[360]Bioshock

[Arclight]

Well, I played through the PC demo again, and played another 1.5 hours or so of the 360 version. I REALLY prefer the PC version so far, but the 360 version is on my big screen tv and I get achievements. I think at this point its more like do I mind experiencing the game for the first time on a control scheme I find VASTLY inferior yet still works acceptably or do I need to play it on 360 for the achievements and for replay value after I play PC? I honestly cant decide, but I do know that fights that were hard for me on the 360 version on normal take me a couple easy shots on the PC version. It's much, much more gratifying.

Play on Easy mode for the 360.........problem solved.

[CeeKay]

Yeah, I am REALLY close to picking up the PC version now and just playing it for the first time on PC.

flip a coin?  god man, women choose shoes quicker than you're choosing which version to get 

[Calvin]

Yeah, I am REALLY close to picking up the PC version now and just playing it for the first time on PC.

flip a coin?  god man, women choose shoes quicker than you're choosing which version to get 

Oh I already bought and am playing the 360 version- about 4 hours or so in, just not entirely satisfied with the controls and I am worried its effecting my enjoyment of the game-I totally love it but am having trouble getting totally sucked into it cause I am always wondering why the fights are so clunky and what I could do better-and this is a known problem with me-deciding versions of games and stuff. Its awful you are right.

To Arc-messes up some achievements and frankly, I don't want to play on easy. Thats for noobs

[jersoc]

I have never felt hinder by the 360's control yet. I was a hardcore FPS for many, many years as well. The game is pretty forgiving in that respect. Plus you can just stun the guys and blast them with your shot gun if you're really have problems. I'm on medium and it's not too bad so far. Only died to big daddies.

[kathode]

To Arc-messes up some achievements and frankly, I don't want to play on easy. Thats for noobs

If you're talking about the difficulty achievement, it looks to me like it doesn't unlock Very Hard difficulty until you beat it in Hard.  At least, I beat it in Medium and I still only have Hard difficulty listed.  I think the achievement is only for beating it on Very Hard.  A little unhappy about that myself.  Can anyone with the guide verify that's the case?

[Calvin]

To Arc-messes up some achievements and frankly, I don't want to play on easy. Thats for noobs

If you're talking about the difficulty achievement, it looks to me like it doesn't unlock Very Hard difficulty until you beat it in Hard.  At least, I beat it in Medium and I still only have Hard difficulty listed.  I think the achievement is only for beating it on Very Hard.  A little unhappy about that myself.  Can anyone with the guide verify that's the case?

Oh ok I see I see. I guess I could change it and it wouldn't mess anything up (BUT I WON'T!!!), but now im scared of looking at achievements because of what you told me!

[disarm]

To Arc-messes up some achievements and frankly, I don't want to play on easy. Thats for noobs

If you're talking about the difficulty achievement, it looks to me like it doesn't unlock Very Hard difficulty until you beat it in Hard.  At least, I beat it in Medium and I still only have Hard difficulty listed.  I think the achievement is only for beating it on Very Hard.  A little unhappy about that myself.  Can anyone with the guide verify that's the case?

Oh ok I see I see. I guess I could change it and it wouldn't mess anything up (BUT I WON'T!!!), but now im scared of looking at achievements because of what you told me!

don't worry about looking at the achievements.  the only ones you can see are for specific actions like hacking a turret or shocking an enemy in water.  any achievement that is related to the plot is listed as 'Secret' until you acquire it yourself.  i'm glad most story-oriented games do this so you don't accidentally come across spoilers while you're looking at a buddy's achievement list.

[Calvin]

To Arc-messes up some achievements and frankly, I don't want to play on easy. Thats for noobs

If you're talking about the difficulty achievement, it looks to me like it doesn't unlock Very Hard difficulty until you beat it in Hard.  At least, I beat it in Medium and I still only have Hard difficulty listed.  I think the achievement is only for beating it on Very Hard.  A little unhappy about that myself.  Can anyone with the guide verify that's the case?

Oh ok I see I see. I guess I could change it and it wouldn't mess anything up (BUT I WON'T!!!), but now im scared of looking at achievements because of what you told me!

don't worry about looking at the achievements.  the only ones you can see are for specific actions like hacking a turret or shocking an enemy in water.  any achievement that is related to the plot is listed as 'Secret' until you acquire it yourself.  i'm glad most story-oriented games do this so you don't accidentally come across spoilers while you're looking at a buddy's achievement list.

I looked online, that was the mistake-spoiled one thing, but I had guessed it already so no big deal and closed the page immediately

[StitchJones]

OK guys, I need some help killing these big daddies.  Am I missing something, because i can't kill them without dying.  Maybe if I allowed my self to die a few times I could take them out, but I was hoping it could be done without resulting to that.  Any strategies I'm not considering?  They just seem to have a TON of health.

[CeeKay]

OK, I got that plasmid that makes Big Daddies think you're Little Sisters, and I found that using it and then bringing one along when I go after another Big Daddy is pretty effective.  there's nothing quite as awesome as Big Daddy on Big Daddy action!

[CeeKay]

OK guys, I need some help killing these big daddies.  Am I missing something, because i can't kill them without dying.  Maybe if I allowed my self to die a few times I could take them out, but I was hoping it could be done without resulting to that.  Any strategies I'm not considering?  They just seem to have a TON of health.

I've found that you need to keep moving- use the whole level if necessary (and use the environment to your advantage), and armor piercing bullets work really well. The lightning bolt tends to stun them.  Maybe I've just gotten lucky but I haven't been killed by one yet.

[Turtle]

Stichjones, killing a big Daddy depends on a lot of things.

The first is preparation.  Follow it around, look for places that are best for you to fight him.  Take plasmids that would be useful for the area that you want to fight him in, and tonics that help you too.  Find armor piercing ammo, lay traps, etc...  Armor piercing ammo can make short work of a Big Daddy, even AP ammo in the pistol will do significant damage.  Watch where they're going and try laying mines in his path, or if there's other splicers spawning in the area, use enrage to get them to fight and weaken the big daddy.  Trigger a security camera, shut down the bots then hack the bots so that you can get two extra guns and bullet soaks flying with you.

In fact, I found Big Daddy fights pretty easy after I'd done enough preparation for the fight.  About the only difficulty I've been having is finding ammo and materials with which to prep more big daddies after I kill one.

Spoiler for the specific Daddy types

Spoiler for Hiden:

For the "Bouncer" daddies, you'll want to stay moving, find a place to fight him with lots of things for you to interpose between yourself and him, like 90 corners, low walls, etc...  The Bouncer daddy uses speed and melee, if he gets a clear line of sight to you he'll practically fly through the air straight at you.  Know the area where you fight him too, don't let yourself get cornered like the guy from the beginning of the game.  In fact, the beginning of the game is a textbook example of where not to fight a Bouncer, in a wide open room with no escape with you standing in a corner.  If the Bouncer gets you in a corner you're dead, he'll just keep hitting you and stunning you until you're down.  Instead, if you keep moving around corners, shocking or freezing him if he gets too close, and pour on the AP ammo, he should go down quickly.

For the Rosies, it's more of a gunfight.  He'll tend to stand back and shoot, throwing grenades every once and a while.  Just take cover and pop in and out, watch for grenades.  He will eventually try to move to negate your cover, just stun him somehow and find some other cover.

Also make sure he's got a little sister in tow so you can reap the rewards.

[Arclight]

Yeah, I am REALLY close to picking up the PC version now and just playing it for the first time on PC.

flip a coin?  god man, women choose shoes quicker than you're choosing which version to get 

Oh I already bought and am playing the 360 version- about 4 hours or so in, just not entirely satisfied with the controls and I am worried its effecting my enjoyment of the game-I totally love it but am having trouble getting totally sucked into it cause I am always wondering why the fights are so clunky and what I could do better-and this is a known problem with me-deciding versions of games and stuff. Its awful you are right.

To Arc-messes up some achievements and frankly, I don't want to play on easy. Thats for noobs

Yeah, I used to be like that. Some kind of gamer pride would never let me play on easy-mode....then I grew old.  I always start games on medium hardness, if it becomes the "least" bit frustrating I have no qualms what-so-ever to drop down to easy mode.

But then again, I could care less about the achievments.

[kathode]

Oh ok I see I see. I guess I could change it and it wouldn't mess anything up (BUT I WON'T!!!), but now im scared of looking at achievements because of what you told me!

don't worry about looking at the achievements.  the only ones you can see are for specific actions like hacking a turret or shocking an enemy in water.  any achievement that is related to the plot is listed as 'Secret' until you acquire it yourself.  i'm glad most story-oriented games do this so you don't accidentally come across spoilers while you're looking at a buddy's achievement list.

DO NOT look up achievements online (meaning, on the interweb).  I can't stress that enough. There are at least two major spoilers in the secret achievements that nearly every achievement website has revealed.

[Kevin Grey]

Had two really fun encounters with Big Daddies last night.  Both in Neptune's Bounty:

Spoiler for Hiden:

  The first was in the left hand entrance to the fisheries area.  There is a section there where you can go into the crawlspace with grating and planking interspersed overhead.  I lured the Big Daddy over there and then would hide, protected, under the floor boards and just pop out and put a round of buck shot in him and then hide again.  The Big Daddy got pretty pissed but he could never get to me and, after a little while, he was dead. 


Even better was the next encounter.  It was McDonnal's Pub (which is by far the best designed area of the game so far) which has some secret passages and other ways of easily circumnavigating the place.  In there I would take on the Big Daddy and whenever he would get close I'd hop into the secret passage, get to the back of the building (with conviently located healing station), and circle around and tag him while he was still looking for me in the front.  Rinse, repeat.  Lots of fun.

[Kevin Grey]

I'm not sure I'm really big on the way the shooting and plasma interface is implemented.  Specifically the fact that the first time you switch from one to the other it doesn't trigger the action but instead just brings up the hand ready for use.  That makes it much harder to combo.

For example (slight spoiler), going up against one Big Daddy, he would shoot at me and then periodically throw proximity mines at me.  Those proximity mines are great to throw back at him.  However when he's not throwing them I would prefer to be pumping him full of lead, or shocking him with Electric buckshot.  But what I found is that because of the delay in going from a weapon to a plasmid, I couldn't switch from the gun to TK in time when I saw a mine flying at me. 

I'm not really sure I understand why they went with this approach and not just "Right Trigger fire weapon" and "Left Trigger Fires Plasmid" with no "getting ready" step. 

[CeeKay]

Also make sure he's got a little sister in tow so you can reap the rewards.

yeah, I wasted a ton of ammo on one only to find out that there was no Little Sister with it.  Quickload for the win!

[CeeKay]

I'm not sure I'm really big on the way the shooting and plasma interface is implemented.  Specifically the fact that the first time you switch from one to the other it doesn't trigger the action but instead just brings up the hand ready for use.  That makes it much harder to combo.

For example (slight spoiler), going up against one Big Daddy, he would shoot at me and then periodically throw proximity mines at me.  Those proximity mines are great to throw back at him.  However when he's not throwing them I would prefer to be pumping him full of lead, or shocking him with Electric buckshot.  But what I found is that because of the delay in going from a weapon to a plasmid, I couldn't switch from the gun to TK in time when I saw a mine flying at me. 

I'm not really sure I understand why they went with this approach and not just "Right Trigger fire weapon" and "Left Trigger Fires Plasmid" with no "getting ready" step. 

that's the great thing about the PC version- switching is defaulted to the right mouse button and there's little if any delay.

[godhugh]

I'm not sure I'm really big on the way the shooting and plasma interface is implemented.  Specifically the fact that the first time you switch from one to the other it doesn't trigger the action but instead just brings up the hand ready for use.  That makes it much harder to combo.

For example (slight spoiler), going up against one Big Daddy, he would shoot at me and then periodically throw proximity mines at me.  Those proximity mines are great to throw back at him.  However when he's not throwing them I would prefer to be pumping him full of lead, or shocking him with Electric buckshot.  But what I found is that because of the delay in going from a weapon to a plasmid, I couldn't switch from the gun to TK in time when I saw a mine flying at me. 

I'm not really sure I understand why they went with this approach and not just "Right Trigger fire weapon" and "Left Trigger Fires Plasmid" with no "getting ready" step. 

If you hold the trigger down it should fire immediately upon switching.

[Kevin Grey]

If you hold the trigger down it should fire immediately upon switching.

That's very good to know.  Thanks!

[godhugh]

If you hold the trigger down it should fire immediately upon switching.

That's very good to know.  Thanks!

Yeah, I had a tough time switching between my Shotgun 'O Death and Telekinesis until I found that.

[Arclight]

Hi, my online name is Arclight, and I play Bioshock on easy!! There, I said it.
I've always been more of an explorer\role-playing\graphic's loving\ old fart.

I found the combat to be distracting me from that. I was so concerned about some un-expected encounter that I wasn't paying attention to everything around me..  I must confess I'm not a FPS lover to start with..Twitch and me just don't mix.

So dropping down in difficulty to easy has given me a nice balance between firing off some nice weapons and seeing the effects, and also obsessing over the great minutia in this game.....

Not everyone's cuppa-tea I must admit, but it suites this Old-Gamer!!!!!

Try it, you might like it.  You're not obligated to come here and confess you're playing on easy........Lets just keep that between thee and me...

[ericb]

Possible spoiler on hacking and taking damage.

Spoiler for Hiden:

This may be considered a spoiler and may not but I wanted to be safe.  I've found that failing at hacking will not kill you.  If your health is empty and you fail at hacking whatever device it just drops back to the game instead of giving you the damage that would finish you off.  Found out last night after a boss when I was almost dead and out of first aid kits   For all I know this may be a design choice though since I didn't read the manual yet.

[PeteRock]

I finally had a chance to play a little last night now that my 360 has returned.  My wife was even interested in "playing along" as she likes to do when I load up Oblivion.  So we turned down the lights, cranked up the surround sound, and prepared to embark on a journey to Rapture.

Within seconds I already decided that I love this game.  Great visuals, fun gameplay, amazing story, and incredibly immersive.  My wife was definitely wowed by the visuals (she even screamed "Whale!" when we were riding in the bathysphere) and really started to get interested in the storyline, but after a little while all of a sudden she said she didn't want to watch anymore.   

I at first asked if it was the graphic violence, and she said no, that she's seen much worse and the blood and wrench bludgeonings weren't a problem at all.  So I then asked if it was the creepy characters, and she again said that even the characters weren't a problem.  I was left with simply asking, "So, what is the problem?"

The sound.  The creaking and groaning of the city, the whispers of characters before we see them, noises behind us as we explore.  She was too creeped out by the sound and it wasn't watching that bothered here, it was what she was hearing.  She said the sound was some of the best and most immersive she's ever experienced, and because of that she just couldn't handle feeling creeped out in the living room.

I thought it was F-ing awesome.  But I was only able to play for a short while and look forward to getting back to it tonight.   

[Caine]

i was really hoping my wife would be interested enough to watch along, but alas it was not to be.  she'd rather play bejeweled or something.  we watched another oddball dram-edy last night.  got to see zach braff swear alot and a couple of hot chicks' naked.  otherwise, a dull excuse for a night. 

i won't be able to get in any serious game time until next week.

played half hour this morning and found another gene tonic.  have not faced a big daddy yet.  i'm anxious to see one in action.  that med level is certainly large enough and has a lot of cool stuff to search out.  very cool area.

[PeteRock]

Destructor, according to Tom Chick on QT3, if you see a Big Daddy sans Little Girl, you can follow him around and he'll eventually call out a Little Girl from her hiding place. 

Re: Hacking- so far (360 Version) I've only found one safe I would classify as hard and used an Auto-Hack to get by, it's just that I don't find the mechanic fun.  I can do the stupid puzzles alright, I just find them very boring. 

Personally, I like the hacking mechanic, and find it a fun and rather tense mini-game, but there are several safes I have found that I would classify as hard, if only because you start with two looping sections and have to immediately find and open up a new path. It's not easy.

Does anyone know if you're able to hack into machines right off the bat, or are you not able to start hacking into machines until a little later in the game?  Right now I've only made it far enough to see a Big Daddy absolutely pulverize a splicer that was trying to harm a Little Sister.  No hacking icons have come up yet when I come across a machine (the only one being the lightning bolt vending machine), so I'm assuming I learn to later, or else I'm doing something wrong.  Haven't played much, so that might be part of the problem (just not far enough in the game).

[Soulchilde]

Destructor, according to Tom Chick on QT3, if you see a Big Daddy sans Little Girl, you can follow him around and he'll eventually call out a Little Girl from her hiding place. 

Re: Hacking- so far (360 Version) I've only found one safe I would classify as hard and used an Auto-Hack to get by, it's just that I don't find the mechanic fun.  I can do the stupid puzzles alright, I just find them very boring. 

Personally, I like the hacking mechanic, and find it a fun and rather tense mini-game, but there are several safes I have found that I would classify as hard, if only because you start with two looping sections and have to immediately find and open up a new path. It's not easy.

Does anyone know if you're able to hack into machines right off the bat, or are you not able to start hacking into machines until a little later in the game?  Right now I've only made it far enough to see a Big Daddy absolutely pulverize a splicer that was trying to harm a Little Sister.  No hacking icons have come up yet when I come across a machine (the only one being the lightning bolt vending machine), so I'm assuming I learn to later, or else I'm doing something wrong.  Haven't played much, so that might be part of the problem (just not far enough in the game).

It will come later.  You should be getting a vending machine soon and there will be a secbot that you can hack,  You will know it when you see it

[PeteRock]

Destructor, according to Tom Chick on QT3, if you see a Big Daddy sans Little Girl, you can follow him around and he'll eventually call out a Little Girl from her hiding place. 

Re: Hacking- so far (360 Version) I've only found one safe I would classify as hard and used an Auto-Hack to get by, it's just that I don't find the mechanic fun.  I can do the stupid puzzles alright, I just find them very boring. 

Personally, I like the hacking mechanic, and find it a fun and rather tense mini-game, but there are several safes I have found that I would classify as hard, if only because you start with two looping sections and have to immediately find and open up a new path. It's not easy.

Does anyone know if you're able to hack into machines right off the bat, or are you not able to start hacking into machines until a little later in the game?  Right now I've only made it far enough to see a Big Daddy absolutely pulverize a splicer that was trying to harm a Little Sister.  No hacking icons have come up yet when I come across a machine (the only one being the lightning bolt vending machine), so I'm assuming I learn to later, or else I'm doing something wrong.  Haven't played much, so that might be part of the problem (just not far enough in the game).

It will come later.  You should be getting a vending machine soon and there will be a secbot that you can hack,  You will know it when you see it

Cool.  I just didn't know if I was missing something.  Good to know that I haven't.  I want to see everything in this game.

[Calvin]

I'm not sure I'm really big on the way the shooting and plasma interface is implemented.  Specifically the fact that the first time you switch from one to the other it doesn't trigger the action but instead just brings up the hand ready for use.  That makes it much harder to combo.

For example (slight spoiler), going up against one Big Daddy, he would shoot at me and then periodically throw proximity mines at me.  Those proximity mines are great to throw back at him.  However when he's not throwing them I would prefer to be pumping him full of lead, or shocking him with Electric buckshot.  But what I found is that because of the delay in going from a weapon to a plasmid, I couldn't switch from the gun to TK in time when I saw a mine flying at me. 

I'm not really sure I understand why they went with this approach and not just "Right Trigger fire weapon" and "Left Trigger Fires Plasmid" with no "getting ready" step. 

I know the trick godhugh is talking about, but I agree completely-its still clunky, it still takes a second longer than necessary, and its prone to error.

[Bullwinkle]

I'm finding the Big Daddies to be a little too much of a bitch, too, Stitch.  I do enjoy scoping the area to find the best way to take one down, but part of that is using the existing enemies to your advantage, and so it turns into a lot of trial and error.  A little too much for my tastes.  I hate respawning, so I'll usually reload and fight the BD again.  After four or five attempts, I usually get him, but I blow all of my armor ammo, most of my electro-shotgun ammo and I'm usually down to about 4 health packs.  A couple more attempts will lower the health packs used, but that's all taking way too long.  I'm an old man, like Arclight.  I usually don't care about wimping out on easy, but I wanted to take my time with this game.  But it's taking me hours to finish a level, and that's going to keep me from plowing through it.

Does anyone know what achievements I'll be missing out on if I drop to easy?

[leo8877]

I got a question about the big daddies:

Spoiler for Hiden:

I just faced my first one and killed him but the little sister had run off during the battle.  As soon as the daddy died, another one spawned.  How do I harvest the little sister if she's already hiding in the walls?

[kathode]

Does anyone know what achievements I'll be missing out on if I drop to easy?

None as far as I know.  I'm still trying to confirm whether or not there's a Very Hard mode that unlocks when you complete Hard, or whether just playing through on Hard gets you the achievement.

[kathode]

I got a question about the big daddies:

Spoiler for Hiden:

I just faced my first one and killed him but the little sister had run off during the battle.  As soon as the daddy died, another one spawned.  How do I harvest the little sister if she's already hiding in the walls?

Spoiler for Hiden:

I've never had one run off during a battle.  Usually the BD throws her onto his back or she stays close.  I know that I always got the little sister because I always saved right before the fight, and I never would've started a fight if there wasn't a sister present.  In spite of the Vitapod things, I recommend saving right before you're ready to fight the BD.  My first thought is that you might have initiated the fight just after the LS started climbing back into the hole.

[leo8877]

Thanks Kathode.  I am a save junkie so I went back and did it over, second time went smoother.

[Kevin Grey]

If the Little Sister hides/gets away, you have to wait for another Big Daddy to spawn and follow them around until he draws the Little Sister out of her hiding place.

[Interloper]

I got three big daddies to fight each other tonight.  As soon as one was dead, the other two started at it.  It was quite entertaining.  Too bad only one had a little sister though.  What a great game - so many ways to progress.

[CeeKay]

If the Little Sister hides/gets away, you have to wait for another Big Daddy to spawn and follow them around until he draws the Little Sister out of her hiding place.

I must have followed one of the Big Daddies through four of those hidey-holes last night before she popped out.

[SpicyJ]

Anyone know of a site that has a listing of audio logs by section? I'd like to make sure I haven't missed any before moving on...

Playing 360 version on Easy...explored everywhere in medical before looking for the crazy surgeon guy w/ the key I need. Was playing in my office, very engrossed, when my oldest son (who had entered the room without my hearing) said, "Hey Dad!".

I had to peel myself off the the ceiling after that.

[CeeKay]

Anyone know of a site that has a listing of audio logs by section? I'd like to make sure I haven't missed any before moving on...

Playing 360 version on Easy...explored everywhere in medical before looking for the crazy surgeon guy w/ the key I need. Was playing in my office, very engrossed, when my oldest son (who had entered the room without my hearing) said, "Hey Dad!".

I had to peel myself off the the ceiling after that.

at least he didn't yell 'BIG DADDY!'

[CeeKay]

well, tonight I ran into about 3 hacking mini-games that were impossible due to the placement of overloads and alarms.  One actually had an overload right in front of the exit point