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Author Topic: [PC] Wasteland 2  (Read 5037 times)
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Turtle
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« Reply #80 on: September 19, 2014, 01:26:20 PM »

Actually, neither Divinity OS, or Wasteland 2 had any funding except the kickstarter and investors after the fact.

Both games couldn't get funding because the devs wanted to do things that publishers considered unprofitable. Things like turn based combat, or top down perspectives, and PC only development.

Anyway, this is a treat, I haven't really watched, read, or played anything except for the earliest previews during the kickstarter. Nice to go into a game blind these days.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 01:33:05 PM by Turtle » Logged
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« Reply #81 on: September 19, 2014, 02:45:45 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on September 19, 2014, 01:26:20 PM

Anyway, this is a treat, I haven't really watched, read, or played anything except for the earliest previews during the kickstarter. Nice to go into a game blind these days.
That's how I feel too.  I'm looking forward to going into the game for the first time.  I was really tempted to use my backer beta access, but I held strong. 
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Blackjack
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« Reply #82 on: September 19, 2014, 02:59:15 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on September 19, 2014, 01:26:20 PM

Actually, neither Divinity OS, or Wasteland 2 had any funding except the kickstarter and investors after the fact.

Both games couldn't get funding because the devs wanted to do things that publishers considered unprofitable. Things like turn based combat, or top down perspectives, and PC only development.
Mmmm.... per Divinity OS' Kickstarter page:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/larianstudios/divinity-original-sin
Quote
Why Come to Kickstarter?
We want to increase the development budget so we can increase the size of our development team. This in turn will allow us to further increase the amount of gameplay in our game world. We are convinced that we are very close to making a great RPG and we want to rise to the occasion by investing everything we can into it.

So far the game has been funded by investors and by our own funds, but we have reached the limit of what we can do on our own. Here's where your help  becomes very valuable. Here's where you can make the difference.

Without your support, we think the result of our efforts will make a good RPG, but with a bigger budget we'll be able to go the extra mile, and accomplish our full vision for the game, as fantastic as it deserves to be.  
I only pointed out because here and there people chafe that Wasteland 2 (crowd funding only) doesn't look as spiffy as Divinity: OS (crowd funding to make a base game great, one might say) though I don't know that's the reason per se.
======

*Some early reviews (PC Gamer for one) suggest the post Early Access content (California) is buggy and has more problems cropping up than the Early Access region (Arizona) which obviously had a lot more folks kicking the tires.

So folks who REALLY wanna wait until it's "done" might need to wait for some hotfixes. Though by the time you reach the California content (maybe 20-30 hours), maybe they'll have issued some patches by then.  icon_smile
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Lee
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« Reply #83 on: September 19, 2014, 03:15:50 PM »

Quote from: Blackjack on September 19, 2014, 02:59:15 PM

*Some early reviews (PC Gamer for one) suggest the post Early Access content (California) is buggy and has more problems cropping up than the Early Access region (Arizona) which obviously had a lot more folks kicking the tires.

So folks who REALLY wanna wait until it's "done" might need to wait for some hotfixes. Though by the time you reach the California content (maybe 20-30 hours), maybe they'll have issued some patches by then.  icon_smile

It's Wasteland, I expect to have to start over about 4 times before I figure out what the best combo of characters/skills is optimal before I can really start, maybe it will be patched by the time I decide. smile
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Turtle
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« Reply #84 on: September 19, 2014, 03:22:34 PM »

Ah, I didn't know that about Divinity. I do know that the reason why Divinity had such little funding from investors was their old school choices.

Wasteland 2 was also crowd developed. They made use of Unity's marketplace and basically modders went and looked at lists of needed assets, then built them, put them on the unity marketplace flagged for Wasteland 2, and the team would choose the ones they liked.

Normally I don't like the whole "contest" style of content farming, but in this case, if the artists' stuff isn't chosen, they still have it up on the Unity marketplace.
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« Reply #85 on: September 19, 2014, 03:37:48 PM »

I expected the reviews to be a little mixed for this one, considering that there is a lack of polish in this early version. I'll still play it happily, now that it's out of early access.
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« Reply #86 on: September 19, 2014, 05:18:49 PM »

Quote from: Blackjack on September 19, 2014, 02:59:15 PM


So folks who REALLY wanna wait until it's "done" might need to wait for some hotfixes. Though by the time you reach the California content (maybe 20-30 hours), maybe they'll have issued some patches by then.  icon_smile
If I recall correctly, Fallout 2 had numerous bugs that would break the game outright on release, so this is just par for the course.  icon_smile
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Blackjack
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« Reply #87 on: September 19, 2014, 05:30:43 PM »

Some gameplay concerns I and some others had in earlier builds:
-Melee combat felt overpowered. Aside from certain maps where you can't close on targets fast enough for melee to be viable, or situations where enemies will blow up in toxic gas/poison clouds, it seemed easier to just give everyone a big stick and beat every enemy to death.  icon_twisted

-Pipe bombs seemed ridiculously overpowered in terms of the damage and how far a character could toss them. If your guys had pipe bombs great, when the AI had pipe bombs you'd have a helluva time trying to take them down since they seemed able to toss them from ridiculous distances.

I pimped for this Halfway TBS title here elsewhere and there the complaint was sniper rifles seemed so overpowered it made other weapons seem pointless to equip at times. That seemed the case with melee and pipe bombs in Wasteland 2, aside from certain situations. I'm eager to see if either got tweaked.

Even if melee did get "nerfed," I'd always encourage folks to develop at least one character really good at it. And even if you only have a point in it, it can be a lifesaver if a character's out of ammo.

-Certain types of ammo, esp. in early going, seemed awfully scarce. Even once I reached vendors that had it, if I ran out of the ammo during a mission, certain weapon types' ammo was just too scarce to find anything outside of vendors. So I'd end up with, say, a sniper who could never actually snipe. I got the impression this was getting tweaked but certain weapon types will still be generally tough to find ammo for.
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« Reply #88 on: September 19, 2014, 05:31:03 PM »

Quote from: Lordnine on September 19, 2014, 05:18:49 PM

Quote from: Blackjack on September 19, 2014, 02:59:15 PM


So folks who REALLY wanna wait until it's "done" might need to wait for some hotfixes. Though by the time you reach the California content (maybe 20-30 hours), maybe they'll have issued some patches by then.  icon_smile
If I recall correctly, Fallout 2 had numerous bugs that would break the game outright on release, so this is just par for the course.  icon_smile

Which is why i never bought another Interplay title. I was so angry when my save no longer worked and they were basically like 'yep, you need to start over.'   *Fist Shaking*
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Blackjack
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« Reply #89 on: September 19, 2014, 05:33:59 PM »

Quote from: ATB on September 19, 2014, 05:31:03 PM

Quote from: Lordnine on September 19, 2014, 05:18:49 PM

Quote from: Blackjack on September 19, 2014, 02:59:15 PM


So folks who REALLY wanna wait until it's "done" might need to wait for some hotfixes. Though by the time you reach the California content (maybe 20-30 hours), maybe they'll have issued some patches by then.  icon_smile
If I recall correctly, Fallout 2 had numerous bugs that would break the game outright on release, so this is just par for the course.  icon_smile

Which is why i never bought another Interplay title. I was so angry when my save no longer worked and they were basically like 'yep, you need to start over.'   *Fist Shaking*
Sorry.  icon_frown fwiw, I trust that post-release patches of Wasteland 2 won't break saves. The Early Access updates I think nearly all of them did, but we were warned of that so it wasn't a surprise.

btw, you can save any time -- "regular" saves and quicksave -- as much as you want in this.  icon_smile It has autosaves too. I'm not sure how much hard drive space each savegame file uses. I dabbled just a tiny bit this morning and the savegame list seems to have gotten a slight facelift.

Also, the game wants to install a Razer Surround Audio driver when you install it. I declined -- wasn't sure if that was specific to a Razer sound card or something? The sound seemed fine without it.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 05:40:24 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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Lordnine
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« Reply #90 on: September 19, 2014, 05:38:24 PM »

Quote from: ATB on September 19, 2014, 05:31:03 PM

Quote from: Lordnine on September 19, 2014, 05:18:49 PM

If I recall correctly, Fallout 2 had numerous bugs that would break the game outright on release, so this is just par for the course.  icon_smile

Which is why i never bought another Interplay title. I was so angry when my save no longer worked and they were basically like 'yep, you need to start over.'   *Fist Shaking*
But…but…Fallout 2 was worth it!  It’s the only game I’ve finished multiple times, and each time I managed to find something new.

Wasteland 2 has some mighty big shoes to fill in my mind.
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« Reply #91 on: September 19, 2014, 10:48:37 PM »

Quote from: Blackjack on September 19, 2014, 05:30:43 PM

-Certain types of ammo, esp. in early going, seemed awfully scarce. Even once I reached vendors that had it, if I ran out of the ammo during a mission, certain weapon types' ammo was just too scarce to find anything outside of vendors. So I'd end up with, say, a sniper who could never actually snipe. I got the impression this was getting tweaked but certain weapon types will still be generally tough to find ammo for.

Scarce ammo is a central part of the Wasteland experience, to a much, much larger degree than the Fallout games. In Wasteland 1, deciding to use full auto on a weapon was an act of desperation with potentially huge consequences, as ammo was a finite resource that was hard to find in the first place.
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Lordnine
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« Reply #92 on: September 20, 2014, 12:14:54 AM »

Toaster repair is an important skill, right?
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Autistic Angel
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« Reply #93 on: September 20, 2014, 12:51:04 AM »

Assuming you can find the toaster, yes.

-Autistic Angel
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Roguetad
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« Reply #94 on: September 20, 2014, 03:49:25 AM »

Not sure about the voice acting so far, but the combat is good. 
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Turtle
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« Reply #95 on: September 20, 2014, 08:28:12 AM »

Wow, this game is rough around the edges. It's clear the focus was on more RPG elements and combat than usability. I suppose that's what people asked for first and foremost.

But man, there's a lot of usability features missing.

I especially hate how they do one of my biggest annoyances from the 2d to 3d transitional days, where you have a 3D camera on an isometric view, but they don't cut away walls or other obstructions in the foreground that might block your view. Instead, it's all manual camera control.

I think the same issue was in Divinity a bit.
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« Reply #96 on: September 20, 2014, 02:35:12 PM »

The interface is clunky.  I don't like it when equipped weapons and armor also appear in the general inventory grid.  I want to see equipped stuff in the character paper doll slots, but not also in the general inventory.  It's confusing.
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Blackjack
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« Reply #97 on: September 20, 2014, 04:50:11 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on September 19, 2014, 10:48:37 PM

Quote from: Blackjack on September 19, 2014, 05:30:43 PM

-Certain types of ammo, esp. in early going, seemed awfully scarce. Even once I reached vendors that had it, if I ran out of the ammo during a mission, certain weapon types' ammo was just too scarce to find anything outside of vendors. So I'd end up with, say, a sniper who could never actually snipe. I got the impression this was getting tweaked but certain weapon types will still be generally tough to find ammo for.

Scarce ammo is a central part of the Wasteland experience, to a much, much larger degree than the Fallout games. In Wasteland 1, deciding to use full auto on a weapon was an act of desperation with potentially huge consequences, as ammo was a finite resource that was hard to find in the first place.
fwiw, i've had little or no low ammo issues with the release build of the game. I did remember to grab the 1st shovel at the intro and dig any time I see a pile. Just seems like this build is more generous with the ammo drops and stashes now, so I'm happy.  icon_smile

A few quality of life improvements I noticed (or maybe I just didn't use these during Early Access):
-Distribute to All button on loot pickup will attempt to divvy up items in a way that makes sense. So if you pick up 5 types of ammo, it'll attempt to make sure those all go to a squad member with the proper equipment.
-If you mouse hover over the points scale of a skill you're considering, the pop-up lists any members in your group (companions included) who already have that skill, and what their level is. Really helpful in avoiding redundancies unless you want to (e.g., having two medic types is a good thing imho).

The inventory UI is what it is. Many of us made suggestions the last few months, some were addressed, some not. Once I played it a while everything became 2nd nature. I prefer it's group inventory handling over that Halfway game that I've yakked about, but think it could've handled a few things better in terms of reloading and passing items at the vendors. I can't defend it, it's just not a deal breaker when I enjoy the overall game so much.

One thing I hounded the devs to put in -- put a compass in so we know what the heck direction we're moving our squad -- got in. Now it has both a compass that shows you what direction your camera view is facing on the main screen, and also on the overhead map (M key). The builds I initially had no such map or compass directions -- was utterly maddening. So I'm glad they listened to our feedback on that, at the least.  icon_smile

Some of us pushed for an RTS-like ability on the overhead map to click once on a far distance to get there. The idea being that on some huge areas once you've cleared to the end, there's an awful drudgerous "click to move" over and over to return to the entrance. That didn't get in, and some of us thought it would be a nice 'quality of life improvement' type thing.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2014, 05:04:42 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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« Reply #98 on: September 20, 2014, 05:06:44 PM »

Energy Weapons are back in finally.  icon_cool Didn't think to put any points in it as I thought it would be a late game thing.
Kind of gobbling on the Action Points. They were removed from the builds before I started playing so I can't give any insight on how they work.

btw, Destructor mentioned to me a cool collection of custom portraits you can use (a common complaint was not having more available in the game):

Wasteland 2 Portraits:
https://imgur.com/a/QYyax#32

I mostly just went with the button that takes a shot of your created character. I did find I could create a Native American type that matched one of the build-in custom portraits pretty well.  icon_smile
« Last Edit: September 20, 2014, 05:09:31 PM by Blackjack » Logged

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Roguetad
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« Reply #99 on: September 20, 2014, 10:08:50 PM »

That portrait pack is really good.  Thanks for linking it Blackjack. 
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« Reply #100 on: Today at 05:37:40 AM »

Quote from: Roguetad on September 20, 2014, 10:08:50 PM

That portrait pack is really good.  Thanks for linking it Blackjack. 
You're welcome - Credit to Destructor, he's playing it too  icon_smile

The dev folks participated in a Reddit Q&A:

We are the leads on Wasteland 2 (currently the #1 PC game), the godfather of the post-apocalyptic fallout series. Brian Fargo, Matt Findley and Chris Keenan here to discuss all things crowdfunding, game-making, and escaping the grasp of publishers.
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2gvfzg/we_are_the_leads_on_wasteland_2_currently_the_1/

I'm having a snit about "Acute Pod Infection" in Ag Center. It sounded like this was gonna get removed from late early access because despite a label saying you can remove the infection, you can't, and it effectively bleeds away the character's constitution until they bleed out. But you can't cure it with quest serum or any medical or surgeon stuff afik. Until we get an answer, my advice -- assuming one saves often  icon_smile -- if you see something with this acute label:

*I'd recommend restore a previous save before it happened so you aren't eventually forced to let an infected character die or be dismissed.

*If there is in fact a cure for it (the ACUTE variation, not the moderate one), not seen anything online about it.
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Blackjack
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« Reply #101 on: Today at 05:43:52 AM »

Away from my snit, some cool things...  icon_cool

*I believe this "combat order panel" is new, at least wasn't on my screenshots from older builds. Very easy to miss on a large monitor - up at the top of the screen.

-So the key thing is, it's not "my folks all take a turn, then they take their turn," it's often a mish mash depending on attributes and stuff. Reminds me a bit of Blackguards' similar panel but I felt BG's way way too large and in our face, at the screen bottom.

*Energy weapons have an interesting mix of pros and cons. I love the visual look. I'd share a streaming vid of it but since Amazon's acquisition of Twitch, I can't get Open Broadcast Software to stream anymore. Amazon just wants to screw up my life in general.  icon_razz

-It's a little sloppy. It's not like a precise laser beam. Even though you don't see a cone targeting visual like with shotguns, it shoots something more like a blurry, wide-focus blast and I've done more friendly fire with it than I expected.

*Weaponsmithing becomes pretty fun and useful.

-It seems like most of the time you can remove one of these upgrades if you change your mind, without damaging or losing something. But that's just my early experience so far. And there's some basic logic -- you can't attach a magazine to a revolver or a shotgun for example. The jamming with early weapons makes me crazy but you soon enough have better gear with less % chance to jam.
« Last Edit: Today at 05:48:43 AM by Blackjack » Logged

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