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Question: It's now 30 days until the next generation begins.   I've noticed a lot of shifting of opinions in the last 30 days back and forth.   Which console are you buying in November?
PS4 - 42 (32.3%)
Xbone - 15 (11.5%)
Both - 13 (10%)
Neither - 19 (14.6%)
Waiting until later - 41 (31.5%)
Total Voters: 130

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Author Topic: 2890 Days until launch. Which system are you getting?  (Read 44833 times)
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CeeKay
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« Reply #920 on: November 05, 2013, 03:52:34 AM »

Quote from: leo8877 on November 05, 2013, 02:49:05 AM

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 02:05:12 AM


IGN thinks Dead Rising is the Xbone exclusive to beat.    Watch the video in the story...

Link

I am annoyed that this is xbone exclusive.  I would have purchased on PS4.

it seems like the even numbered ones go multi-platform smile
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« Reply #921 on: November 05, 2013, 03:54:00 AM »

Quote from: wonderpug on November 04, 2013, 11:57:30 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on November 04, 2013, 11:53:03 PM

speaking of games, where's the Disney Infinity announcement for the next gen?

Doesn't the current Disney Infinity last forever?

only until... INFINITY TWO!!!!!!
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« Reply #922 on: November 05, 2013, 12:07:40 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on November 04, 2013, 11:17:46 PM

Quote from: Razgon on November 04, 2013, 09:45:42 PM

Quote from: msduncan on November 04, 2013, 09:26:44 PM

Quote from: farley2k on November 04, 2013, 09:22:27 PM

Is there anything else this happens with?  I mean why do people do this with gaming consoles?  Actually I guess the iPad often has this happen but that is all I can really think of.  I wonder why?  Is it a case of actual high demand or a case of restricted supply to create demand? 



It's done with event tickets all the time -- sports and non sports.

Edit to add:  Heck, my puzzlement is why it's viewed different just because it's a game console.   Is it because of the kids?

This is illegal in Denmark, actually for the very same reasons Wonderpug lists.

Honestly, I've never heard of any decent people doing this. Its basically scamming people out of their money by creating an artificial shortage by purchasing something you only want for reselling. At least, thats how the danish law view it.

I'm surprised that one person buying and reselling an item could be considered creating an artificial shortage, does the law have a minimum amount of items being sold or is it just one item?

I looked this up a bit,since I found it interesting. There is no limit or minimum amount - The law states that re-selling of tickets with the intent to gain any economic gain is forbidden, no matter how many.

Quote
Act on prohibition against resale of tickets for public entertainment

Hereby promulgated Act No. 677 of 22 December 1919 prohibiting the resale of tickets for public entertainment with the changes resulting from Act No. 213 of 4 June 1965

§ 1 Resale of tickets for public entertainment, at which the seller seeks to make a profit, is prohibited. The Royal Theatre scientists can so far be sold at public auction for one season at a time, and thus sold the tickets are valid determination not.

§ 2 Culture Minister may bookshops, offices, kiosks and similar transactions in the appropriate number allocation for against a set by the Minister of charge to receive and attend to pre-booking of tickets for public entertainment.

§ 3 Violation of the law punishable by a fine.

§ 4 This law takes effect immediately.

Since you asked :-)
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« Reply #923 on: November 05, 2013, 12:37:13 PM »

I can only speculate, but I believe the Danish law about ticket resale (and the similar Norwegian one) was made in order to make cultural arrangements accessible to everyone, no matter their economic standing. Allowing the free market to reign supreme would risk limiting culture to only the rich.
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« Reply #924 on: November 05, 2013, 01:06:02 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on November 05, 2013, 12:37:13 PM

I can only speculate, but I believe the Danish law about ticket resale (and the similar Norwegian one) was made in order to make cultural arrangements accessible to everyone, no matter their economic standing. Allowing the free market to reign supreme would risk limiting culture to only the rich.

Well, let me take my previous example of tickets to Alabama games:

3 or 4 of the games on the schedule only fetch prices around $45 (face value) for entry even on the market.    There are 3 or 4 other games which the market drives up anywhere from $75 to $300 per ticket.   Here is the kicker:   If you show up to a game and do the legwork, you can pick up tickets right outside the stadium right before kickoff for sometimes LESS than face value even for bigger games that were demanding bigger prices.

So in other words, monetarily challenged people can always get into a game for face or less if they do the work to show up and walk around to people selling right before kickoff.    Just like the market drives the demand on these tickets up a few weeks before kickoff -- so does the market drive them down below retail as kickoff approaches when suppliers are dumping their unsold tickets.
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« Reply #925 on: November 05, 2013, 03:55:54 PM »



Saw an article out there that said ToysRus had to take down a launch video of Xbone because it was flooded with comments that had obscene language and photos from tons of users in an effort to get it removed from ToysRus site.     

Not sure if it had any merit or not, and I can't find the article again.    Tongue
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« Reply #926 on: November 05, 2013, 04:00:04 PM »


Unity available free to developers
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« Reply #927 on: November 05, 2013, 04:32:25 PM »

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 04:00:04 PM


That article seems to contradict itself. It's talking about an add-on for Unity, meant for Xbox One and Windows 8 development, being free, not Unity itself. This is a huge difference.

By the way, it was revealed earlier this fall that Unity would be free to qualified developers (which the article briefly touches upon), but IIRC they had to publish their games exclusively for Xbox One. I might be remembering wrong though, since it's been a few months. If true, that's not what I'd call "free" in my world.
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« Reply #928 on: November 05, 2013, 04:52:11 PM »

Well its expected in that case. I assume MS is paying some fee to Unity so developers can use the engine free, but of course that means they can't make it for PS4. If developers don't want to be platform limited then they license it themselves.
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« Reply #929 on: November 05, 2013, 06:01:48 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on November 05, 2013, 04:32:25 PM

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 04:00:04 PM


That article seems to contradict itself. It's talking about an add-on for Unity, meant for Xbox One and Windows 8 development, being free, not Unity itself. This is a huge difference.

By the way, it was revealed earlier this fall that Unity would be free to qualified developers (which the article briefly touches upon), but IIRC they had to publish their games exclusively for Xbox One. I might be remembering wrong though, since it's been a few months. If true, that's not what I'd call "free" in my world.

Read the whole thing again.

http://news.xbox.com/2013/11/xbox-one-unity-id

Quote
To us, ID@Xbox is about providing a level playing field for all developers. So, we worked with Unity and we’re pleased to announce that, when released in 2014, the Xbox One add-on for Unity will be available at no cost to all developers in the ID@Xbox program, as will special Xbox One-only Unity Pro seat licenses for Xbox One developers in the ID@Xbox program.


Emphasis mine.

Quote
The Unity add-on for Xbox One supports every element of Xbox One, from Kinect to SmartGlass to the impulse triggers of the new controller. Using Unity, developers will be able to take advantage of all aspects of Xbox One, which is rad. More importantly, Unity is available for Windows and Windows Phone too (and yes, the add-on is available at no cost to developers for Windows Phone and Windows 8 store games). So from one base game, developers can ship their games across all Microsoft platforms. For more details on Microsoft’s partnership with Unity, check out this Xbox Wire post from BUILD 2013.

This is all kinds of cool - and if they're in the ID@Xbox dev pool, they get

A) Special Unity Pro seat license
B) Xbone Plugin
C) MS Windows 8 Plugin
D) Windows Phone 8 Plugin

FREE. (or at least, it seems to be the case)
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« Reply #930 on: November 05, 2013, 06:10:51 PM »

Yeah, it seems like that confirms what I said actually. You get the plugin for free, and only get Unity for free for Xbox One, supposedly also with a restriction that your games are exclusive.
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« Reply #931 on: November 05, 2013, 06:35:01 PM »

I don't see a problem with that. Microsoft shouldn't foot the bill for someone to create a PS4 title.
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« Reply #932 on: November 05, 2013, 06:51:42 PM »

That's nice.

But the cost of a full unity license is only $1,500. The software used to create art assets costs as much if not more.

I'd rather pay that, and put it out for both platforms and not have to deal with just MS's poor indie support and market overall. Looking at how they both intentionally and unintentionally screwed over indies on both 360 and Windows 8, it's not worth the savings. I've heard a lot of horror stories, and anyone can look at the 360 dash changes over the years and how it became harder and harder to find these games over time. The Skulls of the Shogun developer puts it best in that MS often times isn't trying to screw you over, they're just so incompetent at managing an indie game program they couldn't even manage being malicious if they tried.

Especially so since you only need the Unity pro license for the extra features, or if you happen to make over US$100,000 in revenue. Otherwise, if you don't need those features and don't make over 100,000 you can publish a Unity game for absolutely free. Although, you still have to pay fees if your game becomes popular and goes over certain thresholds, and those cost can really sneak up on you, but everyone has to do that anyway as a cost of success.
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« Reply #933 on: November 05, 2013, 07:14:58 PM »


Please read the past 4 or 5 posts for an inkling of why Xbone purchasers perceive other posters here of taking any possible positive Xbone news and shitting on it.

Exhibit A
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« Reply #934 on: November 05, 2013, 07:15:34 PM »



4 New PS4 videos released
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« Reply #935 on: November 05, 2013, 07:20:42 PM »

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 07:14:58 PM


Please read the past 4 or 5 posts for an inkling of why Xbone purchasers perceive other posters here of taking any possible positive Xbone news and shitting on it.

Exhibit A

/signed.
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« Reply #936 on: November 05, 2013, 07:23:08 PM »

Don't really care about people with a persecution complex. These aren't two children of yours where one is being picked on. They are two products from two companies competing. Get. Over. It.

This is the reality of what a developer such as myself faces right now. Sony's not all sunshine and roses, but they are more prepared.

This will change, but a dev is still better going multiplatform, as I am, unless he can land a good deal with either publisher. I do suspect a publishing deal from MS is more lucrative, but anyone who would use this deal probably isn't worth MS' time.

Which is why, *gasp* Almost every single one of the indies on PS4 will make their way to XB1 within 6 months to a year.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 07:27:17 PM by Turtle » Logged
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« Reply #937 on: November 05, 2013, 07:28:24 PM »

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 07:14:58 PM


Please read the past 4 or 5 posts for an inkling of why Xbone purchasers perceive other posters here of taking any possible positive Xbone news and shitting on it.

Exhibit A

Don't you dare start that shit again! This thread has been doing pretty well for a couple of days now, and I'd rather have it stay that way. If you can't discuss these things like an adult without having your feelings hurt, then maybe you should just stay out of the thread until you do.
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« Reply #938 on: November 05, 2013, 07:38:56 PM »

You kids cut that out this instant or I'll turn this car around and start talking about the morality of ebaying console preorders again!
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« Reply #939 on: November 05, 2013, 07:42:51 PM »

Quote from: wonderpug on November 05, 2013, 07:38:56 PM

You kids cut that out this instant or I'll turn this car around and start talking about the morality of ebaying console preorders again!

she started it!
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« Reply #940 on: November 05, 2013, 07:47:45 PM »

Well, to demonstrate my benevolent neutrality I posted a link to 4 new PS4 videos.   

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Re:
« Reply #941 on: November 05, 2013, 07:54:41 PM »

IBTL
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« Reply #942 on: November 05, 2013, 07:57:34 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on November 05, 2013, 07:23:08 PM

Don't really care about people with a persecution complex. These aren't two children of yours where one is being picked on. They are two products from two companies competing. Get. Over. It.

This is the reality of what a developer such as myself faces right now. Sony's not all sunshine and roses, but they are more prepared.

This will change, but a dev is still better going multiplatform, as I am, unless he can land a good deal with either publisher. I do suspect a publishing deal from MS is more lucrative, but anyone who would use this deal probably isn't worth MS' time.

Which is why, *gasp* Almost every single one of the indies on PS4 will make their way to XB1 within 6 months to a year.

Even Supergiant games has, in the past, indicated that Transistor is likely to appear on other platforms later. It's alright to point out the downside, but as was stated before - I wouldn't expect SonyMS to foot the bill to bring an Xbox game to light[on PS4]. The comment I was responding to was that *a unity pro license* was being made available to developers for free - there are caveats (of which I did not hide or otherwise obfuscate), but being able to develop a game and move it into three platforms without underlying cost is a fantastic thing.

Months ago MS was being chewed upon for vague "indie support plans". This is cut-and-dry, and sounds like a good strategy to help themselves in attracting talent to the indie pool (consider the Mojangs of the world).

[edit: stupid conference call interrupted my thought process slywink ]
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« Reply #943 on: November 05, 2013, 07:57:53 PM »

Quote from: Caine on November 05, 2013, 07:54:41 PM

IBTL

4 days until lock.
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« Reply #944 on: November 05, 2013, 07:59:09 PM »

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 07:47:45 PM

Well, to demonstrate my benevolent neutrality I posted a link to 4 new PS4 videos.

You don't have to demonstrate any neutrality. I don't think anyone here suspects you of being neutral at this point anyway. slywink I'm glad you let it be though, so thanks for that. It's the kind of restraint we should both have shown at the very beginning. I guess we've come a long way in a few days.
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« Reply #945 on: November 05, 2013, 08:07:52 PM »

Quote from: Purge on November 05, 2013, 07:57:34 PM

Quote from: Turtle on November 05, 2013, 07:23:08 PM

Don't really care about people with a persecution complex. These aren't two children of yours where one is being picked on. They are two products from two companies competing. Get. Over. It.

This is the reality of what a developer such as myself faces right now. Sony's not all sunshine and roses, but they are more prepared.

This will change, but a dev is still better going multiplatform, as I am, unless he can land a good deal with either publisher. I do suspect a publishing deal from MS is more lucrative, but anyone who would use this deal probably isn't worth MS' time.

Which is why, *gasp* Almost every single one of the indies on PS4 will make their way to XB1 within 6 months to a year.

Even Supergiant games has, in the past, indicated that Transistor is likely to appear on other platforms later. It's alright to point out the downside, but as was stated before - I wouldn't expect Sony to foot the bill to bring an Xbox game to light. The comment I was responding to was that *a unity pro license* was being made available to developers for free - there are caveats (of which I did not hide or otherwise obfuscate), but being able to develop a game and move it into three platforms without underlying cost is a fantastic thing.

Months ago MS was being chewed upon for vague "indie support plans". This is cut-and-dry, and sounds like a good strategy to help themselves in attracting talent to the indie pool (consider the Mojangs of the world).

All that is true, but it's a very poor offering (given that I'm remembering right about the exclusivity. I haven't double-checked that, so if anyone wants to smack me over the head with a mistake I've made, this might be as good a chance as any) and it's not really news. Microsoft announced this just a few weeks after E3. A couple of news sites followed up the announcement by asking indie developers what they thought about it. The overwhelming response was a guarded "it's a step in the right direction". They most likely saw the same problems as have already been documented today in this thread. However, it takes more than a step in the right direction to actually walk there, and this initiative doesn't do that.

I honestly can't see why anyone would want to sell their games this cheap to exclusivity. I mean, $1500 is absolutely nothing, even to indie companies. Add in having to be accepted by Microsoft first, whatever that entails, and the deal is starting to look less appealing by the minute. How do they select the participants? What are the requirements? What does the indie company have to agree to in order to be accepted? These are all important questions that I don't believe have been answered.

This is why I "shit" upon this initiative. It comes off as no more than a public gesture with nothing solid behind it. I'd love to be proven wrong. I even did some development on the 360 because it was a joy to play around with as a developer, so I'd love for it to be as easy in the new generation. However, that's not what Microsoft has been talking about.
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« Reply #946 on: November 05, 2013, 08:16:31 PM »

Mark Rubin is not allowed to talk about which console is more powerful
http://metro.co.uk/2013/11/05/call-of-duty-ghosts-mark-rubin-interview-there-are-things-that-were-not-allowed-to-talk-about-4173810/

Quote
GC: So the obvious assumption from all this is that the PlayStation 4 is definitely more powerful than the Xbox One, is that true?

MR: [acting very embarrassed] I can’t answer that.

GC: You can’t answer it on a technical level or because you’re being diplomatic?

MR: Can’t answer that.

GC: You can’t say whether you’re avoiding the question for diplomatic reasons?

MR: [embarrassed] I just can’t say anything…

[Even the attending PR guy is looking embarrassed by this point]

PR guy: It’s very hard for us to be…

GC: Are the console manufacturers leaning on you to avoid these sort of questions?

MR: [unsure - speaking to PR guy] I don’t know if that…

MR: [even more embarrassed to us] Yeah, there’s things that we… We sign NDAs with the first parties [i.e. Microsoft and Sony - GC] and there are things that we’re not allowed to talk about.

GC: So when John Carmack and Shinji Mikami say the Xbox One and PlayStation 4 are almost identical, is that something you could agree with?

MR: Hmm… I would say that’s a bit inaccurate but I wouldn’t be able to tell you any detail of why that’s inaccurate.

GC: For diplomatic reasons?

MR: Yes.

GC: Okay, that’s fine. I think we can all read between those lines. But that’s absurd, how can they not except any journalist, any reasonable journalist, not to ask that question? It’s what everyone wants to know.

MR: [still feeling very awkward] The key thing is we try to focus people away from that sort of thing and try to focus them on the fact that the game is fun no matter what platform it’s on.
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« Reply #947 on: November 05, 2013, 08:18:13 PM »

Call of Duty Makers Explain Why Resolution Is Lower On Xbox One:

Quote
Today, the people who make Call of Duty have an official explanation, and it ain't great news for Microsoft. Speaking to Eurogamer, Infinity Ward boss Mark Rubin put it quite candidly: on the Xbox One, they had to sacrifice resolution to get the game running at the 60 frames-per-second they wanted.

"It's very possible we can get it to native 1080p [resolution]. I mean I've seen it working at 1080p native," Rubin said. "It's just we couldn't get the frame rate in the neighborhood we wanted it to be. And it wasn't a lack of effort. It wasn't that it was like last minute. We had the theoretical hardware for a long time. That's the thing you get pretty quickly and that doesn't change dramatically.

"It was more about resource allocation. The resource allocation is different on the consoles. That huge web of tangled resources, whether it's threads-based or if it's GPU threads or if it's memory - whatever it is - optimization is something that could go theoretically on forever."

of course:

Quote
"First launch, first time at bat at a new console is a challenging one," Rubin said to Eurogamer. "That's just the way it is. For people fearful one system is more powerful than the other or vice versa, it's a long game."
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« Reply #948 on: November 05, 2013, 08:27:47 PM »

Every console launch has had one console more powerful than the other one. Name me one console launch in which every competing console was identical.

And before someone brings up the $100 difference argument, if $100 makes the difference of you putting food on the table, you have no business buying a $500 console in the first place.

So tired of this shit.

« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 08:30:19 PM by YellowKing » Logged
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« Reply #949 on: November 05, 2013, 08:29:54 PM »

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 07:14:58 PM


Please read the past 4 or 5 posts for an inkling of why Xbone purchasers perceive other posters here of taking any possible positive Xbone news and shitting on it.

Exhibit A

Is it possible we could continue the discussion without you having to think every single sentence that somehow does not comply with your thinking ties into some vast PS4 conspiracy? Its getting really tiresome.
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« Reply #950 on: November 05, 2013, 08:32:59 PM »

Quote from: YellowKing on November 05, 2013, 08:27:47 PM

And before someone brings up the $100 difference argument, if $100 makes the difference of you putting food on the table, you have no business buying a $500 console in the first place.

That's a pretty ridiculous statement. $100 is still $100.
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« Reply #951 on: November 05, 2013, 08:33:16 PM »

Quote from: Razgon on November 05, 2013, 08:29:54 PM

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 07:14:58 PM


Please read the past 4 or 5 posts for an inkling of why Xbone purchasers perceive other posters here of taking any possible positive Xbone news and shitting on it.

Exhibit A

Is it possible we could continue the discussion without you having to think every single sentence that somehow does not comply with your thinking ties into some vast PS4 conspiracy? Its getting really tiresome.

Let it go! He dropped the subject.

Quote from: YellowKing on November 05, 2013, 08:27:47 PM

Every console launch has had one console more powerful than the other one. Name me one console launch in which every competing console was identical.

Uh, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Are we not supposed to discuss differences between the consoles because previous generations have had differences between consoles? That makes no sense to me.
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« Reply #952 on: November 05, 2013, 08:33:51 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on November 05, 2013, 08:33:16 PM

Quote from: Razgon on November 05, 2013, 08:29:54 PM

Quote from: msduncan on November 05, 2013, 07:14:58 PM


Please read the past 4 or 5 posts for an inkling of why Xbone purchasers perceive other posters here of taking any possible positive Xbone news and shitting on it.

Exhibit A

Is it possible we could continue the discussion without you having to think every single sentence that somehow does not comply with your thinking ties into some vast PS4 conspiracy? Its getting really tiresome.

Let it go! He dropped the subject.

Quote from: YellowKing on November 05, 2013, 08:27:47 PM

Every console launch has had one console more powerful than the other one. Name me one console launch in which every competing console was identical.

Uh, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Are we not supposed to discuss differences between the consoles because previous generations have had differences between consoles? That makes no sense to me.

Yeah - I somehow skipped a page - my apologies about that.
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« Reply #953 on: November 05, 2013, 08:40:18 PM »

That Mark Rubin interview has already been GIFd eek
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YellowKing
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« Reply #954 on: November 05, 2013, 08:41:17 PM »

Quote from: gellar
That's a pretty ridiculous statement. $100 is still $100.

We hear the argument constantly that "the weaker console is $100 more....OH NOs!" That doesn't take into consideration the fact that many people feel that the value of other features of the Xbox One are worth the $100 premium, even with slightly weaker technical specs. People buy iPads all the time and spend HUNDREDS of dollars more than a competing tablet with more features. Value is subjective. That is my point.

Quote from: TiLT
Uh, I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Are we not supposed to discuss differences between the consoles because previous generations have had differences between consoles? That makes no sense to me.

It isn't discussion. It's a one-sided tearing down of one console over another, and you know it.

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msduncan
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« Reply #955 on: November 05, 2013, 08:42:13 PM »

Quote from: YellowKing on November 05, 2013, 08:27:47 PM

Every console launch has had one console more powerful than the other one. Name me one console launch in which every competing console was identical.

And before someone brings up the $100 difference argument, if $100 makes the difference of you putting food on the table, you have no business buying a $500 console in the first place.

So tired of this shit.



Atari 2600?

biggrin
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TiLT
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« Reply #956 on: November 05, 2013, 08:44:41 PM »

Quote from: YellowKing on November 05, 2013, 08:41:17 PM

It isn't discussion. It's a one-sided tearing down of one console over another, and you know it.

This goes back to a point raised multiple times throughout this thread: Why is it our fault that the Xbox One is riddled with bad news? Are we just supposed to pretend that this isn't the case? Are we supposed to make up bad news about the PS4 to compensate? Tell me, what are we allowed to discuss?

We don't shape the world. We just talk about it.
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msduncan
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« Reply #957 on: November 05, 2013, 08:45:43 PM »



Definitely don't get the thread locked.   I've been passing my days until PS4 by updating the thread title with the countdown.    If this thing got locked, how in the heck would I get by over the next 10 days?
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Purge
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« Reply #958 on: November 05, 2013, 08:46:14 PM »

Apparently TiLT doesn't think a 1500 license is of any real value. ninja
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"If it weren't for Philo T. Farnsworth, inventor of television, we'd still be eating frozen radio dinners." - Johnny Carson
TiLT
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« Reply #959 on: November 05, 2013, 08:49:49 PM »

Quote from: Purge on November 05, 2013, 08:46:14 PM

Apparently TiLT doesn't think a 1500 license is of any real value. ninja

On a personal level, that's definitely a lot of money. When running a business though, that's pocket change. It barely registers on most companies' budgets. It's something I learned when I ran my own company for a few years. Your perception of money as a company is completely different from your private perception. I was dirt poor at the time, but even then I would have said the same thing about $1500 for commercial stuff.
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