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Author Topic: [PS3] MGS4 with no previous MGS experience  (Read 2199 times)
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MonkeyFinger
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« on: June 13, 2008, 01:06:22 PM »

Wondering what that's going to be like as there's no way I'm gonna pick up any of the others and play them first. Can this story be enjoyed on its own? I'm guessing confusion will abound since I'm not familiar with any of the back story that (I assumes) sets all this up but wondering how essential that is to enjoying this one.

Got home way late, so all I managed to do was install it. It amused me to watch Health Warnings about sitting back far enough, well lit area, take a break every 15 minutes, yada yada... all while Snake chain smokes.  icon_razz
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Devil
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« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2008, 01:25:22 PM »

I will be doing the same thing.

We'll have to hold hands and try to go through this thing together!
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« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2008, 01:36:05 PM »

Well the correct answer that you don't want to hear is don't play the game without playing the previous 3.  Would you want to watch Return of the Jedi without watching New Hope or Empire Strikes back?

You're coming in when more than 3/4 of the story has been created and delivered.  You can probably cobble together bits and pieces by playing through it and or reading wikis, but you'll totally be blowing the overall experience, imo.

Seriously- if you've played the first two games and then play MGS3 the end of MGS3 flips you on your head and totally sets the table for MGS4 (I can't imagine the poor fools who saw that ending and then had to wait years for MGS4.  late adopting FTW!).  MGS3 in the context of the other 2 is something that you should experience.  Bottom line.
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Scraper
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« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2008, 01:59:23 PM »

Quote
MGS3 in the context of the other 2 is something that you should experience.  Bottom line.

3 is definitely a great game and shouldn't be missed. But I think one could probably skip part 2 and just play 1 and 3 and still get enough of the story.

It's hard to pass up when Konami just released the MGS pack with 1,2 and 3 in one set.

Also, I just played 3 last year and I think it stands up very well against any next gen game that I have played. The graphics are really good for a PS2 game and the story is excellent.
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kathode
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« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2008, 02:22:39 PM »

Amount you will understand if you haven't played the first 3 games - 1%
Amount you will understand if you have - 2%
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Canuck
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« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2008, 02:24:52 PM »

Quote from: kathode on June 13, 2008, 02:22:39 PM

Amount you will understand if you haven't played the first 3 games - 1%
Amount you will understand if you have - 2%

LOL! Still, you're doubling your understanding if you play through the first parts.
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leo8877
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« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2008, 02:43:08 PM »

I played through 1 on the original PS, then played a bit of MGS2 on the xbox, but that's it.  I feel I know enough about the series to suitably enjoy this version though.  I've read enough stuff, watched enough movies to get the jist of what I have missed.
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The Grue
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« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2008, 02:51:13 PM »

Quote from: kathode on June 13, 2008, 02:22:39 PM

Amount you will understand if you haven't played the first 3 games - 1%
Amount you will understand if you have - 2%

It's funny 'cause it's true.
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ATB
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« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2008, 02:57:04 PM »

Quote from: Scraper on June 13, 2008, 01:59:23 PM

It's hard to pass up when Konami just released the MGS pack with 1,2 and 3 in one set.

You have taken leave of your senses. MGS2 is possibly the best game of the series.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2008, 03:00:56 PM »

Quote from: ATB on June 13, 2008, 02:57:04 PM

Quote from: Scraper on June 13, 2008, 01:59:23 PM

It's hard to pass up when Konami just released the MGS pack with 1,2 and 3 in one set.

You have taken leave of your senses. MGS2 is possibly the best game of the series.

Heh, I think you quoted the wrong person icon_wink
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Scraper
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« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2008, 03:04:35 PM »

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You have taken leave of your senses. MGS2 is possibly the best game of the series.

Seriously? Part 2 is no where near as good as 3. Two was the worst offender of 20 minute cutscene, followed by walking down a hallway, only to get another 20 minute cutscene. And don't even get me started on Raiden or the fact that the entire game took place in one boring grey environment.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2008, 03:07:38 PM »

Quote from: Scraper on June 13, 2008, 03:04:35 PM

Quote
You have taken leave of your senses. MGS2 is possibly the best game of the series.

Seriously? Part 2 is no where near as good as 3. Two was the worst offender of 20 minute cutscene, followed by walking down a hallway, only to get another 20 minute cutscene. And don't even get me started on Raiden or the fact that the entire game took place in one boring grey environment.

Big Shell is actually rather orange....
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Devil
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« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2008, 03:38:18 PM »

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Two was the worst offender of 20 minute cutscene, followed by walking down a hallway, only to get another 20 minute cutscene.

This is why I bailed EARLY on 2.
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« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2008, 03:47:45 PM »

Quote from: Scraper on June 13, 2008, 03:04:35 PM


Seriously? Part 2 is no where near as good as 3. Two was the worst offender of 20 minute cutscene, followed by walking down a hallway, only to get another 20 minute cutscene.

That's why it's awesome.  You really play MGS for the gameplay? The story is the point of MGS.  That story is told via cutscenes. If there are in fact 90 minute cutscenes in MGS4 I just have one thing to say: YES! PLEASE!

I bet few people were sitting around going: I can't wait to play MGS4 because of the obtuse controls and sneaking gameplay. It's the story! THE STORY! It's to see what Kojima does next...
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2008, 04:01:15 PM »

Quote from: ATB on June 13, 2008, 03:47:45 PM

That's why it's awesome.  You really play MGS for the gameplay?

*Raises hand*  I do, I do!  Seriously, your reaction to MGS3 is becoming even more clear.  The gameplay is often utterly fantastic (even if the interface...isn't) but Kojima doesn't hold your hand on it so if you sit around and expect the game to show you all of the cool stuff you can do then it just won't happen.  That's what makes the series so replayable to me and not the story (which I can always just re-experience on Youtube). 
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« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2008, 04:08:07 PM »

As I put my MGS3 disc back into the MGS3 case and was hit by the poignancy of of the cover art, I have to reconsider my statement.

I LOVE MGS2. I loved the boss battles, I loved the wacky characters, and I loved the cutscenes.

But man. (I should create a macro for this:) the way MGS3 just flips the player and the world on its head can't be understated.

Maybe I'll call MGS2 and MGS3 a draw smile

Quote
Seriously, your reaction to MGS3 is becoming even more clear.  The gameplay is often utterly fantastic (even if the interface...isn't) but Kojima doesn't hold your hand on it so if you sit around and expect the game to show you all of the cool stuff you can do then it just won't happen. 


Well given how I apparently missed all the gameplay (thanks to horrible documentation) with regard to CQC, I think it's fair for me to be tinged. Not holding hands is one thing- expecting me to figure out a complicated combat methodology on my own...well that's a bit too far.

That said, I can see the roots of MGS4's CQC in MGS3 and well. I missed a lot.
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Kevin Grey
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« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2008, 04:11:05 PM »

Oh yeah, I absolutely agree that not adequately explaining CQC in MGS3 is a huge oversight.  But it's a general principle of the entire series and it existed in MGS2 as well- there were all kinds of neat things to do (especially getting involved in enemy  holdups) but I think most people just kind of tranq'd their way through the game. 
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stimpy
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« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2008, 04:26:06 PM »

At the midnight launch for MGS4, I was shocked at how many young kids were walking out with their parents and the bundle.
I picture a bunch of kids staring at the tv screen while playing this game screaming
"Mom....I keep dying. How do I fight? How do I shoot?
Mom, can we go buy Mario?
I'm sorry honey, theres no Mario for this system.
Mom, can we get a Wii?"
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« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2008, 06:41:38 PM »

Quote from: kathode on June 13, 2008, 02:22:39 PM

Amount you will understand if you haven't played the first 3 games - 1%
Amount you will understand if you have - 2%

which, for me, is what makes the series so strangely... lifelike smile ...
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« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2008, 06:48:06 PM »

Strangely enough, I would estimate that I understood at least 95% of the series going into MGS4 (MGS2 even makes perfect sense to me).

Though I am so happy that I finally got around to playing through the "bad" ending of MGS1 this year.  Before that I actually didn't know:

Spoiler for Hiden:
that Meryl was Campbell's daughter

which would have created a major WTF moment for me in MGS4. 
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« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2008, 07:07:36 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Grey on June 13, 2008, 06:48:06 PM

Strangely enough, I would estimate that I understood at least 95% of the series going into MGS4 (MGS2 even makes perfect sense to me).

Though I am so happy that I finally got around to playing through the "bad" ending of MGS1 this year.  Before that I actually didn't know:

Spoiler for Hiden:
that Meryl was Campbell's daughter

which would have created a major WTF moment for me in MGS4. 

yeah, i understand a bit more than i let on smile ... but i still think there's a very nice, rashomon -type thing to the series, where you're constantly re-seeing from other perspectives... which is, indeed, very lifelike...
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« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2008, 07:59:26 PM »

I still don't understand the while damn Laleleulello BS they through around in 2. The name alone has me confused.
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« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2008, 08:09:01 PM »

Supposedly that's explained in MGS4.
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« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2008, 10:27:16 PM »

I've played through, like, 75% of MGS 1, something like 4 times.  I played through the ship level of 2 and never came back to it.  I didn't have a PS2, so I never played 3.

I suppose I could finish 1 on the Wii using the GC emulation.

I could also pick up 3 for the PS3's PS2 emulation.  I don't see adding 2 to the mix, though.

How long would you say each game takes?
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« Reply #24 on: June 13, 2008, 10:37:14 PM »

hey look at me i can answer that BW as i have just playede through the games

metal gear solid:the twin snakes took me about 8-9 hrs
metal gear solid 2 was a bit longer,about 11,maybe 12 hrs
and metal gear solid 3..THE BEST...about the same 11-12 hrs


worth it to finish all....i am hoping to finally get into and complete MGS:Port Ops on the PSP when i finish number 4
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« Reply #25 on: June 13, 2008, 11:03:55 PM »

Quote from: metallicorphan on June 13, 2008, 10:37:14 PM

hey look at me i can answer that BW as i have just playede through the games

metal gear solid:the twin snakes took me about 8-9 hrs
metal gear solid 2 was a bit longer,about 11,maybe 12 hrs
and metal gear solid 3..THE BEST...about the same 11-12 hrs


worth it to finish all....i am hoping to finally get into and complete MGS:Port Ops on the PSP when i finish number 4

Thanks, MO.

Were these quick play throughs, or were you trying to do things like find all the dog tags, etc.
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« Reply #26 on: June 13, 2008, 11:06:38 PM »

I'd say decent estimates of first time play throughs would be:

MGS1: 8-10 hours
MGS2:  10-12 hours
MGS3:  12-16 hours

That's not searching every nook and cranny nor is it speedruns. 

EDIT:

FWIW- it's actually quicker to playthrough the original PS1 MGS1 instead of Twin Snakes.  The cutscenes in TTS take longer (despite having the same content) and the increased AI capabilities of the guards along with Snake's new abilities actually make it a slower paced game. 
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« Reply #27 on: June 13, 2008, 11:10:25 PM »

if you put them on very easy you will prolly shave an hour or two off the times

i said this to someone on the UK PS3 forums and he said he finished MGS1 in 4 hrs WITH the cutscenes.....as Kev says though,he had the MGS1 version,i had the twin snakes...i still reckon 4 hrs is a bit short though,and wouldnt be suprised if it was maybe 6 or 7 really
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« Reply #28 on: June 14, 2008, 02:28:25 AM »

The easier the game settings, the faster it takes to go through.  At harder difficulties, getting spotted can mean death as waves of troops come in to look for you.  But, at easier settings an experienced shooter player can easily fight his way through.

I love all the little details in the game and it should be interesting to see what funny little things people find in the game.
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« Reply #29 on: June 14, 2008, 03:09:46 AM »

Quote from: Devil on June 13, 2008, 01:25:22 PM

I will be doing the same thing.

We'll have to hold hands and try to go through this thing together!

Thanks for all of the interesting discusssions, I wish I had enough gaming time in my life to go back and play all of the old games I missed out on. I guess Devil & I will just have to suck it up and muddle through this together. 'tarded!

A question on MGS4 - will having played any of the other three mean that intro game show and octopus girl sequence thing will make sense? 'Cuz right now it just gets a big WTF? from me.  icon_neutral
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« Reply #30 on: June 14, 2008, 03:24:41 AM »

They're supposed to be confusing.  But basically, those ads are ads for the PMCs that you face in-game.  So technically it's in-game advertising.  Tongue

For those of you who want a more complete MGS experience, you could try going through all the MGS story via youtube.  The only problem is youtube has been flooded with spoilers for MGS4.
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« Reply #31 on: June 14, 2008, 03:54:49 AM »

Monkey -

Octopus Girl? I can't wait!

Got up to Drebin (Still think of Police Squad).

So far so good.  icon_biggrin


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« Reply #32 on: June 14, 2008, 12:27:57 PM »

Quote from: Turtle on June 14, 2008, 03:24:41 AM

They're supposed to be confusing.  But basically, those ads are ads for the PMCs that you face in-game.  So technically it's in-game advertising.  Tongue

Ah... ok. I was wondering if it was something along those lines. Thanks.  icon_smile
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« Reply #33 on: June 14, 2008, 02:36:28 PM »

Well, I've played through 1 (and the remake), and 2, along with the NES games (like that matters), and I've had no problems at all with the story. Maybe it was because I watched the Metal Gear Retrospective on GameTrailers beforehand, I dunno. Basically, if you haven't played the older titles, you don't know who the players are and how they're all connected.
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« Reply #34 on: June 15, 2008, 04:22:15 PM »

Quote from: Devil on June 14, 2008, 03:54:49 AM

Monkey -

Octopus Girl? I can't wait!
This confused me until I started over, didn't realize the first two shown are seemingly random picks. Just saw 'Bomb Shelter Buffet' (where we get an interesting snake comment at the end) and something about Mantis Defense Systems... both very nicely done. icon_biggrin
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« Reply #35 on: June 15, 2008, 04:53:01 PM »

we've all played games with multiple endings... but multiple beginnings? - not so much smile ...
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« Reply #36 on: June 15, 2008, 09:15:42 PM »

I guess I'm going the add experience route and trying to play through the rest before tackling 4.  Turns out I didn't have much more to go in the first one (only about 2 or 3 hours).  I am a slow player, though, so I don't expect to get to 4 until next year sometime.
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« Reply #37 on: June 16, 2008, 03:52:22 PM »

I'm not exactly no MGS experience, but I only really played through MGS1 when it first came out.   I brushed up with the pre-order DVD and wikipedia and youtube.  So far it hasn't seemed to be detrimental to my game enjoyment.  If I wonder about a charactere, I just head back to wikipedia to brush up.
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