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Author Topic: C&C DRM question  (Read 1159 times)
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Punisher
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« on: March 15, 2010, 12:13:54 PM »

I'm sure it's been answered, but I can't find it.... Does anyone know what is the DRM for C&C 4 is?
I saw this on Steam:
Online Disclaimer
PERSISTENT INTERNET CONNECTION,

and I'm now worried that it is similiar to Ubisuck's DRM and I wont be able to play......
Anyone know the extent of it?
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Razgon
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« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2010, 12:25:58 PM »

mostly wrong stuff
« Last Edit: March 15, 2010, 12:49:07 PM by Razgon » Logged

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Thin_J
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« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2010, 12:40:25 PM »

First thing's first: it is not Ubisoft's new DRMhell. It's not even an Ubisoft game. The game's published by EA, developed by an EA owned studio.

The "DRM" as it's being called with C&C4, isn't really DRM. The issue is that your player profile is stored server side, much like it is with Bad Company 2 or other multiplayer games. The designers have made your singleplayer profile the same as your multiplayer profile. It's less that it's DRM and more that game design decisions they've made have limited what the player can do with the singleplayer.

If you don't like it that's fine, but this isn't quite the same thing as what Ubi's doing with Assassin's Creed and Silent Hunter. It just isn't.

There is an issue here but it's seperate from the DRM issue. It's a problem of game design. People can't seem to get past taht with this one. If you've followed the marketing and listened to what the developers are saying, C&C4 is a multiplayer game first, and it happens to have a singleplayer side, and your player profile is shared between the two. It may or may not function like Bad Company 2, where you can still play the singleplayer without being online, or not. I don't know that anyone has said for sure one way or the other. Based on their descriptions of how the player profile functions though, I'm not sure you'd want to play C&C4 while you were offline. I suspect not having access to your normal player profile kind of breaks a lot of their game design ideas.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2010, 12:49:04 PM by Thin_J » Logged

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Razgon
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« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2010, 12:45:49 PM »

oh! Thanks, I actually didnt know that - live and learn :-)
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Thin_J
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« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2010, 12:51:47 PM »

Well, you're not wrong Raz, it's just that there's a different reason that this game requires an online connection, and if you listen to the people actually making a game it sounds like that reason is related to how they've made the game.

I initially tried and failed to make that point, but I think after the edit what I'm trying to say is a little more clear.

I do think we'd be kidding ourselves if we didn't think they were influenced by publisher pressure to come up with a way to excuse such an approach, but I don't think we'll ever really know for sure exactly how true that might be.
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« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2010, 12:58:06 PM »

Quote from: Thin_J on March 15, 2010, 12:40:25 PM

The "DRM" as it's being called with C&C4, isn't really DRM.

Yeah, that's the ticket.

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Thin_J
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« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2010, 01:05:43 PM »

I sort of gave you that one, I guess.

Well played.

But I think I covered that in the second post.
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Punisher
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« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2010, 01:53:43 AM »

Well, my main concern is with Single Player and if I need an always on connection for that or if it will drop me.

Hopefully, someone finds out...
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Thin_J
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« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2010, 01:58:41 AM »

Quote from: Punisher on March 16, 2010, 01:53:43 AM

Well, my main concern is with Single Player and if I need an always on connection for that or if it will drop me.

Hopefully, someone finds out...

Soon as I see a definite one way or the other I'll post back. Could be as early as tomorrow if I cave and buy it myself.

If I do I'll test it for you myself.
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Punisher
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« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2010, 12:42:56 PM »

Thanks.... I am mostly interested in the storyline to see how it ends.... Worst case scenerio, someone will probably post the entire story on You Tube at some point... If the DRM is acceptable to me, I'll buy it though to play through....
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Thin_J
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« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2010, 07:35:44 PM »

I'm out. I found out there's no real resource model in the game today. So this isn't C&C, it's World in Conflict with Kane videos in between.

I didn't really enjoy World in Conflict. I'll be passing now.
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Punisher
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« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2010, 01:13:56 AM »

Quote from: Thin_J on March 16, 2010, 07:35:44 PM

I'm out. I found out there's no real resource model in the game today. So this isn't C&C, it's World in Conflict with Kane videos in between.

I didn't really enjoy World in Conflict. I'll be passing now.

But I was counting on you to be my guinea pig!!! What will I do now?!?!?  paranoid
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Victoria Raverna
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« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2010, 01:25:35 AM »

Boycott C&C if we don't want the always online DRM to be a norm. Don't be fooled by EA, it is pretty much the same DRM like the stupid Ubisoft one.
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Thin_J
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« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2010, 07:14:15 AM »

Quote from: Punisher on March 17, 2010, 01:13:56 AM

But I was counting on you to be my guinea pig!!! What will I do now?!?!?  paranoid

Yeah, sorry, but $50 is too much for a game that sounds like it has absolutely nothing in common with the predecessors in the series. I was in it mostly to see how the Kane story ends, but as others have suggested I think I'll just watch all the videos on Youtube and pretend I played it instead.
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Punisher
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« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2010, 12:42:44 PM »

Quote from: Thin_J on March 17, 2010, 07:14:15 AM

Quote from: Punisher on March 17, 2010, 01:13:56 AM

But I was counting on you to be my guinea pig!!! What will I do now?!?!?  paranoid

Yeah, sorry, but $50 is too much for a game that sounds like it has absolutely nothing in common with the predecessors in the series. I was in it mostly to see how the Kane story ends, but as others have suggested I think I'll just watch all the videos on Youtube and pretend I played it instead.

You Tube don't fail us now!!!
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ROTC1983
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« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2010, 10:23:00 AM »

So, I actually preordered the game via Impulse.  Let me tell you:  This game has nothing to do with Command and Conquer gameplay...the only thing left are the FMVs.  I am hoping that the game gets better later on down the road...but so far, it doesn't look like it is.  Also, it seems that some of the solo missions require you find someone to do coop because it makes the mission easier.  With a cap of 50 command points (most units take around 6 a piece), you army is spread pretty thin. 

Well, if anyone has any questions, please let me know...the DRM scheme certainly doesn't help it.  What in the hell where they thinking?  finger
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« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2010, 12:43:58 PM »

Quote from: ROTC1983 on March 18, 2010, 10:23:00 AM

Well, if anyone has any questions, please let me know...the DRM scheme certainly doesn't help it.  What in the hell where they thinking?  finger

That people would still buy it... slywink
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« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2010, 02:12:37 PM »

I found this post about the DRM:

Quote
First thing to be clear about, Command & Conquer 4 has NO DRM. Zip, zero, zilch, none. We already made this clear.

Second, you do not need the disc in the machine to play Command & Conquer 4, however the following is how it works:

-AFTER you install Command & Conquer 4 with the disc on your machine, when you try to LOGIN at the Launcher for the first time, it will ask you for your serial key. You will enter in your serial key to activate your Master EA Account. The serial key, like in our past games, can only be activated for 1 master account. You cannot install multiple EA Master accounts on one serial key. You can create multiple Commander Personas however, so if you and your brothers each want your own Persona account with experience, etc, you can do that. Just has to be under the same Master EA account as in our past games.

-You can install the game from the disc as many times as you want on any machine. Re-install, etc.

-You do not need the disc in your machine to play. Your EA account just needs to have been activated by your serial key. After that, you can play Command & Conquer 4 on ANY MACHINE that has it installed. All you need to do is login.

-To play Command & Conquer 4, the computer needs to be connected to the internet. We've always made that clear as well.

But...being connected to the 'net IS DRM. And from what little I've read from said link, the DRM is EXACTLY like ACII.
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« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2010, 03:50:39 PM »

Quote from: Destructor on March 18, 2010, 02:12:37 PM

But...being connected to the 'net IS DRM. And from what little I've read from said link, the DRM is EXACTLY like ACII.

Yeah, it certainly sounds that way to me too.  Ah well, I wasn't planning to buy this game anyway.  But now I'm definitely not buying it!  Have some of that, EA!
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« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2010, 04:10:28 PM »

well, on the bright side this means i save 50 bucks this month...
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« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2010, 04:50:21 PM »

Quote
First thing to be clear about, Command & Conquer 4 has NO DRM. Zip, zero, zilch, none. We already made this clear.

Absolutely amazing.
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Victoria Raverna
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« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2010, 10:14:48 AM »

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=239583

Quote
Once it's been disconnected, it doesn't seem to make any attempt to reconnect. That means even a momentary interruption to your connection kills your session completely: everything you do from then on is pointless.

The only way to avoid losing progress is to save your game the moment you get that message, quit out, then start it again. Otherwise, you won't be connected to EA's servers even if you're connected to the internet, and finishing any mission will erase all your progress.

We've already seen with Ubisoft's authentication servers that your own internet connection is not the only requirement with these systems: the publisher's servers have to be up and working too, and this is by no means guaranteed. Now, if your connection to EA's servers is lost even for a moment, everything you do from then on is a waste of time. You have to quit the game and restart it to even attempt to reconnect.

It gets worse.

EA have previously shut down the multiplayer servers for 78 of their games, sometimes barely more than a year after release. On Tuesday, they shut down all servers for PC games Mercenaries 2 and Lord of the Rings: Conquest, which only came out last year. Naturally we contacted EA to ask how long they intended to keep the servers for C&C 4 online, but have received no response.

All the while, EA's Command & Conquer Community Manager is claiming "Command & Conquer 4 has NO DRM" on their forums. This is seemingly by some new definition of digital rights management, in which systems that restrict your ability to play don't count.
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« Reply #22 on: March 19, 2010, 10:29:12 AM »

Quote from: Victoria Raverna on March 19, 2010, 10:14:48 AM

All the while, EA's Command & Conquer Community Manager is claiming "Command & Conquer 4 has NO DRM" on their forums.

EA's Command & Conquer Community Manager is a fucking twat, then.

Isn't this the last game of the series?  I'm glad I never bothered with any of them; I'd be bursting a blood vessel that I didn't get to see the conclusion.
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« Reply #23 on: March 19, 2010, 01:24:00 PM »

It doesn't even try to reconnect if it gets disconnected? Holy mother of fuck. The pirating community will have a hayday knocking them offline then too just like they did to Ubisoft.

EDIT: And the gameplay is a load of crap now according to reviews. From GameSpy (2.5/5 stars):

Quote
Okay, details. First thing you need to know is that EA Los Angeles (EALA) has taken the long-running real-time strategy series in a completely new direction: The base-building, resource-harvesting, tank-rushing model -- once the hallmark for RTS worldwide -- is totally dropped here. C&C4 replaces the venerable gather-and-build system with a little piece of just about every other significant RTS of the last few years; the majority of the gameplay is now rather unabashedly ripped off of Massive Entertainment's World in Conflict, while the capture-and-hold scoring system is somewhat more abashedly ripped off from Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War II, and the new UI (no more sidebar interface) is re-purposed from EA's own C&C: Generals series.

...

In other words, straight fights in C&C4 play a lot like a boxing match between two guys with iron jaws and teensy weensy hands. You and your opponent can pound away at each other till you're both spent like an addict's last dollar, but nobody's knocking anybody out.

And the random forum posters say the story for C&C4 blows as well. Not a good ending at all.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2010, 01:36:29 PM by Destructor » Logged

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« Reply #24 on: March 19, 2010, 05:52:58 PM »

Yeah, I am definitely not liking the game.  What a pile of rubbish and a horrible way to for the C&C IP to retire frown
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« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2010, 12:19:27 AM »

Glad I started this thread.... Looks like I saved myself some lost money.... Juts have to wait for YouTube to catch up and watch the videos... good or bad, I think I'd like to see the ending, even if they killed the game. I was looking forward to it, but with there "no DRM here" and the gameplay changes, it's not happening...
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« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2010, 10:29:06 PM »

Interesting that EA decided to go this way with the last entry in the series. The negative publicity that's surrounding the game due to the studio closure, leads me to believe that this may be the poorest selling C&C in some time. If sales are bad it seems likely there won't be nearly as many playing it online, so why make online profiles mandatory?
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« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2010, 11:13:24 PM »

Well the ending is up on Youtube.  Even though it's not completely successful I like what they were trying to do with the storyline but judging by the other comments I'm in the minority. 

Spoilers obviously

Spoiler for Hiden:
The storyline works best if you go by the hints throughout the series that Kane is the original Cain from genesis.  He's been alive for a very long time and every time he is killed he is just regenerated as punishment.  The whole purpose of the C&C series has been his attempts to break the cycle.  Basically he's tired of living on earth.  The Brotherhood of Nod was just a means to an end to "transcend" and every time GDI defeated him it resulted in him seeking more desperate measures. 

In the GDI ending Kane tells the protagonist that even if he is killed he will just come back over and over to raise an army, repeating the cycle of endless war on earth.

In the Nod ending Kane seems almost sad when he tells the protagonist that "You were too fragile.  You're all (humanity) so fragile." 
« Last Edit: March 22, 2010, 11:18:41 PM by Lordnine » Logged
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« Reply #28 on: March 27, 2010, 02:52:17 AM »

Is shooting down the General's airship even possible? I can't do it on easy. I need all the anti air i can get yet I get attacked by ground units ahead of the airship. If I build ground units to take care of them then I cannot pump out enough antiair to kill her ship. EASY..easy...god I must be old fer sure.
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