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Author Topic: ESPN Football - no more?!?!?  (Read 7545 times)
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Dimmona
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« on: December 13, 2004, 10:45:49 PM »

EA can eat a giant BAG OF HELL
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Zarkon
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« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2004, 10:57:32 PM »

Oh my god.   :shock:  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:

You have to know that Sega, Sony, Microsoft, ESPN, and Take Two are having conniptions right about now.
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« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2004, 11:05:19 PM »

Well, even though I love the hell out of ESPN NFL this year...if it can't have real players, teams, stadiums, etc...wow.  Just wow.  EA is mean.
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AgtFox
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« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2004, 11:11:59 PM »

This was rumored earlier this year when the $1 billion or whatever was thrown around for NFLPA exclusivity.  Looks like EA actually went and did it, kind of shocking, but this is obviously one way to put Sega out to pasture in the realm of football.

Moral of the story: don't screw with EA because they'll screw you in the end (lowballing of price this year).
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shon
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« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2004, 11:19:09 PM »

This shouldn't be legal isn't this a monopoly.  This is just wrong for any company.
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AgtFox
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« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2004, 11:24:56 PM »

Quote from: "shon"
This shouldn't be legal isn't this a monopoly.  This is just wrong for any company.

Well, they're buying the exclusivity for the licenses outright for 5 years, I'm not sure that's a monopoly.  It's not like EA is buying the NFL and NFLPA.

I believe in the Genesis/SNES days someone owned some license as well (could have been EA) for one sport and the other game makers had to make up fake names.  I forget what it was though, but I seem to remember that.
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Jancelot
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« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2004, 11:31:58 PM »

That sucks taint.  I do like Madden, but having no competition is not good at all.  Hello stagnation!
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angrycoder
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« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2004, 11:39:47 PM »

Kind of makes it hard to "Challenge Everything" when you have no competition.
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Devil
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« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2004, 11:41:19 PM »

That sucks but...

We'll download rosters next year from some fan sites for ESPN. I'm sure Sega is going to make it VERY easy to do.
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« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2004, 11:58:12 PM »

Quote from: "Devil"
We'll download rosters next year from some fan sites for ESPN. I'm sure Sega is going to make it VERY easy to do.

Well, EA has the online exclusivity too...so you won't be playing online with licensed players if you'll be able to play online at all.
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« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2004, 12:00:49 AM »

Exclusivity deals aren't retroactive if my brain is working right. ESPN has paid the rights for 2k5 to have real players and the NFL etc. and who's to say that the new rosters didn't come from a "fan"


Eitherway, it stinks, it's only Madden for the next five years.
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« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2004, 12:30:30 AM »

Wow... brilliant move by EA.  Absolutely pwn the competition in a way they can't pwn you: with money.

I gotta say I'm impressed, whoever's running the ship at EA nowadays knows what they're doing.

gellar
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Chaz
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« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2004, 12:33:48 AM »

EA can bite my fat, hairy ass.

Man, that's the last straw for me.  I'm officially ending my purchasing of any and all EA products.  I know in the end it won't make a difference, but at least it'll make me feel better.

I just hope that this doesn't completely knock Sega out of the race. Of course, I know that it will, but I still hate it.  Lord, I love how this country revolves around money.  If you've got it, you'll win.
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Devil
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« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2004, 01:12:28 AM »

Quote
Lord, I love how this country revolves around money. If you've got it, you'll win.


That's a funny comment.  I know Sega's goal was only to make the world a better place.  :wink:
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2004, 01:17:09 AM »

EA's not necessarily the bad guy here (or at least not more than normal).  According to Gamespot, this was the NFL's idea and at least five companies were in a bidding war for the license, presumably including Sega.  I'm sure this announcement is not coming as a surprise to Sega, MS, and any others involved.  While it can't be good for EA to have the exclusivity they were just doing what any responsible company would do in bidding.
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Mike T
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« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2004, 01:29:55 AM »

Quote
This shouldn't be legal isn't this a monopoly.


No, it's not.  It's a licensing deal, and as the NFL owns the rights to their franchises, etc. they can choose to license or not license to whom they please.

Quote
We'll download rosters next year from some fan sites for ESPN. I'm sure Sega is going to make it VERY easy to do.


Except you'll be playing in fictional stadiums for fictional teams.  Further little bits of chrome such as the halftime show and the crib are down the toilet.

This deal is bad for the consumer all the way around.
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Devil
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« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2004, 01:35:00 AM »

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Except you'll be playing in fictional stadiums for fictional teams. Further little bits of chrome such as the halftime show and the crib are down the toilet.


Not if it goes like I think it could. Sega's game will now allow for "user made" rosters and MS/Sony would need to allow them to be used online. Seems like a way to get around this.

It's EXACTLY what happens in most college sports games where fan sites create 'real' downloadable rosters. The only issue was that you couldn't use them online. MS/Sony might be more willing to let this happen now that they lost the bidding...
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gellar
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« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2004, 01:38:51 AM »

Quote from: "Devil"
Quote
Except you'll be playing in fictional stadiums for fictional teams. Further little bits of chrome such as the halftime show and the crib are down the toilet.


Not if it goes like I think it could. Sega's game will now allow for "user made" rosters and MS/Sony would need to allow them to be used online. Seems like a way to get around this.

It's EXACTLY what happens in most college sports games where fan sites create 'real' downloadable rosters. The only issue was that you couldn't use them online. MS/Sony might be more willing to let this happen now that they lost the bidding...


Either that or Sega takes the engine and asks the NCAA if they can play there.

Either option = not enough sales, IMHO.  Sega ain't in good shape right now.

gellar
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Greggy_D
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« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2004, 02:02:05 AM »

This news is total fucking bullshit.
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sclick
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« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2004, 02:03:58 AM »

This sucks.

I loved ESPN NFL 2k4, and the $20 price-point made me REALLY love ESPN NFL 2k5. I Also appciated the fact that the graphics were optimized for the Xbox, rather than supporting the lowest common denominator. The gameplay, for me, ran circles around anything in Madden.

I doubt fictional teams/stadiums would be a solution. The "Chrome" of NFL 2k4 is all tied to the ESPN license, and downloadable rosters are going to leave us without audible player names, team names, etc. Sure .. it can probably work, but it would be like playing something out of 1995. I doubt Sega would even bother. Also, there are plenty of people who don't have Xbox live and wouldn't have an option to download "real" rosters.

The villain in this story is the NFL, who aren't concerned with giving the fans a choice.

If Sega puts out an NCAA game, I'm there. If not, maybe their MLB game will improve.
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« Reply #20 on: December 14, 2004, 02:11:58 AM »

Hmm.. time for the United Football Organization, or UFO, featuring the New England Minutemen, the Baltimore Sparrows, Green Bay Butchers, Minnesota Norsemen, Cincinatti Leopards, Tampa Bay Privateers, Miami Swordfish, Buffalo Rustlers, Atlanta Shrikes, Cleveland Blues, Chicago Grizzlies, Denver Mustangs, Dallas Lawmen, Houston Alamos, Detroit Cheetahs, Indianapolis Stallions, Jacksonville Ocelots, Kansas City Mohawks, New Orleans Devils, New York Cyclops, San Francisco 3006's, Oakland Burglars, Seattle Seagulls, Pittsburgh Blacksmiths, St. Louis Billy Goats, San Diego Sparks, Tennessee Colossus', and Washington Warriors.

  biggrin
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Dimmona
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« Reply #21 on: December 14, 2004, 02:27:34 AM »

While license exclusivity is nothing new (look at THQ's wrestling games), football games are such a huge sub-genre that this is really gonna hurt.  ESPN Football isn't the only football game out there either.  Seeing how ESPN Football has been my favorite series of the last 4 years, I am pretty much enraged.

FUEA.
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Mike T
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« Reply #22 on: December 14, 2004, 03:14:21 AM »

Quote
Not if it goes like I think it could. Sega's game will now allow for "user made" rosters and MS/Sony would need to allow them to be used online. Seems like a way to get around this.


You're missing my point.  The rosters are a non-issue, though I can see the NFLPA jealously guarding its property rights and going after sharers who don't pay licensing fees.

The problem is you're going to have a lot of fictional stadiusm, and ALL of hte the teams are going to be fictional.   And, I suppose theoretically ESPN/Sega could make their code availlable for XBOX users to create user mods of stadiums and uniforms, but I don't think a) users care enough to do it when they can just buy Madden; b) it's a good enough business model for Sega to justify it.
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Gratch
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« Reply #23 on: December 14, 2004, 03:28:43 AM »

This is very bad for the gamer in the long term.  With no competition, Madden has no incentive to do anything to improve their games year in and year out.  They can now release a game full of bugs, a game with the most pathetic AI, a game with totally lackluster presentation...and you will have no choice but to buy it if you want NFL football.  Not that I think EA won't put effort into next year's version, but they have no incentive at all to make it the absolute best it can be.  That's not a good thing at all.

And those of us who don't like Madden and don't have X-Box Live (assuming ESPN makes a game with dowloable rosters) are pretty much screwed.  Guess I won't be playing any football games for the next 5 years.  frown
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« Reply #24 on: December 14, 2004, 04:06:34 AM »

Mike T, this still has no effect on NFL 2k5, people could effectively keep updating the rosters and keep playing the game. Yeah, sure it sucks that you don't get a new game or any new features, but if you like the gameplay better, then 2k5 is it for the next 5 years.
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Dimmona
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« Reply #25 on: December 14, 2004, 04:13:39 AM »

I think ESPN should go for the 'ultimate customizable football game route'.  Like replace every single reference to the NFL, stadium, players,etc. with made up names, but allow the user a nice built-in utility where they can point to an IP address and download new rosters/stadiums/football league names at the click of a button.

There has to be some easy way to get around the legal issues and still get us our licensed player names :-)   Anybody remember the bad-assness that was Front Page Sports Football?  They did the same thing...
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« Reply #26 on: December 14, 2004, 04:23:33 AM »

Quote
You're missing my point. The rosters are a non-issue, though I can see the NFLPA jealously guarding its property rights and going after sharers who don't pay licensing fees.

The problem is you're going to have a lot of fictional stadiusm, and ALL of hte the teams are going to be fictional. And, I suppose theoretically ESPN/Sega could make their code availlable for XBOX users to create user mods of stadiums and uniforms, but I don't think a) users care enough to do it when they can just buy Madden; b) it's a good enough business model for Sega to justify it.


Mike - Let me present it to you in a way that Sega/MS/Sony could:

ESPN Football 2K6 ALL NEW FEATURES:

-Create a League: The ability to create a whole new league! Allows users to create their own league from city to team names right down to stadiums.
-Expanded Create A Player: Change names/attributes of every player in the league!
-PC Link (Cable Included): Download Software from Sega.Com for easy league and roster creation and then connect your X-Box/PS2 right to your PC and download everything!
-Custom Online Rosters: Take everything you've made online! Play with your newly created teams and players against people from around the world!!

If you don't think someone at Operation Sports won't have new NFL rosters available about a day after the game is out, then you haven't seen that site.

The only real change would be to allow people to use their rosters/teams online. Everythig else is in place already. Flying Finn's NHL Updater is a working example!

Either Sega does this or, it's over. More likely that it's over but it can be done!
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« Reply #27 on: December 14, 2004, 05:40:05 AM »

Rumors are already swirling that EA is on the hunt for the NBA and MLB licenses as well.  Watch out...EA is about to own all the major sports.

Also in this IGN Article it seems Midway already has a non-licensed football game in development called Blitz: Playmakers.  They've evidently hired one of the writers for the now cancelled ESPN television show.  They plan to show everything the NFL doesn't want you to see (like drug use).  Yeah, that sounds like a winner...although I did like the Playmakers show.

It also sounds to me like the NFL and NFLPA wanted an exclusivity deal and it was bid out.  Best guess is EA was not the only company to bid on the exclusivity...they just put the biggest dollar figure down or the NFL/NFLPA saw them as the best company to further their licenses through.
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Dimmona
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« Reply #28 on: December 14, 2004, 07:10:35 AM »

The Midway game sounds awesome.  Maybe it'll be just like Narc, only for the end boss you can square off against Lawrence Taylor.
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« Reply #29 on: December 14, 2004, 01:01:27 PM »

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« Reply #30 on: December 14, 2004, 01:23:05 PM »

This is absolutely insane.

I am speechless.

Oh wait.... something is on the tip of my tongue...



FUCK YOU EA SPORTS
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« Reply #31 on: December 14, 2004, 02:24:18 PM »

Everyone pissed about this just should NOT buy a copy of Madden next year, or any EA Sports game.  I'm not buying this or NCAA next year.
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« Reply #32 on: December 14, 2004, 02:47:24 PM »

Let's play a little role reversal here.  Supposedly the NFL and NFLPA put out the request for bids and 5 companies bid on the exclusivity.  You can guess the companies:

EA
Sony
Microsoft
Midway
Sega/Take Two

Would you guys be reacting the same way if one of the other 4 got the exclusive deal and not EA?  I have a feeling you wouldn't, but I could be wrong.  Most of you would probably be glad if Sega/Take Two got it, but what about the others?
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« Reply #33 on: December 14, 2004, 02:51:52 PM »

This freaking sucks.  Worst news I've heard in a long time.

I won't pay a dime for EA Football.  Not a dime.

See sig...
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« Reply #34 on: December 14, 2004, 03:19:51 PM »

I can't begin to express how upset this news makes me.  *sigh*
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« Reply #35 on: December 14, 2004, 03:20:31 PM »

No Fox.....I wouldn't feel the same way if Sega/VC got the deal.  I would be happy.
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« Reply #36 on: December 14, 2004, 03:53:08 PM »

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« Reply #37 on: December 14, 2004, 04:04:46 PM »

A.F. - You are correct, at least in regards to my sentiments.

If Sega would have won the contract, I would not be upset.  But that is because Sega's game is only about 6 billion times better than EA's.

Maybe I'm not totally fair about the way I think, but I am honest.

This whole thing blows.  Seriously.  It blows big time.

To all my fellow ESPN 2k friends.... be glad 2k5 was so well done, cause it is going to have to last us a pretty long fucking time.

LD
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Devil
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« Reply #38 on: December 14, 2004, 04:07:32 PM »

Next question for me is will EA start charging $75-$100 for the game?  They could probably do it and I wouldn't be shocked.
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« Reply #39 on: December 14, 2004, 04:14:20 PM »

Quote from: "Devil"
Next question for me is will EA start charging $75-$100 for the game?  They could probably do it and I wouldn't be shocked.

I wouldn't be shocked, but they may have a bit of backlash if they did that.  Even die-hard Madden fans might not pony up the money for it unless sports games is all they play.

The other interesting part of this that has not come out in the press (other than right before Madden 2005 came out) is that as far as I know EA has not re-signed Madden (contract ran out with 2005) and the game next year, if Madden is not signed, may be named something totally different.
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