing with Dragon Quest 8 on it yet. Anyone else tried it and have any advice before I start experimenting? biggrin
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Autistic Angel
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« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2010, 01:49:09 PM »

Quote from: Canuck on August 15, 2010, 01:08:05 AM

My problem is the grainy graphics, it's the horrible backwards camera controls.  I wonder if there's any way to fix that on the PC.


Final Fantasy XII has the same backwards camera controls: pushing the stick left rotates the view right, and pushing up angles it down.  I can't find an in-game way to invert it, but PCSX2 lets you manually configure every controller input so I've been very tempted to completely reverse the right stick in the emulator options.

The only drawback is that doing it that way would flip *all* of the right-stick input in the game, whether its controlling the camera or not.  Does anyone know if the right stick in Final Fantasy XII is ever used for anything else?

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2010, 02:28:59 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 15, 2010, 01:49:09 PM

Quote from: Canuck on August 15, 2010, 01:08:05 AM

My problem is the grainy graphics, it's the horrible backwards camera controls.  I wonder if there's any way to fix that on the PC.


Final Fantasy XII has the same backwards camera controls: pushing the stick left rotates the view right, and pushing up angles it down.  I can't find an in-game way to invert it, but PCSX2 lets you manually configure every controller input so I've been very tempted to completely reverse the right stick in the emulator options.

The only drawback is that doing it that way would flip *all* of the right-stick input in the game, whether its controlling the camera or not.  Does anyone know if the right stick in Final Fantasy XII is ever used for anything else?

-Autistic Angel

according to the instruction manual that comes with the game,the right stick is just for moving the camera,in General controls or Battle controls....and pushing down on the right stick(R3)returns the camera to default position behind the character


in usual FF games you can access your ingame menu by pressing Triangle,and in there with items etc..is usually control options,is this not present this time around,or is there just no option in there for the camera invert?
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Autistic Angel
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« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2010, 04:39:39 PM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on August 15, 2010, 02:28:59 PM

in usual FF games you can access your ingame menu by pressing Triangle,and in there with items etc..is usually control options,is this not present this time around,or is there just no option in there for the camera invert?


You can press Triangle to access the Party menu and there's a "Config" menu there, but although there are options to adjust the battle speed and aspect ratio, there's nothing for inverting the camera controls.


Quote from: metallicorphan on August 15, 2010, 02:28:59 PM

according to the instruction manual that comes with the game,the right stick is just for moving the camera,in General controls or Battle controls.


Oh right, the manual! retard  I should have checked that.

In that case, I think I'm going to manually reverse the right-stick bindings in PCSX2.  This zany right-is-left, left-is-right camera has been the biggest technical hurdle so far. icon_razz

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #17 on: August 15, 2010, 05:06:26 PM »

Awesome! I'm going to have to try this out. I never got to finish FF XII before my PS2 bit the dust, but I own the game and enjoyed it quite a bit.
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« Reply #18 on: August 15, 2010, 05:27:58 PM »

Quote from: Chaz on August 15, 2010, 02:06:27 AM

Okay, configuration took a little fiddling, but I've seen worse.  There have been some updates to the program since that guide was written, I think, so it wasn't exact.  Once I figured out where to set a custom resolution and enable smoothing, it does indeed look fantastic.  I'm going to throw Ico (which apparently might have issues) and Shadow of the Colossus on here to try out.

Please let me know if you get SotC running decently.  Cause it runs like total shit on my system, which is a Intel i5-750, Nvidia GTX 275, and 8GB RAM... on Windows 7 64-bit.

FF12 runs totally perfectly at high resolution, rock solid 60fps.  As others have said, it's super easy to get running.  But I don't know what's up with SotC.  One of my favorite games, so let me know Chaz.
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« Reply #19 on: August 15, 2010, 05:35:26 PM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 15, 2010, 04:39:39 PM

Oh right, the manual! retard  I should have checked that.

In that case, I think I'm going to manually reverse the right-stick bindings in PCSX2.  This zany right-is-left, left-is-right camera has been the biggest technical hurdle so far. icon_razz

You can easily change this in PCSX2's pad plugin settings.  It's the first thing I did with FF12, cause that bugs the hell out of me haha.
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« Reply #20 on: August 15, 2010, 05:56:46 PM »

I spent about an hour mucking with SotC and reading through forum posts about it.  Short answer is that it's probably not worth it.  It looks like the vast majority of people have a ton of slowdown and other graphical anomalies, and one of the common fixes is to run at native resolution, which kind of misses the point of the emulation.

One guy's got a custom set of video drivers up for it, but they didn't help me much.  I might mess with it a little bit more, but I think I'm probably done.  I hit a similar roadblock with Ico freezing during an intro cutscene.  It's likely that Team Ico makes use of some unique graphical coding that's difficult to emulate correctly. 

I think my next attempt will be some of the other RPGs I've got hanging around.
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« Reply #21 on: August 15, 2010, 06:15:27 PM »

Quote from: Chaz on August 15, 2010, 05:56:46 PM

I spent about an hour mucking with SotC and reading through forum posts about it.  Short answer is that it's probably not worth it.  It looks like the vast majority of people have a ton of slowdown and other graphical anomalies, and one of the common fixes is to run at native resolution, which kind of misses the point of the emulation.

One guy's got a custom set of video drivers up for it, but they didn't help me much.  I might mess with it a little bit more, but I think I'm probably done.  I hit a similar roadblock with Ico freezing during an intro cutscene.  It's likely that Team Ico makes use of some unique graphical coding that's difficult to emulate correctly. 

Yeah that's what I figured, too bad.  Why does it have to be one of my favorite PS2 games, haha.

I only installed PCSX2 last night for the first time, and so far FF12 and Rogue Galaxy work fine.  Looks great with the improved resolutions of the PC emulation.
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« Reply #22 on: August 15, 2010, 06:31:36 PM »

that emulator doesn't save my settings. i have to reconfig it everytime.

how do i stop that.
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« Reply #23 on: August 15, 2010, 06:34:14 PM »

What settings are people using for FF12?  I'm playing, but can't help think it might look better.
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« Reply #24 on: August 15, 2010, 06:47:52 PM »

I had no idea that PS2 emulation had come that far. That's crazy.

Too bad that game compatibility is (apparently) low. It looks a ton better than what the PS3 can do.
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« Reply #25 on: August 15, 2010, 06:56:39 PM »

Quote from: El-Producto on August 15, 2010, 06:34:14 PM

What settings are people using for FF12?  I'm playing, but can't help think it might look better.

The big two I did to get it looking better were setting the resolution in the graphics plugin to 1680x1050 and turning on texture smoothing.  There's another setting that looks like it would be the resolution setting, but it just controls the window size.  The setting you want defaults to 1024x1024, I think.  I believe I just left everything else at defaults for FF12.
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« Reply #26 on: August 15, 2010, 07:35:46 PM »

There's one more tweak I made.

"Texture Filtering" seems to have three possible settings: empty, a blue square, and a check mark.  I've found that the check mark gives the best results in Final Fantasy XII, greatly improving the look of the text and other 2D icons in the game.  The slight text blockiness seen in the screenshots I posted isn't really apparent at the higher resolution I've been playing at.

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #27 on: August 16, 2010, 01:46:25 AM »

You were killing me until I saw this:

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 14, 2010, 07:29:17 PM

-Autistic Angel
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I kept thinking "This sounds like something I wrote..."

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« Reply #28 on: August 16, 2010, 04:11:22 AM »

Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 15, 2010, 07:35:46 PM

There's one more tweak I made.

"Texture Filtering" seems to have three possible settings: empty, a blue square, and a check mark.  I've found that the check mark gives the best results in Final Fantasy XII, greatly improving the look of the text and other 2D icons in the game.  The slight text blockiness seen in the screenshots I posted isn't really apparent at the higher resolution I've been playing at.

Oh wow this is a good tip.  The check mark definitely makes 2D text look a lot better.  I wonder why the blue square is the default setting.
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« Reply #29 on: August 16, 2010, 12:45:51 PM »

OMG actually being able to control the camera properly (not backwards) makes this game a joy to play!!!
I'll try that texture filtering option.  How do you get the game to play full screen and not windowed?  I dont want to be looking at my Windows start bar while I'm playing.
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Autistic Angel
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« Reply #30 on: August 16, 2010, 02:10:02 PM »

Alt-Enter will toggle it between full screen and windowed mode.  If you're in full screen, tapping Esc will suspend the game and bring you back out to the console.

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #31 on: August 16, 2010, 03:59:41 PM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on August 14, 2010, 07:42:26 PM

i have been thinking recently of replaying Final Fantasy 12,even though the story wasn't one of my favourites...but my next FF game will be FF9 playing along side Myto when she starts it

Which will be fairly soon - almost done with Nier!

I loved FFXII, but wasn't quite able to go to the end with it, despite playing it for - literally - hundreds of hours.  That area near the end that had no map was extremely painful for me, ugh.  I managed to get through it once, but then had to go back to it and quit due to frustration.  Also, I like good graphics, but I thought I played FFXII on my 360, lol, so I apparently didn't mind the graphics at all.  It will still be fun to follow this thread, though I doubt it will provide me with enough FFXII nostalgia to draw me back.

Have fun!

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« Reply #32 on: August 16, 2010, 04:09:36 PM »

the best thing about FF12 was that the levelling up was so enjoyable...with all the gambits selected for everyone i would just be walking up to enemies and hardly needed to do anything....i got well over powered as i must of spent hours grinding,for no other reason than because i was enjoying levelling up in a FF game(which pretty much never happens),the end boss was probably the easiest FF end boss ever

oh and i got that Spear as well...that only appears near to the end of that game if you avoid certain treasures throughout the game...if you avoid them,instead of taking them then you get the spear which equals to 'Hot Knife through Butter' when fighting
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« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2010, 12:45:20 AM »

Unfortunately I'm not getting very good performance during the battles.  I don't know if that's because of the changes I made because I made them before I got into the actual gameplay. It could be that emulation is just a little too demanding for my little desktop.
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« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2010, 10:55:00 PM »

I downloaded the program...got everything configured and setup...and then realized my only copy of FF12 is a sealed CE version sitting on my shelf.  Oh well, maybe I can find a cheap copy at GS smile
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« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2010, 11:49:24 PM »

I had a chance to play a little further today, getting to the point that you meet up with Han, Chewie, and Leia.  That's also the point where the Gambit system unlocks.  I've currently set Luke to "Steal" from the nearest enemy, but I don't yet know if there's a way to make him choose a new target or start attacking after a successful pickpocket.  Maybe that's something I can buy from the Gambit dealer later....

-Autistic Angel
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« Reply #36 on: August 18, 2010, 07:51:53 PM »

Quote from: ericb on August 17, 2010, 10:55:00 PM

I downloaded the program...got everything configured and setup...and then realized my only copy of FF12 is a sealed CE version sitting on my shelf.  Oh well, maybe I can find a cheap copy at GS smile

Why can't you open it?  Am I missing something...
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« Reply #37 on: August 18, 2010, 10:46:29 PM »

Quote from: Canuck on August 17, 2010, 12:45:20 AM

Unfortunately I'm not getting very good performance during the battles.  I don't know if that's because of the changes I made because I made them before I got into the actual gameplay. It could be that emulation is just a little too demanding for my little desktop.


Strangely enough, some of the Party screen menus seem to cause the greatest performance drops for me.  I think it's because it's still actively rendering the frosted-window game view in the background, but maybe it has to do with how it handles the all the text and icon bits.  Even then, the music just sort of warbles a bit so it isn't a big deal.


Quote from: Autistic Angel on August 17, 2010, 11:49:24 PM

I've currently set Luke to "Steal" from the nearest enemy, but I don't yet know if there's a way to make him choose a new target or start attacking after a successful pickpocket.  Maybe that's something I can buy from the Gambit dealer later....


Oh, I remembered the Gambit I want.  If I set him to "Enemy HP = 100% -> Steal", then he'll try only try to pickpocket enemies who haven't been hit yet before shifting over to attacks.  That Steal ability has been extremely useful so far: he's constantly nabbing extra potions, phoenix downs, and loot for unlocking bazaar goods. thumbsup

I'm about 5-hours in now, playing through the part where Luke, Chewie, and Han have to rescue Leia from the stormtroopers and escape.

Is there a place in the menus that describe attack speed modifiers?  For example, aside from looking, is there a stat someplace that shows me how equipping a shield or heavy armor affects how quickly that action bar fills up?

-Autistic Angel
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