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Author Topic: [Next Gen]Tomb Raider 2  (Read 1100 times)
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naednek
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« Reply #40 on: August 03, 2013, 08:18:32 PM »

Quote from: Bullwinkle on August 03, 2013, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: Gratch on August 03, 2013, 05:06:53 PM

Quote from: TiLT on August 03, 2013, 04:59:37 PM

Ask yourselves this: Even if you appreciate the added realism of having someone suffer in the bad situation in which they're put (which I certainly don't have a problem with as long as it's not overdone), do you really think it's a coincidence that the first game in a long time to do this uses a female lead character?

It's the direction the developers of the Tomb Raider series decided to take.  You know, the franchise that is built solely around a female lead?

For the record, I get what you're saying.  I just don't agree that marketing was the entire reason they chose to go that design route.

Nor that it's a cheap move on their part.  A lot of care and skill went into making this game, and the designers clearly cared about the character.  It is the farthest thing from the manipulative cash grab that TiLT is making it out to be.


Exactly.
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« Reply #41 on: August 03, 2013, 09:38:01 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on August 03, 2013, 04:59:37 PM

Not surprised at all. As mentioned earlier, there are certain rules in marketing that dictate what you can and can't do with lead characters. The primary rule is that your lead character must be a man, and he must be white. Any time you break these rules, you lose sales (that's the basic gist of the market research anyway). To counteract the loss of sales by having a woman as the lead character, the easiest solution is to appeal to the male player's protective instincts. It's annoyingly transparent and well known, and that many of you refuse to see through this paper-thin situation is even more annoying.

Ask yourselves this: Even if you appreciate the added realism of having someone suffer in the bad situation in which they're put (which I certainly don't have a problem with as long as it's not overdone), do you really think it's a coincidence that the first game in a long time to do this uses a female lead character?

I might have bought this argument if it was a new IP.  TR is already a hugely popular brand and they didn't really have to worry about sales as long as they made a decent game.

The whole thing about realistic reactions is pretty new in the industry.  Naughty Dog is leading the pack in that department and it's pretty obvious to see the influence of Uncharted on the TR team.  I think you will see more games coming out with similar character interactions in the future and they will have male characters in those positions.   So yeah, it's is a bit of a coincidence that TR came out about the same time as this movement towards more realism (in characters) is starting to get traction and we are getting tired of same old FPS that hasn't evolved in those areas since Quake.

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« Reply #42 on: August 03, 2013, 09:51:05 PM »

Quote from: skyride on August 03, 2013, 09:38:01 PM

Quote from: TiLT on August 03, 2013, 04:59:37 PM

Not surprised at all. As mentioned earlier, there are certain rules in marketing that dictate what you can and can't do with lead characters. The primary rule is that your lead character must be a man, and he must be white. Any time you break these rules, you lose sales (that's the basic gist of the market research anyway). To counteract the loss of sales by having a woman as the lead character, the easiest solution is to appeal to the male player's protective instincts. It's annoyingly transparent and well known, and that many of you refuse to see through this paper-thin situation is even more annoying.

Ask yourselves this: Even if you appreciate the added realism of having someone suffer in the bad situation in which they're put (which I certainly don't have a problem with as long as it's not overdone), do you really think it's a coincidence that the first game in a long time to do this uses a female lead character?

I might have bought this argument if it was a new IP.  TR is already a hugely popular brand and they didn't really have to worry about sales as long as they made a decent game.

The whole thing about realistic reactions is pretty new in the industry.  Naughty Dog is leading the pack in that department and it's pretty obvious to see the influence of Uncharted on the TR team.  I think you will see more games coming out with similar character interactions in the future and they will have male characters in those positions.   So yeah, it's is a bit of a coincidence that TR came out about the same time as this movement towards more realism (in characters) is starting to get traction and we are getting tired of same old FPS that hasn't evolved in those areas since Quake.

A lot of that has to do with the technology finally being at a point to support what the developers are trying to convey.  This sort of TR game wouldn't have been possible last gen, or even earlier this gen.
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« Reply #43 on: August 03, 2013, 10:15:35 PM »

wait.. Skystride and Skyride?
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« Reply #44 on: August 03, 2013, 10:51:38 PM »

Quote from: CeeKay on August 03, 2013, 10:15:35 PM

wait.. Skystride and Skyride?

I'm trying to bolster my opinion by creating multiple accounts ninja

Seriously though, oops.. just got a new PC and since I had been using auto-login to this site, I screwed up logging in and used my login from another site.  Don't even recall now why/when I created that other account.
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« Reply #45 on: August 03, 2013, 11:48:28 PM »

Quote from: skystride on August 03, 2013, 10:51:38 PM

Quote from: CeeKay on August 03, 2013, 10:15:35 PM

wait.. Skystride and Skyride?

I'm trying to bolster my opinion by creating multiple accounts ninja

Seriously though, oops.. just got a new PC and since I had been using auto-login to this site, I screwed up logging in and used my login from another site.  Don't even recall now why/when I created that other account.

Multiple accounts?   ban

slywink
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« Reply #46 on: August 04, 2013, 12:16:36 AM »

my guess is you created Skyride first whilst in the middle of a drug induced forum signing up craze, then a few days later, after coming to dressed up in pink lederhosen, you discovered the address in your recent history.  Due to hazy memories of the past few days you inadvertently forgot you created it and went with Skystride when you saw Skyride was unavailable.  Both accounts share the same password as it the the same word you named your penis during the incident (one of the things you clearly remembered afterwards), and you figured it would be something that no one would guess so it would be safe to use.

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« Reply #47 on: August 04, 2013, 03:45:50 AM »

if you want a good example of a traditional leading man type who goes through hell and is permanently changed by the experience, look at Captain Walker in Spec Ops:  The Line.  bruised and bloodied and eventually getting burned over much of his face, with significant mental problems surfacing throughout the course of the game, with the ending played out as much in his head as in reality. 

I wish more games did this with their characters and showed them as you'd expect someone to react under dire circumstances. 

if Lara had started out as the hardened bad ass I don't think I would have appreciated the story any where as much.  her progression is escapism from reality, but one that most people can ID with in that we can imagine ourselves becoming a hero under pressure. 
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« Reply #48 on: August 04, 2013, 10:06:43 AM »

Quote from: Caine on August 04, 2013, 03:45:50 AM

if you want a good example of a traditional leading man type who goes through hell and is permanently changed by the experience, look at Captain Walker in Spec Ops:  The Line.  bruised and bloodied and eventually getting burned over much of his face, with significant mental problems surfacing throughout the course of the game, with the ending played out as much in his head as in reality. 

I've heard good things about the story in that game. I should probably give it a shot at some point.
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« Reply #49 on: August 05, 2013, 11:26:29 PM »

Quote from: TiLT on August 04, 2013, 10:06:43 AM

Quote from: Caine on August 04, 2013, 03:45:50 AM

if you want a good example of a traditional leading man type who goes through hell and is permanently changed by the experience, look at Captain Walker in Spec Ops:  The Line.  bruised and bloodied and eventually getting burned over much of his face, with significant mental problems surfacing throughout the course of the game, with the ending played out as much in his head as in reality. 

I've heard good things about the story in that game. I should probably give it a shot at some point.

If you're interesting in The Bureau then The Line is one of the pre-order bonuses they are offering at certain places.
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« Reply #50 on: August 06, 2013, 07:54:38 AM »

Quote from: TiLT on August 04, 2013, 10:06:43 AM

Quote from: Caine on August 04, 2013, 03:45:50 AM

if you want a good example of a traditional leading man type who goes through hell and is permanently changed by the experience, look at Captain Walker in Spec Ops:  The Line.  bruised and bloodied and eventually getting burned over much of his face, with significant mental problems surfacing throughout the course of the game, with the ending played out as much in his head as in reality. 

I've heard good things about the story in that game. I should probably give it a shot at some point.

Its one of the three free games on PSN+ this month.
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« Reply #51 on: August 06, 2013, 09:56:35 AM »

I'm just glad this isn't a mobile game.  After Deus Ex : The Fall, I was sure worried they'd go that route with Tomb Raider.
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« Reply #52 on: August 06, 2013, 07:50:36 PM »

give them time, they can still change their mind biggrin
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